Viruses / Vaccines 2

mickeyrat

JB16057 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

JB16057 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

china isn't actively vaccinating their population. they are going to be an outlier here. 

3,180,000,000 vaccinations administered. How is that “isn’t actively vaccinating their population?”

If those numbers are true, that means that about 87.4% of their population is vaccinated. That seems really high if they are having to enforce more lock downs.

 

What leads you to believe that they’re not true?

They are going back into lock downs when the a big portion of their population is vaccinated. Either the vaccine isn't working or the numbers aren't real. And it is China.....

THEIR vaccine....

HughFreakingDillon

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

china isn't actively vaccinating their population. they are going to be an outlier here. 

3,180,000,000 vaccinations administered. How is that “isn’t actively vaccinating their population?”

I read bad info

JB16057

mickeyrat said:

JB16057 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

JB16057 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

china isn't actively vaccinating their population. they are going to be an outlier here. 

3,180,000,000 vaccinations administered. How is that “isn’t actively vaccinating their population?”

If those numbers are true, that means that about 87.4% of their population is vaccinated. That seems really high if they are having to enforce more lock downs.

 

What leads you to believe that they’re not true?

They are going back into lock downs when the a big portion of their population is vaccinated. Either the vaccine isn't working or the numbers aren't real. And it is China.....

THEIR vaccine....

Fair enough. Their vaccine....

JB16057

More than 1.1 billion Chinese people -- or nearly 80% of the population -- have been fully inoculated, mostly with inactivated vaccines developed by Sinopharm and Sinovac. But their efficacy was found to be much lower than the mRNA shots, and studies suggest the immunity provided by the Chinese vaccines wanes rapidly.

According to the World Health Organization, Sinovac's vaccine CoronaVac was just 51% effective at preventing symptomatic disease against the original variant, while Sinopharm was 79%. In comparison, the efficacy of mRNA vaccines developed by Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna were as high as 95%.

And a Hong Kong study published in The Lancet in June found that health workers fully vaccinated with BioNTech's mRNA shot had about 10 times the amount of antibodies than those who received Sinovac's inactivated vaccine.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/13/china/china-western-mrna-vaccine-mic-intl-hnk/index.html

HughFreakingDillon

yes, I mis-remembered that they were not vaccinating with mRNA vaccines, not no vaccines. my bad. 

Smellyman

China's Sinovac vaccine sucksass. 

never go China brand.

Halifax2TheMax

Smellyman said:

China's Sinovac vaccine sucksass. 

never go China brand.

I read that they performed poorly on preventing covid and symptoms but did keep you out of the hospital, unless you were 60+. According to Reuters reporting.

Go Beavers

JB16057 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

china isn't actively vaccinating their population. they are going to be an outlier here. 

3,180,000,000 vaccinations administered. How is that “isn’t actively vaccinating their population?”

If those numbers are true, that means that about 87.4% of their population is vaccinated. That seems really high if they are having to enforce more lock downs.

 

It's a zero Covid policy combined with a totalitarian government.

tempo_n_groove

If people start dying instead of just cases then I would be worried.

static111

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

Poncier

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

But without a 4th dose, Pfizer's huge profits will wane,

static111

Poncier said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

But without a 4th dose, Pfizer's huge profits will wane,

I thought this as well but didn't want to be labeled an anti vax conspiracist

Poncier

static111 said:

Poncier said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

But without a 4th dose, Pfizer's huge profits will wane,

I thought this as well but didn't want to be labeled an anti vax conspiracist

I am not anti vax (have had 3 shots), but when it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

We shouldn't take the recommendations of the CEO of a pharma company on whether or not we need more of his hugely profitable medicine, we should wait until the health experts/CDC/NIAID etc. make that determination.

RunIntoTheRain

https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20220317002651320

S. Korea's new COVID-19 cases spike to over 600,000 amid omicron spread

Go Beavers

static111 said:

Poncier said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

But without a 4th dose, Pfizer's huge profits will wane,

I thought this as well but didn't want to be labeled an anti vax conspiracist

Having a for-profit healthcare system, and recognizing that fact, isn’t a conspiracy. 

mickeyrat

RunIntoTheRain said:

https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20220317002651320

S. Korea's new COVID-19 cases spike to over 600,000 amid omicron spread

hit late January. should follow same trends as elsewhere. 

mace1229

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

I’m reading that the elderly population is vaccine hesitant while 12-17 year olds are vaxxed at a rate of 91%+. Regardless, locking down 9 million people to protect the 14% of the unvaccinated population doesn’t seem unreasonable when you consider its Chy-Na, which apparently is a Q code from POOTWH and refers to Ukraine. Maybe we ought to send over the Freedumb Truckers to set them straight?

Who knows? Maybe it’s an excuse to further fuck with the supply chain and drive US inflation? I’m also reading there’s another variant, the head of Pfizer says another booster or 4th shot will be necessary and that sewage is indicating new increases in covid. I don’t think we’re out of the woods yet so I’m not leaving my mom’s basement any time soon.

I listened to the interview and the Pfizer CEO said (paraphrasing here) that 2 or 3 doses is still fine against hospitalization and death.  But is pushing for the 4th to control the spread.  It seems ridiculous to me that if we have good protection from death and hospitalization to get a 4th shot that will wane in its effectiveness in preventing transmission. Then again I have really only been worried about avoiding hospitalization and death.

.And this is why Pfizer didn’t take up front money with operation warp speed, but took an agreement to sell doses to the government. The government can’t claim part ownership if they didn’t advance money for the development, and Pfizer can sell doses for eternity.

Zod

Data seems limited, but most things I've read seem to indicate both the vaccine's and natural immunity wane.  Moderna seems to be the most robust, but it still wanes.   Plus the vaccines are getting more and more obsolete.  They were designed for the original strain, so their ability to prevent infection has greatly been reduced, but their ability to prevent bad cases of covid is still strong.

So this would seem to be an ongoing problem unless vaccine's improve.  After about 6 months vaccine and natural immunity has greatly waned.  So unless better vaccine's come out, isn't the booster thing going to be an issue for a while?  Unless Covid keeps mutating into less lethal strains.

I guess too.. even if protection has waned, your body must at least remember some of the way to fight the virus, so maybe it's not quite as bad as never been vaccinated or infected.

mrussel1

Zod said:

Data seems limited, but most things I've read seem to indicate both the vaccine's and natural immunity wane.  Moderna seems to be the most robust, but it still wanes.   Plus the vaccines are getting more and more obsolete.  They were designed for the original strain, so their ability to prevent infection has greatly been reduced, but their ability to prevent bad cases of covid is still strong.

So this would seem to be an ongoing problem unless vaccine's improve.  After about 6 months vaccine and natural immunity has greatly waned.  So unless better vaccine's come out, isn't the booster thing going to be an issue for a while?  Unless Covid keeps mutating into less lethal strains.

I guess too.. even if protection has waned, your body must at least remember some of the way to fight the virus, so maybe it's not quite as bad as never been vaccinated or infected.

Aren't we all prepared for an annual shot, like the flu?  That strain changes yearly and annual shots are recommended.  I think this will be the same.  

HughFreakingDillon

mrussel1 said:

Zod said:

Data seems limited, but most things I've read seem to indicate both the vaccine's and natural immunity wane.  Moderna seems to be the most robust, but it still wanes.   Plus the vaccines are getting more and more obsolete.  They were designed for the original strain, so their ability to prevent infection has greatly been reduced, but their ability to prevent bad cases of covid is still strong.

So this would seem to be an ongoing problem unless vaccine's improve.  After about 6 months vaccine and natural immunity has greatly waned.  So unless better vaccine's come out, isn't the booster thing going to be an issue for a while?  Unless Covid keeps mutating into less lethal strains.

I guess too.. even if protection has waned, your body must at least remember some of the way to fight the virus, so maybe it's not quite as bad as never been vaccinated or infected.

Aren't we all prepared for an annual shot, like the flu?  That strain changes yearly and annual shots are recommended.  I think this will be the same.  

agreed. experts believe when it becomes endemic, it will also be more seasonal, so the protection of 6 + or - months will be good enough to get through the covid season.