Why Do Athiests

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  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Jeanie wrote:
    If that's how you've interpreted it, then yes, perhaps I can be. :)
    yeah... i like you already!
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Is it?

    I take it to mean; I would like for the universal chance to work in favor.

    Luck?

    Does an Abrahamist believe in luck?

    According to St. Augustine good things happen to good people and bad things to bad people. That hardly leaves room for chance. Or is this like free-will where it's limited, partly God's will and partly luck?

    "I hope" is a prayer.

    That's what I posted. You're taking it other places.
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  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well, as you know I am an avid believer in God. I also believe that we live by chance. Is that possible?

    I'm not sure how, and if it were, the lines would be pretty blurry. It would have to be that everything operates on chance, but God can intervene. But also God would have to make sure not to unravel his universe by doing so. Everything appears to be cause and effect, so if God did cause something, the effects could be rather chaotic and he would have to be omniscient, which means he'd have to know which choices you are going to make and then you'd have to make those choices.

    It gets pretty nutty when you put God in there.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    I'm not sure how, and if it were, the lines would be pretty blurry. It would have to be that everything operates on chance, but God can intervene. But also God would have to make sure not to unravel his universe by doing so. Everything appears to be cause and effect, so if God did cause something, the effects could be rather chaotic and he would have to be omniscient, which means he'd have to know which choices you are going to make and then you'd have to make those choices.

    It gets pretty nutty when you put God in there.

    You have a history with "God", that's why it's nutty. I don't.
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  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    gue_barium wrote:
    "I hope" is a prayer.

    That's what I posted. You're taking other places.

    Got is the Germanic origin of the word God, which is now spelled Gott in Germany.

    Mein Gott "My God"

    Dein Kind ist dein Gott "Your child is your God" a good tune by Das Ich.

    Also 'Gott ist Tot" "God is dead" is a good song too.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    gue_barium wrote:
    You have a history with "God", that's why it's nutty. I don't.

    I do? What history?
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    I do? What history?
    Obviously, you play off the indoctrination of such. I was never subjected to that indoctrination of "God". God is just a word, to me.
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  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Got is the Germanic origin of the word God, which is now spelled Gott in Germany.

    Mein Gott "My God"

    Dein Kind ist dein Gott "Your child is your God" a good tune by Das Ich.

    Also 'Gott ist Tot" "God is dead" is a good song too.

    "I Hope" is a prayer.

    It has nothing to do with Gott.
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  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    onelongsong wrote:
    now that's how it should be.

    I agree. :)

    I found greg's post very heartening. :)

    onelongsong wrote:
    and the question was why can't others act as you do.

    I think others do act this way OLS. Not everybody, obviously, but don't miss the wood for the trees. There are people that are not threatened by others points of view or beliefs. They are the people that you need to focus on.
    Even if someone doesn't agree with you, or you with them, the important thing is to be respectful of each others differences. Well I think, anyway. :)
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    soulsinging wrote:
    i dont think i ever said he was a monster. i said he was full of shit. like i said, he reminds me of that kid in junior high that always made up something to have the coolest story. it was annoying then and it's annoying now. if he wants to throw that shit out there, then he can expect to be called on it. you went to tell me about the constitution, then prove you know what you're talking about. he didnt. he got schooled by hippiemom. this is a forum about debate. if you want to jerk each other's egos off and flirt and giggle about your crushes, go to aet. he can handle himself and he always has. but if he doesn't want to be asked about these mysterious experiences, he shouldn't be citing to them as reasons for the rest of us to believe he is right.

    it has to do with the thread becos once again, he claimed there were some 619 commandments that every law ever made was based upon and that encompasses all of human morality. i and several others asked what these were as we had never heard of them and there was no reply. i figured it was another of his unsubstantiated claims. for once though, he gave a real answer (they are in the koran) and so i asked where i could see the list. still have not gotten a response. people have tried searching for them... but the only google search result for 619 commandments is... yup, the posts he has made on this board. might strange dont you think?

    :) I never said that you did call him a monster. I said I didn't think he was one. :)

    So it seems that much of what is going on here in this thread actually has nothing to do with this thread and is a combined frustration that you have from many previous threads? Or am I getting that wrong? :confused:
    The thread is about OLS view that athiests, in his opinion, feel the need to attack those of religion. And I read it that he wondered why people couldn't be respectful of each other. :rolleyes: Of course that's just my interpretation. I'm probably wrong.

    Please don't belittle my input. I simply asked why you felt it necessary to attack him personally. Or it seemed to me that you were. Again I could be wrong. This is text after all and not a true indication of the complexity of each of the individuals posting here.

    As to the other, well not that I feel the need to defend him, but I can confirm a couple of his claims. But it's not for me to do that.
    So perhaps like most of us here, some of what he says is bullshit and some of what he says is truth. By all means disagree, gee call it bullshit if you must, but play nice is perhaps all I'm asking. And not because I particularly feel the need to defend OLS but because you attacking him personally dimishes you.
    And I think that does you a diservice. :)
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    LikeAnOcean wrote:
    lol, but seriously. I don't believe in God, but I don't not believe in him. I am totally accepting of him if he is the truth, but I have no evidence besides people telling me who want to believe in him.. If there really is a god, I'm sure he'd understand why people might be confused. If not, then he's an asshole. I have a hard time believe god would be an asshole.

    I pretty much agree with everything that you've said here LAO. :)

    It's never made sense to me that if there is a God he/she would behave like a human. I would expect that if there is a God then surely he/she would be above behaving as the worst kind of human and would be capable of so much more than the best of humans. If not, then what's the point to God?
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Atheists might meditate, which is effectively the same thing.

    How is meditation "effectively the same thing" as prayer?
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    Jeanie wrote:
    How is meditation "effectively the same thing" as prayer?

    It has the same affect on the brain.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Ahnimus wrote:
    It has the same affect on the brain.
    prayer is, in essence, the same as meditating.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    It has the same affect on the brain.

    This is so stupid.

    No, it isn't/doesn't.

    An "I wish" is a prayer, an "I hope" is a prayer.

    Somehow you are ascribing the getting down on knees, and muttering a few wishes with the hands together as something like meditation. That's silly. Prayer is prayer, prayer is hoping. It's arrogant to make fun of those who choose to do it on their knees.
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  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    prayer is, in essence, the same as meditating.

    Bullshit
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  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    gue_barium wrote:
    Bullshit
    why not? prayer is like focusing on something.... like God. just like meditating... you focus on something and it can also be God.

    but if you mean prayer like, "oh, God, I pray that you get me out of this one." then that's the same thing as you mention, "I hope."

    but prayer as in the kind that makes you cry, pout, boohoo and weep and do all sorts of things... that's meditating. i probably sound like an idiot to you. :D
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    gue_barium wrote:
    This is so stupid.

    No, it isn't/doesn't.

    An "I wish" is a prayer, an "I hope" is a prayer.

    Somehow you are ascribing the getting down on knees, and muttering a few wishes with the hands together as something like meditation. That's silly. Prayer is prayer, prayer is hoping. It's arrogant to make fun of those who choose to do it on their knees.

    I'm not making fun of them. I'm just stating what experiments have shown. I'm not talking about light prayers by a moderate religious person. I'm talking about lengthy prayers of a deeply religious person. Or how a moderately religious person might feel at a particular gathering with other deeply religious people.

    I don't make fun of people by stating what I know.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/1847442.stm
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    yeah... i like you already!

    :) Well that's a relief!! ;)
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    I'm not making fun of them. I'm just stating what experiments have shown. I'm not talking about light prayers by a moderate religious person. I'm talking about lengthy prayers of a deeply religious person. Or how a moderately religious person might feel at a particular gathering with other deeply religious people.

    I don't make fun of people by stating what I know.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/1847442.stm

    Then you're making fun of the revival sort of thing: and that is a silly argument on your part. I mean, if you want to be scientific, at least subscribe your argument to the norm. It isn't the voodoo fringe that makes things what they are, and I am certain most of your arguments are aimed at proving what things are.
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