Viruses / Vaccines 2

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  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,627
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,955
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    Been doing his own research on gain of function in his basement, duh.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    edited March 2023
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    Began with high confidence in nature and then slowly started to turn this ship around so they don't look like complete idiots in 1, 2 or 10 years. 
    Post edited by AW124797 on
  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    Been doing his own research on gain of function in his basement, duh.
    Still waiting on your interpretation of that study. 
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,955
    And in other news, shovels aren’t effective.

    With as much as 12 feet of new snow over the past week, and seasonal totals surpassing 41 feet, California’s Sierra Nevada is buried.

    So much snow has fallen that homes are engulfed and roads resemble canyons. More is on the way this weekend, with the National Weather Service office in Sacramento forecasting an additional three to four feet.

    “Expect disruptions to daily life including dangerous/impossible driving conditions with road closures and whiteout conditions at times,” the agency tweeted. “MOUNTAIN TRAVEL IS HIGHLY DISCOURAGED!

    In the wake of the blizzard early this week, California Gov. Gavin Newsom (D) declared a state of emergency in 13 counties affected by the winter storm, including several in the Sierra Nevada.

    The excessive snowfall has presented myriad challenges:

    • The combination of wind and snow caused about 100,000 customers to lose power earlier in the week. Thursday morning, there were more than 50,000 customers still without power in the region, according to PowerOutage.us.
    • The snow’s heft led to at least one reported structure collapse.
    • Yosemite National Park is closed indefinitely. The park reported up to 15 feet of snow on the ground.
    • Major highways such as Interstate 80, including Donner Pass, and U.S. Route 50 were shut down and only recently reopened.
    • Residents of some small mountain communities were stranded because of impassable roads.
    • At least one avalanchehas been reported that forced evacuations.

    As one data point, the Central Sierra Snow Lab received 87.2 inches of snow in 72 hours early this week, bringing its seasonal total to 531 inches, the most on record through February. The snowpack in the region is now above the full-season average.

    Although disruptive, the snow is a blessing for the state’s water supply. According to the federal drought monitor published Thursday morning, the percentage of the state experiencing at least moderate drought conditions plummeted from 84.6 percent to 49.1 percent in the past week because of all the precipitation. Drought covered nearly the entire state on Oct. 1.

    Blocked doors and windows

    At the Sugar Bowl Resort, the marketing office was snowed in, literally.

    Images were posted to social media of snow towering over first-story windows.

    Blinding, disorienting winds and snow

    Between Monday and early Wednesday, the Sierra Nevada was under a rare blizzard warning as snow and wind dropped visibility to near zero.

    Trying to venture out into several feet of snow being blown around by hurricane-force winds was certainly a challenge.

    Story continues below advertisement

    Snow measured in people

    It’s impressive to hear about knee-deep or waist-deep snow. But hair-topping snow is next-level.

    Snow canyons

    To walk or drive, enormous amounts of snow had to be cleared. The resulting snow canyons were imposing and impressive.

    ‘Dude … where’s my house?’

    So much snow fell that one woman had trouble finding her home, lost amid the drifts. “Dude … where’s my house?” she tweeted.



    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 41,953
    And in other news, shovels aren’t effective.

    With as much as 12 feet of new snow over the past week, and seasonal totals surpassing 41 feet, California’s Sierra Nevada is buried.

    So much snow has fallen that homes are engulfed and roads resemble canyons. More is on the way this weekend, with the National Weather Service office in Sacramento forecasting an additional three to four feet.

    “Expect disruptions to daily life including dangerous/impossible driving conditions with road closures and whiteout conditions at times,” the agency tweeted. “MOUNTAIN TRAVEL IS HIGHLY DISCOURAGED!

    In the wake of the blizzard early this week, California Gov. Gavin Newsom (D) declared a state of emergency in 13 counties affected by the winter storm, including several in the Sierra Nevada.

    The excessive snowfall has presented myriad challenges:

    • The combination of wind and snow caused about 100,000 customers to lose power earlier in the week. Thursday morning, there were more than 50,000 customers still without power in the region, according to PowerOutage.us.
    • The snow’s heft led to at least one reported structure collapse.
    • Yosemite National Park is closed indefinitely. The park reported up to 15 feet of snow on the ground.
    • Major highways such as Interstate 80, including Donner Pass, and U.S. Route 50 were shut down and only recently reopened.
    • Residents of some small mountain communities were stranded because of impassable roads.
    • At least one avalanchehas been reported that forced evacuations.

    As one data point, the Central Sierra Snow Lab received 87.2 inches of snow in 72 hours early this week, bringing its seasonal total to 531 inches, the most on record through February. The snowpack in the region is now above the full-season average.

    Although disruptive, the snow is a blessing for the state’s water supply. According to the federal drought monitor published Thursday morning, the percentage of the state experiencing at least moderate drought conditions plummeted from 84.6 percent to 49.1 percent in the past week because of all the precipitation. Drought covered nearly the entire state on Oct. 1.

    Blocked doors and windows

    At the Sugar Bowl Resort, the marketing office was snowed in, literally.

    Images were posted to social media of snow towering over first-story windows.

    Blinding, disorienting winds and snow

    Between Monday and early Wednesday, the Sierra Nevada was under a rare blizzard warning as snow and wind dropped visibility to near zero.

    Trying to venture out into several feet of snow being blown around by hurricane-force winds was certainly a challenge.

    Story continues below advertisement

    Snow measured in people

    It’s impressive to hear about knee-deep or waist-deep snow. But hair-topping snow is next-level.

    Snow canyons

    To walk or drive, enormous amounts of snow had to be cleared. The resulting snow canyons were imposing and impressive.

    ‘Dude … where’s my house?’

    So much snow fell that one woman had trouble finding her home, lost amid the drifts. “Dude … where’s my house?” she tweeted.




    It has, indeed, been a crazy year here!  We were lucky- only lost power once and only for three hours and only got snowed in for two days (probably could have gotten out on day two but no need to so passed on taking a chance on our steep driveway.)  Been loving the 2 to three inches of snow here at 2,000 feet in elevation.  Would not be loving the tens of feet of it if we live up in Tahoe at 6,000 feet! 

    My big concern is that a lot of people here in California will say, "Oh boy, the drought is over!" and start over-using water.  Close to the same situation happened about 7 years ago- big snow, Oroville damn filled to nearly literally bursting- and then we went right back into prolonged drought.  People here just don't learn. 
    I'm super grateful for the extra water this year, but not about to be duped into thinking this is the new normal.  There is no new normal!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,340
    mickeyrat said:
    I had to google this person and I still don't know who he is...
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,627
    AW124797 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    Began with high confidence in nature and then slowly started to turn this ship around so they don't look like complete idiots in 1, 2 or 10 years. 
    I don't understand how this answers the question I asked. How do you decide which gov't experts you are relying upon?  Or in this case, what evidence did you have that the CIA and other agencies didn't?
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    23scidoo said:
    23scidoo said:
    Yesterday was a conspiracy..today its a fact..


    What was labeled a conspiracy theory was that the lab leak was planned by a cabal of global and state leaders, working with “big pharma” and the Chinese government, designed ultimately to enslave the population. This is why people should stop proudly declaring that they used to be called a conspiracy theorist and it turned out they were right. 

    you can see things the way you want, we live in a free world, at least I do..but no matter how we do it, we were right..it was common sense..but some people still insist..
    A lab leak isn’t a conspiracy theory. 
    Since when??..three years now this is how you call us..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,627
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,955

    But its up to the dems to clean this mess up, right?


    Opinion


     There ain’t no cure for long covidiocy

    The pandemic has faded, but one of the least understood effects of the virus still eludes treatment: There is no known cure for long covidiocy.

    House Republicans presented with a textbook case of the ailment this week. The newly formed select subcommittee on the coronavirus pandemic met for the first time for what its chairman, Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R-Ohio), said would be some “Monday-morning quarterbacking.” It instead became a Tuesday afternoon of false starts and illegal blocks.

    Republicans on the panel, some of them medical doctors and others just playing one on TV, offered their predictable assessments. Rep. Debbie Lesko (R-Ariz.) kicked off with the unsupported allegation that “covid was intentionally released” from a Chinese lab because “it would be impossible for the virus to be accidentally leaked.”

    Rep. Richard McCormick (R-Ga.) advanced the ball by informing the panel that coronavirus booster shots “do more harm than good.”

    And then Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) scored with this extraordinary medical discovery: “Researchers found that the vaccinated are at least twice as likely to be infected with covid as the unvaccinated and those with natural immunity.”

    Vaccines make you more likely to get covid! Thank you, Dr. Jewish Space Lasers.

    But the panel’s greatest contribution to the science of misdirection was to feature as witnesses three scientists who arguably did more than all others to champion a herd-immunity approach to covid. Two of them were co-authors of the “Great Barrington Declaration,” put out by a Koch-backed group, which argued in 2020 for letting the virus run wild through the population while somehow segregating the old and vulnerable.

    Had they prevailed in making herd immunity the official policy, hundreds of thousands more Americans might have died. As it was, President Donald Trump and GOP governors used these scientists’ claims disparaging face masks, isolation and vaccines to whip up resistance to public health restrictions.

    One of the witnesses, Marty Makary, a Johns Hopkins surgeon and Fox News regular, used the committee meeting to present a new variant of covidiocy. He declared with absolute certainty that the virus came from a Wuhan lab.

    “It’s a no-brainer that it came from a lab,” he declared. What’s more, “at this point it’s impossible to acquire any more information, and if you did it would only be in the affirmative.” He even suggested that two of the nation’s top virologists knew this but “changed their tunes” because they were bribed with grant money by Anthony Fauci.

    How’s that for sound science? Some (including, now, the “low confidence” Energy Department) believe the virus came from a lab. Others think it occurred naturally. Nobody knows for sure — except Makary. And he knows with equal certainty that whatever unknown evidence might emerge will back him up.

    You didn’t need a peer-reviewed study to predict this sort of nonsense would occur.

    Makary is the guy who predicted in late February 2021, that “covid will be mostly gone by April.” He was also the source of Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis’s dubious claim that face masks cause unhealthy levels of carbon dioxide in children’s blood.

    Another witness, Jay Bhattacharya of Stanford University (also a Fox News regular, on matters medical and nonmedical), had called coronavirus testing “actively harmful” and warned about “great harm” and “danger” from vaccination. He worked on a study that claimed the covid death rate was similar to the flu’s, and he argued in March 2020 that “there’s little evidence” that “the novel coronavirus would kill millions” if left unchecked.

    The three had top-notch academic credentials, and they wore well the professorial-shabby look: One had a hole in his suit-jacket elbow, another slung a parka over his chair and the third wore Hurley athletic socks with his business suit. But when they spoke, their tone was less scholarly sobriety than cable-news combat.

    Makary, mocking “King Fauci,” claimed that “the greatest perpetrator of misinformation during the pandemic has been the United States government.” Bhattacharya repeatedly complained that they had been “censored,” “marginalized” and “slandered” by public health “dictators.” The other witness, Swedish epidemiologist Martin Kulldorf, called covid restrictions “the worst assault” on the poor and middle class “since segregation.”

    In the witnesses’ telling, public health officials and scientists were wrong about everything — masks, vaccines, natural immunity, shutdowns — while the dissidents were unerring. Bhattacharya claimed the “harsh countermeasures” against covid “failed to protect Americans” while ensuring that people “will never trust public health authorities again.”

    That’s rich. Far from being marginalized, these critics became right-wing celebrities and were embraced by the Trump administration. Their ideas helped power resistance to masks and vaccines — at the cost of untold lives. Now they’re blaming the debacle on the public health officials whose advice they encouraged Americans to resist.

    There is an important debate to be had about the effectiveness of school closures and vaccine mandates. Officials working with limited information made a lot of mistakes. But those seeking honest answers will apparently have to look somewhere other than the select covidiocy committee.

    Yet another far-right extremist gets the seat of honor

    And then there are leaders such as James Comer. The Kentucky Republican, chairman of the House Oversight Committee (which includes the covid select subcommittee), has shown himself to be a bear of very little brain.

    Last week, he sent a letter to Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg about the Ohio train derailment in which he referred to “DOT’s National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB)” and demanded of Buttigieg “all documents and communications regarding NTSB’s progress on the cause of the derailment.”

    Buttigieg responded by saying he was “alarmed to learn that the chair of the House Oversight Committee thinks that the NTSB is part of our department. NTSB is independent (and with good reason).”

    Comer, on Fox News, claimed it was “a typo” — a 19-word typo, it would seem.

    Then, this week, Comer paused in his frequent (and sometimes contradictory) attacks on Hunter Biden to disparage the integrity of the president’s other son, Beau — who is not able to defend himself because he died of brain cancer in 2015.

    Comer said on a Lou Dobbs podcast that “it was Beau Biden, the president’s other son, that was involved in some campaign donations from a person that got indicted” and “Joe Biden was involved in some of these campaign donations.” Comer suggested the president’s late son should have been prosecuted.

    Alas, more of the House GOP committee chairs are following the Comer model of leadership than the Gallagher model, using their positions to give platforms to extremists. As I’ve noted, the House Energy and Commerce Committee joined Comer’s panel in elevating the voices of those who adhere to the racist “great replacement” conspiracy theory.

    Lat month, Rep. Jim Jordan’s Judiciary Committee featured as a witness a man who is part of the far-right “constitutional sheriff” movement. Constitutional sheriffs — an outgrowth of the white-nationalist posse comitatus movement — claim they are above federal and state government and are the ultimate arbiters of the law. The nonprofit Arizona Center for Investigative Reporting found that the witness, Cochise County Sheriff Mark Dannels, spoke at a constitutional-sheriff’s event and supports allowing sheriffs to nullify laws.

    This week, it was the House Homeland Security Committee’s turn for some extremism. It hosted as a witness Pinal County, Ariz., Sheriff Mark Lamb — another constitutional sheriff. Though eschewing the term, Lamb is the “frontman” for one constitutional-sheriff group, has spoken to a second and also supports nullification, AZCIR reports. A booster of the “Stop the Steal” rally (he called the Jan. 6 rioters “very loving, Christian people”) and anti-vaxxer movements (he refused to enforce the stay-at-home orders of Arizona’s Republican governor), he responded to the Black Lives Matter movement by creating a “Citizens Posse” of residents to be deputized at Lamb’s pleasure.

    Little more than a week before he came to Washington, Lamb spoke at a Second Amendment rally attended by Oathkeepers, Proud Boys and other extremists. He teased a Senate run and took photos with a few Proud Boys.

    And there he was, just 10 days later, at the witness table in the Homeland Security Committee’s hearing room. Chairman Mark Green (R-Tenn.) hailed Lamb’s “essential role in defending our nation’s homeland.”

    This is precisely how Republican lawmakers bring dangerous extremists into the mainstream.

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  • static111static111 Posts: 4,889

    But its up to the dems to clean this mess up, right?


    Opinion


     There ain’t no cure for long covidiocy

    The pandemic has faded, but one of the least understood effects of the virus still eludes treatment: There is no known cure for long covidiocy.

    House Republicans presented with a textbook case of the ailment this week. The newly formed select subcommittee on the coronavirus pandemic met for the first time for what its chairman, Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R-Ohio), said would be some “Monday-morning quarterbacking.” It instead became a Tuesday afternoon of false starts and illegal blocks.

    Republicans on the panel, some of them medical doctors and others just playing one on TV, offered their predictable assessments. Rep. Debbie Lesko (R-Ariz.) kicked off with the unsupported allegation that “covid was intentionally released” from a Chinese lab because “it would be impossible for the virus to be accidentally leaked.”

    Rep. Richard McCormick (R-Ga.) advanced the ball by informing the panel that coronavirus booster shots “do more harm than good.”

    And then Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) scored with this extraordinary medical discovery: “Researchers found that the vaccinated are at least twice as likely to be infected with covid as the unvaccinated and those with natural immunity.”

    Vaccines make you more likely to get covid! Thank you, Dr. Jewish Space Lasers.

    But the panel’s greatest contribution to the science of misdirection was to feature as witnesses three scientists who arguably did more than all others to champion a herd-immunity approach to covid. Two of them were co-authors of the “Great Barrington Declaration,” put out by a Koch-backed group, which argued in 2020 for letting the virus run wild through the population while somehow segregating the old and vulnerable.

    Had they prevailed in making herd immunity the official policy, hundreds of thousands more Americans might have died. As it was, President Donald Trump and GOP governors used these scientists’ claims disparaging face masks, isolation and vaccines to whip up resistance to public health restrictions.

    One of the witnesses, Marty Makary, a Johns Hopkins surgeon and Fox News regular, used the committee meeting to present a new variant of covidiocy. He declared with absolute certainty that the virus came from a Wuhan lab.

    “It’s a no-brainer that it came from a lab,” he declared. What’s more, “at this point it’s impossible to acquire any more information, and if you did it would only be in the affirmative.” He even suggested that two of the nation’s top virologists knew this but “changed their tunes” because they were bribed with grant money by Anthony Fauci.

    How’s that for sound science? Some (including, now, the “low confidence” Energy Department) believe the virus came from a lab. Others think it occurred naturally. Nobody knows for sure — except Makary. And he knows with equal certainty that whatever unknown evidence might emerge will back him up.

    You didn’t need a peer-reviewed study to predict this sort of nonsense would occur.

    Makary is the guy who predicted in late February 2021, that “covid will be mostly gone by April.” He was also the source of Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis’s dubious claim that face masks cause unhealthy levels of carbon dioxide in children’s blood.

    Another witness, Jay Bhattacharya of Stanford University (also a Fox News regular, on matters medical and nonmedical), had called coronavirus testing “actively harmful” and warned about “great harm” and “danger” from vaccination. He worked on a study that claimed the covid death rate was similar to the flu’s, and he argued in March 2020 that “there’s little evidence” that “the novel coronavirus would kill millions” if left unchecked.

    The three had top-notch academic credentials, and they wore well the professorial-shabby look: One had a hole in his suit-jacket elbow, another slung a parka over his chair and the third wore Hurley athletic socks with his business suit. But when they spoke, their tone was less scholarly sobriety than cable-news combat.

    Makary, mocking “King Fauci,” claimed that “the greatest perpetrator of misinformation during the pandemic has been the United States government.” Bhattacharya repeatedly complained that they had been “censored,” “marginalized” and “slandered” by public health “dictators.” The other witness, Swedish epidemiologist Martin Kulldorf, called covid restrictions “the worst assault” on the poor and middle class “since segregation.”

    In the witnesses’ telling, public health officials and scientists were wrong about everything — masks, vaccines, natural immunity, shutdowns — while the dissidents were unerring. Bhattacharya claimed the “harsh countermeasures” against covid “failed to protect Americans” while ensuring that people “will never trust public health authorities again.”

    That’s rich. Far from being marginalized, these critics became right-wing celebrities and were embraced by the Trump administration. Their ideas helped power resistance to masks and vaccines — at the cost of untold lives. Now they’re blaming the debacle on the public health officials whose advice they encouraged Americans to resist.

    There is an important debate to be had about the effectiveness of school closures and vaccine mandates. Officials working with limited information made a lot of mistakes. But those seeking honest answers will apparently have to look somewhere other than the select covidiocy committee.

    Yet another far-right extremist gets the seat of honor

    And then there are leaders such as James Comer. The Kentucky Republican, chairman of the House Oversight Committee (which includes the covid select subcommittee), has shown himself to be a bear of very little brain.

    Last week, he sent a letter to Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg about the Ohio train derailment in which he referred to “DOT’s National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB)” and demanded of Buttigieg “all documents and communications regarding NTSB’s progress on the cause of the derailment.”

    Buttigieg responded by saying he was “alarmed to learn that the chair of the House Oversight Committee thinks that the NTSB is part of our department. NTSB is independent (and with good reason).”

    Comer, on Fox News, claimed it was “a typo” — a 19-word typo, it would seem.

    Then, this week, Comer paused in his frequent (and sometimes contradictory) attacks on Hunter Biden to disparage the integrity of the president’s other son, Beau — who is not able to defend himself because he died of brain cancer in 2015.

    Comer said on a Lou Dobbs podcast that “it was Beau Biden, the president’s other son, that was involved in some campaign donations from a person that got indicted” and “Joe Biden was involved in some of these campaign donations.” Comer suggested the president’s late son should have been prosecuted.

    Alas, more of the House GOP committee chairs are following the Comer model of leadership than the Gallagher model, using their positions to give platforms to extremists. As I’ve noted, the House Energy and Commerce Committee joined Comer’s panel in elevating the voices of those who adhere to the racist “great replacement” conspiracy theory.

    Lat month, Rep. Jim Jordan’s Judiciary Committee featured as a witness a man who is part of the far-right “constitutional sheriff” movement. Constitutional sheriffs — an outgrowth of the white-nationalist posse comitatus movement — claim they are above federal and state government and are the ultimate arbiters of the law. The nonprofit Arizona Center for Investigative Reporting found that the witness, Cochise County Sheriff Mark Dannels, spoke at a constitutional-sheriff’s event and supports allowing sheriffs to nullify laws.

    This week, it was the House Homeland Security Committee’s turn for some extremism. It hosted as a witness Pinal County, Ariz., Sheriff Mark Lamb — another constitutional sheriff. Though eschewing the term, Lamb is the “frontman” for one constitutional-sheriff group, has spoken to a second and also supports nullification, AZCIR reports. A booster of the “Stop the Steal” rally (he called the Jan. 6 rioters “very loving, Christian people”) and anti-vaxxer movements (he refused to enforce the stay-at-home orders of Arizona’s Republican governor), he responded to the Black Lives Matter movement by creating a “Citizens Posse” of residents to be deputized at Lamb’s pleasure.

    Little more than a week before he came to Washington, Lamb spoke at a Second Amendment rally attended by Oathkeepers, Proud Boys and other extremists. He teased a Senate run and took photos with a few Proud Boys.

    And there he was, just 10 days later, at the witness table in the Homeland Security Committee’s hearing room. Chairman Mark Green (R-Tenn.) hailed Lamb’s “essential role in defending our nation’s homeland.”

    This is precisely how Republican lawmakers bring dangerous extremists into the mainstream.

    I'm sure that the Republican's who "bring dangerous extremists to the mainstream" will clean up their own mess.  Why wouldn't they?
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,955
    edited March 2023
    static111 said:

    But its up to the dems to clean this mess up, right?


    Opinion


     There ain’t no cure for long covidiocy

    The pandemic has faded, but one of the least understood effects of the virus still eludes treatment: There is no known cure for long covidiocy.

    House Republicans presented with a textbook case of the ailment this week. The newly formed select subcommittee on the coronavirus pandemic met for the first time for what its chairman, Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R-Ohio), said would be some “Monday-morning quarterbacking.” It instead became a Tuesday afternoon of false starts and illegal blocks.

    Republicans on the panel, some of them medical doctors and others just playing one on TV, offered their predictable assessments. Rep. Debbie Lesko (R-Ariz.) kicked off with the unsupported allegation that “covid was intentionally released” from a Chinese lab because “it would be impossible for the virus to be accidentally leaked.”

    Rep. Richard McCormick (R-Ga.) advanced the ball by informing the panel that coronavirus booster shots “do more harm than good.”

    And then Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) scored with this extraordinary medical discovery: “Researchers found that the vaccinated are at least twice as likely to be infected with covid as the unvaccinated and those with natural immunity.”

    Vaccines make you more likely to get covid! Thank you, Dr. Jewish Space Lasers.

    But the panel’s greatest contribution to the science of misdirection was to feature as witnesses three scientists who arguably did more than all others to champion a herd-immunity approach to covid. Two of them were co-authors of the “Great Barrington Declaration,” put out by a Koch-backed group, which argued in 2020 for letting the virus run wild through the population while somehow segregating the old and vulnerable.

    Had they prevailed in making herd immunity the official policy, hundreds of thousands more Americans might have died. As it was, President Donald Trump and GOP governors used these scientists’ claims disparaging face masks, isolation and vaccines to whip up resistance to public health restrictions.

    One of the witnesses, Marty Makary, a Johns Hopkins surgeon and Fox News regular, used the committee meeting to present a new variant of covidiocy. He declared with absolute certainty that the virus came from a Wuhan lab.

    “It’s a no-brainer that it came from a lab,” he declared. What’s more, “at this point it’s impossible to acquire any more information, and if you did it would only be in the affirmative.” He even suggested that two of the nation’s top virologists knew this but “changed their tunes” because they were bribed with grant money by Anthony Fauci.

    How’s that for sound science? Some (including, now, the “low confidence” Energy Department) believe the virus came from a lab. Others think it occurred naturally. Nobody knows for sure — except Makary. And he knows with equal certainty that whatever unknown evidence might emerge will back him up.

    You didn’t need a peer-reviewed study to predict this sort of nonsense would occur.

    Makary is the guy who predicted in late February 2021, that “covid will be mostly gone by April.” He was also the source of Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis’s dubious claim that face masks cause unhealthy levels of carbon dioxide in children’s blood.

    Another witness, Jay Bhattacharya of Stanford University (also a Fox News regular, on matters medical and nonmedical), had called coronavirus testing “actively harmful” and warned about “great harm” and “danger” from vaccination. He worked on a study that claimed the covid death rate was similar to the flu’s, and he argued in March 2020 that “there’s little evidence” that “the novel coronavirus would kill millions” if left unchecked.

    The three had top-notch academic credentials, and they wore well the professorial-shabby look: One had a hole in his suit-jacket elbow, another slung a parka over his chair and the third wore Hurley athletic socks with his business suit. But when they spoke, their tone was less scholarly sobriety than cable-news combat.

    Makary, mocking “King Fauci,” claimed that “the greatest perpetrator of misinformation during the pandemic has been the United States government.” Bhattacharya repeatedly complained that they had been “censored,” “marginalized” and “slandered” by public health “dictators.” The other witness, Swedish epidemiologist Martin Kulldorf, called covid restrictions “the worst assault” on the poor and middle class “since segregation.”

    In the witnesses’ telling, public health officials and scientists were wrong about everything — masks, vaccines, natural immunity, shutdowns — while the dissidents were unerring. Bhattacharya claimed the “harsh countermeasures” against covid “failed to protect Americans” while ensuring that people “will never trust public health authorities again.”

    That’s rich. Far from being marginalized, these critics became right-wing celebrities and were embraced by the Trump administration. Their ideas helped power resistance to masks and vaccines — at the cost of untold lives. Now they’re blaming the debacle on the public health officials whose advice they encouraged Americans to resist.

    There is an important debate to be had about the effectiveness of school closures and vaccine mandates. Officials working with limited information made a lot of mistakes. But those seeking honest answers will apparently have to look somewhere other than the select covidiocy committee.

    Yet another far-right extremist gets the seat of honor

    And then there are leaders such as James Comer. The Kentucky Republican, chairman of the House Oversight Committee (which includes the covid select subcommittee), has shown himself to be a bear of very little brain.

    Last week, he sent a letter to Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg about the Ohio train derailment in which he referred to “DOT’s National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB)” and demanded of Buttigieg “all documents and communications regarding NTSB’s progress on the cause of the derailment.”

    Buttigieg responded by saying he was “alarmed to learn that the chair of the House Oversight Committee thinks that the NTSB is part of our department. NTSB is independent (and with good reason).”

    Comer, on Fox News, claimed it was “a typo” — a 19-word typo, it would seem.

    Then, this week, Comer paused in his frequent (and sometimes contradictory) attacks on Hunter Biden to disparage the integrity of the president’s other son, Beau — who is not able to defend himself because he died of brain cancer in 2015.

    Comer said on a Lou Dobbs podcast that “it was Beau Biden, the president’s other son, that was involved in some campaign donations from a person that got indicted” and “Joe Biden was involved in some of these campaign donations.” Comer suggested the president’s late son should have been prosecuted.

    Alas, more of the House GOP committee chairs are following the Comer model of leadership than the Gallagher model, using their positions to give platforms to extremists. As I’ve noted, the House Energy and Commerce Committee joined Comer’s panel in elevating the voices of those who adhere to the racist “great replacement” conspiracy theory.

    Lat month, Rep. Jim Jordan’s Judiciary Committee featured as a witness a man who is part of the far-right “constitutional sheriff” movement. Constitutional sheriffs — an outgrowth of the white-nationalist posse comitatus movement — claim they are above federal and state government and are the ultimate arbiters of the law. The nonprofit Arizona Center for Investigative Reporting found that the witness, Cochise County Sheriff Mark Dannels, spoke at a constitutional-sheriff’s event and supports allowing sheriffs to nullify laws.

    This week, it was the House Homeland Security Committee’s turn for some extremism. It hosted as a witness Pinal County, Ariz., Sheriff Mark Lamb — another constitutional sheriff. Though eschewing the term, Lamb is the “frontman” for one constitutional-sheriff group, has spoken to a second and also supports nullification, AZCIR reports. A booster of the “Stop the Steal” rally (he called the Jan. 6 rioters “very loving, Christian people”) and anti-vaxxer movements (he refused to enforce the stay-at-home orders of Arizona’s Republican governor), he responded to the Black Lives Matter movement by creating a “Citizens Posse” of residents to be deputized at Lamb’s pleasure.

    Little more than a week before he came to Washington, Lamb spoke at a Second Amendment rally attended by Oathkeepers, Proud Boys and other extremists. He teased a Senate run and took photos with a few Proud Boys.

    And there he was, just 10 days later, at the witness table in the Homeland Security Committee’s hearing room. Chairman Mark Green (R-Tenn.) hailed Lamb’s “essential role in defending our nation’s homeland.”

    This is precisely how Republican lawmakers bring dangerous extremists into the mainstream.

    I'm sure that the Republican's who "bring dangerous extremists to the mainstream" will clean up their own mess.  Why wouldn't they?


    Quote feature fucked up again?

    The repub voters. You know, the other 65% or less of non-deplorable voters who voted POOTWH and put these traitor fascist in office? Although, I suppose the dems could release another virus with a vaccine already to go and kill them all off? That’d work as well, I suppose.
    Post edited by Halifax2TheMax on
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  • Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 11,423
    edited March 2023
    This piece on why the lab leak theory isn’t realistic is interesting. 

    https://www.editorialboard.com/lab-cant-leak-what-it-never-had/

    It’s biased for sure, the writer calls out the theory as bullshit from the get go; I’m not convinced one way or the other right now, but it brings up some interesting points.
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,478
    and still......


    this is an addional 1500 dead from yesterday's tally on thus site....


    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
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  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    mickeyrat said:
    and still......


    this is an addional 1500 dead from yesterday's tally on thus site....


    You get in on a hospital for A reason and you came up dead from covid..
    i have seen this movie..it wasn't good one..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
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    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,627
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Considering several other respiratory illnesses started in the wild, including the devastating SARS, which appeared in China in 2002, common sense is that covid COULD come from a lab, not that it did.  You need actual evidence for a gov't or anyone in a position of authority to draw such a conclusion.  Otherwise you are being irresponsible.  
  • benjsbenjs Posts: 9,130
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Considering several other respiratory illnesses started in the wild, including the devastating SARS, which appeared in China in 2002, common sense is that covid COULD come from a lab, not that it did.  You need actual evidence for a gov't or anyone in a position of authority to draw such a conclusion.  Otherwise you are being irresponsible.  
    I think irresponsibility and (intentional or accidental) misreading of the facts are part of a troll's MO. 23 is right on brand.

    The rest of us know the difference between a fact and a theory, and know the difference between a theory and a conspiracy (the body of evidence).
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  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    edited March 2023
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    It's the most recent study, but who the fuck knows at this point and why do you care? I'm just amused how quickly they mocked it and labeled as conspiracy. 
    Post edited by AW124797 on
  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    mickeyrat said:
    and still......


    this is an addional 1500 dead from yesterday's tally on thus site....


    How often you check these digits and is this your favorite covid porn? 
  • jwhjr17jwhjr17 Posts: 1,994
    mickeyrat said:
    and still......


    this is an addional 1500 dead from yesterday's tally on thus site....


    By my calculations that's a 0.009998354395939 death rate or an over 99% survival rate.  And, the cases number is most likely grossly underreported as the number of people who have had it that never tested as well as those who have tested but not reported it anywhere has to be large as well. To be fair, the deaths rate is most likely underreported as well (or over reported depending on who you ask), but even so based on the survival rate I wouldn't imagine it moving the needle at all.  I have the vaccine and boosters including the most recent one, but I'm done with those and will take my chances from here on out.
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  • 23scidoo23scidoo Posts: 19,224
    benjs said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Considering several other respiratory illnesses started in the wild, including the devastating SARS, which appeared in China in 2002, common sense is that covid COULD come from a lab, not that it did.  You need actual evidence for a gov't or anyone in a position of authority to draw such a conclusion.  Otherwise you are being irresponsible.  
    I think irresponsibility and (intentional or accidental) misreading of the facts are part of a troll's MO. 23 is right on brand.

    The rest of us know the difference between a fact and a theory, and know the difference between a theory and a conspiracy (the body of evidence).
    You have no idea about me..ok??..don't talk about me again..otherwise i have to act as i think..
    last warning..thank you..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,627
    23scidoo said:
    benjs said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Considering several other respiratory illnesses started in the wild, including the devastating SARS, which appeared in China in 2002, common sense is that covid COULD come from a lab, not that it did.  You need actual evidence for a gov't or anyone in a position of authority to draw such a conclusion.  Otherwise you are being irresponsible.  
    I think irresponsibility and (intentional or accidental) misreading of the facts are part of a troll's MO. 23 is right on brand.

    The rest of us know the difference between a fact and a theory, and know the difference between a theory and a conspiracy (the body of evidence).
    You have no idea about me..ok??..don't talk about me again..otherwise i have to act as i think..
    last warning..thank you..
    what are you going to do to him?
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Posts: 20,103
    edited March 2023
    23scidoo said:
    benjs said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    23scidoo said:
    mrussel1 said:
    AW124797 said:
    The victimhood is never ending. 
    The only victims here are YouTube scientists. Haha. 
    I don’t understand.  Eight agencies have studied this,  4 have low confidence that it’s natural, 2 say it’s lab with low confidence,  and 2 have not made a determination.  Why do you believe the DOE and FBI over the other 4 agencies?  What information do you have that proves the 2 are right and the 4 are wrong?
    let's be a little serious..they said that the virus was born in a rural market in Juhan..coincidentally, there is also a laboratory nearby that studies viruses..
    coincidence??..
    That's circumstantial evidence, not empirical evidence.  See that's the difference here.  I have never weighed in on this one way or another because I have zero evidence or sources that examined actual empirical evidence.  Jumping to the conclusion you jumped to is irresponsible for a gov't to do.  It's fine for a bunch of yahoos on the internet, but not for a gov't.  At this point, it may be right, and it still may be wrong.  But what you and other did was simply guess.  You had no actual knowledge.  

    And for the record, the Wuhan market wasn't 'rural'. Wuhan has 8.5MM people.  The market had over 1000 tenants.  Athens has a metro population of less than 4MM.  So unless you consider Athens a podunk outpost, Wuhan cannot be considered "rural".  
    Common sense..
    Considering several other respiratory illnesses started in the wild, including the devastating SARS, which appeared in China in 2002, common sense is that covid COULD come from a lab, not that it did.  You need actual evidence for a gov't or anyone in a position of authority to draw such a conclusion.  Otherwise you are being irresponsible.  
    I think irresponsibility and (intentional or accidental) misreading of the facts are part of a troll's MO. 23 is right on brand.

    The rest of us know the difference between a fact and a theory, and know the difference between a theory and a conspiracy (the body of evidence).
    You have no idea about me..ok??..don't talk about me again..otherwise i have to act as i think..
    last warning..thank you..
    You gonna ask him to meet you in the parking lot?
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 11,423
    Gold, Jerry! Gold!
  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 667
    jwhjr17 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    and still......


    this is an addional 1500 dead from yesterday's tally on thus site....


    By my calculations that's a 0.009998354395939 death rate or an over 99% survival rate.  And, the cases number is most likely grossly underreported as the number of people who have had it that never tested as well as those who have tested but not reported it anywhere has to be large as well. To be fair, the deaths rate is most likely underreported as well (or over reported depending on who you ask), but even so based on the survival rate I wouldn't imagine it moving the needle at all.  I have the vaccine and boosters including the most recent one, but I'm done with those and will take my chances from here on out.
    May I ask what made you have this change of heart? That updated booster must've been very recent. 
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