It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
shockingly low. After reading this thread, I was convinced it was 7/8 people pulled double GA, the remainder who didn’t are in this thread.
The system is not unfair, all members have an equal chance to win tickets to every show, for all seating levels. Each show is an individual draw with an equal chance for all members. It is the results that could be perceived as unfair as members were highly successful and others got nothing. Some people win at blackjack, some people lose their shirts. And if you selected GA/P1 for your only option and got nothing you should not be surprised.
How is a system where one person wins GA to the same 4 shows I put in for and I get nothing not unfair?
Again; this goes back to not understanding basic statistics. Also, there weren’t a majority of people winning 4 GA shows. Some did. Most did not. Some got shut out completely, most did not get shut out completely. It’s really that simple.
I understand basic statistics, trust me. Applied math major here. My point is they shouldn't have a system that allows these types of outcomes.
You are probably right. People don't need to go 10 out of 10 on fan club lottery to enjoy the tour, when many get noting. But thems the breaks. Whatever they would try to do to put a cap on the lotto system in order to guarantee something for everyone would create another spiral of complaints. Two show minimum or whatever they may decide on etc. If we were all guaranteed one pair of 10C tickets per leg or something, I'd sign up for that and then you battle it out for more if you want. I don't think they will every even consider coming up with the parameters for something like that. It would lead to even more phony 10C accounts by resellers. Hell, I'd have a total of 6 accounts for me, my wife, and the kids.
For the record, exactly two people-- two!-- have reported going 10-for-10 in 93 pages of the lottery thread.
And the odds of anyone going 10-10 are extremely low. Let alone 2 people
How many people have been skunked after picking 4 or 5 shows?
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
shockingly low. After reading this thread, I was convinced it was 7/8 people pulled double GA, the remainder who didn’t are in this thread.
There are also an inordinate amount of people who got shut out for both nights in one city. So, if they put in for “GA or Reserved” but didn’t get GA… I don’t think they were added back into the draw for reserved seats for either night. People who selected “Reserved” in addition to “GA and Reserved” (whether P1 or P2) were probably okay. But those who thought they would be okay with just selecting “GA and Reserved” were not included in the general seated draw, therefore not getting either night.
Thoughts?
If said person only selected "GA or Reserved", that's on them. It was pretty clear all should be selected for best chance
It literally says this is the instructions, I pulled it directly: "Select GA Pit / Reserved for your best chance of getting tickets."
That would lead one to believe that if they selected "GA or Reserved" they wouildn't then need to also select just "Reserved."
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
This ^ for SHZA! Simply put, something went wrong with the random draw.
Since I don't have hard data, I will suggest something that may have happened only based on the results I have seen here and heard through friends - so it may be off base, but thought it was worth a mention. Do any of you think that they drew for cities and not specific shows. So, if a person put in for two shows and they got whatever they got for the first show, they were also automatically given that for the second show. And if the first show was not won at all, then you were also not given the second show? But if you only put in for the second show, then you were in the draw for that show. From some of the winning patterns here, it almost seems like that. The two shows I got were both single night shows (Baltimore and MSG). But for the shows I put in with two nights - I was shut out of both nights completely. Again, just trying to figure out how some people got GA for both shows in multiple cities. I know it is possible, but seems so unlikely.
Potentially. I noticed the same thing.
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
shockingly low. After reading this thread, I was convinced it was 7/8 people pulled double GA, the remainder who didn’t are in this thread.
1/8 is shockingly high
You’re the applied math major, you of all people should know each draw is an independent draw and not related to the next, so how can you think 12% of people is high (even if this number is inflated) to pull GA to 2 shows?
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
shockingly low. After reading this thread, I was convinced it was 7/8 people pulled double GA, the remainder who didn’t are in this thread.
1/8 is shockingly high
Yup, esp since it also equals the percentage of people that got one GA. Not sure why people are still disputing that there could be issues with the draw, especially after what happened in last year's.
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
It is high given what should be expected. There are also a couple respondents who entered 1 GA and 1 P1 for different cities which is mucking up that poll. If people can't see the anomaly of so many GA + GA for 2 show cities vs. P1 + GA (it should not be close to the same %), not sure what to say. I don't personally care about GA, but I would hope that TC and TM would want to try to improve equity where it can, especially if the no priority is here to stay.
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
shockingly low. After reading this thread, I was convinced it was 7/8 people pulled double GA, the remainder who didn’t are in this thread.
1/8 is shockingly high
You’re the applied math major, you of all people should know each draw is an independent draw and not related to the next, so how can you think 12% of people is high (even if this number is inflated) to pull GA to 2 shows?
Since I believe the odds to get GA to any individual show are less than 20 percent (much lower for higher demand shows). 12% is insanely high for random distribution with those percentage odds
It's a completely separate draw for each and every show.
Is it? How do we know this?
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
Not counting people who chose not to answer the poll so as not to undermine the system that helped them
To be honest, I would have been more surprised if the draw went off without a hitch. However, I am surprised that it was so obvious for us to see given they removed GA-only and seniority from the equations.
The system is not unfair, all members have an equal chance to win tickets to every show, for all seating levels. Each show is an individual draw with an equal chance for all members. It is the results that could be perceived as unfair as members were highly successful and others got nothing. Some people win at blackjack, some people lose their shirts. And if you selected GA/P1 for your only option and got nothing you should not be surprised.
How is a system where one person wins GA to the same 4 shows I put in for and I get nothing not unfair?
Again; this goes back to not understanding basic statistics. Also, there weren’t a majority of people winning 4 GA shows. Some did. Most did not. Some got shut out completely, most did not get shut out completely. It’s really that simple.
I understand basic statistics, trust me. Applied math major here. My point is they shouldn't have a system that allows these types of outcomes.
You are probably right. People don't need to go 10 out of 10 on fan club lottery to enjoy the tour, when many get noting. But thems the breaks. Whatever they would try to do to put a cap on the lotto system in order to guarantee something for everyone would create another spiral of complaints. Two show minimum or whatever they may decide on etc. If we were all guaranteed one pair of 10C tickets per leg or something, I'd sign up for that and then you battle it out for more if you want. I don't think they will every even consider coming up with the parameters for something like that. It would lead to even more phony 10C accounts by resellers. Hell, I'd have a total of 6 accounts for me, my wife, and the kids.
For the record, exactly two people-- two!-- have reported going 10-for-10 in 93 pages of the lottery thread.
And the odds of anyone going 10-10 are extremely low. Let alone 2 people
How many people have been skunked after picking 4 or 5 shows?
Me
I got 2 of 4, one of my crew got skunked, and another forgot to renew his membership SMH
To be honest, I would have been more surprised if the draw went off without a hitch. However, I am surprised that it was so obvious for us to see given they removed GA-only and seniority from the equations.
When was the last time seniority was in the equation?
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
The system is not unfair, all members have an equal chance to win tickets to every show, for all seating levels. Each show is an individual draw with an equal chance for all members. It is the results that could be perceived as unfair as members were highly successful and others got nothing. Some people win at blackjack, some people lose their shirts. And if you selected GA/P1 for your only option and got nothing you should not be surprised.
How is a system where one person wins GA to the same 4 shows I put in for and I get nothing not unfair?
Again; this goes back to not understanding basic statistics. Also, there weren’t a majority of people winning 4 GA shows. Some did. Most did not. Some got shut out completely, most did not get shut out completely. It’s really that simple.
I understand basic statistics, trust me. Applied math major here. My point is they shouldn't have a system that allows these types of outcomes.
You are probably right. People don't need to go 10 out of 10 on fan club lottery to enjoy the tour, when many get noting. But thems the breaks. Whatever they would try to do to put a cap on the lotto system in order to guarantee something for everyone would create another spiral of complaints. Two show minimum or whatever they may decide on etc. If we were all guaranteed one pair of 10C tickets per leg or something, I'd sign up for that and then you battle it out for more if you want. I don't think they will every even consider coming up with the parameters for something like that. It would lead to even more phony 10C accounts by resellers. Hell, I'd have a total of 6 accounts for me, my wife, and the kids.
For the record, exactly two people-- two!-- have reported going 10-for-10 in 93 pages of the lottery thread.
And the odds of anyone going 10-10 are extremely low. Let alone 2 people
How many people have been skunked after picking 4 or 5 shows?
Me
I got 2 of 4, one of my crew got skunked, and another forgot to renew his membership SMH
It just feels like I could do a better job of ticket allocation with a Microsoft Excel spreadhseet then how this goes down every tour. If it's not one thing its another.
Ha, ha, ha.... 10c did a far better job with the ticket lottery than TM.
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
It just feels like I could do a better job of ticket allocation with a Microsoft Excel spreadhseet then how this goes down every tour. If it's not one thing its another.
Ha, ha, ha.... 10c did a far better job with the ticket lottery than TM.
Keep in mind that only a small percentage of members actually post here or on facebook. We are not seeing anything close to the whole picture. Yes, the process could be improved, and yes TM has made major mistakes in the past. It is is an imperfect system, and truthfully, it always has been.
Agreed, but it should be a representative sample
Not really. Negative experiences are much more likely to be reported than positive ones. How many times do you call customer service just to say everything was great?
I think there are a lot more excited, positive posts initially. There are a lot of people posting on FB, sharing their results. In threads here as well.
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
This doesn't include Vancouver BC, which was handled by TM Canada, or MSG which was limited to one night.
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
It's a completely separate draw for each and every show. The results of any other show have zero bearing on who is selected. There is no fair/unfair. As long as you're actually in the draw and not just registered for Verified Fan, everyone has the same chance of being selected. Unless a recap of final results using the full spectrum of winners vs. entries etc. for each show is released, speculating based on a small subset of results reported by members online will never represent what happened. The complaining and conspiracy theories are fun to read though. Carry on.
**Edit MSG only shows where result of another show mattered as you could only win for one of the MSG shows**
It is supposed to be a completely separate draw for each and every show - but do you think that is what actually happened. Last year there were several mistakes that TM made with the lottery draw and assigning seats - so trust in their competence to do this correctly is not a given.
Why would it be any other way? Taking priority out of the equation made the draw process pretty cut and dry other than the MSG variable.
Well, here's what is weird. Between my ticket buddy and I we put in for roughly 5 cities with double nights... some doubled up to try and increase odds. Neither of us got one night in a city, we either got both nights, or no nights. There were no split outcomes in one city. This happened to a lot of other people I have talked with. I live in Seattle and I know at least 10 people who were shut out of both shows. It's very odd. I know Seattle is high demand, but usually there would be more of a split... most of them would get at least one night.
But that didn't happen. There is a large amount of people who either got both nights, or no nights.
Post edited by LukinTimer on
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
The person who created the poll said it appeared that people may not have really understand what he was asking. So, I wouldn't just keep pointing to the poll. Also, I am looking at information here in the pit and on other social media.
I understand that you have a different opinion. We are all just talking about what we have observed.
Post edited by LukinTimer on
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
There are also an inordinate amount of people who got shut out for both nights in one city. So, if they put in for “GA or Reserved” but didn’t get GA… I don’t think they were added back into the draw for reserved seats for either night. People who selected “Reserved” in addition to “GA and Reserved” (whether P1 or P2) were probably okay. But those who thought they would be okay with just selecting “GA and Reserved” were not included in the general seated draw, therefore not getting either night.
Thoughts?
If said person only selected "GA or Reserved", that's on them. It was pretty clear all should be selected for best chance
It literally says this is the instructions, I pulled it directly: "Select GA Pit / Reserved for your best chance of getting tickets."
That would lead one to believe that if they selected "GA or Reserved" they wouildn't then need to also select just "Reserved."
Yes. And we did select multiple... "GA or Reserved P1" and "Reserved P2", where applicable. PJ has always said that if you select "GA or Reserved P1" you are already entered into the draw for 'Reserved P1" if you dont get GA. Especially when combined with them saying "Select GA Pit / Reserved for your best chance of getting tickets."
That being said, your point is well taken... and I think that could have been the error we made.
"Holly f**k, that was so amazing, I just forgot who I came here to see!!" - Courtesy of the guy in the U2 t-shirt standing next to me in Aloha Stadium, Post PJ
I'm not here for conspiracy theories, and it is what it is at this point, but as a math person, a lot of it just doesn't pass the smell test statistically speaking...like at all.
I was in the Vegas draw for both shows, as was my wife. I also have two friends that did the same set up, and every one of us got the same pick for both shows. I got res for both, both my friends got res for both, and all 3 wives didn't get picked at all for either show. That combined with seeing a lot of people hitting GA for both just doesn't smell right to me, from a purely mathematical/statistical probablitly standpoint.
The odds of all that happening that way if truly random are almost inmeasurably small.
This exactly. The question of whether the system is fair or another system is better is beside the point of the OP's premise that the bits of data that we're seeing don't pass the smell test. Those saying "that's just how statistics work" don't have enough data to say that the results we're seeing are consistent with the results that should be expected with a random draw. And given TM's track record with these lotteries--two redraws last year due to mistakes, for example--I don't understand why some are quick to write off the possibility that these draws were not executed in a truly random fashion.
Not sour grapes -- I wasn't expecting anything great from the lottery and almost didn't enter at all.
This ^ for SHZA! Simply put, something went wrong with the random draw.
Since I don't have hard data, I will suggest something that may have happened only based on the results I have seen here and heard through friends - so it may be off base, but thought it was worth a mention. Do any of you think that they drew for cities and not specific shows. So, if a person put in for two shows and they got whatever they got for the first show, they were also automatically given that for the second show. And if the first show was not won at all, then you were also not given the second show? But if you only put in for the second show, then you were in the draw for that show. From some of the winning patterns here, it almost seems like that. The two shows I got were both single night shows (Baltimore and MSG). But for the shows I put in with two nights - I was shut out of both nights completely. Again, just trying to figure out how some people got GA for both shows in multiple cities. I know it is possible, but seems so unlikely.
That's almost exactly what I think happened. There have been so few reports of same city splits (Seats on night and GA the other) that there was likely a selection difference of some sort from the majority. I could see the results trickling out today being of a more random nature as the issue has likely been identified and possibly corrected.
There have been plenty of reports of same-city splits. I flagged a half-dozen of them in a four-page span of the 93-page lottery thread. There were many others in the preceding 70 pages.
One of ypur very few examples was from Vancouver, which, as has been mention is excluded from this cluster. It seems to have been handled correctly. It was also sorted by TM Canada and not TM USA.
Another of your very few examples was from a gentleman who later apologized for misleading and mention that his results were actually from the combined results of he and his spouse.
"A smart monkey doesn't monkey around with another monkey's monkey" - Darwin's Theory
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
Speaking of cherry picking, yet another reminder that the root complaint is not strictly regarding GA. It is about the percentage of people receiving the exact same choice for show 2 in city x as they did for show 1. Regardless of what Jimmy got drawn (or denied) for LA, he was (almost) automatically going to get the same selection for night 2 in LA.
"A smart monkey doesn't monkey around with another monkey's monkey" - Darwin's Theory
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on2legs
Standing in the Jersey rain… Posts: 14,580
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
It's 12%, and that percentage is extremely high for double GA
Thats literally 1/8 people
Not counting people who chose not to answer the poll so as not to undermine the system that helped them
What?!?
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
Speaking of cherry picking, yet another reminder that the root complaint is not strictly regarding GA. It is about the percentage of people receiving the exact same choice for show 2 in city x as they did for show 1. Regardless of what Jimmy got drawn (or denied) for LA, he was (almost) automatically going to get the same selection for night 2 in LA.
There’s no evidence of this.
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on2legs
Standing in the Jersey rain… Posts: 14,580
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
Speaking of cherry picking, yet another reminder that the root complaint is not strictly regarding GA. It is about the percentage of people receiving the exact same choice for show 2 in city x as they did for show 1. Regardless of what Jimmy got drawn (or denied) for LA, he was (almost) automatically going to get the same selection for night 2 in LA.
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
Speaking of cherry picking, yet another reminder that the root complaint is not strictly regarding GA. It is about the percentage of people receiving the exact same choice for show 2 in city x as they did for show 1. Regardless of what Jimmy got drawn (or denied) for LA, he was (almost) automatically going to get the same selection for night 2 in LA.
This is the one example I saw where someone got a N2 GA after a N1 P1. I'm sure there are others, but there should be a lot more 'splits' than 'sames' especially with GA in cities with 2 shows. Something is funky with the double GA's in 2 show US cities (and maybe doubles in general).
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on2legs
Standing in the Jersey rain… Posts: 14,580
It's not just GA. If someone put it for GA/P1 seats to both shows for a US city EXCLUDING NYC (i.e. Vegas, LA, Chicago, Philly and Boston or Seattle) they were ALMOST positively given the same results for each show in the same city. It is city specific. This did not occur for those entering 1 Wrigley show and 1 Philly show, etc... This did not appear to occur in Vancouver, Likely due to TM Canada handling it rather than US TM.
@mookieblalock - the pool already seems to be skewed due to people failing to read the information I was looking for. Or my inability to communicate it thoroughly. I was not iso feedback from those who entered a single show in Vegas and a show in Missoula. Strictly both shows of 1 city.
So, if selected for GA in LA 1, they also were nearly guaranteed GA night 2 If given P1 for Wrigley 1, they were also going to recieve P1 for Wrigley 2
Example: Person A put in request for GA/P1 for 6 shows LA 1 LA 2 Vegas 1 Vegas 2 Wrigley 1 Wrigley 2
What we are seeing as "random" results: LA 1 - GA LA 2 - GA Vegas 1 - P1 Reserved Vegas 2 - P1 Reserved Wrigley 1 - GA Wrigley 2 - GA
^^^^^^ This directly above. I have never seen this many doulbe GA, that are repeated. This seems off. Then, if looking around, you see a lot of people were also shut out of both shows for one city. Also, in very high numbers. It appears to be a new and weird pattern, specific to the recent draw.
There’s a poll on the front page that doesn’t line up with any of your cherry picked anecdotal evidence. Something like 8% of people got double GA in the same city. 92% didn’t.
Speaking of cherry picking, yet another reminder that the root complaint is not strictly regarding GA. It is about the percentage of people receiving the exact same choice for show 2 in city x as they did for show 1. Regardless of what Jimmy got drawn (or denied) for LA, he was (almost) automatically going to get the same selection for night 2 in LA.
This is the one example I saw where someone got a N2 GA after a N1 P1. I'm sure there are others, but there should be a lot more 'splits' than 'sames' especially with GA in cities with 2 shows. Something is funky with the double GA's in 2 show US cities (and maybe doubles in general).
But if there is a glitch like you're describing then this guy should not have pulled these seats.
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore
Comments
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
When was the last time seniority was in the equation?
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
But that didn't happen. There is a large amount of people who either got both nights, or no nights.
I understand that you have a different opinion. We are all just talking about what we have observed.
That being said, your point is well taken... and I think that could have been the error we made.
Another of your very few examples was from a gentleman who later apologized for misleading and mention that his results were actually from the combined results of he and his spouse.
What?!?
But if there is a glitch like you're describing then this guy should not have pulled these seats.