Fan to Fan Ticket Exchange
Comments
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One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?Post edited by rustneversleeps on0 -
This band's fan base travels. This won't change. A way to combat these issues is to only provide tickets to fans within various zip codes close in proximity to a show. This would hurt fans in areas where they rarely play, yes. However, creativity could take over and I am sure solutions for that could also be thought of.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?0 -
I'm not sure what the fan base traveling has to do with people buying tickets they have no intention of using.cmalisze said:
This band's fan base travels. This won't change. A way to combat these issues is to only provide tickets to fans within various zip codes close in proximity to a show. This would hurt fans in areas where they rarely play, yes. However, creativity could take over and I am sure solutions for that could also be thought of.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?0 -
My dog doesn’t have an account but is a huge fan of the band.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?1996.....Toronto
2005.....Hamilton
2011.....Toronto N1, Toronto N2, Hamilton
2013.....London, Buffalo
2014.....Detroit
2016.....Toronto N1 Toronto N2, Boston N1, Boston N2, Chicago N1
2018.....Seattle N1, Seattle N2
2022.....San Diego, Los Angeles N1, Los Angeles N2, Phoenix, Oakland N1, Oakland N2, Quebec City, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto
2023.....Fort Worth N1, Fort Worth N2, Austin N1, Austin N2
2024.....Las Vegas N1, Las Vegas N2, Los Angeles N1, Los Angeles N2, Boston N1, Boston N2
2025.....Raleigh N1, Raleigh N2, Pittsburgh N1, Pittsburgh N2
2026.....?????????????????????????????????????????0 -
what are you waiting for?D-Rod said:
My dog doesn’t have an account but is a huge fan of the band.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?0 -
cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel0 -
Fan to Fan was promised to ticket buyers before they made their purchases. I don't disagree that buying tickets you aren't going to use isn't a good idea, but what was promised should be delivered.
Also, since the clear expectation is that we will travel wherever they play, people's plans will always change at the last minute. There are kids, elderly parents, work commitments, and a million other things that might prevent someone from flying to Fresno for a concert.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel0 -
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel0 -
replace "dont need" with "have no intention of using". make sense now? i dont see your point, no. you dont have one.cmalisze said:
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travelPost edited by rustneversleeps on0 -
I live in IL. I have someone willing to trade me a PJ20 mural for 1 ticket to MSG. I want the PJ20 mural. Therefore I NEED 1 ticket to USE in a trade. Currently I could potentially pull this off if I lived in Asia but had no intention of ATTENDING the show. Theoretically by living closer to a venue there is a greater chance of ATTENDING a show. Hence my solution to alleviate the stress on tickets. You sure I don't have a point?rustneversleeps said:
replace "dont need" with "have no intention of using". make sense now? i dont see your point, no. you dont have one.cmalisze said:
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel0 -
potentially, theoretically....cmalisze said:
I live in IL. I have someone willing to trade me a PJ20 mural for 1 ticket to MSG. I want the PJ20 mural. Therefore I NEED 1 ticket to USE in a trade. Currently I could potentially pull this off if I lived in Asia but had no intention of ATTENDING the show. Theoretically by living closer to a venue there is a greater chance of ATTENDING a show. Hence my solution to alleviate the stress on tickets. You sure I don't have a point?rustneversleeps said:
replace "dont need" with "have no intention of using". make sense now? i dont see your point, no. you dont have one.cmalisze said:
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel
you have a point, a ridiculous one, but a point none the less0 -
Asia0
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Heat of the MomentOrustneversleeps said:AsiaMarquee 91
Wetlands 91
CBGB 91
Roseland 91
and many, many more0 -
My dog was a member back in 1992 but forgot to renew.D-Rod said:
My dog doesn’t have an account but is a huge fan of the band.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 (#25) | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park 2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2025: Raleigh0 -
Has no one seen my avatar? I clearly am a dog.___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."0 -
whats a 10C Friends and Family Plan without the dog?on2legs said:
My dog was a member back in 1992 but forgot to renew.D-Rod said:
My dog doesn’t have an account but is a huge fan of the band.rustneversleeps said:
One thing fans could do is stop buying tickets they aren’t going to use. Instead of bitching. I know life gets in the way in some cases, but the amount of tickets i see people scrambling to get rid of almost immediately after they get them is ridiculous. And how many of them are actually already going, but the tickets they “cant use anymore” are the extra pair(s) they won with their spouses accounts, who don't even like the band. Or their dogs account. Or one of the other extra accounts they have.mpedone said:danofun said:mpedone said:I am curious about the need to blame PJ for all of this. To what end? Let's say everyone agrees that this was the band's decision. What then?It is a free market economy and PJ is solely providing the product we so desperately desire. They have the right to charge whatever they want for a concert ticket. Instead of gouging concert-goers, PJ has historically offered reasonably priced tickets to the 10C and public while remaining a staunch advocate for fan access to reasonably priced tickets.In 2020, PJ wrote a letter to the Committee on Energy and Commerce opposing the Better Oversight of Secondary Sales and Accountability in Concert Ticketing (BOSS Act). The complete letter can be found here and it opens:We write to you as one of the biggest touring bands of the last three decades. We also write to you as the working musicians and the MUSIC FANS we were for years before that. We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.WE KNOW HOW TO SERVICE TICKETS TO OUR FANS. Only a few artists in our profession have worked to provide tickets directly to fans. We developed a system for our fan club outside of public sales. For almost thirty years, we have learned from our successes and failures; we have real time experience making sure people buying our tickets actually attend the shows and do not merely sell seats at a markup. We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
One of their stated reasons for opossing the bill was becasue it would “blocks non-transferable ticketing”. PJ's primary gripe seemed to be with profiting on the secondary ticket market. In 2020, PJ and TM launched their Fan to Fan ticket soution which promised to keep tickets off the secondary market and relied on tickets remaining non-transferable. It would be difficult to call the 2020 Fan to Fan solution anything but a success.The rub comes from the apparent about face in 2022. By blocking ticket transfers and Fan to Fan Sales, PJ and TM have succeeded in completely eliminated a secondary market. As we have seen over the past few weeks regarding the east coast shows, plenty of tickets were withheld from the 10C, Verified Fan, and public sales. Additionally, plenty of ticketholders are looking to unload thier in-hand tickets, at face value, but are restricted from doing so. Instead, these withheld, PJ/TM controlled tickets are being sold as "PJ Premium," which come with zero additional perks and are offered at extreme price points.We are sympathetic to fans who haven't seen their favorite acts and who mistakenly believe that artists and promoters who are driving prices up through manufactured scarcity.
We haven't forgotten what it is like to hunger and work so hard to see our favorite bands and as a result, we have worked continuously to ensure our fans can see our shows at a reasonable cost.
Make no mistake, what we are seeing out of our beloved band and TM is nothing other "manufactured scarcity" and tickets being sold at completely unreasonable costs.No man for any considerable period can wear one face to himself and another to the multitude, without finally getting bewildered as to which may be the true. - Nathaniel Hawthorne
Okay, so what do you propose to do about it?0 -
Why do you think ridiculous? I'm agreeing with you that it would be easier if folks only put in for shows they would attend. We know fans travel and shows are hard to come by. My suggestion is in recognition of your point.rustneversleeps said:
potentially, theoretically....cmalisze said:
I live in IL. I have someone willing to trade me a PJ20 mural for 1 ticket to MSG. I want the PJ20 mural. Therefore I NEED 1 ticket to USE in a trade. Currently I could potentially pull this off if I lived in Asia but had no intention of ATTENDING the show. Theoretically by living closer to a venue there is a greater chance of ATTENDING a show. Hence my solution to alleviate the stress on tickets. You sure I don't have a point?rustneversleeps said:
replace "dont need" with "have no intention of using". make sense now? i dont see your point, no. you dont have one.cmalisze said:
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel
you have a point, a ridiculous one, but a point none the less0 -
The ‘they’ in your post is Ticketmaster.droptheleash9 said:I know we're not "owed" or "entitled" to anything but it is getting VERY frustrating that they haven't opened the Fan2Fan Exchange yet. I'm not sure what the hold up is or if the band even knows (or cares quite frankly) but a little communication goes a long way. I would imagine it has something to do with the fact that PJ Premium has been a flop in a number of cities (mainly CA) and they don't want to allow F2F sales at face value until more of the premium seats are sold. I hope I'm wrong in assuming that and that it's just a case of them not having their act together vs trying to prevent some fans from buying/selling tickets just to pedal a few extra seats at higher prices.0 -
I think it is ridiculous to suggest limiting shows to local zipcodes. Not even realistic. I suggested a start would be people stop buying tickets they arent going to use, only to be screaming for a ticket exchange a week later. you said something about fans traveling in response to that. I still dont know what that has to do with people buying tickets they dont use. then the point about what need is, and trading for a poster with someone from asia, i'm still lost. i guess all i'm saying is, the people screaming for a ticket exchange, in many cases bought tickets they had no business buying in the first place. its the neurotic pearl jam fan syndrome.cmalisze said:
Why do you think ridiculous? I'm agreeing with you that it would be easier if folks only put in for shows they would attend. We know fans travel and shows are hard to come by. My suggestion is in recognition of your point.rustneversleeps said:
potentially, theoretically....cmalisze said:
I live in IL. I have someone willing to trade me a PJ20 mural for 1 ticket to MSG. I want the PJ20 mural. Therefore I NEED 1 ticket to USE in a trade. Currently I could potentially pull this off if I lived in Asia but had no intention of ATTENDING the show. Theoretically by living closer to a venue there is a greater chance of ATTENDING a show. Hence my solution to alleviate the stress on tickets. You sure I don't have a point?rustneversleeps said:
replace "dont need" with "have no intention of using". make sense now? i dont see your point, no. you dont have one.cmalisze said:
Define need. You can't. I need MSG tickets to trade for a PJ20 Mural. See the point.rustneversleeps said:
the idea of limiting requests to zip codes so people stop buying tickets they dont need, it might be one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on here yet.Lerxst1992 said:cmalisze said:
Another point I've also considered. The remedy would be to limit requests to shows to zip codes within a certain perimeter. This would alleviate the nation-wide pressure per show for the reasons you've mentioned.DF220512 said:Long time lurker, but I'm going to post for fun. I agree with everything that has been said... but there is another perspective missing from this discussion. For decades, fan club members (not just of Pearl Jam, but other bands too) have used their early access/preferential treatment for tickets they knew they might not use (life could get in the way, they could score better seats through an alternate vendor, they could be used as trade-bait for shows they really wanted to get tickets to, etc.). Then, when tickets went on sale to the general public, non-fan club members didn't have access to those seats, still inflating the price of tickets on the secondary market against the band's wishes.
What TM and PJ are doing right now by inflating prices and by delaying us from "trading out" our tickets, will eventually render our seats worth less than face value closer to the show. This will have burned some of their fan club members (for this tour) who will be more cautious with what tickets they buy for future tours. With fan club members requesting less tickets, more will go on sale to the general public, lowering the cost of resale values (perhaps.)
Again, I type this as an angry fan who can't sell back tickets post-pandemic... but I do see how, in the long-term, it may fix two issues at the same time which ends up lowering prices and increasing availability for everyone... especially with as few tours these guys go on anymore.That could be viewed as another limitation to access shows for fans living near msg. We already get few shows per capita. For many of us the only option is to get in a car or plane and travel
you have a point, a ridiculous one, but a point none the less
and there is no reason to wait around for ticketmaster to wipe your ass for you. if you have tickets to sell, find someone who wants the tickets and figure it out. its not hard.0
This discussion has been closed.
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