why do you believe in God or...

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  • norm
    norm Posts: 31,146
    soulsinging wrote:
    that's what im saying. i do believe in god. i just believe in a god who is vastly different from the christian one. now, if the christians are right, and i show up at the pearly gates and god is asking me why i wasnt down with jesus, ill say it didnt make sense to me and i found a stronger faith in my own spiritual experiences. i will admit i was wrong though and if that isn't good enough, then it is a god i want no part of and im perfectly happy rotting in hell. i prefer that to spending eternity with a god who is as vain as paris hilton and cannot forgive anyone for picking the wrong manner of expressing their devotion.


    amen....;) :D
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    CorporateWhore wrote:
    Life is a miracle. Creation is a miracle. These things could not be present without goodness in the world. On the other hand, the world could exist without goodness, logically speaking. But, it exists WITH it. That is the work of God in our daily lives.

    In my view, God is the first cause and all creation was brought about because of His actions.

    If you are an atheist but God exists, you will spend eternity in hell because you had the opportunity to believe. If you believe in God and he doesn't exist, all you did was give up a little bit of your time to worship God and forego sin. What atheism really comes down to is selfishness - it's all about what I want.

    eh! so call me selfish! :rolleyes: I had kinda hoped that we wouldn't be put through hell here on this thread having to listen to your loopy theories and fire and brimstone.
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    Jeanie wrote:
    eh! so call me selfish! :rolleyes: I had kinda hoped that we wouldn't be put through hell here on this thread having to listen to your loopy theories and fire and brimstone.

    dont let it get to ya. if ya dont like his sermons, go to the sex thread and read about his love of premarital intercourse. it's a nice laugh to see the open hypocrisy.
  • CorporateWhore
    CorporateWhore Posts: 1,890
    Jeanie wrote:
    eh! so call me selfish! :rolleyes: I had kinda hoped that we wouldn't be put through hell here on this thread having to listen to your loopy theories and fire and brimstone.
    Yer mom is loopy
    All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    soulsinging wrote:
    that's what im saying. i do believe in god. i just believe in a god who is vastly different from the christian one. now, if the christians are right, and i show up at the pearly gates and god is asking me why i wasnt down with jesus, ill say it didnt make sense to me and i found a stronger faith in my own spiritual experiences. i will admit i was wrong though and if that isn't good enough, then it is a god i want no part of and im perfectly happy rotting in hell. i prefer that to spending eternity with a god who is as vain as paris hilton and cannot forgive anyone for picking the wrong manner of expressing their devotion.
    ok... you believe in god, just not the biblical one. no problem. i mean, if you'd rather rot in hell, as you say, and you've seemed to find stronger spiritual experiences. that's perfectly understandable in your point of view.

    the funny thing is the biblical God isn't such a dictator as you view it... although if that's how you view it and don't want to hear anymore of it that's ok too. but still you're not understanding what i'm telling you.... "cannot forgive anyone for picking the wrong manner of expressing their devotion" he's doing that right now and has been doing that since the beginning of time. abraham, a pagan. paul, an executioner. my father, nephew of a voodoo witch. that's where you're wrong, he does forgive for picking other
    "spiritual devotions".
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    soulsinging wrote:
    dont let it get to ya. if ya dont like his sermons, go to the sex thread and read about his love of premarital intercourse. it's a nice laugh to see the open hypocrisy.
    i always thought corporatewhore was a girl
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    ok... you believe in god, just not the biblical one. no problem. i mean, if you'd rather rot in hell, as you say, and you've seemed to find stronger spiritual experiences. that's perfectly understandable in your point of view.

    the funny thing is the biblical God isn't such a dictator as you view it... although if that's how you view it and don't want to hear anymore of it that's ok too. but still you're not understanding what i'm telling you.... "cannot forgive anyone for picking the wrong manner of expressing their devotion" he's doing that right now and has been doing that since the beginning of time. abraham, a pagan. paul, an executioner. my father, nephew of a voodoo witch. that's where you're wrong, he does forgive for picking other
    "spiritual devotions".

    but only if they change their mind before they die? i dont view the christian god as anything other than what im told he is. now, if christians tell me that i can only go to heaven if i accept jesus, the bible, and all accompanying doctrines BEFORE i die... how is that any different from what i have been saying? you choose wrong, and you go to hell.

    otherwise, it is as i said, i can worship whatever and however i want now as long as it is honest and sincere and then god will judge me on those merits. under that system, you don't have to be christian to go to heaven.

    so do you or don't you? if you do, then your argument is deceptive, becos god IS punishing you for choosing wrong. if you don't then what does it matter what faith you use to express your love of god? it's only a matter of what works for you.
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    soulsinging wrote:
    dont let it get to ya. if ya dont like his sermons, go to the sex thread and read about his love of premarital intercourse. it's a nice laugh to see the open hypocrisy.

    eh! hehe! :D Shoulda left well alone. The kids got a lot of life to get through yet. Never know he might actually change his mind about a few things! :p
    Of course if he doesn't that wouldn't surprise me either.
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    CorporateWhore wrote:
    Yer mom is loopy

    Your point oh holier than thou? :rolleyes:
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Indifference
    Indifference Posts: 2,759
    soulsinging wrote:
    that's what im saying. i do believe in god. i just believe in a god who is vastly different from the christian one. now, if the christians are right, and i show up at the pearly gates and god is asking me why i wasnt down with jesus, ill say it didnt make sense to me and i found a stronger faith in my own spiritual experiences. i will admit i was wrong though and if that isn't good enough, then it is a god i want no part of and im perfectly happy rotting in hell. i prefer that to spending eternity with a god who is as vain as paris hilton and cannot forgive anyone for picking the wrong manner of expressing their devotion.

    Well put. This nails it for me as well.

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  • brain of c
    brain of c Posts: 5,213
    help me, jebus.
    d'oh!!!!!!

    http://www.myspace.com/brain_of_c
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    CorporateWhore wrote:
    If you are an atheist but God exists, you will spend eternity in hell because you had the opportunity to believe. If you believe in God and he doesn't exist, all you did was give up a little bit of your time to worship God and forego sin. What atheism really comes down to is selfishness - it's all about what I want.

    and that is my call is it not? i can not bring myself to believe in something that makes zero sense to me.
    i would hardly call it selfishness to choose not to compromise myself in order to believe in something i can not logically believe in, just cause the alternative is an imaginary hell.
    i don't think you understand. as an atheist i don't believe there is a hell. naturally i also don't believe there is a heaven. the possible existence(which i don't believe) plays no aprt in how i live my life.
    it is not all about what i want. it is all about how i can live my life in order that i can find some peace before i die. if i live my life to the best of my abilities then that is my peace. and if i do that without imposing upon others or hurting them in any way then that shall also be my peace.
    who are you living your life for? do you forego all sin? or just the ones convenient for you to do so?

    don't tell me if i do not believe in your God that i am going to hell. it is no deterrent to me.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    chopitdown wrote:
    would you as an atheist want to go to heaven? if you say yes, then that means that you want to do whatever you want and reject God yet still have him accept you to heaven. That seems pretty selfish on your part. If you want no part of heaven then there's no selfishness.

    how can an atheist want to go to heaven? it is non existent to them.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • CorporateWhore
    CorporateWhore Posts: 1,890
    catefrances wrote:
    don't tell me if i do not believe in your God that i am going to hell. it is no deterrent to me.

    you're either 100% right or 100% wrong. What a chance to take!
    All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    CorporateWhore wrote:
    you're either 100% right or 100% wrong. What a chance to take!

    yes tis isn't it? :)
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • CorporateWhore
    CorporateWhore Posts: 1,890
    catefrances wrote:
    yes tis isn't it? :)

    It depends on what the meaning of "tis" tis.
    All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    soulsinging wrote:
    but only if they change their mind before they die? i dont view the christian god as anything other than what im told he is. now, if christians tell me that i can only go to heaven if i accept jesus, the bible, and all accompanying doctrines BEFORE i die... how is that any different from what i have been saying? you choose wrong, and you go to hell.

    otherwise, it is as i said, i can worship whatever and however i want now as long as it is honest and sincere and then god will judge me on those merits. under that system, you don't have to be christian to go to heaven.

    so do you or don't you? if you do, then your argument is deceptive, becos god IS punishing you for choosing wrong. if you don't then what does it matter what faith you use to express your love of god? it's only a matter of what works for you.
    well, basically, yes... that's how the story goes... "i am the way, the truth, and the life. no man comes to the Father but by me." that's one thing.

    but when you put it this way, "oh God is such a meany because he'll send you to hell if you don't like him." that's where i'm trying to correct you. the bible never says that. i could be an atheist myself and read the bible and still conclude the same thing that, no, the bible doesn't say it.

    yes, if you want salvation the only way is through Jesus Christ. that's the message of the Bible. you're absolutely right. but no... God doesn't send you to hell because you don't accept Jesus. you sent yourself to hell.

    it's like this. you commit a crime. you're going to jail. so now the judge says, ok, you don't have a lawyer to back you up, go to jail. if you do have a lawyer and he has proof to back you up, then you don't go to jail. that's how it is with the message of the bible. God is the judge... christ is the lawyer and you are the suspect.

    i guess all in all we have a hard time understanding this because God hates sin. he hates it because of what it has caused to his creation. so sin cannot enter the kingdom of heaven... if you have not repented of your sins so that Christ can wash them away you neither can enter. it's basically how it is.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    CorporateWhore wrote:
    It depends on what the meaning of "tis" tis.


    or what meaning i choose to bring to it. :)
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    Collin wrote:
    Actually if your chosen belief is wrong and the right belief has a hell, you're going there.

    why not a carnival......that's where all the bad people in my belief go.

    Anyone want to join my church? Much more fun..and allot less stress.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well, basically, yes... that's how the story goes... "i am the way, the truth, and the life. no man comes to the Father but by me." that's one thing.

    but when you put it this way, "oh God is such a meany because he'll send you to hell if you don't like him." that's where i'm trying to correct you. the bible never says that. i could be an atheist myself and read the bible and still conclude the same thing that, no, the bible doesn't say it.

    yes, if you want salvation the only way is through Jesus Christ. that's the message of the Bible. you're absolutely right. but no... God doesn't send you to hell because you don't accept Jesus. you sent yourself to hell.

    it's like this. you commit a crime. you're going to jail. so now the judge says, ok, you don't have a lawyer to back you up, go to jail. if you do have a lawyer and he has proof to back you up, then you don't go to jail. that's how it is with the message of the bible. God is the judge... christ is the lawyer and you are the suspect.

    i guess all in all we have a hard time understanding this because God hates sin. he hates it because of what it has caused to his creation. so sin cannot enter the kingdom of heaven... if you have not repented of your sins so that Christ can wash them away you neither can enter. it's basically how it is.

    sometimes think I'm reading a scientific novel on this board......wow
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG

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