support the troop 100%...have a few friends enlisted serving and not serving anymore
they do alot more than fight wars, but if asked to fight they go and do their job whether the war is just or not...most that i talk to dont even have this mentality if the war is just or not, just the lazy average american sitting at home doing nothing with their lives, whom if you ask the average person on the street they couldnt even tell you who the president is
the troops help to preserve the first amendment right that Ed takes advantage of at almost every show, as much as it gets annoying, he has that right but i hope he remembers who preserves that right each time he spews his rhetoric
the troops help to preserve the first amendment right that Ed takes advantage of at almost every show, as much as it gets annoying, he has that right but i hope he remembers who preserves that right each time he spews his rhetoric
how do troops help preserve first amendment rights?????
THAT is rhetoric.
the supreme court upholds first amendment rights, not the military.
I'm late to this discussion but I've read the first three pages and saw several replies that brought up Ed's right to say what he said then calling the OP a hypocrite when he/she mentioned the good ol' U S of A....
One thing...
While Ed and everyone else certainliy has the right to say what they want, it does not mean it is right nor does it mean everyone agrees with it. The right of people to disagree is also one of the most important in our country.
I don't think the OP ever said Ed should not have been allowed to say what he said, the OP just disagreed with it.
The tired old lecture about everybody having the right to say whatever they want whenever they want has been plainly explained by so many on here that we don't need to hear it anymore.....especially not when his right to say whatever you want is not what was in question to start with
By the way, if PJ doesn't want the Marines recruiting at their concerts that's fine by me.
All I have to do is revel in the everyday....then do it again tomorrow
They say every sin is deadly but I believe they may be wrong...I'm guilty of all seven and I don't feel too bad at all
Supporting the troops is not the same thing as supporting the administration. Blindly supporting what Bush has done is ridiculous. Not one person can say we are better off having gone to Iraq. Anyone that does is just covering their ass for a bad decision they made in the past.
That being said, there's very little more honorable than risking your life for your country
MANSFIELD 7/3/03, 7/11/03
BOSTON 9/28/04, 9/29/04
HARTFORD 5/13/06
BOSTON 5/24/06
MANSFIELD 6/28/08, 6/30/08
EV BOSTON 8/1/08, 8/2/08
CHICAGO 8/24/09
HARTFORD 5/15/10
BOSTON 5/17/10
EV PROV 6/15/11
WORCESTER 10/15/13, 10/16/13
HARTFORD 10/25/13
I know I will probably receive some slack for this but it been on my mind for a few days so here it goes. A few days ago i got the Mansfield 2(great show!). I found what Ed said after whipping to be a bit out of line and it sort of pissed me off. If you do know what he said here is a abbreviated summary. After rocking out whipping he talks about a marine recruiting person being at the first Mansfield show. He then states how some of his best friends are marines and ex-marines and how he supports their work. He goes on to say that he has a relationship with the people there to see the gig and he felt that the marine recruiter there was trying to get them to "bite a poison apple" and "these are our people and we're trying to take care of them", "so there is no marine recruiting center out there, its gone". Ok now I am sure theres a good chance that the marines where not going to get anyone to sign up for the marines at a Pearl Jam concert but what was the harm in having them there? Its those marines and other armed forces branches that fight and die so that Ed can verbally criticize the leaders of the country he lives in. Go to Iran Ed and say some shit about their leaders in front of 15,000 of their citizens, see how that works out for ya. Its those great people that helped rescues victims of hurricane Katrina. Its those great people that keep our country safe ect ect. Now why would Ed want to prevent people from signing up for the marines? (no matter how small the contribution) The armed forces of today rely on future personnel to relieve them in time of war and relief, learn new things and ways to aid them in future conflicts, and to make them more stronger and safer in the numbers ect. Low recruiting numbers effect the troops of today in a very negative way and it angers me Ed contributes to that. Its like we should all thank him for the marine recruiter removal because we all agree with what Eddie thinks. Are there really that many puppets at the shows that Eddie can assume we all wanted the removal? If he felt that bad about a recruiter being there, fine, have them removed for the 2nd show, but dont announce it and assume we all think your a hero for doing so. I think Ed needs to lay off the bottles of wine and watch what he says at shows. It may come back to him some day. I applaud and respect the men and women who want to join the armed forces. I hope the keep doing it, in great numbers. They are the only reason our country safe with leaders like this.
Maybe Ed knows this and is very concerned...
The Department of Defense statistics are alarming — one in three women who join the US military will be sexually assaulted or raped by men in the military.
Department of Defense (DOD), which declared that nearly one-third of a nationwide sample of female veterans seeking health care through the V.A. said they experienced rape or attempted rape during their service. Of that group, 37 percent said they were raped multiple times, and 14 percent reported they were gang-raped
Supporting the troops is not the same thing as supporting the administration. Blindly supporting what Bush has done is ridiculous. Not one person can say we are better off having gone to Iraq. Anyone that does is just covering their ass for a bad decision they made in the past.
That being said, there's very little more honorable than risking your life for your country
supporting the troops is certainly not the same as supporting marine recruitment at a rock concert :cool:
The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).
Ed is acting like an full-fledged American with all his rights. This does not make America a more dangerous place for you and I. Imho, fear of not appeasing all those in power makes America a more dangerous place for you and I.
yeah Ed is making this country more dangerous-what a joke
dont take his politics personally-in fact dont take anyones politics personally
Best advice anyone could give my friend. Choose your own path and make your own educated choices I say. I support my fellow troops and also find great dissatisfaction in war and the current one and have no faith in the administration at current. However, I appreciate and respect the men and Women who serve there country under all circumstances regardless.
supporting the troops is certainly not the same as supporting marine recruitment at a rock concert :cool:
I totally agree. It was a good move on Ed's part to ensure that it didn't occur on the second show night. It's against what the band is going for so if he can wield that power of choice then I say so bit it.
We need our Military.
We need people, like EV, to criticize their actions when necessary.
We need each other.
Make your argument coherently. Avoid name calling and anger.
"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).
that's not an explanation, really.
how would we not have free speech if it weren't for the military? If there were NO militaries, EVERYONE would have free speech. Hell, I can't even figure out why we have borders.
and I agree with H.Helen- "supporting the troops" is NOT the same as supporting recruitment at a rock concert.
I don't try to recruit for MY job at a rock concert, and my job doesn't even involve death.
how would we not have free speech if it weren't for the military? If there were NO militaries, EVERYONE would have free speech. Hell, I can't even figure out why we have borders.
and I agree with H.Helen- "supporting the troops" is NOT the same as supporting recruitment at a rock concert.
I don't try to recruit for MY job at a rock concert, and my job doesn't even involve death.
It's a very clear explanation. That oath has been the basis since inception of the Constitution. You stated that you didn't see how the military protects the amendments rights correct? You view is skewed and an opinion and not based on facts. I am truly try to explain to you, not belittle or attack you in any way so please do not take any offense.
It is a fact that the oath I Noted is not an oath to defend any specific territory or persons or property. This is an oath to defend the Constitution of the United States. The entire purpose and the commitment that armed forces and militias have taken and served to preserve and ensure to this very day. Many american armed forces have died for your rights and to further them. Do not ever take that for granted please.
The question is once Bush is out of the office?
what the f.... is Ed going to have to complain about then????????
The past years, tours and LP's thats all he bitch's about!!!!!!!
Kind of getting old to hear this stuff ever show.......
Its cool to believe in something but now its become brain washing......
I am sure he will find something, kind of what he does.....
But with that said I love Pearl Jam and ED keep on rocking....
Ed had as much right to say what he said as you had to post that. Not to mention the fact that the Marines recruiting outside a PJ gig could affect the PJ brand. If he didn't agree with it, he was right to speak out about it - anyone who can be persuaded not to sign up by a short, drunken Eddie rant probably shouldn't sign up in the first place.
there's your answer....
to the threader: the most common response without understanding this whole topic is your's. People are too sensitive in this country and don't realize that most organizations have agenda's, even the military. Most soldiers are working with good intention, and may the best come to them. But we should probably be spending more time on our land than others'.
Meadowlands, MSG 1, MSG 2 - '98 Jones Beach NY 1 + 3 - '00 MSG 1 + 2 - '03 Boston Garden - '04 Montreal - '05 Boston Garden 1, Meadowlands 1 + 2 - '06 Mansfield 1 - '08 (EV solo) Boston 1 - '08 Chicago 1 - '09 MSG -'10 Brooklyn 1+2 - '13 Central Park - '15 MSG - '16 Fenway - '16 Wrigley - '16 (RRHOF) Brooklyn - '17 Fenway - '18 MSG - '22
I know I will probably receive some slack for this but it been on my mind for a few days so here it goes. A few days ago i got the Mansfield 2(great show!). I found what Ed said after whipping to be a bit out of line and it sort of pissed me off. If you do know what he said here is a abbreviated summary. After rocking out whipping he talks about a marine recruiting person being at the first Mansfield show. He then states how some of his best friends are marines and ex-marines and how he supports their work. He goes on to say that he has a relationship with the people there to see the gig and he felt that the marine recruiter there was trying to get them to "bite a poison apple" and "these are our people and we're trying to take care of them", "so there is no marine recruiting center out there, its gone". Ok now I am sure theres a good chance that the marines where not going to get anyone to sign up for the marines at a Pearl Jam concert but what was the harm in having them there? Its those marines and other armed forces branches that fight and die so that Ed can verbally criticize the leaders of the country he lives in. Go to Iran Ed and say some shit about their leaders in front of 15,000 of their citizens, see how that works out for ya. Its those great people that helped rescues victims of hurricane Katrina. Its those great people that keep our country safe ect ect. Now why would Ed want to prevent people from signing up for the marines? (no matter how small the contribution) The armed forces of today rely on future personnel to relieve them in time of war and relief, learn new things and ways to aid them in future conflicts, and to make them more stronger and safer in the numbers ect. Low recruiting numbers effect the troops of today in a very negative way and it angers me Ed contributes to that. Its like we should all thank him for the marine recruiter removal because we all agree with what Eddie thinks. Are there really that many puppets at the shows that Eddie can assume we all wanted the removal? If he felt that bad about a recruiter being there, fine, have them removed for the 2nd show, but dont announce it and assume we all think your a hero for doing so. I think Ed needs to lay off the bottles of wine and watch what he says at shows. It may come back to him some day. I applaud and respect the men and women who want to join the armed forces. I hope the keep doing it, in great numbers. They are the only reason our country safe with leaders like this.
Yes, yes, yes recruiters have a job to do, but young men attending a concert are not really in the best frame of mind to make a balanced and informed decision about something as important as handing over their future and possibly even their life.
agreed... they had no problem getting people during WWII
Yeah, because there was a draft ... lol
I kind of see both sides of the issue here.
Ed doesn't want Marines recruiting at his show. That's his prerogative.
But by the same token all his talk about "I have friends in the military, so I respect the job" seems incredibly disingenuous to me.
It's kind of like those people who will make a racist joke and then say, "It's OK, some of my best friends are black."
Judging by things he's said in the past, Ed doesn't respect the military and he doesn't respect their mission. He (paternalistically) believes they were all duped into joining up. I can imagine how that might be considered incredibly insulting to those who actually believe in what they're doing. Ed thinks they are stupid and need to be protected ... by him, I guess.
But that said ... if Ed doesn't want the Marines at his show, by all means have them evicted from the premises. That's his right.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Yes, yes, yes recruiters have a job to do, but young men attending a concert are not really in the best frame of mind to make a balanced and informed decision about something as important as handing over their future and possibly even their life.
So damn true. Recruiters treat new recruits like slabs of meat. They tell them whatever they wanna hear to get those stats up. A concert is no place for such a thing and only shows absolute desperation in my view.
Many american armed forces have died for your rights and to further them. Do not ever take that for granted please.
outside of...the revolutionary and civil wars...what wars has the US been involved in where our rights have been threatened? certainly not the current one.
Ed has every right to say what he wants to say about that Marine recruiting station. Iraq is about as dangerous as it gets, and it was our war that made it dangerous. As bad as Saddam was, at least he had control of his country, so from a U.S. standpoint, he pretty much prevented anti-U.S. terrorists from gaining strength in his country. Now it's chaos. A terrorist breeding ground.
Thoughts?
Wait. Let me get this straight. You think Saddam prevented terrorism against the U.S?
Wow.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
outside of...the revolutionary and civil wars...what wars has the US been involved in where our rights have been threatened? certainly not the current one.
WWII. That was kind of a big one.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Ed doesn't want Marines recruiting at his show. That's his prerogative.
But by the same token all his talk about "I have friends in the military, so I respect the job" seems incredibly disingenuous to me.
It's kind of like those people who will make a racist joke and then say, "It's OK, some of my best friends are black."
Judging by things he's said in the past, Ed doesn't respect the military and he doesn't respect their mission. He (paternalistically) believes they were all duped into joining up. I can imagine how that might be considered incredibly insulting to those who actually believe in what they're doing. Ed thinks they are stupid and need to be protected ... by him, I guess.
But that said ... if Ed doesn't want the Marines at his show, by all means have them evicted from the premises. That's his right.
I think Ed basically means "I have friends in the military and I don't want them to die."
I have relatives in the military, and if I'm being 100% honest, don't fully respect their career decision. but I don't want them to die.
outside of...the revolutionary and civil wars...what wars has the US been involved in where our rights have been threatened? certainly not the current one.
That again is an opinion. All armed forces at all costs preserve that right regardless. Semantics aside, that is fact. It should not be taken for granted just because you disagree with the current war which I disagree with as well. You cna argue it till your blue in the face but it will not change anything. We can agree to disagree as you have made your mind up without concern for the truth as it is. I originally was pissed when I read your first post that I felt absurd, then I took a breath and stood back and looked at your point of view. While Not agreeing with you I can understand your views and respect them. But what is and what a view is are two different things. You literally are stating that everything after the revolutionary and civil wars was a farce concerning protecting and preserving your rights though and that doesn't anger me. It saddens me. But hey, it's America after all. To each there own.
The biggest threat to the safety of americans after the fall of the nazi's and the cold war is not iran, iraq or afghanistan - it is itself. Most Americans have no idea how feared and loathed they are, and how their own actions/inaction has made it a pretty harsh place to live (at least the eastern half). Hope I never go back. I mean, most people think that the 'war' is for their own safe conduct = ridiculous.
Take Iran. Israel and the USA are leaders in exacting the tenets of nuclear non proliferation treatises from them. WTF? Both are nuclear powers. It's so glaringly hypocritical. The USA pumps huge dollars unconditonally to supporty Israel who MAY be committing war crimes in the middle east on your dollars. Hmmm, maybe that stirred up the 'bad guys', or maybe it was Eddie Vedder in Mansfield Mass. I doubt it, for all the storm troopers in the area I'd say things were prety much under control.
Comments
they do alot more than fight wars, but if asked to fight they go and do their job whether the war is just or not...most that i talk to dont even have this mentality if the war is just or not, just the lazy average american sitting at home doing nothing with their lives, whom if you ask the average person on the street they couldnt even tell you who the president is
the troops help to preserve the first amendment right that Ed takes advantage of at almost every show, as much as it gets annoying, he has that right but i hope he remembers who preserves that right each time he spews his rhetoric
how do troops help preserve first amendment rights?????
THAT is rhetoric.
the supreme court upholds first amendment rights, not the military.
Comments like that are absurd to say the least.
why don't you tell me why it's absurd then?
One thing...
While Ed and everyone else certainliy has the right to say what they want, it does not mean it is right nor does it mean everyone agrees with it. The right of people to disagree is also one of the most important in our country.
I don't think the OP ever said Ed should not have been allowed to say what he said, the OP just disagreed with it.
The tired old lecture about everybody having the right to say whatever they want whenever they want has been plainly explained by so many on here that we don't need to hear it anymore.....especially not when his right to say whatever you want is not what was in question to start with
By the way, if PJ doesn't want the Marines recruiting at their concerts that's fine by me.
They say every sin is deadly but I believe they may be wrong...I'm guilty of all seven and I don't feel too bad at all
That being said, there's very little more honorable than risking your life for your country
BOSTON 9/28/04, 9/29/04
HARTFORD 5/13/06
BOSTON 5/24/06
MANSFIELD 6/28/08, 6/30/08
EV BOSTON 8/1/08, 8/2/08
CHICAGO 8/24/09
HARTFORD 5/15/10
BOSTON 5/17/10
EV PROV 6/15/11
WORCESTER 10/15/13, 10/16/13
HARTFORD 10/25/13
Maybe Ed knows this and is very concerned...
The Department of Defense statistics are alarming — one in three women who join the US military will be sexually assaulted or raped by men in the military.
Department of Defense (DOD), which declared that nearly one-third of a nationwide sample of female veterans seeking health care through the V.A. said they experienced rape or attempted rape during their service. Of that group, 37 percent said they were raped multiple times, and 14 percent reported they were gang-raped
Verona??? it's all surmountable
Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
Wembley? We all believe!
Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
Chicago 07? And love
What a different life
Had I not found this love with you
The wordings of the current oath of enlistment
"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).
dont take his politics personally-in fact dont take anyones politics personally
Best advice anyone could give my friend. Choose your own path and make your own educated choices I say. I support my fellow troops and also find great dissatisfaction in war and the current one and have no faith in the administration at current. However, I appreciate and respect the men and Women who serve there country under all circumstances regardless.
I totally agree. It was a good move on Ed's part to ensure that it didn't occur on the second show night. It's against what the band is going for so if he can wield that power of choice then I say so bit it.
We need people, like EV, to criticize their actions when necessary.
We need each other.
Make your argument coherently. Avoid name calling and anger.
that's not an explanation, really.
how would we not have free speech if it weren't for the military? If there were NO militaries, EVERYONE would have free speech. Hell, I can't even figure out why we have borders.
and I agree with H.Helen- "supporting the troops" is NOT the same as supporting recruitment at a rock concert.
I don't try to recruit for MY job at a rock concert, and my job doesn't even involve death.
It's a very clear explanation. That oath has been the basis since inception of the Constitution. You stated that you didn't see how the military protects the amendments rights correct? You view is skewed and an opinion and not based on facts. I am truly try to explain to you, not belittle or attack you in any way so please do not take any offense.
It is a fact that the oath I Noted is not an oath to defend any specific territory or persons or property. This is an oath to defend the Constitution of the United States. The entire purpose and the commitment that armed forces and militias have taken and served to preserve and ensure to this very day. Many american armed forces have died for your rights and to further them. Do not ever take that for granted please.
what the f.... is Ed going to have to complain about then????????
The past years, tours and LP's thats all he bitch's about!!!!!!!
Kind of getting old to hear this stuff ever show.......
Its cool to believe in something but now its become brain washing......
I am sure he will find something, kind of what he does.....
But with that said I love Pearl Jam and ED keep on rocking....
there's your answer....
to the threader: the most common response without understanding this whole topic is your's. People are too sensitive in this country and don't realize that most organizations have agenda's, even the military. Most soldiers are working with good intention, and may the best come to them. But we should probably be spending more time on our land than others'.
Jones Beach NY 1 + 3 - '00
MSG 1 + 2 - '03
Boston Garden - '04
Montreal - '05
Boston Garden 1, Meadowlands 1 + 2 - '06
Mansfield 1 - '08
(EV solo) Boston 1 - '08
Chicago 1 - '09
MSG -'10
Brooklyn 1+2 - '13
Central Park - '15
MSG - '16
Fenway - '16
Wrigley - '16
(RRHOF) Brooklyn - '17
Fenway - '18
MSG - '22
Yes, yes, yes recruiters have a job to do, but young men attending a concert are not really in the best frame of mind to make a balanced and informed decision about something as important as handing over their future and possibly even their life.
Yeah, because there was a draft ... lol
I kind of see both sides of the issue here.
Ed doesn't want Marines recruiting at his show. That's his prerogative.
But by the same token all his talk about "I have friends in the military, so I respect the job" seems incredibly disingenuous to me.
It's kind of like those people who will make a racist joke and then say, "It's OK, some of my best friends are black."
Judging by things he's said in the past, Ed doesn't respect the military and he doesn't respect their mission. He (paternalistically) believes they were all duped into joining up. I can imagine how that might be considered incredibly insulting to those who actually believe in what they're doing. Ed thinks they are stupid and need to be protected ... by him, I guess.
But that said ... if Ed doesn't want the Marines at his show, by all means have them evicted from the premises. That's his right.
for the least they could possibly do
So damn true. Recruiters treat new recruits like slabs of meat. They tell them whatever they wanna hear to get those stats up. A concert is no place for such a thing and only shows absolute desperation in my view.
outside of...the revolutionary and civil wars...what wars has the US been involved in where our rights have been threatened? certainly not the current one.
Wait. Let me get this straight. You think Saddam prevented terrorism against the U.S?
Wow.
for the least they could possibly do
WWII. That was kind of a big one.
for the least they could possibly do
I think Ed basically means "I have friends in the military and I don't want them to die."
I have relatives in the military, and if I'm being 100% honest, don't fully respect their career decision. but I don't want them to die.
That again is an opinion. All armed forces at all costs preserve that right regardless. Semantics aside, that is fact. It should not be taken for granted just because you disagree with the current war which I disagree with as well. You cna argue it till your blue in the face but it will not change anything. We can agree to disagree as you have made your mind up without concern for the truth as it is. I originally was pissed when I read your first post that I felt absurd, then I took a breath and stood back and looked at your point of view. While Not agreeing with you I can understand your views and respect them. But what is and what a view is are two different things. You literally are stating that everything after the revolutionary and civil wars was a farce concerning protecting and preserving your rights though and that doesn't anger me. It saddens me. But hey, it's America after all. To each there own.
Peace, John
Take Iran. Israel and the USA are leaders in exacting the tenets of nuclear non proliferation treatises from them. WTF? Both are nuclear powers. It's so glaringly hypocritical. The USA pumps huge dollars unconditonally to supporty Israel who MAY be committing war crimes in the middle east on your dollars. Hmmm, maybe that stirred up the 'bad guys', or maybe it was Eddie Vedder in Mansfield Mass. I doubt it, for all the storm troopers in the area I'd say things were prety much under control.
Well, that's nice of him, I guess.
for the least they could possibly do