Purpose for USA??

fear4freedom

mickeyrat wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

Im asking all those who are from other countries what they think about this philosophy! Dont think of your country in particular, think of all the weak, poor nations here. If you are from the US, sit back and watch this thread for once! Dont sabatoge it! Also, if you dont believe in God, thats fine, read on anyways.

I believe that God's intentions for all of mankind is for his children to have Individual Liberty and Freedom to pursue their own Individual Salvation and their own identity. We as the United States have formed a country that empowers the individuals and states to control and hold to account the central govt. The US is blessed by God to have the unique opportunity and responsibility to defend the weak and poor, promote Liberty and Freedom, stand for "The People" over any centralized power or govt. within that nation. We are to stand on these principles and values to help the people who are oppressed by their govt! The weak, poor and sick people of the world have hope that we are fighting for them on many different levels. We are blessed to have the capability to do what we do! We acknowledge that blessing and are thankful for having that unique responsibilty and opportunity. This is what I have learned and envision to be American Exceptionalism!

Again, for all you haters out there....we are thankful and blessed for this opportunity, this is not us being "prideful"

This is us understanding our role and being grateful for it!

Your thoughts?

please , as a fellow american, speak only for yourself.

IMO its the height of human ego to claim to know the will of god. The ideas of democracy and liberty etc , did not originate with the founding rich guys of their day.

this country was founded upon stolen ideas from others, land stolen from another people, built up on the backs of slaves.

I believe the world would be better served if the US stayed home and shut the fuck up in the process.

I view as suspicious anything or anyone who shows up with their hand out saying "we're here to help you"

So please OP speak only for yourself and not for me.

Well well well....lol ok. You werent invited to respond in the OP as an American. The OP even said so!

Now lets take a look! "Stolen Ideas" May I ask who's ideas did we steal?

land stolen? Maybe some of it, but do you think that the natives needed the entire continent? If so, what about all the other migration that has taken place in the world, including now?

Backs of slaves? Maybe 1/2 of the labor at some point was from slaves, but that was also the case in many nations through many centuries. There was a high demand for work. Its the natural evolution that happened in an uncivilized world. America didnt invent slavery bud!

"The founding rich guys of their day"? or educated men of their day is what I say.

So you give the founders and the founding ZERO relevance and ZERO meaning? WOW OK THERE BUD! You dont seem out of touch now!

mickeyrat

fear4freedom wrote:

mickeyrat wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

Im asking all those who are from other countries what they think about this philosophy! Dont think of your country in particular, think of all the weak, poor nations here. If you are from the US, sit back and watch this thread for once! Dont sabatoge it! Also, if you dont believe in God, thats fine, read on anyways.

I believe that God's intentions for all of mankind is for his children to have Individual Liberty and Freedom to pursue their own Individual Salvation and their own identity. We as the United States have formed a country that empowers the individuals and states to control and hold to account the central govt. The US is blessed by God to have the unique opportunity and responsibility to defend the weak and poor, promote Liberty and Freedom, stand for "The People" over any centralized power or govt. within that nation. We are to stand on these principles and values to help the people who are oppressed by their govt! The weak, poor and sick people of the world have hope that we are fighting for them on many different levels. We are blessed to have the capability to do what we do! We acknowledge that blessing and are thankful for having that unique responsibilty and opportunity. This is what I have learned and envision to be American Exceptionalism!

Again, for all you haters out there....we are thankful and blessed for this opportunity, this is not us being "prideful"

This is us understanding our role and being grateful for it!

Your thoughts?

please , as a fellow american, speak only for yourself.

IMO its the height of human ego to claim to know the will of god. The ideas of democracy and liberty etc , did not originate with the founding rich guys of their day.

this country was founded upon stolen ideas from others, land stolen from another people, built up on the backs of slaves.

I believe the world would be better served if the US stayed home and shut the fuck up in the process.

I view as suspicious anything or anyone who shows up with their hand out saying "we're here to help you"

So please OP speak only for yourself and not for me.

Well well well....lol ok. You werent invited to respond in the OP as an American. The OP even said so!

Now lets take a look! "Stolen Ideas" May I ask who's ideas did we steal?

land stolen? Maybe some of it, but do you think that the natives needed the entire continent? If so, what about all the other migration that has taken place in the world, including now?

Backs of slaves? Maybe 1/2 of the labor at some point was from slaves, but that was also the case in many nations through many centuries. There was a high demand for work. Its the natural evolution that happened in an uncivilized world. America didnt invent slavery bud!

"The founding rich guys of their day"? or educated men of their day is what I say.

So you give the founders and the founding ZERO relevance and ZERO meaning? WOW OK THERE BUD! You dont seem out of touch now!

soooo, you would tell me I dont have free speech now? IF this country actually practiced what we hold so dear and preach then I would have something else to say.

The simple fact is this country was founded upon exploiting the weak. Tell me, how christian is this?

mickeyrat

! !!! !!!!!



!

fear4freedom

mickeyrat wrote:

! !!! !!!!!



!

You are free to believe what you want! So you are free! Enjoy it, cause you are living in a free world, thanks to the USA!

otter

Byrnzie wrote:

otter wrote:

if it weren't for the US then Germany would have won the 2nd World War and all our lives would be completely different. If it weren't for the US the Soviet Union would have swept through Europe and all our lives would be completely different

So on one hand you claim that Germany would have won the war without the intervention of the U.S - simply not true - and in the very next sentence you claim that the Soviets would have swept through Europe.

No contradiction there then.

Intervention by the US won the war. Russia beat em back but if not for US Nazis would have continued their domination of West Europe. Once France fell that was it. Italy was done and the Germans were in Africa. That's it Fort Pitt Russia had no interest in saving Europe Stalin had other (ruthless and despicable) plans. Then with the resources of Europe (natural and human) they would have kept up with Hitler's plan.

right no contradiction. First the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia then defeated Russia when they dropped the iron curtain. Historically US protects the rights, freedom, and liberty of all people (if they want it).

There is only one chance of world peace....western civilization.

Byrnzie

otter wrote:

Intervention by the US won the war....the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia then defeated Russia when they dropped the iron curtain.

Absolute nonsense.

9 out of every 10 German soldiers killed in the war were killed on Russian soil. And the Germans had already been beaten back at Moscow before the U.S even joined the war. The tide was already turning in the Russians favour at that point. And Stalingrad was the key battle of WWII.

Seriously, I don't think I've ever heard a more ignorant and arrogant statement as 'the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia'.

otter wrote:

Historically US protects the rights, freedom, and liberty of all people (if they want it).

Tell that to the Chileans, Vietnamese, Guatemalans, Nicaraguans, El Salvadoreans, Panamanians, Iraqi's, Lebanese, and Palestinians.


Seriously, let's just take a couple of examples from the list above. Do you think that overthrowing the democratically elected Chilean leader Salvador Allende and replacing him with a brutal dictator constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Do you think that funding, training, arming, and defending death squads in Guatemala when they were carrying out genocide against the indigenous civilian population constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Guatamalan people?

Just what topsy-turvy World do you inhabit my friend?

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Byrnzie wrote:

otter wrote:

Intervention by the US won the war....the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia then defeated Russia when they dropped the iron curtain.

Absolute nonsense.

9 out of every 10 German soldiers killed in the war were killed on Russian soil. And the Germans had already been beaten back at Moscow before the U.S even joined the war. The tide was already turning in the Russians favour at that point. And Stalingrad was the key battle of WWII.

Seriously, I don't think I've ever heard a more ignorant and arrogant statement as 'the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia'.

otter wrote:

Historically US protects the rights, freedom, and liberty of all people (if they want it).

Tell that to the Chileans, Vietnamese, Guatemalans, Nicaraguans, El Salvadoreans, Panamanians, Iraqi's, Lebanese, and Palestinians.


Seriously, let's just take a couple of examples from the list above. Do you think that overthrowing the democratically elected Chilean leader Salvador Allende and replacing him with a brutal dictator constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Do you think that funding, training, arming, and defending death squads in Guatemala when they were carrying out genocide against the indigenous civilian population constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Just what topsy-turvy World do you inhabit my friend?

I had prepared a response to some of these naive assertions and then just deleted it. I'm glad I did. This post says it well. I guarantee it will be ignored though.

Smellyman

Byrnzie wrote:

otter wrote:

Intervention by the US won the war....the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia then defeated Russia when they dropped the iron curtain.

Absolute nonsense.

9 out of every 10 German soldiers killed in the war were killed on Russian soil. And the Germans had already been beaten back at Moscow before the U.S even joined the war. The tide was already turning in the Russians favour at that point. And Stalingrad was the key battle of WWII.

Seriously, I don't think I've ever heard a more ignorant and arrogant statement as 'the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia'.

otter wrote:

Historically US protects the rights, freedom, and liberty of all people (if they want it).

Tell that to the Chileans, Vietnamese, Guatemalans, Nicaraguans, El Salvadoreans, Panamanians, Iraqi's, Lebanese, and Palestinians.


Seriously, let's just take a couple of examples from the list above. Do you think that overthrowing the democratically elected Chilean leader Salvador Allende and replacing him with a brutal dictator constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Do you think that funding, training, arming, and defending death squads in Guatemala when they were carrying out genocide against the indigenous civilian population constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Just what topsy-turvy World do you inhabit my friend?

You have to forgive us. We are brought up being taught that we are the best and the shining light of the world. Saving all because of our huge heart...... looking after the downtrodden. (ecxept our own)

We grow up singing the national anthem at school, sporting events, reciting the "pledge of allegiance" to the flag under god...... as children.

Some can get over that propaganda and indoctrination and others can't. Throw in Some religious zealotry of it being the US' divine right it and gets even more creepy.

badbrains

Byrnzie wrote:

otter wrote:

Intervention by the US won the war....the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia then defeated Russia when they dropped the iron curtain.

Absolute nonsense.

9 out of every 10 German soldiers killed in the war were killed on Russian soil. And the Germans had already been beaten back at Moscow before the U.S even joined the war. The tide was already turning in the Russians favour at that point. And Stalingrad was the key battle of WWII.

Seriously, I don't think I've ever heard a more ignorant and arrogant statement as 'the US defeated the Germans with the help of Russia'.

otter wrote:

Historically US protects the rights, freedom, and liberty of all people (if they want it).

Tell that to the Chileans, Vietnamese, Guatemalans, Nicaraguans, El Salvadoreans, Panamanians, Iraqi's, Lebanese, and Palestinians.


Seriously, let's just take a couple of examples from the list above. Do you think that overthrowing the democratically elected Chilean leader Salvador Allende and replacing him with a brutal dictator constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Chilean people?

Do you think that funding, training, arming, and defending death squads in Guatemala when they were carrying out genocide against the indigenous civilian population constituted protecting 'the rights, freedom, and liberty' of the Guatamalan people?

Just what topsy-turvy World do you inhabit my friend?

I'm so fucken glad steve takes the time out to respond with facts. People need to know the truth and I applaud you buddy. Sad thing is these blind sheep will continue with there "rah rah rah." I'm sorry but if your country or ANY country, has been in some kind of war for 215 years out of 236 years of exsistance, then you're doing something wrong. That's 22 years of peace out of 236 years of exsisting. Think about it.

badbrains

Smellyman wrote:

You have to forgive us. We are brought up being taught that we are the best and the shining light of the world. Saving all because of our huge heart...... looking after the downtrodden. (ecxept our own)

We grow up singing the national anthem at school, sporting events, reciting the "pledge of allegiance" to the flag under god...... as children.

Some can get over that propaganda and indoctrination and others can't. Throw in Some religious zealotry of it being the US' divine right it and gets even more creepy.

Wow, this post was great. Lived it and thankfully woke up from it.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

badbrains wrote:

Smellyman wrote:

You have to forgive us. We are brought up being taught that we are the best and the shining light of the world. Saving all because of our huge heart...... looking after the downtrodden. (ecxept our own)

We grow up singing the national anthem at school, sporting events, reciting the "pledge of allegiance" to the flag under god...... as children.

Some can get over that propaganda and indoctrination and others can't. Throw in Some religious zealotry of it being the US' divine right it and gets even more creepy.

Wow, this post was great. Lived it and thankfully woke up from it.

It truly is. I compare such closed minds to those of people immersed in a cult: when they are in- they are 'all in'. They truly cannot see the bigger picture, nor do they care to look. A fully indoctrinated belief set or good, solid, brainwashing if you prefer. For those that wake up: they have an entirely different perpsective.

Critical thinking is the number one skill we seek to teach our students to prepare them for the responsibilities they will face as adults. We need critical thinkers now more than ever when you consider the way the world has evolved and the challenges we face as a global society in the coming years.

Just victims of the in-house drive-by. They say jump, you say how high.

JimmyV

Smellyman wrote:

You have to forgive us. We are brought up being taught that we are the best and the shining light of the world. Saving all because of our huge heart...... looking after the downtrodden. (ecxept our own)

We grow up singing the national anthem at school, sporting events, reciting the "pledge of allegiance" to the flag under god...... as children.

Some can get over that propaganda and indoctrination and others can't. Throw in Some religious zealotry of it being the US' divine right it and gets even more creepy.

I think we save a hell of a lot more than this post indicates. We are far from perfect as a nation but we are better than many. And there is no harm in pledging allegiance or singing the national anthem as a child in this country because when you become an adult you are free to stop anytime you like. To say that children are indoctrinated and that many cannot break out of it is a bit of a stretch.

JonnyPistachio

otter wrote:

There is only one chance of world peace....western civilization.

:?

otter

JonnyPistachio wrote:

otter wrote:

There is only one chance of world peace....western civilization.

:?

What other chance is there for world peace? The only way I can think of is if the Arab people are exposed to western civilization. If they were they would surely embrace it because it is their leaders who isolate the people. The Arabs are people just like us; they don't want to kill us. But if they only know what they are told by the extreme leaders that is all they know.

Western Civ is better than Sharia Law right? Imagine...Egypt is about to be a Sharia nation. That is so freaking scary. Well at least for the women and those who believe in a different profit.

Byrnzie

otter wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

otter wrote:

There is only one chance of world peace....western civilization.

:?

What other chance is there for world peace? The only way I can think of is if the Arab people are exposed to western civilization.

Nice job of managing to completely fail to address any of the points raised on the previous page.

At the risk of failing to mention many similar such examples; Western civilization gave us genocide in the America's, genocide in Australia, the slave trade, the exploitation and butchery that took place in Africa and India, WWI, WWII (including the Jewish Holocaust, and the Ukrainian famine), Vietnam (which saw an estimated 2 million Vietnamese killed), a decade of U.S-backed slaughter in Latin America, Vietnam, Iraq (both the first Iraq War, ten years of devastating sanctions that resulted in approx half a million children dying, and the second Iraq War, which saw over 1 million dead Iraqi's and between 4-5 million refugees), e.t.c, e.t.c.
Oh, and Western 'Civilization' has also managed to successfully bring the Earths environment to the point of complete destruction (our plundering of the planets resources has now reached critical proportions).


Yep, definitely an example to be envious of. I bet those ignorant, pesky A-rabs would really love nothing better than to be just like 'us'.

Byrnzie

otter wrote:

What other chance is there for world peace? The only way I can think of is if the Arab people are exposed to western civilization.

Personally, I'd prefer for all peoples to be better exposed to the beliefs and teachings of indigenous populations, such as the original inhabitants of Australia and the America's.

(Not quite sure where all the hostility towards Arabs has been coming from lately on this message board. But then I suppose there are people who will always need an enemy, even if it means inventing one).


And one more thing, the West's overabundance of material wealth simply wouldn't exist if it weren't for it's exploitation of the 'Third World', through a well-documented process of economic imperialism, the backing of Western-friendly dictators, and outright aggression.

otter

It is freezing where I am no global warming here. Why aren't you overjoyed that the "scientists" who scared you were proved to be lying? I don't understand why global warming believers refuse to acknowledge the news that says the planted is okay. It is impossible to "plunder" the worlds resources. The amount of oil, coal, and gas in this big blue marble is unfathomable, we have only scratched the surface of oil. All that using oil does is transfer carbon, it's no big deal dude. This will make you nuts I'm sure but I'll write it anyway...I think the Earth makes oil from within. My theory is just as plausible as any that you believe. Think about it...plate tectonics moves the stuff on the surface to the inside of the planet. I think all this carbon on the surface gets cooked by the hot interior and produces gas, coal, and oil. So it is impossible to use it all up.

Your characterization of Western Civ is tired and boring. How about right now? You whine about wealth distribution being unfair; it is incomprehensible to us because our poorest have more than 50% of the people in the Arab nations. And "war on women"? There is a true war on women in the Mid-East.

And why do you write A-rab? Is that some racist way of pronouncing Arab?

You lefty libs are the most racist, bulling, unfair, uncaring people around. Why do you hate the country you live in? That's wacked!

JonnyPistachio

otter wrote:

It is freezing where I am no global warming here. Why aren't you overjoyed that the "scientists" who scared you were proved to be lying? I don't understand why global warming believers refuse to acknowledge the news that says the planted is okay. It is impossible to "plunder" the worlds resources. The amount of oil, coal, and gas in this big blue marble is unfathomable, we have only scratched the surface of oil. All that using oil does is transfer carbon, it's no big deal dude. This will make you nuts I'm sure but I'll write it anyway...I think the Earth makes oil from within. My theory is just as plausible as any that you believe. Think about it...plate tectonics moves the stuff on the surface to the inside of the planet. I think all this carbon on the surface gets cooked by the hot interior and produces gas, coal, and oil. So it is impossible to use it all up.

Your characterization of Western Civ is tired and boring. How about right now? You whine about wealth distribution being unfair; it is incomprehensible to us because our poorest have more than 50% of the people in the Arab nations. And "war on women"? There is a true war on women in the Mid-East.

And why do you write A-rab? Is that some racist way of pronouncing Arab?

You lefty libs are the most racist, bulling, unfair, uncaring people around. Why do you hate the country you live in? That's wacked!

another gem!
I love the country I live in. I respect it. But I dont want to force it all over the world. What we've done in some places is a travesty. We should pull our tail between our legs and hide under the sheets after the lies and ridiculous amounts of money spent on Iraq in the last decade.

And I will NEVER take anyone seriously who says its impossible to plunder our worlds resources. :roll: :? That's possibly the most ridiculous thing I've ever read on this site.

otter

JonnyPistachio wrote:

otter wrote:

It is freezing where I am no global warming here. Why aren't you overjoyed that the "scientists" who scared you were proved to be lying? I don't understand why global warming believers refuse to acknowledge the news that says the planted is okay. It is impossible to "plunder" the worlds resources. The amount of oil, coal, and gas in this big blue marble is unfathomable, we have only scratched the surface of oil. All that using oil does is transfer carbon, it's no big deal dude. This will make you nuts I'm sure but I'll write it anyway...I think the Earth makes oil from within. My theory is just as plausible as any that you believe. Think about it...plate tectonics moves the stuff on the surface to the inside of the planet. I think all this carbon on the surface gets cooked by the hot interior and produces gas, coal, and oil. So it is impossible to use it all up.

Your characterization of Western Civ is tired and boring. How about right now? You whine about wealth distribution being unfair; it is incomprehensible to us because our poorest have more than 50% of the people in the Arab nations. And "war on women"? There is a true war on women in the Mid-East.

And why do you write A-rab? Is that some racist way of pronouncing Arab?

You lefty libs are the most racist, bulling, unfair, uncaring people around. Why do you hate the country you live in? That's wacked!

another gem!
I love the country I live in. I respect it. But I dont want to force it all over the world. What we've done in some places is a travesty. We should pull our tail between our legs and hide under the sheets after the lies and ridiculous amounts of money spent on Iraq in the last decade.

And I will NEVER take anyone seriously who says its impossible to plunder our worlds resources. :roll: :? That's possibly the most ridiculous thing I've ever read on this site.

What makes you think that there is any less oil now than there was 100 years ago? Because it is being used? Nobody knows where it comes from it's all speculation.

I don't want to force it either but don't you think opressed people would choose it? I do.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

otter wrote:

It is freezing where I am no global warming here. Why aren't you overjoyed that the "scientists" who scared you were proved to be lying? I don't understand why global warming believers refuse to acknowledge the news that says the planted is okay. It is impossible to "plunder" the worlds resources. The amount of oil, coal, and gas in this big blue marble is unfathomable, we have only scratched the surface of oil. All that using oil does is transfer carbon, it's no big deal dude. This will make you nuts I'm sure but I'll write it anyway...I think the Earth makes oil from within. My theory is just as plausible as any that you believe. Think about it...plate tectonics moves the stuff on the surface to the inside of the planet. I think all this carbon on the surface gets cooked by the hot interior and produces gas, coal, and oil. So it is impossible to use it all up.

Your characterization of Western Civ is tired and boring. How about right now? You whine about wealth distribution being unfair; it is incomprehensible to us because our poorest have more than 50% of the people in the Arab nations. And "war on women"? There is a true war on women in the Mid-East.

And why do you write A-rab? Is that some racist way of pronouncing Arab?

You lefty libs are the most racist, bulling, unfair, uncaring people around. Why do you hate the country you live in? That's wacked!

climate change is a myth? interesting. the earth makes oil? interesting. are you a scientist?