Message from UPS to our European Super Deluxe Customers

Cinnamon Girl

oh boy. This really sucks for you guys, but I'm sure 10C is on it now and trying to do all they can. Like Santos said; hang tight, keep your receipts. Hopefully this wrong will be righted.

dimitrispearljam

couse if they didnt change the shipping method from us post office to ups this will never happen190$ for the box and ups ask me 200$ more...

Thorns2010 wrote:

Ummm....unless I'm reading this wrong that email CLEARLY states its UPS fuck up, not the 10Club.

So why is everyone saying that 10Club should do something for them??

SleightOfHand

Members of the EUROPEAN UNION should NOT pay any taxes because goods bellow the value limit of EUR 150.00 are NOT subject to customs duties.

Council Regulation (EC) No 274/2008 of 17 March 2008:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2008:085:0001:01:EN:HTML

Hippyvik

I found this charge of £32 duty a bitter pill to swallow after already paying out the $190 (£130) for the box set. I was hard pushed to afford this in the first place! Any refund will be greatly received, thankyou!

Pearl Jam shop, I think for future reference, you guys need to make customers outside America aware that they are likely to be stung for duty on expensive items like this.

Peace & Hugs :roll:

ML245287

SleightOfHand wrote:

Members of the EUROPEAN UNION should NOT pay any taxes because goods bellow the value limit of EUR 150.00 are NOT subject to customs duties.

Council Regulation (EC) No 274/2008 of 17 March 2008:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2008:085:0001:01:EN:HTML

We have paid VAT, not custom duties, 2 differents things

pdalowsky

Thorns2010 wrote:

Ummm....unless I'm reading this wrong that email CLEARLY states its UPS fuck up, not the 10Club.

So why is everyone saying that 10Club should do something for them??

who fucking organised this thing??

dimitrispearljam

ML245287 wrote:

SleightOfHand wrote:

Members of the EUROPEAN UNION should NOT pay any taxes because goods bellow the value limit of EUR 150.00 are NOT subject to customs duties.

Council Regulation (EC) No 274/2008 of 17 March 2008:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2008:085:0001:01:EN:HTML

We have paid VAT, not custom duties, 2 differents things

they ask me 200$ extra for vat and custom duties and to pay and the employ who will do all this,,,the box is in the ups in airport,,,what a mess,,,plus i order 2,,so 400$ extra,,sorry i forgot to born like rockfeller..

pdalowsky

what a fucking shambles...

accept it, dont accept it, accept it....

pay more for dealing with the band and supporting them

they'll sign till their hand cramps....then sign 30....

charge international $50 then hide the cost of shipping from the package and charge US nothing

keep it up Tenclub, really great way to go on....

even the delivery guy today was laughing at the amount we had to pay....for some reason he thought it was stupid and 'easily avoided' and that was amusing him....notthe first report of this today either

Pegasus

PH109495 wrote:

I was at work and missed mine being delivered anyway - I'm guessing you guys are being charged VAT? In which case it shouldn't happen, as the value of the goods is less than £105 - which has been the customs duty limit since 1st December 2008 (see here - http://tinyurl.com/cuhpjj).

the £105 DOES NOT APPLY TO VAT. (I wish! and it's more like £140 = €150)
this is the limit for DUTY.

When you import something you pay:
+ VAT on item + shipping (that means on $150 people, not $100! that's the law, nothing to do with 10c or UPS) if total cost of items only (so you order 2 limit is not higher) is over £18/€25 (whatever the rate is in your country, 15% in the UK now, %19.5 in France for example. and if it's above you pay on all, not deducting £18)
+ DUTY (depends on country and product type, 2.5% here I think for CDs/DVDs) if over £140 (so that'll be nil in this case)
+ carrier fee (in UK: £8 for Royal Mail, £11 for UPS..) for processing your customs for you (and unfortunately for individuals, it's impossible to pre-pay customs yourself.).

SLH is very nice to get UPS to look into it, but likely only those Portuguese or Dimitris that had really ridiculous fees will see any money back.

The £30 UK charge is perfectly in line with what you're supposed to pay ($22.5 15%VAT = £15.85 as per C&E official rate for this week + £11 UPS fee = £26.85.) the difference of a few quid I wouldn't question since $100 is not the real value anyway and UPS just has to look on this website to know that (and with the real value of $140, VAT = £20.1, + £11 fee = £31.1).

For euro countries, depending on your VAT rate and UPS local fee, but the people quoting €45 seems right too.

anything above €50 otoh I'd question. Dimitris, €150 for 2 seems too high, I'd question that one.

Ruxpin wrote:

1.) There was never an announcement of changing the courier to UPS from the usual USPS. Usually the shipments to europe etc go by USPS via Sweden and then onto the respective countries. I have ordered a number of items before and yes I have had to pay import costs a couple of times in the past year (when the value of the goods was over £18.00). These charges were approx £7.50 and £8.00 for orders of £50ish and £80ish respectively.

I've no idea how you ended up paying so little since Royal Mail (that's normal mail for non-UK people) charges a fee of £8 on top of WHATEVER the VAT amount they collect. (and 17.5% on £80 never works out to be £8..unless you had a book in that which didn't count). So even if 10c hadn't changed the carrier, you'd have saved £3 (and a slight chance of not getting hit, but considering the size of the package, very slight. Plus regular mail doesn't have any real tracking, which for an item of this cost is a very bad idea).
oh, and they don't use USPS normally (that would be a lot quicker if they did), they use Swedish Post (it's a totally different service) but it does NOT go through Sweden in fact (or you'd never pay customs at all since Sweden is in the EU).

PH109495 wrote:

I just had a look on Amazon - £99 with free shipping. And there's me like a fool paying £133 (I checked my CC statement) to get it delivered from the States and potentially another £30 tax... How do we get a refund from ten club?

that's your own fault for not checking competition before spending >£100, I don't see why you should get a refund! the base product is at exactly the same price, you for shipment and import, that's your choice.

seriously people, everyone knows lots of goods, particularly electronics, are sold cheaper in the US.
You never thought twice why people didn't order from there all the time instead of buying locally? :roll:

CJMST3K

Hippyvik wrote:

I found this charge of £32 duty a bitter pill to swallow after already paying out the $190 (£130) for the box set. I was hard pushed to afford this in the first place! Any refund will be greatly received, thankyou!

Pearl Jam shop, I think for future reference, you guys need to make customers outside America aware that they are likely to be stung for duty on expensive items like this.

Peace & Hugs :roll:

You know what? I fully agree.

It's one thing that those of us in the US are paying about $15 more than we would pay at Best Buy. I guessed that in advance, and figured I'd rather the band make the extra $80. But for European people to be paying MORE for the item than their local store, then even MORE for shipping, then a lot MORE for duty charges... all for the pleasure of giving Ten Club money directly, with no middleman (meaning more double or more profit for Ten Club than wholesaling to retailers) makes this all unfortunate for the fans, particularly the ones in Europe.

A lot of us bought it directly from Ten Club for the chance of it being signed. I think if they were up front and said "about 30-40 will be signed" a number of us would have made an informed decision and purchased it locally... and cheaper.

And to the Europeans I think if they were up front and said "you'll be paying additional significant duties on top of paying additional significant shipping" then they could have made an informed decision to purchase it locally... and cheaper... a LOT cheaper.

Sorry... but this is all true. I'm gonna enjoy the hell out of my Super Deluxe Edition... but I'm gonna assume the worst case scenario with future TC direct purchases, and probably not buy direct again.

dimitrispearljam

pdalowsky wrote:

what a fucking shambles...

accept it, dont accept it, accept it....

pay more for dealing with the band and supporting them

they'll sign till their hand cramps....then sign 30....

charge international $50 then hide the cost of shipping from the package and charge US nothing

keep it up Tenclub, really great way to go on....

even the delivery guy today was laughing at the amount we had to pay....for some reason he thought it was stupid and 'easily avoided' and that was amusing him....notthe first report of this today either

i order 2 boxes,,,they ask me 400$ extra for both,,the woman in ups here in greece i talk will remember me for a lond time ago,,,me too,i could believe the limits of my voice

JimNastics

It is a bitter pill to swallow... I doubt you will find any European fan who isn't now regretting buying it from TC. It is an amazing set, I absolutely love it, but I feel like a complete idiot when I see it on Amazon for £99 with free delivery. Like someone else mentioned, we've basically paid £60+ for the very small chance it might get signed. I'm trying to just forget about it as one of the those things, but it has dampened the whole experience somewhat

lowenan

I agree CJMST3K. Really poorly handled by the Ten Club this.

CJMST3K

...and to add to what I wrote above, I think many of us understand that Ten Club needs to sell this for face-value, and a retailer can many times have an introductory sale price.

But knowing this, plus knowing about the significant taxes for people buying direct from Europe as opposed to their local record shop, why didn't they include some extra special Ten Club only item to justify the additional price? Free MSG 1998 cd? Something... That would have cost them pennies to produce.

BlackCo

Putain Pegazus arrete de prendre de haut tout le monde, tu ressembles à rien là.

Ten Club should give a refund for every extra euro or pound given by european costumers. When i see shipment for 50 dollars i am not supposed to give anything more to receive the object (ie: i don't care if it comes with us post, UPS, DHL or santa...). OK to say that this might not be a TC mistake but IT IS a TC responsibility.

Hope the TC will do what should be done here: ask for every one a copy of the UPS bill and refund what has been paid.

dimitrispearljam

Pegasus wrote:

PH109495 wrote:

I was at work and missed mine being delivered anyway - I'm guessing you guys are being charged VAT? In which case it shouldn't happen, as the value of the goods is less than £105 - which has been the customs duty limit since 1st December 2008 (see here - http://tinyurl.com/cuhpjj).

the £105 DOES NOT APPLY TO VAT. (I wish! and it's more like £140 = €150)
this is the limit for DUTY.

When you import something you pay:
+ VAT on item + shipping (that means on $150 people, not $100! that's the law, nothing to do with 10c or UPS) if total cost of items only (so you order 2 limit is not higher) is over £18/€25 (whatever the rate is in your country, 15% in the UK now, %19.5 in France for example. and if it's above you pay on all, not deducting £18)
+ DUTY (depends on country and product type, 2.5% here I think for CDs/DVDs) if over £140 (so that'll be nil in this case)
+ carrier fee (in UK: £8 for Royal Mail, £11 for UPS..) for processing your customs for you (and unfortunately for individuals, it's impossible to pre-pay customs yourself.).

SLH is very nice to get UPS to look into it, but likely only those Portuguese or Dimitris that had really ridiculous fees will see any money back.

The £30 UK charge is perfectly in line with what you're supposed to pay ($22.5 15%VAT = £15.85 as per C&E official rate for this week + £11 UPS fee = £26.85.) the difference of a few quid I wouldn't question since $100 is not the real value anyway and UPS just has to look on this website to know that (and with the real value of $140, VAT = £20.1, + £11 fee = £31.1).

For euro countries, depending on your VAT rate and UPS local fee, but the people quoting €45 seems right too.

anything above €50 otoh I'd question. Dimitris, €150 for 2 seems too high, I'd question that one.

Ruxpin wrote:

1.) There was never an announcement of changing the courier to UPS from the usual USPS. Usually the shipments to europe etc go by USPS via Sweden and then onto the respective countries. I have ordered a number of items before and yes I have had to pay import costs a couple of times in the past year (when the value of the goods was over £18.00). These charges were approx £7.50 and £8.00 for orders of £50ish and £80ish respectively.

I've no idea how you ended up paying so little since Royal Mail (that's normal mail for non-UK people) charges a fee of £8 on top of WHATEVER the VAT amount they collect. (and 17.5% on £80 never works out to be £8..unless you had a book in that which didn't count). So even if 10c hadn't changed the carrier, you'd have saved £3 (and a slight chance of not getting hit, but considering the size of the package, very slight. Plus regular mail doesn't have any real tracking, which for an item of this cost is a very bad idea).
oh, and they don't use USPS normally (that would be a lot quicker if they did), they use Swedish Post (it's a totally different service) but it does NOT go through Sweden in fact (or you'd never pay customs at all since Sweden is in the EU).

PH109495 wrote:

I just had a look on Amazon - £99 with free shipping. And there's me like a fool paying £133 (I checked my CC statement) to get it delivered from the States and potentially another £30 tax... How do we get a refund from ten club?

that's your own fault for not checking competition before spending >£100, I don't see why you should get a refund! the base product is at exactly the same price, you for shipment and import, that's your choice.

seriously people, everyone knows lots of goods, particularly electronics, are sold cheaper in the US.
You never thought twice why people didn't order from there all the time instead of buying locally? :roll:

no my friend,,,150 euros not for 2,,for 1,,,they ask me 296 euros exactly for both!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
my order before deluxe edition was 276 for clothes,cd,t-shirts ,hoodies dvd was 278$,,and i didnt pay anything,,,u know why?couse they send it with usa post office,,not with ups,,thats all what is about,,and why its 10c,mistake,last year i was in new york foe msg 1,2 and i bought a laptop 850$,,and i send it from the shop to greece,,,and pay 100 $ in the custom,,and for 2 cd,1 dvd,2 lp,and fotos and stuff,,to pay 150?come on,,

dimitrispearljam

ad137304 wrote:

Putain Pegazus arrete de prendre de haut tout le monde, tu ressembles à rien là.

Ten Club should give a refund for every extra euro or pound given by european costumers. When i see shipment for 50 dollars i am not supposed to give anything more to receive the object (ie: i don't care if it comes with us post, UPS, DHL or santa...). OK to say that this might not be a TC mistake but IT IS a TC responsibility.

Hope the TC will do what should be done here: ask for every one a copy of the UPS bill and refund what has been paid.

cant say anything more than YES

CJMST3K

I'd be tempted to return the items all together, especially if previous purchases were with USPS with little or no tax and then their choice of UPS makes this an insanely high taxed item. Again, I'm not in your boat - I'm in the US, but I feel for ya. This is just not right.

Benz

I just really hope PJ gets a record label soon and will not sell their new CD at the Ten Club Store. It was my first and last order for sure :-( Man all so sad when I think about al the goodies I still wanted to get :-(

Pegasus

ad137304 wrote:

Putain Pegazus arrete de prendre de haut tout le monde, tu ressembles à rien là.

Ten Club should give a refund for every extra euro or pound given by european costumers. When i see shipment for 50 dollars i am not supposed to give anything more to receive the object (ie: i don't care if it comes with us post, UPS, DHL or santa...). OK to say that this might not be a TC mistake but IT IS a TC responsibility.

Hope the TC will do what should be done here: ask for every one a copy of the UPS bill and refund what has been paid.

si les gens sont cons, c'est comme ca qu'il faut les prendre.
It's not like I didn't try to warn people for weeks.

it is NOT 10c responsibility to check every single country import policy. That's YOURS.
How very French of you expecting to be totally assisted instead of taking responsibility (for the Mods: I'm French too.. originally)

If you don't like having to pay taxes, talk to your government instead! (or in the case of the French, shout at it :roll: )

Dimitris, I said in your case you have obviously something very wrong going on and should question it, but 99% of people complaining (the ones with £30/€45 fees) do about something that is THE LAW..not 10c decision (who exposed themselves for you by under-declaring the merchandise), not UPS (well, ok their fee is), but the local government!