The Democratic Presidential Debates

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  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    Are you slowly turning into @mrussel1 and @mcgruff10 haha.  Trying to go for the "learn how to quote" take down?

    Didn't go so well for them when they tried that on me a few pages back. 

    Haha.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • ecdanc
    ecdanc Posts: 1,814
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    What’s really funny is if YOU actually looked this up, you’d find you’re wrong. Silly bear. 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    I was just thinking I needed writing advice from you
    Kinda sad isn’t it?
    hippiemom = goodness
  • ecdanc
    ecdanc Posts: 1,814
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    I was just thinking I needed writing advice from you
    Kinda sad isn’t it?
    Your posts do make me sad. And tired. 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    I was just thinking I needed writing advice from you
    Kinda sad isn’t it?
    Your posts do make me sad. And tired. 
    “I’m so smart and unwilling to ever listen to others yet I pretend to always want to learn when in reality I just want to be a condescending #%>”
    hippiemom = goodness
  • ecdanc
    ecdanc Posts: 1,814
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    I was just thinking I needed writing advice from you
    Kinda sad isn’t it?
    Your posts do make me sad. And tired. 
    “I’m so smart and unwilling to ever listen to others yet I pretend to always want to learn when in reality I just want to be a condescending #%>”
    See. I taught you something. 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    I was just thinking I needed writing advice from you
    Kinda sad isn’t it?
    Your posts do make me sad. And tired. 
    “I’m so smart and unwilling to ever listen to others yet I pretend to always want to learn when in reality I just want to be a condescending #%>”
    See. I taught you something. 
    You sure have 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    edited February 2020
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • what dreams
    what dreams Posts: 1,761
    Lerxst1992 said:
    what dreams said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:




    That -0- is going to lose him ALOT of general election votes. 
    THE FOCUS ON COST IGNORES COVERAGE.  Medicare provides HORRIBLE COVERAGE. I'm taking care of my mother who is on Medicare, and if she didn't have supplemental private insurance through Kaiser, she would have no health care at all. Medicare is fine if you are at death's door in the hospital, and even then, the rules you have to follow can be confusing. If you mess up -- or as happened in our case, the social workers give you wrong information -- you're stuck with a huge bill, which happened to my mother and my family.  But thank God for her private supplemental, or we would be broke paying for her chronic health conditions since then. People have no idea what an M4A plan actually means. Basically, nothing. Quit telling people what it will cost and actually explain the coverage, and I guarantee you nobody will want it.

    We are not sure if Bernie is using Medicare as a moniker or he will actually be keeping the current system for all. Sorry to hear about your situation. 

    We're not sure? It's in writing. Here is the text of the Sanders's bill in the Senate. https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/1129/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%221129%22%5D%7D&r=7#toc-id25c91cb96228483495ad9de0b47b79f8 

    There are a lot of words. If you read it, you see the provisions in the bill that are problematic for me (and I'm sure there are many others):
    1.  Providers have to agree to participate -- so, doctors who don't want to, don't have to, giving lie to the platitude that you can keep your doctor. Maybe. If your doctor doesn't participate and you want to keep your doctor, you are at the mercy of whatever your doctor charges. This will only further the divide between the haves and have nots. There is a provision for private insurance, but private insurance can't be "duplicative." In other words, private insurance can only cover what M4A doesn't. We may all end up needing supplemental anyway on top of what we pay for M4A because of #2 below.
    2.  If you look at the "Administration" section of the bill, you see that the HHS Secretary is charged with developing all the "policies." Among those policies to be developed are: "benefits provided;" "the determination of medical necessity and appropriateness with respect to coverage of certain services."  In other words, while we generally know that the bill calls for "comprehensive coverage" WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT MEANS AND WON'T UNTIL AFTER THE BILL IS PASSED.
    3.  the establishment of a "health care budget" every year. LOL -- when was the last time Congress passed a budget without threat of shutting down the government -- so that nobody gets paid, including doctors? When the government shuts down, do hospitals continue to operate? Will doctors close their doors? It's a nightmare scenario. Why on earth would we turn our health care system over to the government when our government leaders can't be trusted to do anything other than investigate each other, and they can't even do that right?

    Medicare for All is the number one reason why I will not vote for Bernie Sanders if he is our nominee. End of story. I will sit out the election. It's a horrible choice -- Trump v. Sanders. Good God how did we arrive here?
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    what dreams said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:




    That -0- is going to lose him ALOT of general election votes. 
    THE FOCUS ON COST IGNORES COVERAGE.  Medicare provides HORRIBLE COVERAGE. I'm taking care of my mother who is on Medicare, and if she didn't have supplemental private insurance through Kaiser, she would have no health care at all. Medicare is fine if you are at death's door in the hospital, and even then, the rules you have to follow can be confusing. If you mess up -- or as happened in our case, the social workers give you wrong information -- you're stuck with a huge bill, which happened to my mother and my family.  But thank God for her private supplemental, or we would be broke paying for her chronic health conditions since then. People have no idea what an M4A plan actually means. Basically, nothing. Quit telling people what it will cost and actually explain the coverage, and I guarantee you nobody will want it.
    What care does you mother need that Bernies "vision" of health care would not cover? Or that would not be covered in all those odd countries having a much worse systems than the US by having universal health care instead of the wonder of private gouging?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    cincybearcat said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 

    Looks that way to me too.  Sorry to see her lose steam. 

    I wonder when the herd will thin?
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    brianlux said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 

    Looks that way to me too.  Sorry to see her lose steam. 

    I wonder when the herd will thin?
    Super Tuesday. This seems very ego-driven, and from the moderates like they are waiting out eachother. Instead of going into a backroom and being all "Look folks. We need to get together and have only one candidate out there to beat good-guy Sanders"

    Seen both Yang and someone else say that Bloombergs people are going out to big doners wanting them to stop contributing to the other moderates campaigns to starve them.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Lerxst1992
    Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,879
    what dreams said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    what dreams said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:




    That -0- is going to lose him ALOT of general election votes. 
    THE FOCUS ON COST IGNORES COVERAGE.  Medicare provides HORRIBLE COVERAGE. I'm taking care of my mother who is on Medicare, and if she didn't have supplemental private insurance through Kaiser, she would have no health care at all. Medicare is fine if you are at death's door in the hospital, and even then, the rules you have to follow can be confusing. If you mess up -- or as happened in our case, the social workers give you wrong information -- you're stuck with a huge bill, which happened to my mother and my family.  But thank God for her private supplemental, or we would be broke paying for her chronic health conditions since then. People have no idea what an M4A plan actually means. Basically, nothing. Quit telling people what it will cost and actually explain the coverage, and I guarantee you nobody will want it.

    We are not sure if Bernie is using Medicare as a moniker or he will actually be keeping the current system for all. Sorry to hear about your situation. 

    We're not sure? It's in writing. Here is the text of the Sanders's bill in the Senate. https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/1129/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%221129%22%5D%7D&r=7#toc-id25c91cb96228483495ad9de0b47b79f8 

    There are a lot of words. If you read it, you see the provisions in the bill that are problematic for me (and I'm sure there are many others):
    1.  Providers have to agree to participate -- so, doctors who don't want to, don't have to, giving lie to the platitude that you can keep your doctor. Maybe. If your doctor doesn't participate and you want to keep your doctor, you are at the mercy of whatever your doctor charges. This will only further the divide between the haves and have nots. There is a provision for private insurance, but private insurance can't be "duplicative." In other words, private insurance can only cover what M4A doesn't. We may all end up needing supplemental anyway on top of what we pay for M4A because of #2 below.
    2.  If you look at the "Administration" section of the bill, you see that the HHS Secretary is charged with developing all the "policies." Among those policies to be developed are: "benefits provided;" "the determination of medical necessity and appropriateness with respect to coverage of certain services."  In other words, while we generally know that the bill calls for "comprehensive coverage" WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT MEANS AND WON'T UNTIL AFTER THE BILL IS PASSED.
    3.  the establishment of a "health care budget" every year. LOL -- when was the last time Congress passed a budget without threat of shutting down the government -- so that nobody gets paid, including doctors? When the government shuts down, do hospitals continue to operate? Will doctors close their doors? It's a nightmare scenario. Why on earth would we turn our health care system over to the government when our government leaders can't be trusted to do anything other than investigate each other, and they can't even do that right?

    Medicare for All is the number one reason why I will not vote for Bernie Sanders if he is our nominee. End of story. I will sit out the election. It's a horrible choice -- Trump v. Sanders. Good God how did we arrive here?

    Thank you for the information. I still believe sanders would be much better than trump although I don’t support him in the primary because he is against choice of coverage
  • what dreams
    what dreams Posts: 1,761
    edited February 2020
    cincybearcat said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 
    I don't. I saw her first advertisement in Virginia this morning. She has raised 12 million since NH.  I sent her $25.00 this week myself. I plan to vote for her in the VA primary.
    I really think all the nay-saying about the field needs to stop. Candidates can run or drop out at their own discretion and should not be pressured just so Sanders or Biden can be our nominee. It's BS. Let the voters decide.
    EDIT:  So much parroting of the media that we all decry. That's all this is. If she gets through Super Tuesday and doesn't win anything significant, then so be it. We've had two states cast their votes that don't represent anything about America. I don't know why anyone trusts the polls after 2016. Seriously.  Can we get through Super Tuesday before we write people off?  
    Post edited by what dreams on
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    edited February 2020
    what dreams said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 
    I don't. I saw her first advertisement in Virginia this morning. She has raised 12 million since NH.  I sent her $25.00 this week myself. I plan to vote for her in the VA primary.
    I really think all the nay-saying about the field needs to stop. Candidates can run or drop out at their own discretion and should not be pressured just so Sanders or Biden can be our nominee. It's BS. Let the voters decide.
    So what do you think this thread should be about, if we cannot debate and have ideas about if candidates are surging and when they are dropping out etc?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Lerxst1992
    Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,879
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    Did I say anything in that quote, or just provide statistics and say it’s a difficult balancing act? 

    More stats, acknowledging stats can be spun in any direction. But look at that cliff the murder rate took during Bloomberg’s tenure. Maybe taking a long look at that spike should get people to think. Probably not.






    .
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,471
    edited February 2020


    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    what dreams said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    So what do you guys think of Amy? Is the surge over? 
    I think it is. She had a poor debate and with her $ and lack of national recognition, she needed to perform amazingly. Her margin for error was the smallest of the bunch 
    I don't. I saw her first advertisement in Virginia this morning. She has raised 12 million since NH.  I sent her $25.00 this week myself. I plan to vote for her in the VA primary.
    I really think all the nay-saying about the field needs to stop. Candidates can run or drop out at their own discretion and should not be pressured just so Sanders or Biden can be our nominee. It's BS. Let the voters decide.
    EDIT:  So much parroting of the media that we all decry. That's all this is. If she gets through Super Tuesday and doesn't win anything significant, then so be it. We've had two states cast their votes that don't represent anything about America. I don't know why anyone trusts the polls after 2016. Seriously.  Can we get through Super Tuesday before we write people off?  
    Ummm just to be clear that was my own thought. If you heard it in the media then I guess they agree with me. But please don’t assume that all people do is listen and parrot back all the time.

    Im very concerned for her campaign after watching that debate. 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    Lerxst1992 said:
    cincybearcat said:
    ecdanc said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    The highly conservative village voice paints a stark timeline of NYC crime.


    record high homicides in 1990 which was cut by nearly 70% in 1998. Wonder what could have happened in between.

    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/07/the-rise-and-fall-of-crime-in-new-york-city-a-timeline/
    “Listen, I’m against stop and frisk...but I also believe racist policing gets results.”
    You do a great job of using quotes 100% wrong. Do you know what a quote is? You can read about it.
    Did I say anything in that quote, or just provide statistics and say it’s a difficult balancing act? 

    More stats, acknowledging stats can be spun in any direction. But look at that cliff the murder rate took during Bloomberg’s tenure. Maybe taking a long look at that spike should get people to think. Probably not.






    .
    Did you mean to respond to me?
    hippiemom = goodness
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