i remember in 2006 when i went to london to see bon jovi at wembley stadium (it was suppose to be the first concert at the new wembley stadium) and it was changed to milton keynes because the stadiumn was not ready in time.
i know milton keynes is a huge bawl but its not impossible to change venues....
From an economic perspective the organizer’s goal is to maximize revenue and not necessarily to sell out.
For example they make more money selling half the venue at $161 than all the venue at $80. (Numbers could be tweaked to account for money people spend at the show but the concept remains.)
Of course they make even more selling half at $161 and the other half at $80. And so that might happen. But they have to ensure the people who spent $161 will not be so upset as to not buy future shows.
PJ: 2013: London (ON); Buffalo; 2014: Cincinnati; 2016: Sunrise, Miami, Toronto 1-2, Wrigley 2; 2018: London (UK) 1, Milan, Padova, Sea 2, Wrigley 1-2, Fenway 1-2; 2021: SHN, Ohana, Ohana Encore 1-2; 2022: LA 1-2, Phx, Oak 1-2, Fresno, Copenhagen, Hyde Park 1-2; Quebec, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto; MSG, Camden, Nashville, Louisville, St. Louis, OKC; 2023: St. Paul 1-2, Chicago 1-2; Fort Worth 2; Austin 1-2
EV Solo: 2017 Louisville and Franklin, 2018 Ohana, 2019 Innings Fest, Berlin, Düsseldorf, Dublin and Ohana; 2021 Ohana Friday (from beach) and Saturday; 2022 Earthlings Newark; 2023 Innings Fest and Benoraya 1-2.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
This thread got me thinking. If Europeans are not used to higher prices and tickets are not selling, why doesn't PJ just tour the states more? It's got to cost a lot more to tour over seas, and for less money. It seems like with every tour, South America or Europe gets more shows than NA. I always just assumed they made more doing it, but apparently not.
crowds are so better in Europe. I'm sure they enjoy playing in Europe or SudAM. Much more than US. Not only dollars Dude.
Of course it’s not only dollars. But it looks like they tried to make it a factor by charging more than most Europeans are willing to pay. My point wasn’t that it’s just about dollars. But I assume the cost to tour is a lot more expensive over seas. The cost to take a crew and all the equipment and everything has got to eat into the budget. So whatever to reason is, it’s got to be worth it for them. Are US crowds that bad where they’ll play more shows out of the country, or do they just enjoy working and vacationing at the same time?
From an economic perspective the organizer’s goal is to maximize revenue and not necessarily to sell out.
For example they make more money selling half the venue at $161 than all the venue at $80. (Numbers could be tweaked to account for money people spend at the show but the concept remains.)
Of course they make even more selling half at $161 and the other half at $80. And so that might happen. But they have to ensure the people who spent $161 will not be so upset as to not buy future shows.
Absolutely right, however with PJ we have to factor in the merch effect. 65000 rabid merch buyers are going to do some serious damage compared to 30,000 LOL
As I understand it the band will be paid a set fee for playing - which is agreed with the promoter (I may be wrong) but they then make a good sum on the merch they sell. I expect on that footing having a huge crowd is financially attractive.
Mind you once folk have stumped up all this cash I wonder if they can really afford to spend £40 on a T shirt.
Then those responsible had better get started quickly.
For the second night in Barcelona, there are still around 9,000 seats that have not been sold. And where nothing is happening at all. In addition, there is an unknown number of unsold standing tickets. At a price of €165, the sales figures for the standing tickets will be just as shameful as for the seats. So we can assume that they definitely didn't sell more than half of the tickets.
There must be some consequence to this.
For the sake of completeness. Even on the first evening in Barcelona, an alarming number of seats plus an unknown number of standing tickets are still unsold. There are still around 5,500 seats available for the first evening alone. At the moment, it might still be possible to find a free seat or standing on the first evening for all the people who have bought tickets for the second evening. I know that won't work. Because of the value of the seats. But there should be enough space.
I think they want to do their concerts with as little traveling as possible. That’s why they set up 2 concerts in Berlin and Barcelona and thought that fans from Scandinavia, Eastern Europe, Italy.
Looks like this doesn’t work out as planned. Maybe due to the high ticket prices, the late announcement and the football Euros, which makes traveling more expensive.
i truly believe these are the reasons.
Euro only affects germany
Are Germany playing themselves??
That would be the only way for us to win something this year.
Then those responsible had better get started quickly.
For the second night in Barcelona, there are still around 9,000 seats that have not been sold. And where nothing is happening at all. In addition, there is an unknown number of unsold standing tickets. At a price of €165, the sales figures for the standing tickets will be just as shameful as for the seats. So we can assume that they definitely didn't sell more than half of the tickets.
There must be some consequence to this.
For the sake of completeness. Even on the first evening in Barcelona, an alarming number of seats plus an unknown number of standing tickets are still unsold. There are still around 5,500 seats available for the first evening alone. At the moment, it might still be possible to find a free seat or standing on the first evening for all the people who have bought tickets for the second evening. I know that won't work. Because of the value of the seats. But there should be enough space.
1st Barcelona night only has premium tickets for standing. And if u take into account the small amount of premium tickets for seats those wont be much.
Black keys Manchester (same venue as pj) 42.50-80 gbp pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Suppose there’s only two members of Black Keys vs five (plus two touring members) of PJ. And PJ is a much much more famous band.
You are right though in that it’s crazy the cost for Black Keys is 25% of PJ. Black Keys tour only 3 dates vs 9 for PJ but I imagine more Black Keys shows to be added.
Black keys Manchester (same venue as pj) 42.50-80 gbp pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Suppose there’s only two members of Black Keys vs five (plus two touring members) of PJ. And PJ is a much much more famous band.
You are right though in that it’s crazy the cost for Black Keys is 25% of PJ. Black Keys tour only 3 dates vs 9 for PJ but I imagine more Black Keys shows to be added.
The Black Keys is a 2 piece (but with four backing musicians) so their costs will be low, imagine the backup guys probably waged so won't be adding too much to the cost.
The secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits
How much do you think tickets in the lower and upper tiers will have to cost for the two Barcelona concerts to sell reasonably well? Or has too much damage already been done?
I would still be interested. But as the tickets are still not selling and there is no rush, I would just wait. Any opinions?
Black keys Manchester (same venue as pj) 42.50-80 gbp pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Suppose there’s only two members of Black Keys vs five (plus two touring members) of PJ. And PJ is a much much more famous band.
You are right though in that it’s crazy the cost for Black Keys is 25% of PJ. Black Keys tour only 3 dates vs 9 for PJ but I imagine more Black Keys shows to be added.
The Black Keys is a 2 piece (but with four backing musicians) so their costs will be low, imagine the backup guys probably waged so won't be adding too much to the cost.
Yep see the point just being 2 of them. Another comparison uk pricing this year I’m off to see - green day GA in Milan 65 euro the eagles, arena seated 90 gbp (same seats for pj are 125 gbp in same venue) Taylor swift with the kids, middling upper tier stadium seats 90 gbp Foo fighters, Manchester standing 80gbp Springsteen, front standing in Sunderland 160gbp
Black keys Manchester (same venue as pj) 42.50-80 gbp pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Suppose there’s only two members of Black Keys vs five (plus two touring members) of PJ. And PJ is a much much more famous band.
You are right though in that it’s crazy the cost for Black Keys is 25% of PJ. Black Keys tour only 3 dates vs 9 for PJ but I imagine more Black Keys shows to be added.
The Black Keys is a 2 piece (but with four backing musicians) so their costs will be low, imagine the backup guys probably waged so won't be adding too much to the cost.
Yep see the point just being 2 of them. Another comparison uk pricing this year I’m off to see - green day GA in Milan 65 euro the eagles, arena seated 90 gbp (same seats for pj are 125 gbp in same venue) Taylor swift with the kids, middling upper tier stadium seats 90 gbp Foo fighters, Manchester standing 80gbp Springsteen, front standing in Sunderland 160gbp
anyway you look at it, pricing is out of whack.
Though the eagles were almost another £100 on the price that PJ charged, on the lower tier and more than double on the floor
How much do you think tickets in the lower and upper tiers will have to cost for the two Barcelona concerts to sell reasonably well? Or has too much damage already been done?
I would still be interested. But as the tickets are still not selling and there is no rush, I would just wait. Any opinions?
Just making this up but the premiums should be changed to standard price, other lowers discounted 25% and uppers discounted 40%. That might not sell out but it should sell.
I don’t know what to say about GA. I’ll let someone else answer that one.
PJ: 2013: London (ON); Buffalo; 2014: Cincinnati; 2016: Sunrise, Miami, Toronto 1-2, Wrigley 2; 2018: London (UK) 1, Milan, Padova, Sea 2, Wrigley 1-2, Fenway 1-2; 2021: SHN, Ohana, Ohana Encore 1-2; 2022: LA 1-2, Phx, Oak 1-2, Fresno, Copenhagen, Hyde Park 1-2; Quebec, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto; MSG, Camden, Nashville, Louisville, St. Louis, OKC; 2023: St. Paul 1-2, Chicago 1-2; Fort Worth 2; Austin 1-2
EV Solo: 2017 Louisville and Franklin, 2018 Ohana, 2019 Innings Fest, Berlin, Düsseldorf, Dublin and Ohana; 2021 Ohana Friday (from beach) and Saturday; 2022 Earthlings Newark; 2023 Innings Fest and Benoraya 1-2.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
From an economic perspective the organizer’s goal is to maximize revenue and not necessarily to sell out.
For example they make more money selling half the venue at $161 than all the venue at $80. (Numbers could be tweaked to account for money people spend at the show but the concept remains.)
Of course they make even more selling half at $161 and the other half at $80. And so that might happen. But they have to ensure the people who spent $161 will not be so upset as to not buy future shows.
Absolutely right, however with PJ we have to factor in the merch effect. 65000 rabid merch buyers are going to do some serious damage compared to 30,000 LOL
As I understand it the band will be paid a set fee for playing - which is agreed with the promoter (I may be wrong) but they then make a good sum on the merch they sell. I expect on that footing having a huge crowd is financially attractive.
Mind you once folk have stumped up all this cash I wonder if they can really afford to spend £40 on a T shirt.
Most bands are paid a guaranteed fee, and once the show hits a specific amount of gross revenue, the band receives a share of the excess revenue (Referred to as "overage").
In some cases, when a show doesn't sell well, the promoter may ask the band to reduce their guaranteed fee.
It might not seem like a lot but none of those shows in Germany or England are sold out. I guess demand has been met?
At the current prices, that certainly appears to be the case. If they drop the non gold circle standing and less good seats prices in line with the average prices for other stadium/arena shows then it may pick up again.
O2 is a great venue - going to see Tool there again in the summer - saw QotSA there before Xmas.
Wont be moved there as cancelling White Hart Lane would be ruinous.
Indeed, they'd have the cost of hiring the o2, they'd lose a whole heap of the money they paid to hire WHL, then have the admin costs of relocating everyone. Worst case scenario, they can always move the stage further down the pitch, make the portion of the stadium used smaller and just relocate people to the new equivalent of what they'd bought.
And then there's the non financial damage... downsizing a stadium show to an arena. The media would have a field day beating them with the pricing structure, TM stuff all over again... plus probably a few bruised egos.
Depending on the promoter's relationship with the venue, the promoter may not lose the entire rental amount should they opt to move venues.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
It might not seem like a lot but none of those shows in Germany or England are sold out. I guess demand has been met?
At the current prices, that certainly appears to be the case. If they drop the non gold circle standing and less good seats prices in line with the average prices for other stadium/arena shows then it may pick up again.
O2 is a great venue - going to see Tool there again in the summer - saw QotSA there before Xmas.
Wont be moved there as cancelling White Hart Lane would be ruinous.
Indeed, they'd have the cost of hiring the o2, they'd lose a whole heap of the money they paid to hire WHL, then have the admin costs of relocating everyone. Worst case scenario, they can always move the stage further down the pitch, make the portion of the stadium used smaller and just relocate people to the new equivalent of what they'd bought.
And then there's the non financial damage... downsizing a stadium show to an arena. The media would have a field day beating them with the pricing structure, TM stuff all over again... plus probably a few bruised egos.
Depending on the promoter's relationship with the venue, the promoter may not lose the entire rental amount should they opt to move venues.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
Insuring a PJ show must be super expensive given how many cancellations they've had. Like a driver with a bunch of recent accidents
It might not seem like a lot but none of those shows in Germany or England are sold out. I guess demand has been met?
At the current prices, that certainly appears to be the case. If they drop the non gold circle standing and less good seats prices in line with the average prices for other stadium/arena shows then it may pick up again.
O2 is a great venue - going to see Tool there again in the summer - saw QotSA there before Xmas.
Wont be moved there as cancelling White Hart Lane would be ruinous.
Indeed, they'd have the cost of hiring the o2, they'd lose a whole heap of the money they paid to hire WHL, then have the admin costs of relocating everyone. Worst case scenario, they can always move the stage further down the pitch, make the portion of the stadium used smaller and just relocate people to the new equivalent of what they'd bought.
And then there's the non financial damage... downsizing a stadium show to an arena. The media would have a field day beating them with the pricing structure, TM stuff all over again... plus probably a few bruised egos.
Depending on the promoter's relationship with the venue, the promoter may not lose the entire rental amount should they opt to move venues.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
Insuring a PJ show must be super expensive given how many cancellations they've had. Like a driver with a bunch of recent accidents
It might not seem like a lot but none of those shows in Germany or England are sold out. I guess demand has been met?
At the current prices, that certainly appears to be the case. If they drop the non gold circle standing and less good seats prices in line with the average prices for other stadium/arena shows then it may pick up again.
O2 is a great venue - going to see Tool there again in the summer - saw QotSA there before Xmas.
Wont be moved there as cancelling White Hart Lane would be ruinous.
Indeed, they'd have the cost of hiring the o2, they'd lose a whole heap of the money they paid to hire WHL, then have the admin costs of relocating everyone. Worst case scenario, they can always move the stage further down the pitch, make the portion of the stadium used smaller and just relocate people to the new equivalent of what they'd bought.
And then there's the non financial damage... downsizing a stadium show to an arena. The media would have a field day beating them with the pricing structure, TM stuff all over again... plus probably a few bruised egos.
Depending on the promoter's relationship with the venue, the promoter may not lose the entire rental amount should they opt to move venues.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
Insuring a PJ show must be super expensive given how many cancellations they've had. Like a driver with a bunch of recent accidents
Are you related to SZA?
Hey man that’s my joke.
PJ: 2013: London (ON); Buffalo; 2014: Cincinnati; 2016: Sunrise, Miami, Toronto 1-2, Wrigley 2; 2018: London (UK) 1, Milan, Padova, Sea 2, Wrigley 1-2, Fenway 1-2; 2021: SHN, Ohana, Ohana Encore 1-2; 2022: LA 1-2, Phx, Oak 1-2, Fresno, Copenhagen, Hyde Park 1-2; Quebec, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto; MSG, Camden, Nashville, Louisville, St. Louis, OKC; 2023: St. Paul 1-2, Chicago 1-2; Fort Worth 2; Austin 1-2
EV Solo: 2017 Louisville and Franklin, 2018 Ohana, 2019 Innings Fest, Berlin, Düsseldorf, Dublin and Ohana; 2021 Ohana Friday (from beach) and Saturday; 2022 Earthlings Newark; 2023 Innings Fest and Benoraya 1-2.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
Black keys Manchester (same venue as pj) 42.50-80 gbp pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Suppose there’s only two members of Black Keys vs five (plus two touring members) of PJ. And PJ is a much much more famous band.
You are right though in that it’s crazy the cost for Black Keys is 25% of PJ. Black Keys tour only 3 dates vs 9 for PJ but I imagine more Black Keys shows to be added.
The Black Keys is a 2 piece (but with four backing musicians) so their costs will be low, imagine the backup guys probably waged so won't be adding too much to the cost.
These guys can split their income 30 ways and still be rich. They'll probably make more money in 1 week than I will in my lifetime. It really isn't a factor. It's a matter of how much can they make.
It might not seem like a lot but none of those shows in Germany or England are sold out. I guess demand has been met?
At the current prices, that certainly appears to be the case. If they drop the non gold circle standing and less good seats prices in line with the average prices for other stadium/arena shows then it may pick up again.
O2 is a great venue - going to see Tool there again in the summer - saw QotSA there before Xmas.
Wont be moved there as cancelling White Hart Lane would be ruinous.
Indeed, they'd have the cost of hiring the o2, they'd lose a whole heap of the money they paid to hire WHL, then have the admin costs of relocating everyone. Worst case scenario, they can always move the stage further down the pitch, make the portion of the stadium used smaller and just relocate people to the new equivalent of what they'd bought.
And then there's the non financial damage... downsizing a stadium show to an arena. The media would have a field day beating them with the pricing structure, TM stuff all over again... plus probably a few bruised egos.
Depending on the promoter's relationship with the venue, the promoter may not lose the entire rental amount should they opt to move venues.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
Insuring a PJ show must be super expensive given how many cancellations they've had. Like a driver with a bunch of recent accidents
It seems to me that frugality reigns supreme among too many people here. I was paying $50 for single concert tickets during the mid-1990s, so I don't balk at $150 per ticket three decades later. If some of you are so concerned about saving $60 a ticket, then you probably need to rearrange your finances. I mean, most Pearl Jam fans are age 50 or older, so they should be in good overall financial standing. I'm not saying ... I'm just saying. Long live Pearl Jam. 🥑
How much do you think tickets in the lower and upper tiers will have to cost for the two Barcelona concerts to sell reasonably well? Or has too much damage already been done?
I would still be interested. But as the tickets are still not selling and there is no rush, I would just wait. Any opinions?
Just making this up but the premiums should be changed to standard price, other lowers discounted 25% and uppers discounted 40%. That might not sell out but it should sell.
I don’t know what to say about GA. I’ll let someone else answer that one.
I was thinking along the same lines. Standard seats down from 160 to 120 euros. Second level 90 euros. And third level 60 to 70 euros.
It seems to me that frugality reigns supreme among too many people here. I was paying $50 for single concert tickets during the mid-1990s, so I don't balk at $150 per ticket three decades later. If some of you are so concerned about saving $60 a ticket, then you probably need to rearrange your finances. I mean, most Pearl Jam fans are age 50 or older, so they should be in good overall financial standing. I'm not saying ... I'm just saying. Long live Pearl Jam. 🥑
It’s not about price , it’s about value.
Travel to London, to watch tiny insect sized musicians (Jeff Antment and Gnat Cameron ? ) on a stage far far away in a corporate dome with as RHCP fans will tell you has a terrible sound system - it’s just not worth it. I’d want a discount for that venue - not a doubling of prices.
Comments
i know milton keynes is a huge bawl but its not impossible to change venues....
Wellington 1998
London 2007
Brisbane 2009
Stockholm 2012
EV Dublin 2017
Milan 2018
Padova 2018
Boston 2 2018
For example they make more money selling half the venue at $161 than all the venue at $80. (Numbers could be tweaked to account for money people spend at the show but the concept remains.)
Of course they make even more selling half at $161 and the other half at $80. And so that might happen. But they have to ensure the people who spent $161 will not be so upset as to not buy future shows.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
My point wasn’t that it’s just about dollars. But I assume the cost to tour is a lot more expensive over seas. The cost to take a crew and all the equipment and everything has got to eat into the budget. So whatever to reason is, it’s got to be worth it for them. Are US crowds that bad where they’ll play more shows out of the country, or do they just enjoy working and vacationing at the same time?
to be honest i just dont want to see berlin and barcelona 2nd nights cancelled.
As I understand it the band will be paid a set fee for playing - which is agreed with the promoter (I may be wrong) but they then make a good sum on the merch they sell. I expect on that footing having a huge crowd is financially attractive.
Mind you once folk have stumped up all this cash I wonder if they can really afford to spend £40 on a T shirt.
pearl jam - 160 gbp with back rows of upper tier hastily reduced to 121gbp
similar stage set up and cost (I’ve seen both bands plenty) and similar limited uk dates (2-3 max)
this argument that touring has got more expensive is moot - I assume the black keys aren’t touring at a loss
difference is required income/take ie greed
Poster for the planned show in the LTU Arena (stadium). Ended up in the ISS Dome.
I would still be interested. But as the tickets are still not selling and there is no rush, I would just wait. Any opinions?
green day GA in Milan 65 euro
the eagles, arena seated 90 gbp (same seats for pj are 125 gbp in same venue)
Taylor swift with the kids, middling upper tier stadium seats 90 gbp
Foo fighters, Manchester standing 80gbp
Springsteen, front standing in Sunderland 160gbp
anyway you look at it, pricing is out of whack.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
In some cases, when a show doesn't sell well, the promoter may ask the band to reduce their guaranteed fee.
Most large promoters carry insurance for instances when a show is downgraded or cancelled (not saying that the show is being cancelled!)
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
Travel to London, to watch tiny insect sized musicians (Jeff Antment and Gnat Cameron ? ) on a stage far far away in a corporate dome with as RHCP fans will tell you has a terrible sound system - it’s just not worth it. I’d want a discount for that venue - not a doubling of prices.