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US Christian Missionary endanger the lives of inhabitants on isolated Indian island

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  • SmellymanSmellyman Asia Posts: 4,528
    edited November 2018
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.


    This guy is getting too much air time.


    Post edited by Smellyman on
  • njnancynjnancy Posts: 5,096
    Smellyman said:
    Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.


    This guy is getting too much air time.


    Agree. Unless they give his body back or something I think we've beaten this horse to death. 
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 44,144
    An invasion. Armed with a Bible. 
    bible blocks an arrow from  killing him. swins back to the boat that brought him.

    the next day he WENT BACK. Desrved to die? no. Earned his death? yes.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • An invasion. Armed with a Bible. 
    History tells us that’s one of the worst invasions a people can meet.

    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_Soul said:
    I guess you're interpreting the word different than I am then... You're using some kind of emotional interpretation of it. I'm using the word more objectively. He literally deserved it. He did something illegal that is known to be likely to get him killed, and, most importantly, that threatened the lives of a bunch of other people who are well known to defend themselves in that manner, which is half the reason approaching them is illegal in the first place. Therefore, he deserved the consequences of his actions. Kind of like someone who knowingly walks into a cage occupied by a starving wild tiger deserves to get mauled and eaten by the tiger. Actions = consequence.
    Or, someone throwing rocks hoping to harm or kill law enforcement with the intent to illegally cross a protected border?
  • njnancynjnancy Posts: 5,096
    Or, someone throwing rocks hoping to harm or kill law enforcement with the intent to illegally cross a protected border?
    You are just arguing for the sake of arguing. There is no response for a productive debate. 
  • History tells us that’s one of the worst invasions a people can meet.

    Why because it invades your soul? 
  • njnancynjnancy Posts: 5,096
    Why because it invades your soul? 
    Do you have an inability to answer anything I post to you? I'll answer - yes you do. Why? I don't care. This thread is dead.
  • Why because it invades your soul? 
    No. People get hurt.

    Large scale: crusades.
    Small scale: Native American experiences (in particular the residential school experiences).

    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    He was quoted as saying “You guys might think I’m crazy in all this but I think it’s worth it to declare Jesus to these people.”
    HAHAHA
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 44,144
      https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/he-lost-his-mind-slain-missionary-john-allen-chau-planned-for-years-to-convert-remote-tribe/2018/11/27/eb13d7ad-4685-4748-951b-790d671f655d_story.html?utm_term=.3ea01ad91ebc&wpisrc=nl_rainbow&wpmm=1


    By Annie Gowen
    November 27 at 7:28 PM

    On Instagram, John A. Chau came off like a carefree young adventurer — climbing mountain peaks and exploring jungles. But in reality, the missionary harbored a deadly obsession with an isolated tribe in India he’d first read about as a teen.

    Chau spent years planning and training to travel illegally to remote North Sentinel Island on a mission to convert its residents to Christianity, including learning emergency medicine, and studying linguistics and cultural anthropology, his missionary group said. Though he knew the islanders had long violently resisted outsiders, he conducted a covert mission to the protected island this month. Police said that shortly after he arrived at the island this month, the tribe killed him. Indian authorities say they have yet to recover the body.

    The death of the 26-year-old missionary from Washington state — who broke a raft of laws and put the health of the indigenous people at risk — has sparked international outrage, a heated debate about the protection of tribal communities and at least two investigations by authorities in India. It also has prompted soul-searching in the U.S. evangelical community, which has been debating whether Chau was a martyr, a fool or was afflicted by a messiah complex.

    “God, I don’t want to die,” Chau scrawled in his journal while sitting in a fishing boat off the coast of the island where the North Sentinelese people live, shortly before he was killed. “WHO WILL TAKE MY PLACE IF I DO?”

    Chau, easygoing and friendly, seemed like any other backpacker when he showed up at Remco Snoeij’s dive shop in 2016 on Havelock Island — in India’s Andaman and Nicobar island chain — and said he wanted to learn to scuba dive.

    Chau’s time on the island, a diver’s haven, was largely unremarkable. He stayed in a house called Scubaluv, which was filled with “chattering geckos,” swam with parrotfish and snapped pictures of blue coral for his Instagram account, where he had 17,000 followers.

    Yet Snoeij recalled that Chau seemed intently interested in the North Sentinelese tribe, which lived a Stone Age existence on a nearby island, protected by a three-mile, exclusion zone imposed by the Indian government. The tribe has long resisted outside human contact; when Indian helicopters flew overhead after the 2004 tsunami, members of the tribe fired arrows and threw spears.

    Snoeij told Chau that the island was off-limits, but on dive excursions, he regaled the American with local lore — about the two fishermen who traveled to the island in 2006 and were strangled by islanders, about the rumors that the Japanese military had buried gold there during World War II.

    “He shared a keen interest in researching and knowing more about them,” Snoeij said. “It must have struck a chord.”

    Chau later told other friends he was on a kind of reconnaissance mission; police said that on his last trip to the island, he spent time studying how to circumvent military patrols.

    Chau had a “very meticulous plan to camouflage his expedition as fishing activity,” said Dependra Pathak, the director general of police for the Andaman and Nicobar Islands.

    The son of a doctor who fled China during the Cultural Revolution, Chau had been fascinated with the outdoors since he pulled a dusty copy of “Robinson Crusoe” off his father’s bookshelf as a child, he told an online wilderness adventure journal. He later read the novel “The Sign of the Beaver,” about a boy who is left alone and guards his family’s log cabin with the help of a Native American friend.

    That book “inspired my brother and I to paint our faces with wild blackberry juice and to tramp through our backyard with bows and spears we created from sticks,” Chau recalled.

    In an email, Chau’s father, Patrick, declined to comment, saying the family needs peace.
    U.S. missionary killed by tribe on remote Indian island

    Chau majored in sports medicine at Oral Roberts University, graduating in 2014, and he volunteered for soccer programs in Iraq and South Africa. He lived in a cabin for three summers in Whiskeytown National Recreation Area in California; at one point, he was hospitalized after being bitten by a rattlesnake.

    A friend, John Middleton Ramsey, 22, recalls that in 2016 Chau stayed with him in Bellingham, Wash., and that the island in the Andaman Sea was much on his mind. Chau confided that he was avoiding romantic attachments because of his planned mission.

    “He knew of the dangers of this place,” Ramsey recalled. “He didn’t want any hearts to get broken should something go wrong. He was very much aware of what he was doing. He also knew it wasn’t exactly legal.”

    That year, Chau joined forces with All Nations, a missionary group based in Kansas City, Mo., that sends Christian missionaries to 40 countries. The group provided him training and support, according to Mary Ho, its international executive leader. She was surprised by the “soft-spoken, very gentle young man” who had a very “radical call” to find “unreached groups.”

    “You could see that every decision he has made, every step he has taken since then was driven by his desire to be among the North Sentinelese people,” Ho said. He planned to live there for years and hoped to learn their language.

    Ho said the group was aware that Chau had traveled to India as a tourist, without the proper missionary visa, because missionary visas “aren’t easy to come by.” Ho insisted that Chau had not violated any laws, though authorities in India said he clearly did.

    Brahma Chellaney, a professor at the Center for Policy Research in New Delhi, says Chau violated the country’s aboriginal and forest protection laws as well as cultural norms.

    “He repeatedly trespassed on this island, and they lost their patience with him,” Chellaney said. “There is faith, and there is mental illness. . . . He didn’t understand the line between faith and doing something that’s absolutely nutty.”

    Chau’s diary, which his family provided to The Washington Post, unfolds like the adventure novels he once read. He arrived in the Andamans on Oct. 16 and paid fishermen to take him by boat at night to the island on Nov. 14, evading the lights of patrols on the way. When the sun broke, Chau drew near the tribe. The women began “looing and chattering,” he wrote, and he was faced by men armed with bows and arrows. “My name is John, I love you and Jesus loves you,” he shouted before retreating.

    The second day, he kayaked to the island and tried to offer the tribe small gifts — fish, scissors, cord and safety pins. A man in white with a crown, possibly made of flowers, shouted at him. He responded by singing “worship songs and hymns” and the tribe fell silent. A juvenile fired an arrow at him, piercing his waterproof Bible. Chau fled on foot through the mangroves.

    “Lord, is this island Satan’s last stronghold where none have heard or even had the chance to hear your name?” he wrote.

    By the third day, he became convinced he was going to die.

    “Watching the sunset and it’s beautiful — crying a bit . . . wondering if it will be the last sunset I see,” he wrote. He asked the fishermen to drop him on the beach. They returned the next day and saw the tribesmen dragging Chau’s body.

    Those fishermen have been arrested, as has a friend of Chau’s who helped organize the boat trip. Police do not yet have a strategy to retrieve his body and do not plan to confront the islanders, Pathak said.

    Chau’s friends from the islands are still grieving and mystified by the whole episode.

    “He lost his mind, definitely,” Snoeij said. “But ask any adventurer. You have to lose your mind a little bit, otherwise you don’t do it.”

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    mickeyrat said:
      https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/he-lost-his-mind-slain-missionary-john-allen-chau-planned-for-years-to-convert-remote-tribe/2018/11/27/eb13d7ad-4685-4748-951b-790d671f655d_story.html?utm_term=.3ea01ad91ebc&wpisrc=nl_rainbow&wpmm=1


    By Annie Gowen
    November 27 at 7:28 PM

    On Instagram, John A. Chau came off like a carefree young adventurer — climbing mountain peaks and exploring jungles. But in reality, the missionary harbored a deadly obsession with an isolated tribe in India he’d first read about as a teen.

    Chau spent years planning and training to travel illegally to remote North Sentinel Island on a mission to convert its residents to Christianity, including learning emergency medicine, and studying linguistics and cultural anthropology, his missionary group said. Though he knew the islanders had long violently resisted outsiders, he conducted a covert mission to the protected island this month. Police said that shortly after he arrived at the island this month, the tribe killed him. Indian authorities say they have yet to recover the body.

    The death of the 26-year-old missionary from Washington state — who broke a raft of laws and put the health of the indigenous people at risk — has sparked international outrage, a heated debate about the protection of tribal communities and at least two investigations by authorities in India. It also has prompted soul-searching in the U.S. evangelical community, which has been debating whether Chau was a martyr, a fool or was afflicted by a messiah complex.

    “God, I don’t want to die,” Chau scrawled in his journal while sitting in a fishing boat off the coast of the island where the North Sentinelese people live, shortly before he was killed. “WHO WILL TAKE MY PLACE IF I DO?”

    Chau, easygoing and friendly, seemed like any other backpacker when he showed up at Remco Snoeij’s dive shop in 2016 on Havelock Island — in India’s Andaman and Nicobar island chain — and said he wanted to learn to scuba dive.

    Chau’s time on the island, a diver’s haven, was largely unremarkable. He stayed in a house called Scubaluv, which was filled with “chattering geckos,” swam with parrotfish and snapped pictures of blue coral for his Instagram account, where he had 17,000 followers.

    Yet Snoeij recalled that Chau seemed intently interested in the North Sentinelese tribe, which lived a Stone Age existence on a nearby island, protected by a three-mile, exclusion zone imposed by the Indian government. The tribe has long resisted outside human contact; when Indian helicopters flew overhead after the 2004 tsunami, members of the tribe fired arrows and threw spears.

    Snoeij told Chau that the island was off-limits, but on dive excursions, he regaled the American with local lore — about the two fishermen who traveled to the island in 2006 and were strangled by islanders, about the rumors that the Japanese military had buried gold there during World War II.

    “He shared a keen interest in researching and knowing more about them,” Snoeij said. “It must have struck a chord.”

    Chau later told other friends he was on a kind of reconnaissance mission; police said that on his last trip to the island, he spent time studying how to circumvent military patrols.

    Chau had a “very meticulous plan to camouflage his expedition as fishing activity,” said Dependra Pathak, the director general of police for the Andaman and Nicobar Islands.

    The son of a doctor who fled China during the Cultural Revolution, Chau had been fascinated with the outdoors since he pulled a dusty copy of “Robinson Crusoe” off his father’s bookshelf as a child, he told an online wilderness adventure journal. He later read the novel “The Sign of the Beaver,” about a boy who is left alone and guards his family’s log cabin with the help of a Native American friend.

    That book “inspired my brother and I to paint our faces with wild blackberry juice and to tramp through our backyard with bows and spears we created from sticks,” Chau recalled.

    In an email, Chau’s father, Patrick, declined to comment, saying the family needs peace.
    U.S. missionary killed by tribe on remote Indian island

    Chau majored in sports medicine at Oral Roberts University, graduating in 2014, and he volunteered for soccer programs in Iraq and South Africa. He lived in a cabin for three summers in Whiskeytown National Recreation Area in California; at one point, he was hospitalized after being bitten by a rattlesnake.

    A friend, John Middleton Ramsey, 22, recalls that in 2016 Chau stayed with him in Bellingham, Wash., and that the island in the Andaman Sea was much on his mind. Chau confided that he was avoiding romantic attachments because of his planned mission.

    “He knew of the dangers of this place,” Ramsey recalled. “He didn’t want any hearts to get broken should something go wrong. He was very much aware of what he was doing. He also knew it wasn’t exactly legal.”

    That year, Chau joined forces with All Nations, a missionary group based in Kansas City, Mo., that sends Christian missionaries to 40 countries. The group provided him training and support, according to Mary Ho, its international executive leader. She was surprised by the “soft-spoken, very gentle young man” who had a very “radical call” to find “unreached groups.”

    “You could see that every decision he has made, every step he has taken since then was driven by his desire to be among the North Sentinelese people,” Ho said. He planned to live there for years and hoped to learn their language.

    Ho said the group was aware that Chau had traveled to India as a tourist, without the proper missionary visa, because missionary visas “aren’t easy to come by.” Ho insisted that Chau had not violated any laws, though authorities in India said he clearly did.

    Brahma Chellaney, a professor at the Center for Policy Research in New Delhi, says Chau violated the country’s aboriginal and forest protection laws as well as cultural norms.

    “He repeatedly trespassed on this island, and they lost their patience with him,” Chellaney said. “There is faith, and there is mental illness. . . . He didn’t understand the line between faith and doing something that’s absolutely nutty.”

    Chau’s diary, which his family provided to The Washington Post, unfolds like the adventure novels he once read. He arrived in the Andamans on Oct. 16 and paid fishermen to take him by boat at night to the island on Nov. 14, evading the lights of patrols on the way. When the sun broke, Chau drew near the tribe. The women began “looing and chattering,” he wrote, and he was faced by men armed with bows and arrows. “My name is John, I love you and Jesus loves you,” he shouted before retreating.

    The second day, he kayaked to the island and tried to offer the tribe small gifts — fish, scissors, cord and safety pins. A man in white with a crown, possibly made of flowers, shouted at him. He responded by singing “worship songs and hymns” and the tribe fell silent. A juvenile fired an arrow at him, piercing his waterproof Bible. Chau fled on foot through the mangroves.

    “Lord, is this island Satan’s last stronghold where none have heard or even had the chance to hear your name?” he wrote.

    By the third day, he became convinced he was going to die.

    “Watching the sunset and it’s beautiful — crying a bit . . . wondering if it will be the last sunset I see,” he wrote. He asked the fishermen to drop him on the beach. They returned the next day and saw the tribesmen dragging Chau’s body.

    Those fishermen have been arrested, as has a friend of Chau’s who helped organize the boat trip. Police do not yet have a strategy to retrieve his body and do not plan to confront the islanders, Pathak said.

    Chau’s friends from the islands are still grieving and mystified by the whole episode.

    “He lost his mind, definitely,” Snoeij said. “But ask any adventurer. You have to lose your mind a little bit, otherwise you don’t do it.”

    I think we can rule out “naive”, as some have claimed. This was far more willfully defiant. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,443
    I think we can rule out “naive”, as some have claimed. This was far more willfully defiant. 
    I think some may have supposed "naive" in the absence of anything else concrete. obviously now we know that's not the case. 
    Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall




  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,048
    Idiot comes to mind....you would have to be stupid to think they would understand English.
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
    The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,362
    Idiot comes to mind....you would have to be stupid to think they would understand English.
    English no
    Jesus and the bible YES!
  • AnnafalkAnnafalk Sweden Posts: 4,004
    He was clearly obsessed.
  • jeffbrjeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    Idiot is right. Glad he's not around to hassle the natives anymore and potentially disrupt their existence. Hopefully other religious zealots will learn something from this, but his type of religious fervor borders on psychosis as far as I'm concerned. Most of these evangelical missionary efforts are at best misguided. But some are clearly dangerous and delusional. The idea that he could land on an island, tell the people in English that Jesus loves them, and expect to "save their souls" is completely idiotic. No sympathy here. Only disgust.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,606
    I think we can rule out “naive”, as some have claimed. This was far more willfully defiant. 
    He was clearly an asshole.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,048
    jeffbr said:
    Idiot is right. Glad he's not around to hassle the natives anymore and potentially disrupt their existence. Hopefully other religious zealots will learn something from this, but his type of religious fervor borders on psychosis as far as I'm concerned. Most of these evangelical missionary efforts are at best misguided. But some are clearly dangerous and delusional. The idea that he could land on an island, tell the people in English that Jesus loves them, and expect to "save their souls" is completely idiotic. No sympathy here. Only disgust.
    A few hundred years ago we would have loaded up some ships and annihilated the tribe.  MAGA
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
    The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Reading that and all I can say is "what a fucking idiot".
    Either an idiot or severely mentally disturbed.

    “God, I don’t want to die,” Chau scrawled in his journal while sitting in a fishing boat off the coast of the island where the North Sentinelese people live, shortly before he was killed. “WHO WILL TAKE MY PLACE IF I DO?”

    Hopefully noone will take your place.....
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,409
    edited November 2018
    PJ_SOUL REDEEMED!
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 44,144

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    mickeyrat said:

    LOL
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    Trump's gonna have dudes with spears on the Mexican border lol
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    my2hands said:
    Trump's gonna have dudes with spears on the Mexican border lol
    LOL
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • mickeyrat said:


    hahahahahaha
    "My brain's a good brain!"
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