New Lottery System

RE4790

81 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

And suggesting that makes perfect sense. Suggesting that the old system was perfect and that we should be sitting in front of our computers for hours on end does not.

nobody likes hitting f5 endlessly...i view it more as a term to represent a normal sale process....log in, click buy, check out. use the TM process like they did for a few of the shows in 2011. that seemed to work pretty good.

That is the context in which the term is now used. I'd love to see something as simple as the TM pre-sale process be used again, but with so many venues setting up their own e-commerce solutions (to milk every cent they can out of the ticketing process), that may not be practical right now.

At least we aren't lined up in the rain outside of Tower Records anymore.

JimmyV

RE4790 wrote:

81 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

And suggesting that makes perfect sense. Suggesting that the old system was perfect and that we should be sitting in front of our computers for hours on end does not.

nobody likes hitting f5 endlessly...i view it more as a term to represent a normal sale process....log in, click buy, check out. use the TM process like they did for a few of the shows in 2011. that seemed to work pretty good.

That is the context in which the term is now used. I'd love to see something as simple as the TM pre-sale process be used again, but with so many venues setting up their own e-commerce solutions (to milk every cent they can out of the ticketing process), that may not be practical right now.

At least we aren't lined up in the rain outside of Tower Records anymore.

It was Strawberries in the burbs of Boston and oh yes did that ever suck.

RE4790

pjsteelerfan wrote:

With the old system I expected to get tickets to most shows I tried for, and was disappointed if I didn't.

With the new system, I expect to get shut out of tickets to all shows I try for and will be shocked if I win.

It is what it is now.

That is what is so heartbreaking about the lotto. Thousands of PJ fans used to be able to log in and buy tickets... to plan a vacation for a few shows... sit near people they met while touring... develop a sense of community from seeing familiar faces around them... that's all lost to random selection now. It is fair, certainly more fair for fans who couldn't be at a computer during the on-sale time, but it's not what built up the community of legions of die-hard touring fans over the last decade and that makes me sad.

october22

RE4790 wrote:

pjsteelerfan wrote:

With the old system I expected to get tickets to most shows I tried for, and was disappointed if I didn't.

With the new system, I expect to get shut out of tickets to all shows I try for and will be shocked if I win.

It is what it is now.

That is what is so heartbreaking about the lotto. Thousands of PJ fans used to be able to log in and buy tickets... to plan a vacation for a few shows... sit near people they met while touring... develop a sense of community from seeing familiar faces around them... that's all lost to random selection now. It is fair, certainly more fair for fans who couldn't be at a computer during the on-sale time, but it's not what built up the community of legions of die-hard touring fans over the last decade and that makes me sad.

Exactly my experience.

JimmyV

I am curious to see how the lottery plays out when a real tour is announced. I do think it is premature to accurately judge the success of the lottery until we see it used for many shows at once. The possibility does remain that it may work better than some expect. Or not. But we won't know for sure until the fall tour goes on sale.

october22

JimmyV wrote:

I am curious to see how the lottery plays out when a real tour is announced. I do think it is premature to accurately judge the success of the lottery until we see it used for many shows at once. The possibility does remain that it may work better than some expect. Or not. But we won't know for sure until the fall tour goes on sale.

That's true. Guess we'll have to wait and see.

PJ

pjsteelerfan wrote:

With the old system I expected to get tickets to most shows I tried for, and was disappointed if I didn't.

With the new system, I expect to get shut out of tickets to all shows I try for and will be shocked if I win.

It is what it is now.

Thats exactly what I am expecting as well. I feel that this will change the way people plan for tours...

Lets say theyre playing two nights at MSG and a bunch of others (Philly, Boston, etc). The two MSG shows are Friday and Wednesday...Clearly everyones 1st choice would be the Friday(2nd) night show, but If i want any chance of tickets, Im thinking of choosing Wednesday as my first choice and the Friday show as my 5th/6th choice and looking for public sale for the Friday show to at least get some chance at 10C MSG seats...But again I guess we will all wait and see

Indifference71

october22 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

I am curious to see how the lottery plays out when a real tour is announced. I do think it is premature to accurately judge the success of the lottery until we see it used for many shows at once. The possibility does remain that it may work better than some expect. Or not. But we won't know for sure until the fall tour goes on sale.

That's true. Guess we'll have to wait and see.

Yep. The lottery has only been used for one of the most in demand PJ shows ever so it is hard to judge it just based off of that. Plus, regardless of what system is used, tickets for huge shows like the Wrigley one and shows in the Northeast are always going to be difficult to get and there will be plenty of people that get shut out.

RatsTJRats

Ugh.....not this thread again..... :fp:

rearviewross

MG79478 wrote:

rearviewross wrote:

The new system is way easier for the 10 club.

How so, it's not like the 10C needs to do anything else before/during/after an F5 sale? They simply have to deal with the complaints, of which there are surely more with the lottery. Depending on whether the lottery is completely automated or not, they might actually have significantly more work required to choose and notify winners, and run second chance lotteries.

rearviewross wrote:

No server crashes, and it is convenient for all members and gives everyone equal shot at tickets.

Server crashers were RARE, and not even worth discussing. The lottery is more convenient for the members who win; it’s much less convenient for those shut out. Everyone had an equal shot to put in time and effort in the F5 system. Odds are worse now in the lottery, due to how easy it is to enter, so while everyone may have equal odds of winning, those odds are significantly reduced from F5.

rearviewross wrote:

Its not going anywhere and I don't see any changes coming, at least until it has gone through one tour. People need to accept it.

This is simply conjecture on your part. This could have been a short time trial, and we are going to something much better soon. The lottery has been an utter failure, and many want to see it go away. People need to accept it.

This whole lottery came about because of the PJ20 debacle. Server crashing repeatedly. They don't have to worry about the DOS attack that is the F5 system. Look, I am an F5er I sat there all day banging away but the reality is tons of people cant do that. From the bands perspective I think they like the lotto because it means less IT overhead and headaches and it means equal opportunity for all, sucks for us but I don't think it is going away. Obviously it is conjecture on my part. I am not an employee of the band. Everything on this board is conjecture.

MG79478

Indifference71 wrote:

MG79478 wrote:

The lottery has been an utter failure, and many want to see it go away. People need to accept it.

How was the lottery a failure? It seemed to be a pretty smooth operation to me.

Just because something is easy, doesn't make it a success. Many deserving fans who would have earned tickets in the F5 system got shut out. Many local fans got shut out because anyone could easily enter and plan a trip. Luckily I won my first choice of seats… karma working in my favor!

JimmyV wrote:

Not liking the lottery is one thing. Can it be improved? Is it the best method for selling tickets? These are legitimate questions. But hitting f5 for hours on end was nowhere in the design of the old system. We were forced to do that because the system was broken. Lottery critics lose some support when they advocate for a return to a broken ticketing system.

Except that nearly all ticket sales only included hitting F5 for minutes on end, and only on RARE occasions did it take hours. While a system that functioned correctly most of the time could be in need of upgrades, it can't be considered broken. F5 critics lose some support then they advocate that a ticket system that worked perfectly most of the time was broken.

JimmyV wrote:

Suggesting that the old system was perfect and that we should be sitting in front of our computers for hours on end does not.

I tried helping a friend get tickets to Wrigley through the general sale. I sat in a damn waiting room for at least 2 hours, which was longer than ANY 10C ticket experience I have ever had. (Note: that I was on a business trip and my wife scored PJ20 tickets for me). This just takes me back to an extremely relevant and often ignored point on venue entry. Why should people line up and wait for hours to get the best spots? Some of us have lives/jobs/families/etc and can't do it. A lottery could be employeed, it would be so easy and fair!

JimmyV wrote:

I question whether some of those people actually were hitting f5 for hours or if they were exploiting some loophole to cheat the system, but only they know that for sure.

This is the root of all F5 hate. People who worked harder, and put in more effort HAD to be cheating. People can't stomach the thought that others are simply better and more prepared than them. If I was ever shut out of an F5 sale, I wouldn't have complained, I would have only looked for ways to step up my performance.

I'll also point out, again, that it was only hitting F5 for minutes, not hours.

rearviewross wrote:

Look, I am an F5er I sat there all day banging away but the reality is tons of people cant do that.

Why can't tons of people do that? What is stopping them? We all have lives/jobs/families/etc.

I never missed out on tickets during an F5 sale, because I planned, prepared and put in the required effort. It wasn't always me sitting in front of a computer getting tickets. I've gotten them on my phone in airports. I've had friends/family/co-workers score when I couldn't. I never made an excuse.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

I love the new system.

shortstack

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

no one cares

SPEEDY MCCREADY

shortstack wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

no one cares

I FUCKING LOVE THE NEW SYSTEM!!!!!!!!

shortstack

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

shortstack wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

no one cares

I FUCKING LOVE THE NEW SYSTEM!!!!!!!!

weirdo

RE4790

Indifference71 wrote:

Yep. The lottery has only been used for one of the most in demand PJ shows ever so it is hard to judge it just based off of that.

True, but Wrigley capacity is twice that of most venues the band plays and the 10C said they had more tickets (a higher %) than they usually get. I suspect it will be a pretty good measure of the North Eastern US shows.

october22

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

Cool. Do you have anything else to offer?

All your posts are "I love the new system" or "blablablabla" or something to that effect. It's easy to be annoying in a forum but I'd be curious to have a little more insight into your perspective since we seem to have opposing viewpoints.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

october22 wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

Cool. Do you have anything else to offer?

All your posts are "I love the new system" or "blablablabla" or something to that effect. It's easy to be annoying in a forum but I'd be curious to have a little more insight into your perspective since we seem to opposing viewpoints.

What do I have to offer.

I get pure joy and laughter from the people here, who think that sitting on a computer for 2-5 hours, hitting the F5 key, is the better way to do things. Every day those same people, bring a smile to my face, with their non stop whining, bitching and complaining. Sitting on a computer for 5 hours, while the system crashes, wasting 2-5 hours of your day, is not a good thing, in my eyes. Putting my name in a hat, taking 5 minutes to enter the lottery, is a better way.

JimmyV

MG79478 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

Not liking the lottery is one thing. Can it be improved? Is it the best method for selling tickets? These are legitimate questions. But hitting f5 for hours on end was nowhere in the design of the old system. We were forced to do that because the system was broken. Lottery critics lose some support when they advocate for a return to a broken ticketing system.

Except that nearly all ticket sales only included hitting F5 for minutes on end, and only on RARE occasions did it take hours. While a system that functioned correctly most of the time could be in need of upgrades, it can't be considered broken. F5 critics lose some support then they advocate that a ticket system that worked perfectly most of the time was broken.

JimmyV wrote:

Suggesting that the old system was perfect and that we should be sitting in front of our computers for hours on end does not.

I tried helping a friend get tickets to Wrigley through the general sale. I sat in a damn waiting room for at least 2 hours, which was longer than ANY 10C ticket experience I have ever had. (Note: that I was on a business trip and my wife scored PJ20 tickets for me). This just takes me back to an extremely relevant and often ignored point on venue entry. Why should people line up and wait for hours to get the best spots? Some of us have lives/jobs/families/etc and can't do it. A lottery could be employeed, it would be so easy and fair!

JimmyV wrote:

I question whether some of those people actually were hitting f5 for hours or if they were exploiting some loophole to cheat the system, but only they know that for sure.

This is the root of all F5 hate. People who worked harder, and put in more effort HAD to be cheating. People can't stomach the thought that others are simply better and more prepared than them. If I was ever shut out of an F5 sale, I wouldn't have complained, I would have only looked for ways to step up my performance.

I'll also point out, again, that it was only hitting F5 for minutes, not hours.

To your first point, what may have been rare occasions became frequent occasions beginning in at least 2010. MSG and the rest of the northeast that year, PJ20 and the Canadian debacle in 2011. It was becoming the rule, not the exception. F5 was most certainly broken.

To your second point, neither your experience with Tickets.com nor the method used to enter an arena has anything to do with the 10C ticket lottery. The Tickets.com method is obviously of poor design which may be why 10C did not adopt it. I don’t particularly care how people line up. If you would like to advocate for a lottery I say go right ahead. And none of what you wrote there rebutted my point that it makes no sense to pretend the f5 method was perfect.

To your third point, I do question how many people were cheating because I have learned that some were. That is not, however, the root of all F5 hate. I hated F5 long before I knew people were cheating. The example I gave earlier was the Hartford 2010 show. No one got tickets that day because they worked harder than me, that argument is completely not based in reality. Many got tickets because they were lucky that day. Some got tickets because they knew how to cheat the system. Cheating the system does not constitute working harder that someone else. Quite the opposite actually.

Again, I am not saying everyone or even most who got tickets through F5 were cheating. But some of us were. That the lottery eliminated this cheating is among the best reasons for its continued use. On that point I say nice job 10C.

october22

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

october22 wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

I love the new system.

Cool. Do you have anything else to offer?

All your posts are "I love the new system" or "blablablabla" or something to that effect. It's easy to be annoying in a forum but I'd be curious to have a little more insight into your perspective since we seem to opposing viewpoints.

What do I have to offer.

I get pure joy and laughter from the people here, who think that sitting on a computer for 2-5 hours, hitting the F5 key, is the better way to do things. Every day those same people, bring a smile to my face, with their non stop whining, bitching and complaining. Sitting on a computer for 5 hours, while the system crashes, wasting 2-5 hours of your day, is not a good thing, in my eyes. Putting my name in a hat, taking 5 minutes to enter the lottery, is a better way.

Sounds like you have a pretty strange fetish. I prefer to get my joy from the smile on a baby's face or blow jobs but to each his own.