Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

pandora

ComeToTX wrote:

pandora wrote:

ComeToTX wrote:

if he shot me and i lived i might be able to forgive me. if he shot my young child an she died there's no way i could.

He is not competent, he is not responsible, he is not in his competent mind

if this proves to be the case

how could you blame him?

How would never coming to terms with the loss of your daughter
ever help her, her siblings, her grandparents, her mother or you ?

Would this be what your daughter would want for you and your family?
She knows she will see you again.

Do you think anybody ever comes to terms with the violent loss of their child? I don't. Whether I had empathy or not it would never help me come to terms with my innocent little girl being shot full of holes while watching a movie.

I think yes forgiving is a form of closure for some people.

comebackgirl

pandora wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Didn't 3 people subdue Loughner after the Giffords shooting without the use of a gun? It seems as though it is possible to protect oneself and fight back without the use of a firearm. Indeed people do it every day. Not owning a gun does not equate to resigning oneself to victimhood.

Saying "guns protect" vs. "guns kill" is just semantics. Ultimately the end result is the same - the gun is either being used to kill or injure or to threaten to kill or injure, unless you're using it to deflect bullets, in which case Wonder Woman's bracelets are a much cuter look.

I love her don't you?

Guns protect they are saving lives as we speak.

just saw this on TV...

89-Year Old Woman Saved By Owning A Gun...

Malboro County, SC (WPDE/CNN) - Two men reportedly broke into a great-grandmother's South Carolina home, and the elderly woman made sure the thieves didn't steal a thing.

"I sleep with my pistol," said 89-year-old Ruby Hodge.

That's what she says saved her from would-be burglars Monday morning.

"About 8 o'clock I hadn't got up out of bed and I heard somebody knocking on my door which I did not answer the knock then," she said.

Before she could even get out of bed, two men broke in Ruby's back door and made their way inside.

"Then I heard a loud noise and I said it was somebody broken in my door," she said.

At this point, the great-grandmother says she knew what she had to do.

"And I got my pistol and I met them right outside of my bedroom. Right inside of my bedroom door, two black men passed and they were two medium black men and they were dressed in black and when they saw me standing in there with my pistol, they left and run," said Ruby.

She pressed her emergency alert button that she wears around her neck. It alerted 911 dispatchers, who sent deputies to her house within five minutes. Ruby's daughter and niece got there a few minutes later.

"She has always said that she had a gun and if it came she would shoot," said her daughter, Helen Caison.

"My aunt will be 90-yearsold in October and she held her own. And when the people were breaking in and they saw her, she had hit the lifeline button and also had her pistol turned on them they turned around and high-tailed it out of here. I'm so proud of her," said Rebecca McArthur.

Ruby says she's worked hard all her life and should be able to live in peace in her home.

Just in case something threatens that, she's got her piece nearby.

Police say they've tracked down the two men suspected of breaking into Hodge's home.

Both face burglary and damage to property charges.

WPDE/CNN

She's AWESOME!

I adore her and have since I was 3 years old. I had the underoos and all!

I'm glad the woman is safe. Hopefully she'll never have to face anything like that again.

I'm reading a book (true story) about a woman who adopts a blind kitten. One night the woman awakens to find a man has broken into her apartment and is standing at the foot of her bed. She was awoken by her cat (who has never been anything but loving and affectionate) growling and snarling, who then launches himself full force from the foot of the bed, lashing at the man's face and chasing him from the apartment. Go kitty That's the route I'm going.

I've gone to school, worked and done internships in Camden, NJ. It's been ranked one of the top 5 most dangerous cities for as long as I can remember, often claiming the number one spot. When I did rape crisis counseling I would drive to the hospitals in the middle of the night if there was a SART call. Somehow I've managed to protect myself sans gun for all these years. All 5'1" of me. Some people may feel safer with a gun, but I would argue it's not necessary for protection. If anything, it might give a false sense of safety.

ComeToTX

They kill a lot more people every day then they save. You would need 8,000 stories like that each year to make up for the gun murders we have.

pandora

hedonist wrote:

pandora wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Sounds like I should defer to your judgment...but I won't. What I said was in response to your post, and I stand by it.

I hope someday an understanding comes that will allow you to forgive when someone is ill
and not a fuck.

hedonist wrote:

Good for whomever has the capacity to feel empathy for a sick fucker, and the ability to forgive them.

Doesn't mean everyone can or should (and I'm amazed that anyone could be so arrogant to say as much); also doesn't mean that those withholding "empathy" for someone like this piece of shit are heartless if they choose to place their compassion elsewhere.

The thing is...
there is plenty of compassion to go around, we were built with an endless commodity.

Pandora, you don't really know me, or my capacity to understand / forgive, or my choice not to. Nor what I HAVE forgiven, and chosen not to.

I'm at peace with my heart...with my choices.

And I'll leave it at this: It's a sweet summer morning here and I'm reveling in the abundance of goodness around me. Not looking to argue and I figure you're not either. There are times I disagree with your views and methods of communicating them, but I do appreciate the good intentions behind them.

I was responding to your post revealing you would not attempt to understand
this man or the mental illness that caused this man to do what he did,
if in fact they find him to be ill. Commenting on what you shared for us to know.

It is true though, we do not agree,
I have compassion for those who are victims of mental illness, I feel they should be forgiven,
because they really know not what they do ... literally.


Another psychologist on CNN today very informative, shares my belief as well.
He has an extreme case of a thought disorder, such as schizophrenia.

pandora

ComeToTX wrote:

They kill a lot more people every day then they save. You would need 8,000 stories like that each year to make up for the gun murders we have.

You don't get it, granny would be a statistic... how about if that was your grandmother?

Ridiculous that you think she should not have a gun to protect herself if she so chooses.
How is that your right to make that her reality.
That she should be beaten, robbed and victimized ....
cause you don't like guns :wtf:

pandora

comebackgirl wrote:

pandora wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Didn't 3 people subdue Loughner after the Giffords shooting without the use of a gun? It seems as though it is possible to protect oneself and fight back without the use of a firearm. Indeed people do it every day. Not owning a gun does not equate to resigning oneself to victimhood.

Saying "guns protect" vs. "guns kill" is just semantics. Ultimately the end result is the same - the gun is either being used to kill or injure or to threaten to kill or injure, unless you're using it to deflect bullets, in which case Wonder Woman's bracelets are a much cuter look.

I love her don't you?

Guns protect they are saving lives as we speak.

just saw this on TV...

89-Year Old Woman Saved By Owning A Gun...

Malboro County, SC (WPDE/CNN) - Two men reportedly broke into a great-grandmother's South Carolina home, and the elderly woman made sure the thieves didn't steal a thing.

"I sleep with my pistol," said 89-year-old Ruby Hodge.

That's what she says saved her from would-be burglars Monday morning.

"About 8 o'clock I hadn't got up out of bed and I heard somebody knocking on my door which I did not answer the knock then," she said.

Before she could even get out of bed, two men broke in Ruby's back door and made their way inside.

"Then I heard a loud noise and I said it was somebody broken in my door," she said.

At this point, the great-grandmother says she knew what she had to do.

"And I got my pistol and I met them right outside of my bedroom. Right inside of my bedroom door, two black men passed and they were two medium black men and they were dressed in black and when they saw me standing in there with my pistol, they left and run," said Ruby.

She pressed her emergency alert button that she wears around her neck. It alerted 911 dispatchers, who sent deputies to her house within five minutes. Ruby's daughter and niece got there a few minutes later.

"She has always said that she had a gun and if it came she would shoot," said her daughter, Helen Caison.

"My aunt will be 90-yearsold in October and she held her own. And when the people were breaking in and they saw her, she had hit the lifeline button and also had her pistol turned on them they turned around and high-tailed it out of here. I'm so proud of her," said Rebecca McArthur.

Ruby says she's worked hard all her life and should be able to live in peace in her home.

Just in case something threatens that, she's got her piece nearby.

Police say they've tracked down the two men suspected of breaking into Hodge's home.

Both face burglary and damage to property charges.

WPDE/CNN

She's AWESOME!

I adore her and have since I was 3 years old. I had the underoos and all!

I'm glad the woman is safe. Hopefully she'll never have to face anything like that again.

I'm reading a book (true story) about a woman who adopts a blind kitten. One night the woman awakens to find a man has broken into her apartment and is standing at the foot of her bed. She was awoken by her cat (who has never been anything but loving and affectionate) growling and snarling, who then launches himself full force from the foot of the bed, lashing at the man's face and chasing him from the apartment. Go kitty That's the route I'm going.

I've gone to school, worked and done internships in Camden, NJ. It's been ranked one of the top 5 most dangerous cities for as long as I can remember, often claiming the number one spot. When I did rape crisis counseling I would drive to the hospitals in the middle of the night if there was a SART call. Somehow I've managed to protect myself sans gun for all these years. All 5'1" of me. Some people may feel safer with a gun, but I would argue it's not necessary for protection. If anything, it might give a false sense of safety.

Even a false sense is better than no sense.
Really comes down to whether you are willing to be a victim or not.
Granny is not and it was a good thing she wasn't....
alot can happen in a 5 minute cop response time, those little old bones snap easy.

I have dogs but wouldn't rely on them saving me, perhaps alerting.

I know most every bad guy out there has a gun and my precious pups would be the first
shot.

unsung

josevolution wrote:

unsung wrote:

Police do not prevent crimes; police respond to crimes.

Police presence does , just saying ...

Is that what you want, a military state? Police on every corner asking random people where they are going, what they are doing and with who? Cameras everywhere? Random searches?

ComeToTX

pandora wrote:

ComeToTX wrote:

They kill a lot more people every day then they save. You would need 8,000 stories like that each year to make up for the gun murders we have.

You don't get it, granny would be a statistic... how about if that was your grandmother?

Ridiculous that you think she should not have a gun to protect herself if she so chooses.
How is that your right to make that her reality.
That she should be beaten, robbed and victimized ....
cause you don't like guns :wtf:

I was just stating facts. I'm fine with her having a gun. Never said I wasn't.

Since you brought her up my grandma was almost killed by a gun. Twenty years ago. Her drunk neighbor was having fun shooting his gun into the air and one of the bullets went through my grandparents bedroom window and ended up in the wall about 3 feet from where she was standing.

pandora

ComeToTX wrote:

pandora wrote:

ComeToTX wrote:

They kill a lot more people every day then they save. You would need 8,000 stories like that each year to make up for the gun murders we have.

You don't get it, granny would be a statistic... how about if that was your grandmother?

Ridiculous that you think she should not have a gun to protect herself if she so chooses.
How is that your right to make that her reality.
That she should be beaten, robbed and victimized ....
cause you don't like guns :wtf:

I was just stating facts. I'm fine with her having a gun. Never said I wasn't.

Facts? Good lord ...

the fact is she needed a gun she wanted a gun and a gun saved her life.


But gun opponents hate to admit that.

This fact is happening all over and will continue to because people are sick of being victims
and realize fighting back is taking back

taking back a law abiding life and that is saving lives.

norm

ComeToTX wrote:

Since you brought her up my grandma was almost killed by a gun. Twenty years ago. Her drunk neighbor was having fun shooting his gun into the air and one of the bullets went through my grandparents bedroom window and ended up in the wall about 3 feet from where she was standing.

that happen to my grandma too...jackass drunk next door fired one off through his window and hit the wall of her house...right where she was sitting...she heard it hit the wall but it didn't go through

so yeah, responsible gun ownership...woo hoo!

pandora

ComeToTX wrote:

pandora wrote:

ComeToTX wrote:

They kill a lot more people every day then they save. You would need 8,000 stories like that each year to make up for the gun murders we have.

You don't get it, granny would be a statistic... how about if that was your grandmother?

Ridiculous that you think she should not have a gun to protect herself if she so chooses.
How is that your right to make that her reality.
That she should be beaten, robbed and victimized ....
cause you don't like guns :wtf:

I was just stating facts. I'm fine with her having a gun. Never said I wasn't.

Since you brought her up my grandma was almost killed by a gun. Twenty years ago. Her drunk neighbor was having fun shooting his gun into the air and one of the bullets went through my grandparents bedroom window and ended up in the wall about 3 feet from where she was standing.

I think that is an irresponsible gun owner who hopefully went to prison ...
yes?
can not punish thoughtful people because of thoughtless

ComeToTX

People buy guns to protect themselves from people with guns. Do I have that right? But we don't need stricter gun laws? As long as it's as easy or easier for the bad guys to get the guns I will maintain we need stronger gun control.

comebackgirl

pandora wrote:

Even a false sense is better than no sense.
Really comes down to whether you are willing to be a victim or not.
Granny is not and it was a good thing she wasn't....
alot can happen in a 5 minute cop response time, those little old bones snap easy.

I have dogs but wouldn't rely on them saving me, perhaps alerting.

I know most every bad guy out there has a gun and my precious pups would be the first
shot.

I think an accurate sense of safety is best. I think the reason I've been able to stay safe in such a dangerous city for all of those years is because I'm realistic about my vulnerability and take precautions as a result. Not having a gun doesn't mean you're willing to be a victim. Hell, being victimized doesn't mean you're willing to be a victim. That responsibility lies solely with the perp. I see no place for victim blaming.

ahhh...maybe you should get a cat instead

comebackgirl

pandora wrote:

Another psychologist on CNN today very informative, shares my belief as well.
He has an extreme case of a thought disorder, such as schizophrenia.

Yeah I'm really interested in hearing more about his current mental status and his mental health history. It seems he was engaged with the university counseling center in some capacity, but it's not clear to what extent. His lawyers are claiming his mailed journal is a privileged communication, but it's not clear if he was engaged in treatment with the psychiatrist or had some other type of interaction with her. University psychiatrists are called in to consult in a variety of situations, which is different from a lot of other treatment settings. I'm interested to hear more about the extent to which he was involved with them. If the reports I'm hearing are accurate and genuine it sounds very much like a dissociative episode of some sort. There were a lot of reports of childlike behavior - the police stating he was using evidence bags as puppets, the prison guards claiming he was complaining his "tummy hurt" from the prison food, asking how the movie ended, expressing confusion as to why he was in jail. The reports that he seemed confused upon his arrest and didn't flee when the police arrived almost sound like a "coming to" of some sort. His demeanor in court (if genuine) seemed more confused and childlike, in comparison to Loughner's crazed expression. There have also been conflicting reports of his intelligence. His science camp mentor called him a "mediocre student" and another neuroscientist called him a "dolt", meanwhile others were saying he's the "top of the top." It seems odd that he would shoot a theatre full of people and rig his apartment, but then tell police about the explosives. There are reports of him being shy and quiet, and then other reports of him posting on sex sites and rating prostitutes. The pictures on the sex sites show him appearing starkly different with the red hair and creepy expression, as opposed to his college photos where he looks pretty straight laced. Someone pointed out (I think earlier on this thread) how different he looked in one photo from the other. Those major inconsistencies often point to a dissociative disorder, which could present alone of in conjunction with psychosis. People with DID are often misdiagnosed because they "hear voices," but it's different than the auditory hallucinations that occur with psychotic disorders, so antipsychotics and typical treatments aren't usually effective. People who have had very early histories of extreme trauma often develop these disorders. Obviously I haven't assessed him and I don't know nearly enough about him or his history to come to any conclusions about him, but I'm really interested to hear more.

redrock

comebackgirl wrote:

Go kitty That's the route I'm going.

I've got six.. I'm cool.

comebackgirl

redrock wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Go kitty That's the route I'm going.

I've got six.. I'm cool.

Only a fool would break into your house My cat has hurled herself against the front door from the couch if someone approaches that she doesn't like :shock: No one is getting inside :P

redrock

comebackgirl wrote:

redrock wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Go kitty That's the route I'm going.

I've got six.. I'm cool.

Only a fool would break into your house My cat has hurled herself against the front door from the couch if someone approaches that she doesn't like :shock: No one is getting inside :P

Mine can gang up (well... five of them). Good thing they don't have opposable thumbs and access to mini guns!

But back to subject - good and informative recap post combackgirl (and your other post in the other thread). Another 'proof' that we need to wait and see and not present opinions as facts before these are fully known.

comebackgirl

pandora wrote:

just saw this on TV...

89-Year Old Woman Saved By Owning A Gun...

Malboro County, SC (WPDE/CNN) - Two men reportedly broke into a great-grandmother's South Carolina home, and the elderly woman made sure the thieves didn't steal a thing.

"I sleep with my pistol," said 89-year-old Ruby Hodge.

That's what she says saved her from would-be burglars Monday morning.

"About 8 o'clock I hadn't got up out of bed and I heard somebody knocking on my door which I did not answer the knock then," she said.

Before she could even get out of bed, two men broke in Ruby's back door and made their way inside.

"Then I heard a loud noise and I said it was somebody broken in my door," she said.

At this point, the great-grandmother says she knew what she had to do.

"And I got my pistol and I met them right outside of my bedroom. Right inside of my bedroom door, two black men passed and they were two medium black men and they were dressed in black and when they saw me standing in there with my pistol, they left and run," said Ruby.

She pressed her emergency alert button that she wears around her neck. It alerted 911 dispatchers, who sent deputies to her house within five minutes. Ruby's daughter and niece got there a few minutes later.

"She has always said that she had a gun and if it came she would shoot," said her daughter, Helen Caison.

"My aunt will be 90-yearsold in October and she held her own. And when the people were breaking in and they saw her, she had hit the lifeline button and also had her pistol turned on them they turned around and high-tailed it out of here. I'm so proud of her," said Rebecca McArthur.

Ruby says she's worked hard all her life and should be able to live in peace in her home.

Just in case something threatens that, she's got her piece nearby.

Police say they've tracked down the two men suspected of breaking into Hodge's home.

Both face burglary and damage to property charges.

WPDE/CNN

She's AWESOME!

It's interesting that they mention the race of the 2 men, but not that of Ruby. Also, there's no mention if they might perhaps be mentally ill. :think:

Media bias at its finest.

mickeyrat

comebackgirl wrote:

pandora wrote:

just saw this on TV...

89-Year Old Woman Saved By Owning A Gun...

Malboro County, SC (WPDE/CNN) - Two men reportedly broke into a great-grandmother's South Carolina home, and the elderly woman made sure the thieves didn't steal a thing.

"I sleep with my pistol," said 89-year-old Ruby Hodge.

That's what she says saved her from would-be burglars Monday morning.

"About 8 o'clock I hadn't got up out of bed and I heard somebody knocking on my door which I did not answer the knock then," she said.

Before she could even get out of bed, two men broke in Ruby's back door and made their way inside.

"Then I heard a loud noise and I said it was somebody broken in my door," she said.

At this point, the great-grandmother says she knew what she had to do.

"And I got my pistol and I met them right outside of my bedroom. Right inside of my bedroom door, two black men passed and they were two medium black men and they were dressed in black and when they saw me standing in there with my pistol, they left and run," said Ruby.

She pressed her emergency alert button that she wears around her neck. It alerted 911 dispatchers, who sent deputies to her house within five minutes. Ruby's daughter and niece got there a few minutes later.

"She has always said that she had a gun and if it came she would shoot," said her daughter, Helen Caison.

"My aunt will be 90-yearsold in October and she held her own. And when the people were breaking in and they saw her, she had hit the lifeline button and also had her pistol turned on them they turned around and high-tailed it out of here. I'm so proud of her," said Rebecca McArthur.

Ruby says she's worked hard all her life and should be able to live in peace in her home.

Just in case something threatens that, she's got her piece nearby.

Police say they've tracked down the two men suspected of breaking into Hodge's home.

Both face burglary and damage to property charges.

WPDE/CNN

She's AWESOME!

It's interesting that they mention the race of the 2 men, but not that of Ruby. Also, there's no mention if they might perhaps be mentally ill. :think:

Media bias at its finest.

hmm, bad guys with NO guns? I thought ALL the bad guys had guns. My worldview is crushed.

hedonist

pandora wrote:

I was responding to your post revealing you would not attempt to understand
this man or the mental illness that caused this man to do what he did,
if in fact they find him to be ill. Commenting on what you shared for us to know.

It is true though, we do not agree,
I have compassion for those who are victims of mental illness, I feel they should be forgiven,
because they really know not what they do ... literally.


Another psychologist on CNN today very informative, shares my belief as well.
He has an extreme case of a thought disorder, such as schizophrenia.

Why "revealing" was italicized, I don't know. And how you surmised a lack of compassion on my part...

OK.

Good on ya for being the bigger, forgiving person.