who gives a fuck abuot blame? blaming people doesnt solve the problem. there needs to be a mutual unconditional ceasefire... innocents on both sides are being murdered.
something else that pissed me off.... bush said something along the lines of iran has been the main sponsor of hezbollah and so is bad etc etc.... irish americans have been the main sponsors of IRA terrorists that led a murderous campaign against civilians in britian for years.... does bush crack down on that? NO.... does the senate ratify an extrodition treaty that will allow the british govt to extrodite IRA murderers? NO.....so bush, get off your moral high horse and clean up your own back garden.
you know the day he vetoed the stem cell funding bill saying murder is wrong, he backed the isralies to murder more lebonease civilians... i guess if you are not american or jewish your life doesnt mean much...
Bush... Bush... You know, it's quite apparent to me that Bush is.. well he's a moron ethically, but in the sense of Hitler he's quite brilliant. He's a people person, good 'ol texas boy that likes to shoot dear and he acts very personable. He is a good frontman, but not a good leader. The real problem lies in the administration as a whole. Political parties rarely change, new faces take the forefront but the same key players are calling the shots. In Canada we elected Stephen Harper, a friendly looking guy, but not much besides that. With him is the same old criminals behind Brian Mulroney. Guys like Stockwell Day. With Bush you have Dick Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Powell, etc.. It's the same crap over and over again, like a bad record. Arguably the best president the United States ever had was John F Kennedy, RFK could have been a good one too. Andrew Jackson had good goals and Abraham Lincoln was great too. What happened to freedom in the United States? What happened to care? I know the answer, Bush cremated care at the bohemian grove.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
We are putting quotes around "Israel", now? Alrighty.
It could be done for any country or politician as well. The central banks own all the weapons, factories, land, assets, (i.e. everything imaginable) and they really call all the shots.
Depends on the authors intention, I assume he was referring to US govt's sticky fingers and constant showering of weapons to Israel. Easy to see given the facts and statistics in this regard.
Good question ... I think the answer probably gets right at the heart of Hezbollah's goals. A military or a militia would focus on fighting the invaders. A terrorist group would choose to kill civilians instead.
You're hilarious. Do you even have any idea what's going on over there?
i understand that the rockets are not precise. so if i were in the situation of using indiscriminate rockets if would aim at a close target. i most definitely would not aim at targets far away.
again. i am just a simpleton using simpleton logic.
be safe.
?? How are they going to get close to armored tanks and long range machine guns without getting killed instantly?
Listen, I don't condone violence, war is the most disgusting thing we've ever created. It's sickening that we focus on the technologies of criminal scientists while the ground-breaking discoveries of zero-point energy and wireless power remain locked away in vaults. This is all a cruel joke. We haven't the slightest chance of knowing the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Half of what is printed in the history books and at least half of what we think we know are lies. You can get a slice of truth from every corner of the world and it still won't make up the whole truth. The war of 1812 as it is referred to in Canadian history is called the American War in the United States. The war ran from 1812-1814, a relatively short war, I used it as a single example of selective truth. In American history it's taught that it was a revolutionary war against Britain for land sovereignty. In Canadian history it was when the US tried to invade Canada and we got help from the Brittish. The president of the United States declared to Canada "You are either with us or against us." and Canada went against. The US led a full-scale invasion into southern Ontario, the main battle point was London, Ontario. London still has military bases and military within the city. The threat of US invasion still exists. What we are dealing with are governments that are highly susceptible to corruption and populations that are highly subjected to lies and propaganda. During the Nazi reign of Germany the network of german media was nowhere near as vast as the United States. However Hitler following the principles of Himmler managed to gain the sympathy for war and motivated the populace into attempted world domination. Germany is not like that anymore, it went through a series of drastic changes. Germany now has several US military strongholds from which forces were mobilized to fight in Iraq. The United States practically dominates german television. Documents were found in germany that suggested Hitler's own men set fire to the reichstag, which was the main reason for war. We've seen throughout history countless incidents of "False Flag" operations, the government stages an attack and blames it on a foreign entity. As people, as pro-nation and pro-humanity, we have to look at every thing that happens seriously and with scrutiny. The Constitution and Bill of Rights in the United States of America is intended to restrict government and allow the people to hold the government responsible. Your right to bare arms is your right to defend yourself from a police state. I admire that about the USA, Canada takes a much more "humanitarian" approach, but I argue, guns don't kill people, people kill people and they will use a pencil if they are serious about doing it. For the sake of scrutiny and liberty you must look at all sides of the story, look at what Hezbollah is saying, look at what Israel is saying, look at their history together. Place yourself in the shoes of both parties and try to get a feeling for their grief. O'reilly used this analogy "imagine mexicans have rockets pointed at you" fair enough, imagine that, that would suck and they probably do. With 90% certainty I can tell you Russia has nuclear warheads aimed at you and you have nukes aimed at Russia. Imagine illegal immigrants enter your country and continue to grow in a specified region, after a few years they declare themselves independant, taking a large chunk of the United States. You take up arms and attempt to drive them out, but they are too strong, they push the battle back onto your land. After the war is over, the land is theirs and the United Nations says it is. Over the next 45 years they continue to expand and gain pieces of your land, destroying your homes and colonizing in their place. At some point you realize that all you have left is a small chunk of land that you must share with millions of other people, under the rule of a foreign entity, living in poverty, struggling to survive. How would you react? How does the story end? Historically, speaking of native indians in North America, you lose, they take over, dominating you, you hope they don't completely destroy you and in the very best case, you get reperations for the damage. So yes, it does suck to have missiles aimed at you, it sucks from all perspectives. "Hezbollah attacked first" is not the root cause, it's not even a speck of truth. "Hezbollah are terrorists" not even close, criminals?, yes, but not terrorists. No more terrorists than Israel or the United States.
Anyway, I can't talk about it anymore right now. It's just disgusting how this conflict is perceived. It's a damn shame to call ourselves sophisticated or humane. People like to feel big, bigger than others, as countries I see this all the time. America: We are strong, we are free, we are generous, Canada: We are peaceful, we bring aid, we keep the peace. Americans tend to pride themselves on their wealth as a country, their military power and hollywood. Canadians pride themselves on peaceful superiority, and constantly bash the United States to make themselves bigger. The same thing happens in society, people talk negatively behind coworkers backs, lie, cheat and steal to keep up with the Jones'. This is our reality, that we have to come to grips with first, to be able to understand someone else.
Nice one dude. Say it like it is man. Those would appear to be your words, and I couldn't agree more. I wonder when they eyes of the stubborn will finally open and awake in this regard?
Good question ... I think the answer probably gets right at the heart of Hezbollah's goals. A military or a militia would focus on fighting the invaders. A terrorist group would choose to kill civilians instead.
Hezbollah lacks the proper funding and technology to target anything really. I don't think they have much 'guided' anything.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
israel wanted a pretext... it got its pretext... 10 members of the security council condemn israel's excessive attacks... of course, minus the US... hezebollah was wrong to do what it did... but i have no sympathy for israel after this... sadly many more civilians will be killed... but hey we can argue about it on the message board of a early 90s rock band... that's always fun...
Hezbollah lacks the proper funding and technology to target anything really. I don't think they have much 'guided' anything.
Ok, that's it. Do you guys really bother to actally read other's posts?
I wrote it over and over again (even in this specifuc thread) - Hezbollah has Iran as a main funder, which means L-O-T-S of money. They also have advanced missiles from Iran & Syria, the kind that no technology can shoot down, and they are using these missiles to fire at C-I-V-I-L-I-A-N-S in northern Israel. The more advanced technology such as guided missiles, UAV's etc' is mainly used against the IDF, along with other "regular" weapons.
Allow me to repeate my own words:
"I really don't understand you. simple rockets or advanced ones - they are all designed to kill, and Hezbollah is only targeting them toward Israeli civilians"
Yesterday Hezbollah had *direct* hits on several civilians houses so you see, they don't really missinig the target.
Ok, that's it. Do you guys really bother to actally read other's posts?
I wrote it over and over again (even in this specifuc thread) - Hezbollah has Iran as a main funder, which means L-O-T-S of money. They also have advanced missiles from Iran & Syria, the kind that no technology can shoot down, and they are using these missiles to fire at C-I-V-I-L-I-A-N-S in northern Israel. The more advanced technology such as guided missiles, UAV's etc' is mainly used against the IDF, along with other "regular" weapons.
Allow me to repeate my own words:
"I really don't understand you. simple rockets or advanced ones - they are all designed to kill, and Hezbollah is only targeting them toward Israeli civilians"
Yesterday Hezbollah had *direct* hits on several civilians houses so you see, they don't really missinig the target.
I don't think they have the capabilities to really target anything specificially as opposed to Israel's billion dollar military funded by the US. I think they shoot missiles, but I don't think they can really pinpoint actual targets.
Here's what i did find on actual targets and the drone:
Ok, that's it. Do you guys really bother to actally read other's posts?
I wrote it over and over again (even in this specifuc thread) - Hezbollah has Iran as a main funder, which means L-O-T-S of money. They also have advanced missiles from Iran & Syria, the kind that no technology can shoot down, and they are using these missiles to fire at C-I-V-I-L-I-A-N-S in northern Israel. The more advanced technology such as guided missiles, UAV's etc' is mainly used against the IDF, along with other "regular" weapons.
Allow me to repeate my own words:
"I really don't understand you. simple rockets or advanced ones - they are all designed to kill, and Hezbollah is only targeting them toward Israeli civilians"
Yesterday Hezbollah had *direct* hits on several civilians houses so you see, they don't really missinig the target.
Listen Shiraz, I know what you said. I can't begin to understand what it's like to live in a war zone. However, we just watched the US pull this shit in Iraq and Afghanistan. Hezbollah was NOT launching rockets at you prior to the IAF's strikes on Lebonese civilians. Israel has been occupying arab land in Lebonan, Syria and Palestine for half a century and that is fact. Stand up for your people and recognize what is going on.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I admit, I haven't read every post here, but has anyone addressed why and how Hezbollah started? 1982 Israel launches a massive offensive into Lebanon which was a highly educated, cosmopolitan, free thinking society and continued to occupy it til 1990. Hezbollah was formed to fight the occupation on their own soil and is credited by many people for freeing Lebanon from the Israeli occupation and a regime that killed many, many civilians and was led by Ariel Sharon who was tossed out of politics after being labelled a war criminal. Soooo, who really started it?
Israel justified the invasion saying that Lebanon allowed Palestinians who set up camp there after being bombed by Jordan to remain and threaten Israel, while the truth of the matter is that Lebanon's gov't was just far too weak to do anything about it. Thousands of lebanese civilians dead from Israeli bombs. Sound familiar?
I admit, I haven't read every post here, but has anyone addressed why and how Hezbollah started? 1982 Israel launches a massive offensive into Lebanon which was a highly educated, cosmopolitan, free thinking society and continued to occupy it til 1990. Hezbollah was formed to fight the occupation on their own soil and is credited by many people for freeing Lebanon from the Israeli occupation and a regime that killed many, many civilians and was led by Ariel Sharon who was tossed out of politics after being labelled a war criminal. Soooo, who really started it?
Israel justified the invasion saying that Lebanon allowed Palestinians who set up camp there after being bombed by Jordan to remain and threaten Israel, while the truth of the matter is that Lebanon's gov't was just far too weak to do anything about it. Thousands of lebanese civilians dead from Israeli bombs. Sound familiar?
Yea, I posted it a few times. Hezbollah says they want Israel to release over 9,000 women and children, some infants from their jails. Palestinians are thankful to Hezbollah for diverting Israel's attention for a short time. That's why Hezbollah commited an "act of war", not an "act of terror" by capturing and killing Israeli soldiers, not civilians. The whole issue of civilians came into play afterwards.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
"Hezbollah was NOT launching rockets at you prior to the IDF's strikes on Lebonese civilians". W-R-O-N-G, but at the momemt when Haifa area has just taken 14 hits, I don't really care. There isn't any justification to Hezbollah initial actions, end of story.
"Israel has been occupying arab land in Lebonan" - till 2000, yes, and therefore Hezbollah has no right to exsit as a terror organization anymore.
"... Syria and Palestine for half a century and that is fact" - I never said we didn't, but I'm sorry - these facts are irelevant for Hezbollah latest actions. Hezbollah acted for the sake of southern Lebanon since day one, his goal was getting this area out of our occupation, and he got what he wanted.
The thing is that Hezbollah is not just a military/terror organization, but a full fledged political entity. They provide hospitals, schools and other public services along with a military side which is plenty pissed at Israel with good reason. So the reason why they continue to exist beyond the Israeli occupation in 2000 is probably due to their other work within the Lebonese community and general distrust of Israel. I'm not justifying their actions but they do serve a useful purpose beyond the bloodshed.
"Hezbollah was NOT launching rockets at you prior to the IDF's strikes on Lebonese civilians". W-R-O-N-G, but at the momemt when Haifa area has just taken 14 hits, I don't really care. There isn't any justification to Hezbollah initial actions, end of story.
"Israel has been occupying arab land in Lebonan" - till 2000, yes, and therefore Hezbollah has no right to exsit as a terror organization anymore.
"... Syria and Palestine for half a century and that is fact" - I never said we didn't, but I'm sorry - these facts are irelevant for Hezbollah latest actions. Hezbollah acted for the sake of southern Lebanon since day one, his goal was getting this area out of our occupation, and he got what he wanted.
No I distinctly recall reading that Hezbollah declared itself freedom fighters for the entire arab world. Israel still occupies defenseless palestinian land and the Shebaa Farms in Syria. So first of all, it's no wonder Syria provides funding to Hezbollah, they want their farms back. Secondly, it's obvious why they picked now to commit an "act of war" while Israel is dismantling the Hamas - the democratically elected government of palestine.
To say that Hezbollah has no reason... how can I exlain this. Imagine a guy runs up to someone and beats the living shit out of them for no reason. I would expect him to run around laughing histerically afterwards until his brain explodes. I mean, anyone who is not criminally insane has a reason. Hezbollah exists as more than one person, a number of people with international support. So the only possible explanation is that they are all criminally insane, which supports Israel and Bush's idea that all arabs are nuts and is rather racist if you ask me. Or maybe Hezbollah has a reason for what they did. I am confident that I know the reason, and it's not to "drive Israel into the ocean". I'd say at this point, if Israel pulled all of it's soldiers and colonies out of Palestine, Syria and wherever else they exist, sometime within the next 50 years the fighting will stop, groups like Hezbollah will lose support and will be forced to disolve. At the current rate though, using war philosophy that I disagree with, the only other way to resolve the ongoing conflict is the total genocide of the Arab world and domination by Israel. In all fairness, I support the former solution.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
The thing is that Hezbollah is not just a military/terror organization, but a full fledged political entity. They provide hospitals, schools and other public services along with a military side which is plenty pissed at Israel with good reason. So the reason why they continue to exist beyond the Israeli occupation in 2000 is probably due to their other work within the Lebonese community and general distrust of Israel. I'm not justifying their actions but they do serve a useful purpose beyond the bloodshed.
I was claer - they have no reason to exist as a terror organization since we moved out of Lebanon in 2000, hence no reason to be an armed force, but this is just what they are.
And all of the talking about other work - well, even if its true (which I find it hard to believe), I can say the exact thing about bin laden's organization. After all, we heard the same things about it too.
Great, 2 people were killed about 20 minutes ago in the latest Haifa attack. at least 2 hits were directed.
No I distinctly recall reading that Hezbollah declared itself freedom fighters for the entire arab world. Israel still occupies defenseless palestinian land and the Shebaa Farms in Syria. So first of all, it's no wonder Syria provides funding to Hezbollah, they want their farms back. Secondly, it's obvious why they picked now to commit an "act of war" while Israel is dismantling the Hamas - the democratically elected government of palestine.
To say that Hezbollah has no reason... how can I exlain this. Imagine a guy runs up to someone and beats the living shit out of them for no reason. I would expect him to run around laughing histerically afterwards until his brain explodes. I mean, anyone who is not criminally insane has a reason. Hezbollah exists as more than one person, a number of people with international support. So the only possible explanation is that they are all criminally insane, which supports Israel and Bush's idea that all arabs are nuts and is rather racist if you ask me. Or maybe Hezbollah has a reason for what they did. I am confident that I know the reason, and it's not to "drive Israel into the ocean". I'd say at this point, if Israel pulled all of it's soldiers and colonies out of Palestine, Syria and wherever else they exist, sometime within the next 50 years the fighting will stop, groups like Hezbollah will lose support and will be forced to disolve. At the current rate though, using war philosophy that I disagree with, the only other way to resolve the ongoing conflict is the total genocide of the Arab world and domination by Israel. In all fairness, I support the former solution.
This is pointless. I wrote it over and over, but you just ignore the simple facts - Hezbollah acts for southern Lebanon, Hamas for southern Israel (the Gaza area). Hezbollah has nothing to do with Gaza, nothing, and even if it did it has NO right to cross the Israeli border, kill and kidnap patrol soliders at the Israeli side and start shooting towards civilians BEFORE Israel had responded.
Since 2000, Hezbollah was orderd by the U.N to disarm, but it didn't do so. Hezbollah Is considered to be a terror group by the UN, US, England, Canada and Australia by deffinition. Its considered to be 'an armed foece who is involved with terror acts' within other western countries. I really don't see your point - Everyone defind Hezbollah as a group of terrorists, but you are doing everything you can to justifay its right to exsit as one.
LEBANON & GAZA ARE NOT REALLY RELATED!!! get it to your head!
This is pointless. I wrote it over and over, but you just ignore the simple facts - Hezbollah acts for southern Lebanon, Hamas for southern Israel (the Gaza area). Hezbollah has nothing to do with Gaza, nothing, and even if it did it has NO right to cross the Israeli border, kill and kidnap patrol soliders at the Israeli side and start shooting towards civilians BEFORE Israel had responded.
Since 2000, Hezbollah was orderd by the U.N to disarm, but it didn't do so. Hezbollah Is considered to be a terror group by the UN, US, England, Canada and Australia by deffinition. Its considered to be 'an armed foece who is involved with terror acts' within other western countries. I really don't see your point - Everyone defind Hezbollah as a group of terrorists, but you are doing everything you can to justifay its right to exsit as one.
LEBANON & GAZA ARE NOT REALLY RELATED!!! get it to your head!
Just because you say something doesn't make it fact. If you want me to believe what it in the slightest I'd suggest providing some links to credible sources.
I personally don't care what those nations say about Hezbollah, they used to say the world is flat. I've checked it out, I've spent a lot of time on Israeli government websites and Hezbollah affiliated websites and I can say you are misguided. Lebanon and Palestine have a lot in common, and that is Israel. Can you admit that you are there by force? That Israel has stolen the land and continues to steal land?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
"All attempts to claim Arab sovereignty over Israel of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state and the only bulwark of the Judeo-Christian Western civilization in the Middle East."
This website, claims that palestine does not exist and says "all attempts to claim arab sovereignty over "Israel" of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state"
I can't stress enough how racist this website is towards arabs.
Using the same website, I've linked to several maps, as a illustration of Israel's birth and expansion.
It's pretty amazing how these websites keep using the entire Arab world to make Israel look small and helpless, and uses ratios to make Israel's military look small by comparison. Just as an example, Vancouver Island, B.C. is larger than Japan. So Israel being smaller than California is no suprise and doesn't justify expansion.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Just as an example, Vancouver Island, B.C. is larger than Japan.
No, it's not.
Japan has a total land area of 145,903 square miles. It consists of a great string of islands in a northeast-southwest arc that stretches for approximately 1,500 miles
Vancouver Island, B.C. has a total land area of 12,407 square miles. The island is 285 miles long and up to 50 miles wide.
Japan has a total land area of 145,903 square miles. It consists of a great string of islands in a northeast-southwest arc that stretches for approximately 1,500 miles
Vancouver Island, B.C. has a total land area of 12,407 square miles. The island is 285 miles long and up to 50 miles wide.
Where do you get your facts?
Heh, well I didn't actually get the facts. I used to live there and a lot of Japanese live there. I'll admit that I was wrong, it doesn't change anything though. Except you can see how I will admit that I am wrong, even when you don't provide a source for your information. I can look it up here and see that you are right, but some of these other claims it's not that simple.
Anyway, I hope your not saying that justifies Israel's expansion.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Heh, well I didn't actually get the facts. I used to live there and a lot of Japanese live there. I'll admit that I was wrong, it doesn't change anything though. Except you can see how I will admit that I am wrong, even when you don't provide a source for your information. I can look it up here and see that you are right, but some of these other claims it's not that simple.
Anyway, I hope your not saying that justifies Israel's expansion.
I'm just pointing out a glaring inaccuracy
As far as the topic at hand, I say fuck it! Let them wipe each other off the face of the Earth. No more "Trouble in the Middle East".
That would only mean death for the palestinians. Unless the US decided to stop supporting Israel, then it would mean death to the Jews. Anyway, I'm too tired to debate this anymore. Have a good night... err morning, whatever.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
"All attempts to claim Arab sovereignty over Israel of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state and the only bulwark of the Judeo-Christian Western civilization in the Middle East."
This website, claims that palestine does not exist and says "all attempts to claim arab sovereignty over "Israel" of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state"
I can't stress enough how racist this website is towards arabs.
Using the same website, I've linked to several maps, as a illustration of Israel's birth and expansion.
It's pretty amazing how these websites keep using the entire Arab world to make Israel look small and helpless, and uses ratios to make Israel's military look small by comparison. Just as an example, Vancouver Island, B.C. is larger than Japan. So Israel being smaller than California is no suprise and doesn't justify expansion.
What the hell are you talking about!?! I don't even know these sites! everything I worte is a fact, and if you just litsen for a minute instead of ignoring everything I say, you'll see I'm not making things up. Check the main news sites, check out wikipedia - Hezbollah IS a terror organization which had lost his right to exsit as one since 2000.
Its latest attack was not the first one since 2000, in 2003 they did the same thing - kidnaped and then killed 3 patrol soliders *inside* Israel. Its easy just to dismiss me by saying I'm taking my info from these kind of websites, than actually dig in some more in what I have to say, ha?
"Just because you say something doesn't make it fact. If you want me to believe what it in the slightest I'd suggest providing some links to credible sources": I dont need to. obviously you're not gonna believe me, a person who live here, no matter what I say.
"I personally don't care what those nations say about Hezbollah" - than why are keep telling everyone that Hezbollah is not considered to be a terror organization? Who decided that, you? Almost eveyone claim it is a terror organization, but they are all wrong? please...
"I've checked it out, I've spent a lot of time on Israeli government websites and Hezbollah affiliated websites and I can say you are misguided": I live here, I am l-i-v-i-n-g this situation everyday, and you say I'm misguided? You are basically prefer to believe the info from a terror organization site, a website which has every reason to make you think Hezbollah are harmless people, and you are calling me misguided?
"Lebanon and Palestine have a lot in common, and that is Israel". No. They HAD a lot in common, Israel moved out from Lebanon in 2000, the only reason we came back to southeren Lebanese border are the actions of the Hezbollah- end of story.
"Can you admit that you are there by force? That Israel has stolen the land": I already did, in MANY MANY posts that you didn't actually bother to read. We are in Lebanon now cause of the Hezbollah, there is no Israeli occupation in Lebanon since 2000, but we are still occuping lands in southern Isreal for really no good reason.
"and continues to steal land" Really? wanna tell me something new? Which land other than the one in Gaza area / syria (desputed) did we steal lately?
As far as the topic at hand, I say fuck it! Let them wipe each other off the face of the Earth. No more "Trouble in the Middle East".
I'm almost going to have to agree and say let this crazy thing play out. It's a means to an end of some kind, or even more means, then an end, or just more means, then perhaps a new beginning....perhaps good. It's like making up after a good fight. Maybe they just need to get it on...work it out of their systems, and have a good fuck. I can tell you one thing, If I was a civillian, I'd be waaaay out of there by now though as far as I could get, so whoever sticks around is pretty insane (hezzy?)
It seems no one over there is willing to talk reasonably anymore...oh well. What can be done? What would/could stop this thing right now? If they both want it... let em have it.
The reasoning behind it all is beginning to melt my brain... It's so extremely polarized it makes the ying/yang symbol look like a rubiks cube...
This is a terrorist organization who has no respect for human life at all....hopefully israel gets the job done
Ha Ha Ha Ha !!! this one's really funny !!! Hey man ! Don't be so Naive , and don't trust every word that the journalists on Fox News say !!!
Man ! "Hezbollah" is not a terrosist organization but a resistance . Maybe you tend to forget that Israel is collonising a big part of the south of lebanon , and also a big part of "syria" and a big part of "egypt" and collonising the whole palestine ! Man , those poeple are suffering since 50 years , they've been taken all that they have , and nobody talked about that ! While you are sitting there , drinking a beer in front of your TV , Hundreds of poeple are dying ,innocent Kids and Women . so you don't have the right , I say you don't have the fucking right to say this " Hopefully Israel gets the job done" Who do you think you are ? I'm really upset when i hear those kind of things !!! tell me ! you don't have heart or what !? please keep those kind of thoughts to yourself , I bet nobody here wants to hear what you have to say !!!
Since 2000, Hezbollah was orderd by the U.N to disarm, but it didn't do so. Hezbollah Is considered to be a terror group by the UN, US, England, Canada and Australia by deffinition. Its considered to be 'an armed foece who is involved with terror acts' within other western countries.
there's plenty of UN resolution against Israel occupation and Israel has an army... so, through your definition, because Israel has an army and don't respect the UN resolutions, should be considered a terror organization...
It's interesting how people of a nation which government is oppressing other people start to turn against those people too: see for example Serbs in Kosovo: before 1999 also civilian serbs committed human rights violations. It's a shame that you keep a blind eye on what your government is doing, shiraz
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Bush... Bush... You know, it's quite apparent to me that Bush is.. well he's a moron ethically, but in the sense of Hitler he's quite brilliant. He's a people person, good 'ol texas boy that likes to shoot dear and he acts very personable. He is a good frontman, but not a good leader. The real problem lies in the administration as a whole. Political parties rarely change, new faces take the forefront but the same key players are calling the shots. In Canada we elected Stephen Harper, a friendly looking guy, but not much besides that. With him is the same old criminals behind Brian Mulroney. Guys like Stockwell Day. With Bush you have Dick Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Powell, etc.. It's the same crap over and over again, like a bad record. Arguably the best president the United States ever had was John F Kennedy, RFK could have been a good one too. Andrew Jackson had good goals and Abraham Lincoln was great too. What happened to freedom in the United States? What happened to care? I know the answer, Bush cremated care at the bohemian grove.
It could be done for any country or politician as well. The central banks own all the weapons, factories, land, assets, (i.e. everything imaginable) and they really call all the shots.
Depends on the authors intention, I assume he was referring to US govt's sticky fingers and constant showering of weapons to Israel. Easy to see given the facts and statistics in this regard.
You're hilarious. Do you even have any idea what's going on over there?
?? How are they going to get close to armored tanks and long range machine guns without getting killed instantly?
yes perhaps you are a simpleton... :P
Nice one dude. Say it like it is man. Those would appear to be your words, and I couldn't agree more. I wonder when they eyes of the stubborn will finally open and awake in this regard?
Ignorance is bliss they say...
Hezbollah lacks the proper funding and technology to target anything really. I don't think they have much 'guided' anything.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Ok, that's it. Do you guys really bother to actally read other's posts?
I wrote it over and over again (even in this specifuc thread) - Hezbollah has Iran as a main funder, which means L-O-T-S of money. They also have advanced missiles from Iran & Syria, the kind that no technology can shoot down, and they are using these missiles to fire at C-I-V-I-L-I-A-N-S in northern Israel. The more advanced technology such as guided missiles, UAV's etc' is mainly used against the IDF, along with other "regular" weapons.
Allow me to repeate my own words:
"I really don't understand you. simple rockets or advanced ones - they are all designed to kill, and Hezbollah is only targeting them toward Israeli civilians"
Yesterday Hezbollah had *direct* hits on several civilians houses so you see, they don't really missinig the target.
I don't think they have the capabilities to really target anything specificially as opposed to Israel's billion dollar military funded by the US. I think they shoot missiles, but I don't think they can really pinpoint actual targets.
Here's what i did find on actual targets and the drone:
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&q=hezbollah%20drone&sa=N&tab=wn
They all say a warship was targeted.
I also found this:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/012/481ydesv.asp
"And while early reports that an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) was responsible for the attack on the Israeli warship were inaccurate, Hezbollah is still assumed to possess several UAVs."
I think the majority of their aresnal can not pinpoint specific targets.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Listen Shiraz, I know what you said. I can't begin to understand what it's like to live in a war zone. However, we just watched the US pull this shit in Iraq and Afghanistan. Hezbollah was NOT launching rockets at you prior to the IAF's strikes on Lebonese civilians. Israel has been occupying arab land in Lebonan, Syria and Palestine for half a century and that is fact. Stand up for your people and recognize what is going on.
Israel justified the invasion saying that Lebanon allowed Palestinians who set up camp there after being bombed by Jordan to remain and threaten Israel, while the truth of the matter is that Lebanon's gov't was just far too weak to do anything about it. Thousands of lebanese civilians dead from Israeli bombs. Sound familiar?
Yea, I posted it a few times. Hezbollah says they want Israel to release over 9,000 women and children, some infants from their jails. Palestinians are thankful to Hezbollah for diverting Israel's attention for a short time. That's why Hezbollah commited an "act of war", not an "act of terror" by capturing and killing Israeli soldiers, not civilians. The whole issue of civilians came into play afterwards.
"Israel has been occupying arab land in Lebonan" - till 2000, yes, and therefore Hezbollah has no right to exsit as a terror organization anymore.
"... Syria and Palestine for half a century and that is fact" - I never said we didn't, but I'm sorry - these facts are irelevant for Hezbollah latest actions. Hezbollah acted for the sake of southern Lebanon since day one, his goal was getting this area out of our occupation, and he got what he wanted.
Adress that tought to my friend in Carmiel (she has no home to come back to) and to the rest of Israeli civilians who their house was bombed.
No I distinctly recall reading that Hezbollah declared itself freedom fighters for the entire arab world. Israel still occupies defenseless palestinian land and the Shebaa Farms in Syria. So first of all, it's no wonder Syria provides funding to Hezbollah, they want their farms back. Secondly, it's obvious why they picked now to commit an "act of war" while Israel is dismantling the Hamas - the democratically elected government of palestine.
To say that Hezbollah has no reason... how can I exlain this. Imagine a guy runs up to someone and beats the living shit out of them for no reason. I would expect him to run around laughing histerically afterwards until his brain explodes. I mean, anyone who is not criminally insane has a reason. Hezbollah exists as more than one person, a number of people with international support. So the only possible explanation is that they are all criminally insane, which supports Israel and Bush's idea that all arabs are nuts and is rather racist if you ask me. Or maybe Hezbollah has a reason for what they did. I am confident that I know the reason, and it's not to "drive Israel into the ocean". I'd say at this point, if Israel pulled all of it's soldiers and colonies out of Palestine, Syria and wherever else they exist, sometime within the next 50 years the fighting will stop, groups like Hezbollah will lose support and will be forced to disolve. At the current rate though, using war philosophy that I disagree with, the only other way to resolve the ongoing conflict is the total genocide of the Arab world and domination by Israel. In all fairness, I support the former solution.
I was claer - they have no reason to exist as a terror organization since we moved out of Lebanon in 2000, hence no reason to be an armed force, but this is just what they are.
And all of the talking about other work - well, even if its true (which I find it hard to believe), I can say the exact thing about bin laden's organization. After all, we heard the same things about it too.
Great, 2 people were killed about 20 minutes ago in the latest Haifa attack. at least 2 hits were directed.
This is pointless. I wrote it over and over, but you just ignore the simple facts - Hezbollah acts for southern Lebanon, Hamas for southern Israel (the Gaza area). Hezbollah has nothing to do with Gaza, nothing, and even if it did it has NO right to cross the Israeli border, kill and kidnap patrol soliders at the Israeli side and start shooting towards civilians BEFORE Israel had responded.
Since 2000, Hezbollah was orderd by the U.N to disarm, but it didn't do so. Hezbollah Is considered to be a terror group by the UN, US, England, Canada and Australia by deffinition. Its considered to be 'an armed foece who is involved with terror acts' within other western countries. I really don't see your point - Everyone defind Hezbollah as a group of terrorists, but you are doing everything you can to justifay its right to exsit as one.
LEBANON & GAZA ARE NOT REALLY RELATED!!! get it to your head!
Just because you say something doesn't make it fact. If you want me to believe what it in the slightest I'd suggest providing some links to credible sources.
I personally don't care what those nations say about Hezbollah, they used to say the world is flat. I've checked it out, I've spent a lot of time on Israeli government websites and Hezbollah affiliated websites and I can say you are misguided. Lebanon and Palestine have a lot in common, and that is Israel. Can you admit that you are there by force? That Israel has stolen the land and continues to steal land?
"All attempts to claim Arab sovereignty over Israel of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state and the only bulwark of the Judeo-Christian Western civilization in the Middle East."
http://www.science.co.il/History-Palestine.asp
This website, claims that palestine does not exist and says "all attempts to claim arab sovereignty over "Israel" of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state"
I can't stress enough how racist this website is towards arabs.
Using the same website, I've linked to several maps, as a illustration of Israel's birth and expansion.
Palestine 1920, the area Britain promised to both the Arabs and the Jews
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/PalestineMandate.asp
Palestine 1923, Britain split it 25/75, Jews/Arabs.
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/PartitionforTransJordan.asp
"Israel" 1947, showing the still Arab occupied land
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/1947UNPartitionPlan.asp
1949
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/1949ArmisticeLines.asp
Pre 1967 Golan Heights
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/Pre1967GolanHeights.asp
1967 cease-fire lines
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/1967CeaseFireLines.asp
1973 Yom Kippur War
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/1973YomKippurWar.asp
Withdrawl from Sinai
http://www.unitedjerusalem.com/Graphics/Maps/SinaiWithdrawlFinal.asp
It's pretty amazing how these websites keep using the entire Arab world to make Israel look small and helpless, and uses ratios to make Israel's military look small by comparison. Just as an example, Vancouver Island, B.C. is larger than Japan. So Israel being smaller than California is no suprise and doesn't justify expansion.
No, it's not.
Japan has a total land area of 145,903 square miles. It consists of a great string of islands in a northeast-southwest arc that stretches for approximately 1,500 miles
Vancouver Island, B.C. has a total land area of 12,407 square miles. The island is 285 miles long and up to 50 miles wide.
Where do you get your facts?
Heh, well I didn't actually get the facts. I used to live there and a lot of Japanese live there. I'll admit that I was wrong, it doesn't change anything though. Except you can see how I will admit that I am wrong, even when you don't provide a source for your information. I can look it up here and see that you are right, but some of these other claims it's not that simple.
Anyway, I hope your not saying that justifies Israel's expansion.
I'm just pointing out a glaring inaccuracy
As far as the topic at hand, I say fuck it! Let them wipe each other off the face of the Earth. No more "Trouble in the Middle East".
http://www.britannica.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
Take your pick!
That would only mean death for the palestinians. Unless the US decided to stop supporting Israel, then it would mean death to the Jews. Anyway, I'm too tired to debate this anymore. Have a good night... err morning, whatever.
What the hell are you talking about!?! I don't even know these sites! everything I worte is a fact, and if you just litsen for a minute instead of ignoring everything I say, you'll see I'm not making things up. Check the main news sites, check out wikipedia - Hezbollah IS a terror organization which had lost his right to exsit as one since 2000.
Its latest attack was not the first one since 2000, in 2003 they did the same thing - kidnaped and then killed 3 patrol soliders *inside* Israel. Its easy just to dismiss me by saying I'm taking my info from these kind of websites, than actually dig in some more in what I have to say, ha?
"I personally don't care what those nations say about Hezbollah" - than why are keep telling everyone that Hezbollah is not considered to be a terror organization? Who decided that, you? Almost eveyone claim it is a terror organization, but they are all wrong? please...
"I've checked it out, I've spent a lot of time on Israeli government websites and Hezbollah affiliated websites and I can say you are misguided": I live here, I am l-i-v-i-n-g this situation everyday, and you say I'm misguided? You are basically prefer to believe the info from a terror organization site, a website which has every reason to make you think Hezbollah are harmless people, and you are calling me misguided?
"Lebanon and Palestine have a lot in common, and that is Israel". No. They HAD a lot in common, Israel moved out from Lebanon in 2000, the only reason we came back to southeren Lebanese border are the actions of the Hezbollah- end of story.
"Can you admit that you are there by force? That Israel has stolen the land": I already did, in MANY MANY posts that you didn't actually bother to read. We are in Lebanon now cause of the Hezbollah, there is no Israeli occupation in Lebanon since 2000, but we are still occuping lands in southern Isreal for really no good reason.
"and continues to steal land" Really? wanna tell me something new? Which land other than the one in Gaza area / syria (desputed) did we steal lately?
I'm almost going to have to agree and say let this crazy thing play out. It's a means to an end of some kind, or even more means, then an end, or just more means, then perhaps a new beginning....perhaps good. It's like making up after a good fight. Maybe they just need to get it on...work it out of their systems, and have a good fuck. I can tell you one thing, If I was a civillian, I'd be waaaay out of there by now though as far as I could get, so whoever sticks around is pretty insane (hezzy?)
It seems no one over there is willing to talk reasonably anymore...oh well. What can be done? What would/could stop this thing right now? If they both want it... let em have it.
The reasoning behind it all is beginning to melt my brain... It's so extremely polarized it makes the ying/yang symbol look like a rubiks cube...
Ha Ha Ha Ha !!! this one's really funny !!! Hey man ! Don't be so Naive , and don't trust every word that the journalists on Fox News say !!!
Man ! "Hezbollah" is not a terrosist organization but a resistance . Maybe you tend to forget that Israel is collonising a big part of the south of lebanon , and also a big part of "syria" and a big part of "egypt" and collonising the whole palestine ! Man , those poeple are suffering since 50 years , they've been taken all that they have , and nobody talked about that ! While you are sitting there , drinking a beer in front of your TV , Hundreds of poeple are dying ,innocent Kids and Women . so you don't have the right , I say you don't have the fucking right to say this " Hopefully Israel gets the job done" Who do you think you are ? I'm really upset when i hear those kind of things !!! tell me ! you don't have heart or what !? please keep those kind of thoughts to yourself , I bet nobody here wants to hear what you have to say !!!
It's interesting how people of a nation which government is oppressing other people start to turn against those people too: see for example Serbs in Kosovo: before 1999 also civilian serbs committed human rights violations. It's a shame that you keep a blind eye on what your government is doing, shiraz
www.amnesty.org.uk