Yeah, hit a 12 against a 2 or 3, stay on 13. These are borderline cases though. Playing on feel wouldn't be a horrible thing to do. Gotta hit on anything up to 16 against an ace. $15 blackjack sounds good. I hate dipshits who think they know all the "rules" when they really don't. I sit there and say "I'm an actuary, and you don't even understand what that is and you certainly don't understand what's going on here at this table."
Team gets to 3 games back Friday night (still a long shot). I pay for my playoff tixx Saturday morning. Team tanks rest of the weekend. Ain't life a bitch.
I guess that's the kind of crowd you get at $15 tables. It actually helped though. I always have a tough time walking away from a table...especially when I'm drunk.
As for playoff tix...I laughed when I got that email. I wasn't sending a dime. The less of a FA budget amaro has, the better off this team will be
another thing I was doing that I took shit for was doubling down every time the dealer had a six showing and I had anything less than 12. I could have a two and three and I'm doubling against her six (if not splitting that type of hand...I'm not even sure if you can split two diff card numbers like a 2 and 3)
that's the right play against a dealer 6. doubles and splits are how you make money at blackjack. most blackjack sittings positive or negative comes down to those hands. if you win a high percentage of doubles and splits you will make money every time. the regular house advantage in blackjack i think is only 52-48 so getting and hitting doubles and splits moves the percentages nearer to even. against a dealer 6 im begging for a split and then two cards to double so i have up to 4 hands going.
the key to blackjack to me is sitting and sustaining during average to lousy shoes and having the patience to wait for a good one. then once you get a shoe that turns your way to hit it and hit it hard. i'll play $10-$15 tables but when you get on a run i've gone up to $100 a hand. it's how to make money.
other advice i'd give is if you get on a full table where everyone knows what they are doing hang at the table as long as possible because when the cards are played the correct way at least 1 or 2 people at the table will make money.
sitting at a fun blackjack table, either full of friends or full of good people to hang with is such a great time.
another thing I was doing that I took shit for was doubling down every time the dealer had a six showing and I had anything less than 12. I could have a two and three and I'm doubling against her six (if not splitting that type of hand...I'm not even sure if you can split two diff card numbers like a 2 and 3)
Can only split two of the same card.
Never split 10's (or 5's I'm pretty sure). Always split aces & 8's. Split 7's against 2 through 7. Split 2's & 3's against 4, 5 & 6 I think - starts to get confusing. Split 9's against something weird like 7 & 9, maybe. I have no idea when you might want to split 4's.
You're allowed to bring a cheat sheet to the blackjack table, and you can use it to shut up the morons who don't know what they're doing.
I hate the always split 8's rule. If dealer shows a ten I always lose. I'd rather just take a card on my 16. Should be a law that you can't stay on 16 vs a ten...ever.
other advice i'd give is if you get on a full table where everyone knows what they are doing hang at the table as long as possible because when the cards are played the correct way at least 1 or 2 people at the table will make money.
Statistically speaking, the way everyone else at the table plays should not affect how much money any individual makes. Even if it seems otherwise at times.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila, PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
I hate the always split 8's rule. If dealer shows a ten I always lose. I'd rather just take a card on my 16. Should be a law that you can't stay on 16 vs a ten...ever.
Just take your medicine and split 'em. You're trying to just break even on the hand.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila, PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
another thing I was doing that I took shit for was doubling down every time the dealer had a six showing and I had anything less than 12. I could have a two and three and I'm doubling against her six (if not splitting that type of hand...I'm not even sure if you can split two diff card numbers like a 2 and 3)
that's the right play against a dealer 6. doubles and splits are how you make money at blackjack. most blackjack sittings positive or negative comes down to those hands. if you win a high percentage of doubles and splits you will make money every time. the regular house advantage in blackjack i think is only 52-48 so getting and hitting doubles and splits moves the percentages nearer to even. against a dealer 6 im begging for a split and then two cards to double so i have up to 4 hands going.
the key to blackjack to me is sitting and sustaining during average to lousy shoes and having the patience to wait for a good one. then once you get a shoe that turns your way to hit it and hit it hard. i'll play $10-$15 tables but when you get on a run i've gone up to $100 a hand. it's how to make money.
other advice i'd give is if you get on a full table where everyone knows what they are doing hang at the table as long as possible because when the cards are played the correct way at least 1 or 2 people at the table will make money.
sitting at a fun blackjack table, either full of friends or full of good people to hang with is such a great time.
this is the best post you have ever had. esp your first paragraph, which sounds exactly like me
you have to press when you're on a hot streak.
I tend to be an aggressive player (esp on a $15 table). some people get mad. I don't really give a shit. I feel like I know what I'm doing 90% of the time
I hate the always split 8's rule. If dealer shows a ten I always lose. I'd rather just take a card on my 16. Should be a law that you can't stay on 16 vs a ten...ever.
Just take your medicine and split 'em. You're trying to just break even on the hand.
exactly. isn't trying to break even a losing strategy? I don't like giving hands away.
I follow the rule, but I don't agree with it (I know this doesn't make sense)
I hate the always split 8's rule. If dealer shows a ten I always lose. I'd rather just take a card on my 16. Should be a law that you can't stay on 16 vs a ten...ever.
Just take your medicine and split 'em. You're trying to just break even on the hand.
I follow the rule, but I don't agree with it (I know this doesn't make sense)
i do the same. i do it but i don't really think you should.
and i also think you should split 10s against a dealer 6 but i've never done it. i know they say to never split 10s but it really does make sense to do it against a 6.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
Whatever. You know that more than half of this thread is on shit that has nothing to do with baseball.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila, PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Just like I thought - this season will end like 2005, and of course at the hands of the Astros. If they split they would be 3 back, and if they took 3 out of 4 they'd be 2 back and right in it. Ah well, I'm still going to the game on Tuesday for my 30th.
30???
man, you're getting old
This is true. Looks like I join the rest of you curmudgeons now...
Is the season still going on??? I hope Ruf learns how to play LF.
season ended in june. ruf should have been playing for months. Instead we were force fed juan pierre and john mayberry....neither of who I want to see back next year
sucks that phils won't be in it but I'm still looking forward to watching the playoffs next week. I don't care who wins as long as it's not DC
Is the season still going on??? I hope Ruf learns how to play LF.
That would be decent. Glad the phills finally brought him up.
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly. PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
Ok who are you and what have you done with the real Kyle Kendrick?
the real one is back.
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
Ok who are you and what have you done with the real Kyle Kendrick?
the real one is back.
:fp:
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly. PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
Was down at the game last night. don't understand the fans hatred of Jayson. guy was a huge part of the championship run and got a ridiculous contract offer that the phils could never match.
Was down at the game last night. don't understand the fans hatred of Jayson. guy was a huge part of the championship run and got a ridiculous contract offer that the phils could never match.
I don't really have a huge problem with him, but in the on deck circle in the 9th he picked up a ball chopped his way and acted as if he was going to toss to the crowd then tossed it in the dug out. Dick move in my book.
I've met Rob
DEGENERATE FUK
This place is dead
"THERE ARE NO CLIQUES, ONLY THOSE WHO DON'T JOIN THE FUN" - Empty circa 2015
Was down at the game last night. don't understand the fans hatred of Jayson. guy was a huge part of the championship run and got a ridiculous contract offer that the phils could never match.
I don't really have a huge problem with him, but in the on deck circle in the 9th he picked up a ball chopped his way and acted as if he was going to toss to the crowd then tossed it in the dug out. Dick move in my book.
saw that. definitely a dick move. still he has been booed pretty unmercifully since last year which i don't get. and he'd sure as shit would look good in right field again.
Was down at the game last night. don't understand the fans hatred of Jayson. guy was a huge part of the championship run and got a ridiculous contract offer that the phils could never match.
I don't really have a huge problem with him, but in the on deck circle in the 9th he picked up a ball chopped his way and acted as if he was going to toss to the crowd then tossed it in the dug out. Dick move in my book.
A bigger dick move were the Phillies fans cheering when he broke his wrist in Washington. I wished he drilled someone in the forehead with the ball. How soon the fans forget. Just because the Phillies were too cheap to pay him, he's the asshole. That makes sense. He should be receiving a standing ovation every time he comes to CBP. Maybe then he'll toss a ball to a fan. Phillies fans are turning into ungrateful basterds. All of a sudden we're supposed to deserve eveything.
Alright, alright, alright!
Tom O. "I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
A bigger dick move were the Phillies fans cheering when he broke his wrist in Washington. I wished he drilled someone in the forehead with the ball. How soon the fans forget. Just because the Phillies were too cheap to pay him, he's the asshole. That makes sense. He should be receiving a standing ovation every time he comes to CBP. Maybe then he'll toss a ball to a fan. Phillies fans are turning into ungrateful basterds. All of a sudden we're supposed to deserve eveything.
this board is boring. someone argue about something
was Juan Pierre an ok addition? i remember you arguing at the end of spring training that they should have kept Posednik instead.
why the hell is Roy Halladay pitching again this season?
the legandary Darrin Ruf is only 299 career home runs away from ryan. although have to say the ball jumps off his bat. he must get a good look in spring training next year.
this board is boring. someone argue about something
was Juan Pierre an ok addition? i remember you arguing at the end of spring training that they should have kept Posednik instead.
why the hell is Roy Halladay pitching again this season?
the legandary Darrin Ruf is only 299 career home runs away from ryan. although have to say the ball jumps off his bat. he must get a good look in spring training next year.
pierre sucks. want no part of him on this team next year. ruf should have been playing LF two months ago
Was at a game last week and I hate the booing of Werth. I was in RF and yelling (well not really) "Hey Werth - thanks for helping us win a World Series!" I mean, are we still going to boo him at the 25th anniversary of the 2008 team? :roll:
Dropping a lead weight on your toe has to be the dumbest injury of the year.
Congrats to Cole for 17 wins.
Let's keep the Nats from celebrating for one night at least. With Cloyd vs. Gonzalez tomorrow, it's inevitable. Hopefully Braves and Phils win tonight so they just back into it.
Ruf looks like a hell of a hitter.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila, PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
That was so weird. Nats celebrating on the field while Aumont was warming up. They won the division, but they're still losers.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila, PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Comments
I guess that's the kind of crowd you get at $15 tables. It actually helped though. I always have a tough time walking away from a table...especially when I'm drunk.
As for playoff tix...I laughed when I got that email. I wasn't sending a dime. The less of a FA budget amaro has, the better off this team will be
that's the right play against a dealer 6. doubles and splits are how you make money at blackjack. most blackjack sittings positive or negative comes down to those hands. if you win a high percentage of doubles and splits you will make money every time. the regular house advantage in blackjack i think is only 52-48 so getting and hitting doubles and splits moves the percentages nearer to even. against a dealer 6 im begging for a split and then two cards to double so i have up to 4 hands going.
the key to blackjack to me is sitting and sustaining during average to lousy shoes and having the patience to wait for a good one. then once you get a shoe that turns your way to hit it and hit it hard. i'll play $10-$15 tables but when you get on a run i've gone up to $100 a hand. it's how to make money.
other advice i'd give is if you get on a full table where everyone knows what they are doing hang at the table as long as possible because when the cards are played the correct way at least 1 or 2 people at the table will make money.
sitting at a fun blackjack table, either full of friends or full of good people to hang with is such a great time.
I hate the always split 8's rule. If dealer shows a ten I always lose. I'd rather just take a card on my 16. Should be a law that you can't stay on 16 vs a ten...ever.
Statistically speaking, the way everyone else at the table plays should not affect how much money any individual makes. Even if it seems otherwise at times.
Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22;
Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Just take your medicine and split 'em. You're trying to just break even on the hand.
Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22;
Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
this is the best post you have ever had. esp your first paragraph, which sounds exactly like me
you have to press when you're on a hot streak.
I tend to be an aggressive player (esp on a $15 table). some people get mad. I don't really give a shit. I feel like I know what I'm doing 90% of the time
exactly. isn't trying to break even a losing strategy? I don't like giving hands away.
I follow the rule, but I don't agree with it (I know this doesn't make sense)
i do the same. i do it but i don't really think you should.
and i also think you should split 10s against a dealer 6 but i've never done it. i know they say to never split 10s but it really does make sense to do it against a 6.
I guess you guys have waved the white flag
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
Whatever. You know that more than half of this thread is on shit that has nothing to do with baseball.
Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22;
Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
This is true. Looks like I join the rest of you curmudgeons now...
season ended in june. ruf should have been playing for months. Instead we were force fed juan pierre and john mayberry....neither of who I want to see back next year
sucks that phils won't be in it but I'm still looking forward to watching the playoffs next week. I don't care who wins as long as it's not DC
That would be decent. Glad the phills finally brought him up.
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
the real one is back.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
DEGENERATE FUK
This place is dead
"THERE ARE NO CLIQUES, ONLY THOSE WHO DON'T JOIN THE FUN" - Empty circa 2015
"Kfsbho&$thncds" - F Me In the Brain - circa 2015
Was down at the game last night. don't understand the fans hatred of Jayson. guy was a huge part of the championship run and got a ridiculous contract offer that the phils could never match.
I don't really have a huge problem with him, but in the on deck circle in the 9th he picked up a ball chopped his way and acted as if he was going to toss to the crowd then tossed it in the dug out. Dick move in my book.
DEGENERATE FUK
This place is dead
"THERE ARE NO CLIQUES, ONLY THOSE WHO DON'T JOIN THE FUN" - Empty circa 2015
"Kfsbho&$thncds" - F Me In the Brain - circa 2015
saw that. definitely a dick move. still he has been booed pretty unmercifully since last year which i don't get. and he'd sure as shit would look good in right field again.
A bigger dick move were the Phillies fans cheering when he broke his wrist in Washington. I wished he drilled someone in the forehead with the ball. How soon the fans forget. Just because the Phillies were too cheap to pay him, he's the asshole. That makes sense. He should be receiving a standing ovation every time he comes to CBP. Maybe then he'll toss a ball to a fan. Phillies fans are turning into ungrateful basterds. All of a sudden we're supposed to deserve eveything.
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
I'll agree with everything else you said
DEGENERATE FUK
This place is dead
"THERE ARE NO CLIQUES, ONLY THOSE WHO DON'T JOIN THE FUN" - Empty circa 2015
"Kfsbho&$thncds" - F Me In the Brain - circa 2015
agree 100%
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
was Juan Pierre an ok addition? i remember you arguing at the end of spring training that they should have kept Posednik instead.
why the hell is Roy Halladay pitching again this season?
the legandary Darrin Ruf is only 299 career home runs away from ryan. although have to say the ball jumps off his bat. he must get a good look in spring training next year.
pierre sucks. want no part of him on this team next year. ruf should have been playing LF two months ago
Dropping a lead weight on your toe has to be the dumbest injury of the year.
Congrats to Cole for 17 wins.
Let's keep the Nats from celebrating for one night at least. With Cloyd vs. Gonzalez tomorrow, it's inevitable. Hopefully Braves and Phils win tonight so they just back into it.
Ruf looks like a hell of a hitter.
Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22;
Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Looking forward to watching the playoffs later in the week.
Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22;
Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16