Question for Republifans

MG79478

Bentleyspop said:

If you spend money, time, energy going to see, or listening to a performer you are supporting them and their views.
I for one will never spend a dime to see or hear ted nugent, kid rock, rosanne, or any other "artist" who has shown support for the current regime.

The Buddhists will tell you that when you support evil that makes you evil as well.
When you support a racist in any way, shape, or form, including voting,  that makes you a racist as well.

If the arena is going to be sold out anyway, you specifically aren't supporting their views. It doesn't matter who bought the seats, but what does matter is that you are taking up seats that could be filled by some impressionable young people that could be corrupted by the views of some rich artists who live in liberal fantasyland.

MG79478

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Veddernarian said:

Ellen Degeneres was hanging out with George Bush.  Both political opposites but respectful and friendly with each other.  

If I were friends with Ellen and she hanged out with a war criminal that should be tried at Hague, then i would question my friend Ellen and my friendship with her.

I try to have some standards in my life.

Also, stating ones opinions or worldview in a song =/= stating to be an expert. 

I have problems "looking the other way" or tuning out. That's why I don't listen to KISS - Take it off. No matter how good that riff is. because the lyrics are seeping iiiiiiiinnnnn

Just not grammar standards?

pjhawks said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Veddernarian said:

Ellen Degeneres was hanging out with George Bush.  Both political opposites but respectful and friendly with each other.  

If I were friends with Ellen and she hanged out with a war criminal that should be tried at Hague, then i would question my friend Ellen and my friendship with her.

I try to have some standards in my life.

Also, stating ones opinions or worldview in a song =/= stating to be an expert. 

I have problems "looking the other way" or tuning out. That's why I don't listen to KISS - Take it off. No matter how good that riff is. because the lyrics are seeping iiiiiiiinnnnn

i would think everyone has a point of no return for actions by their friends.  i don't disparage or lose my friends if they support Trump but it surely makes me question their judgment on what is good and bad.  No problem with being Republican or Conservative but honestly I don't understand any education person supporting our current Potus in any way shape or form.

Oh the Irony!

MG79478

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

You nailed it.  This thread can end now.

ejk1280

I can’t imagine going through life making decisions on who I am friends with or surround myself with based on their political thoughts or beliefs.  That would be a horrible boring and sad life. 

rgambs

ejk1280 said:

I can’t imagine going through life making decisions on who I am friends with or surround myself with based on their political thoughts or beliefs.  That would be a horrible boring and sad life. 

You should try to understand that this is a privileged position to hold.  Are you insulated from the political decisions that hurt people?

Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be fired/harassed/discriminated agoainst for their sexuality or gender circumstances due to conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be stripped from the life and family they've built in America because of conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is suffering under medical issues that any other country in the first world would cover?  Do you not know anyone who works full-time for a massively profitable company that still can't make ends meet, due to conservative political actions?
"Politics" have real-world consequences for people, if you can't see that, then you should work to make your social circle less homogeneous.

Like ecdanc mentioned earlier, how are you going to sit down to dinner with someone as a dear friend, and then turn around the next day and sit down to dinner with someone who campaigns to keep the former from having the same rights you have?

ejk1280

rgambs said:

ejk1280 said:

I can’t imagine going through life making decisions on who I am friends with or surround myself with based on their political thoughts or beliefs.  That would be a horrible boring and sad life. 

You should try to understand that this is a privileged position to hold.  Are you insulated from the political decisions that hurt people?

Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be fired/harassed/discriminated agoainst for their sexuality or gender circumstances due to conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be stripped from the life and family they've built in America because of conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is suffering under medical issues that any other country in the first world would cover?  Do you not know anyone who works full-time for a massively profitable company that still can't make ends meet, due to conservative political actions?
"Politics" have real-world consequences for people, if you can't see that, then you should work to make your social circle less homogeneous.

Like ecdanc mentioned earlier, how are you going to sit down to dinner with someone as a dear friend, and then turn around the next day and sit down to dinner with someone who campaigns to keep the former from having the same rights you have?

So republicans and democrats can’t be friends.  Got it

rgambs

ejk1280 said:

rgambs said:

ejk1280 said:

I can’t imagine going through life making decisions on who I am friends with or surround myself with based on their political thoughts or beliefs.  That would be a horrible boring and sad life. 

You should try to understand that this is a privileged position to hold.  Are you insulated from the political decisions that hurt people?

Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be fired/harassed/discriminated agoainst for their sexuality or gender circumstances due to conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is legally liable to be stripped from the life and family they've built in America because of conservative political actions?  Do you not know anyone who is suffering under medical issues that any other country in the first world would cover?  Do you not know anyone who works full-time for a massively profitable company that still can't make ends meet, due to conservative political actions?
"Politics" have real-world consequences for people, if you can't see that, then you should work to make your social circle less homogeneous.

Like ecdanc mentioned earlier, how are you going to sit down to dinner with someone as a dear friend, and then turn around the next day and sit down to dinner with someone who campaigns to keep the former from having the same rights you have?

So republicans and democrats can’t be friends.  Got it

Sometimes they can and sometimes they can't.  Get it?

cp3iverson

Far left people and far right people are actually the same kind of person when it comes down to it.   

Most other people are pretty chill and can get along just fine. 

prljmr316

As the gay socialist that went to the Kid Rock show, let me say this. I would normally never promote an artist, company, politician, friend or whatever that would harm my cause. That said, I found it a good opportunity to take a friend, who happens to be very autistic, and is a huge Kid Rock fan. He is not a political type, lives in utter filth in a hoarder trailer along with 2 other disabled family members, and never gets to experience things like concerts. Yes it was my birthday and I was also bored, but it worked out the way it did, and I am glad to have given him that experience, as well as myself.I don't like giving my money to Kid, or Chick fill a, etc. I would normally never do it, but have I eaten a chicken sandwich a handful of times in my life, yes, I don't like giving them my money, but a few times I have done it, felt it reasonable in the current circumstances at those times. I wonder if Kid even made any money on that show honestly, Idk, he couldn't even fill the lower bowl of the arena, tix were $10. I felt sad for Kid in a way, but he did it to himself.  I wish I could bring a friend to PJ, but can't afford to, even at face value. It may not be wise spending to be going to concerts if your struggling, but some enjoyment in life is necessary to survive, or you would likely just succumb to suicide. I am disabled myself living on SSDI, sometimes those with out funds have to shop at the dollar store, or support Walmart. Shit, Chic fil a and kid rock are luxuries for some of us. It may not be a good choice to support these types of conservative businesses, but if you want to eat and Wal Mart is the only store in your town. What are you going to do? You take what you can get in many ways. And yes, I booed as loud as I could during Kids rant, he deserves it. If conservatives wanna boo Eddie they will, even if I don't like it, everyone has there freedom of speech here, or at least we should, even if many times we don't truly have a voice, and other people have the microphone, and we would rather them not speak at all. Not saying yell fire in a crowded theater either, if there is no fire. But, the corona virus is looking like it could be the mother of all fires, so let's call it a hoax? We need to start working together as a species, real fast or this is going to go south real quick, for everyone!

ejk1280

cp3iverson said:

Far left people and far right people are actually the same kind of person when it comes down to it.   

Most other people are pretty chill and can get along just fine. 

I like this line of thinking 

NewfieintheUSA

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

Here is what I don't get about self proclaimed fiscal conservatives who are against universal health care. Let's look at the numbers.

Health care spending per capita 2018

Canada - $4,974
US - $10,586

So if the US could adopt a similar system with similar costs as Canada, in 2018 the US (between the government, companies, and individuals) could have saved $1,836,246,400,000 on health care spending. Yes that is almost $2 trillion dollars. Heck, even if it was just half way between, it would be almost $1 trillion. 

But what does that extra spending get you? A longer life? No. 

Average life expectancy
Canada - 82.96 years
US - 79.11 years

So in the US we are paying over twice the cost per year, and our life expectancy is almost 4 years less than Canada. 

But let's play the fiscally conservative card and say this wouldn't work, or doesn't make sense.

DewieCox

Don’t agree with everything that hardly anybody says and even less with most of the bands I’m a fan of. I can accept that other people have a different outlooks for different reason and not think that it comes from a place of hate or greed. It’s easy for things to seem black and white and for people to treat them as such so getting people to discuss things on a deeper level than some oversimplified label is a good thing.

jstu39

NewfieintheUSA said:

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

Here is what I don't get about self proclaimed fiscal conservatives who are against universal health care. Let's look at the numbers.

Health care spending per capita 2018

Canada - $4,974
US - $10,586

So if the US could adopt a similar system with similar costs as Canada, in 2018 the US (between the government, companies, and individuals) could have saved $1,836,246,400,000 on health care spending. Yes that is almost $2 trillion dollars. Heck, even if it was just half way between, it would be almost $1 trillion. 

But what does that extra spending get you? A longer life? No. 

Average life expectancy
Canada - 82.96 years
US - 79.11 years

So in the US we are paying over twice the cost per year, and our life expectancy is almost 4 years less than Canada. 

But let's play the fiscally conservative card and say this wouldn't work, or doesn't make sense.

Does that cost comparison include taxes and fees used to subsidize healthcare? I honestly don’t know. What I do know is many simple things cost 2 - 3 times more based on what I hear from people in Canada. Maybe those are imports or something else. Again I am not overly educated on the topic. What I can say is if the government managed USPS loses millions while FedEx and UPS make money I don’t have much confidence is those same people running healthcare with any sort of success. I know it’s not apples to apples but just an analogy. 

myoung321

Don't you think that in ONE Healthcare system things can get done quicker? Especially in epidemic..... meaning in the US we have to coordinate how many Corporations that own Hospitals, Urgent Care Centers, etc, etc How many Insurance Companies do you have to deal with??? .... Where as in a one system healthcare its all connected... faster!   Hell we can't get test kits to Seattle!!!!!!!!!!

droptheleash9

Yup...about time for this thread to go to AMT

NewfieintheUSA

jstu39 said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

Here is what I don't get about self proclaimed fiscal conservatives who are against universal health care. Let's look at the numbers.

Health care spending per capita 2018

Canada - $4,974
US - $10,586

So if the US could adopt a similar system with similar costs as Canada, in 2018 the US (between the government, companies, and individuals) could have saved $1,836,246,400,000 on health care spending. Yes that is almost $2 trillion dollars. Heck, even if it was just half way between, it would be almost $1 trillion. 

But what does that extra spending get you? A longer life? No. 

Average life expectancy
Canada - 82.96 years
US - 79.11 years

So in the US we are paying over twice the cost per year, and our life expectancy is almost 4 years less than Canada. 

But let's play the fiscally conservative card and say this wouldn't work, or doesn't make sense.

Does that cost comparison include taxes and fees used to subsidize healthcare? I honestly don’t know. What I do know is many simple things cost 2 - 3 times more based on what I hear from people in Canada. Maybe those are imports or something else. Again I am not overly educated on the topic. What I can say is if the government managed USPS loses millions while FedEx and UPS make money I don’t have much confidence is those same people running healthcare with any sort of success. I know it’s not apples to apples but just an analogy. 

Yes it does include taxes and fees used to subsidize health care. 

foodshop65

At 55, with 42 years of concerts, the live show was an escape to hear the music and get to see the band. 2 hours to be away from it all and just rock out. At 2020 prices, it's not that much to wish for?

ejk1280

It’s quite impressive  when a person thinks they have it all figured out and their entire line of thinking is how everyone should view each and every aspect of the world.  Must be nice to have all the answers in life.  

rgambs

jstu39 said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

Here is what I don't get about self proclaimed fiscal conservatives who are against universal health care. Let's look at the numbers.

Health care spending per capita 2018

Canada - $4,974
US - $10,586

So if the US could adopt a similar system with similar costs as Canada, in 2018 the US (between the government, companies, and individuals) could have saved $1,836,246,400,000 on health care spending. Yes that is almost $2 trillion dollars. Heck, even if it was just half way between, it would be almost $1 trillion. 

But what does that extra spending get you? A longer life? No. 

Average life expectancy
Canada - 82.96 years
US - 79.11 years

So in the US we are paying over twice the cost per year, and our life expectancy is almost 4 years less than Canada. 

But let's play the fiscally conservative card and say this wouldn't work, or doesn't make sense.

Does that cost comparison include taxes and fees used to subsidize healthcare? I honestly don’t know. What I do know is many simple things cost 2 - 3 times more based on what I hear from people in Canada. Maybe those are imports or something else. Again I am not overly educated on the topic. What I can say is if the government managed USPS loses millions while FedEx and UPS make money I don’t have much confidence is those same people running healthcare with any sort of success. I know it’s not apples to apples but just an analogy. 

That is not a wholly informed summary of the situation, you should look into it, it's quite fascinating...and very sad.

jstu39

rgambs said:

jstu39 said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

mattsavard said:

Libertarian here (Fiscal conservative, socially liberal) who generally thinks BOTH the far left and right are mental. Both tend to be closed minded, use hyperbole and straw men to attack "the other team", and the rest of the country has to suffer as a result.

Ed and most other celebrities aren't forced to live in the real world, and thus preach in a manner disconnected with reality, all while living a life protected by armed security (while preaching against guns), and flying in private jets and riding in gas guzzling busses (while preaching about global warming).

They're hypocrites, but I don't let it impact my enjoyment of the music. I choose to walk away from any preachy fans, and at most shows Ed's ranting is kept pretty low-key. If Ed does get on a roll, it's always a nice time to tune him out, and go grab a beer and piss break.   

IMO everyone should be able to do whatever they want as long as it's not hurting someone else (including speaking their mind), and government interference (fiscally & legislatively) should be kept to a bare minimum. Those who think healthcare and college education should be provided for those who can't afford it, nobody's stopping you from voluntarily setting aside a chunk of your salary to help make that happen. No need for a federal mandate. 

Here is what I don't get about self proclaimed fiscal conservatives who are against universal health care. Let's look at the numbers.

Health care spending per capita 2018

Canada - $4,974
US - $10,586

So if the US could adopt a similar system with similar costs as Canada, in 2018 the US (between the government, companies, and individuals) could have saved $1,836,246,400,000 on health care spending. Yes that is almost $2 trillion dollars. Heck, even if it was just half way between, it would be almost $1 trillion. 

But what does that extra spending get you? A longer life? No. 

Average life expectancy
Canada - 82.96 years
US - 79.11 years

So in the US we are paying over twice the cost per year, and our life expectancy is almost 4 years less than Canada. 

But let's play the fiscally conservative card and say this wouldn't work, or doesn't make sense.

Does that cost comparison include taxes and fees used to subsidize healthcare? I honestly don’t know. What I do know is many simple things cost 2 - 3 times more based on what I hear from people in Canada. Maybe those are imports or something else. Again I am not overly educated on the topic. What I can say is if the government managed USPS loses millions while FedEx and UPS make money I don’t have much confidence is those same people running healthcare with any sort of success. I know it’s not apples to apples but just an analogy. 

That is not a wholly informed summary of the situation, you should look into it, it's quite fascinating...and very sad.

Why didn’t you put the next sentence in bold too?  It says it’s not a wholly informed summary.

Or the statistical breakdown above that clearly does not tell the whole story? 

Both we’re simply using numbers to illustrate a point using a couple lines on a complex issue. 

But to say the people ultimately in charge of something won’t impact its success is very sad indeed.