Trayvon Martin

Godfather.

peacefrompaul wrote:

AllNiteThing wrote:

goingtoverona wrote:

dude, i agree 100 percent, so please blame the fuckhead that made the choices and not the gun.

You gun nuts are really living on another planet. I swear some of you have unhealthy fantasies about your 'piece'. :roll:

Yeah so what? I like shooting my guns on a perfectly safe range. It's my right.

Someone pulled the trigger.

straight up truth bro !

Godfather.

Godfather.

back to the topic:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/opinion/b ... ?hpt=ju_c1

Depending on the facts that ultimately emerge, the "stand your ground" law may ultimately control the legal outcome of the Trayvon Martin case. If, as a result, Florida's citizens and legislators (and those in other states) see that law in a new light, they can change the law, perhaps leading to fewer tragic outcomes in the future.



Godfather.

Cliffy6745

The more I think about this, the worse it fucking is. This kid was followed while doing nothing wrong, confronted, probably defended himself and then was fucking shot to death, all because he was black and walking down the street at night. A 17 year old good student dead because he was black and some fuck face had a hard on and a gun.

Edit: And there is no way that big fuck had to use a gun against a scrawny unarmed 17 year old. This fuck is going to rot in jail and it's going to be awesome.

keeponrockin

The kid was hunted down.

goingtoverona

the stand the ground law is solid in my opinion, if some buttcrack is trying to hurt you, you should be allowed to "stand your ground" and defend yourself. the problem here is that zimmerman chased trayvon down, which there is even proof of on the 911 tapes. you can't harrass a person, chase them down, terrorize them and then kill them if they defend themselves against the assault taking place on them. this is like beating the shit out of a dog into a corner, the dog biting, then killing the dog with the excuse of, well i had to kill it, it bit me.

Godfather. wrote:

back to the topic:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/opinion/b ... ?hpt=ju_c1

Depending on the facts that ultimately emerge, the "stand your ground" law may ultimately control the legal outcome of the Trayvon Martin case. If, as a result, Florida's citizens and legislators (and those in other states) see that law in a new light, they can change the law, perhaps leading to fewer tragic outcomes in the future.



Godfather.

Idris

goingtoverona wrote:

the stand the ground law is solid in my opinion, if some buttcrack is trying to hurt you, you should be allowed to "stand your ground" and defend yourself. the problem here is that zimmerman chased trayvon down, which there is even proof of on the 911 tapes. you can't harrass a person, chase them down, terrorize them and then kill them if they defend themselves against the assault taking place on them. this is like beating the shit out of a dog into a corner, the dog biting, then killing the dog with the excuse of, well i had to kill it, it bit me.

I agree.

cincybearcat

Cliffy6745 wrote:

The more I think about this, the worse it fucking is. This kid was followed while doing nothing wrong, confronted, probably defended himself and then was fucking shot to death, all because he was black and walking down the street at night. A 17 year old good student dead because he was black and some fuck face had a hard on and a gun.

Edit: And there is no way that big fuck had to use a gun against a scrawny unarmed 17 year old. This fuck is going to rot in jail and it's going to be awesome.

I agree with everything you said, except I'm not 100% sure it was because the kid was black. May have been, but also may not have mattered.

Something seriously wrong with that guy.

goingtoverona

not sure if this was posted or talked about, not in the mood to reread10 pages, but there is a petition on change.org that you can sign. just signed myself, there is almost 900,000 signatures, if you're into that sort of thing.

peacefrompaul

goingtoverona wrote:

not sure if this was posted or talked about, not in the mood to reread10 pages, but there is a petition on change.org that you can sign. just signed myself, there is almost 900,000 signatures, if you're into that sort of thing.

http://www.change.org/petitions/prosecu ... von-martin

I signed it a while ago.

Godfather.

goingtoverona wrote:

the stand the ground law is solid in my opinion, if some buttcrack is trying to hurt you, you should be allowed to "stand your ground" and defend yourself. the problem here is that zimmerman chased trayvon down, which there is even proof of on the 911 tapes. you can't harrass a person, chase them down, terrorize them and then kill them if they defend themselves against the assault taking place on them. this is like beating the shit out of a dog into a corner, the dog biting, then killing the dog with the excuse of, well i had to kill it, it bit me.

Godfather. wrote:

back to the topic:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/opinion/b ... ?hpt=ju_c1

Depending on the facts that ultimately emerge, the "stand your ground" law may ultimately control the legal outcome of the Trayvon Martin case. If, as a result, Florida's citizens and legislators (and those in other states) see that law in a new light, they can change the law, perhaps leading to fewer tragic outcomes in the future.



Godfather.

if this guy walks there is a serious problem with the courts in Fl. (or the 12 jury members)
do they use the death penalty in Fl. ? seems fitting.


Godfather.

haffajappa

This case is pretty disturbing.
My first thoughts after seeing Zimmerman's picture is that he looks like a BIG guy, and Trayvon looks pretty tiny. Self defense? REALLY?

I just listened to the 911 call.. i'm in agreement with those saying he chased the poor kid down. I just don't understand why this wouldn't be an automatic investigation... If it didn't get the media coverage it did, would they have done anything about it? It feels bizarre. I mean, shit happens up here too, but sometimes I am really surprised at some of the things that go on in the states :shock:

On another note, the dispatcher asked "white black or hispanic"... So glad I'll never get caught in FL there's no asian option. (I don't know why that question struck me as odd)

MotoDC

haffajappa wrote:

On another note, the dispatcher asked "white black or hispanic"... So glad I'll never get caught in FL there's no asian option. (I don't know why that question struck me as odd)

What's the point of asking? Too busy makin' that money to bother with crime:
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/ ... 2s0697.pdf

pandora

just saw this on the news ... the petition on the web 750,000 sigs I think it said
for justice.

I don't get why the guy is not in jail yet...
at least that is what the 5pm news said.

A young life gone, parents broken, a neighborhood in conflict
why again?
cause the shooter presumed he was a bad kid, bad enough to kill :?

the article said he called the cops how many times 46...
in a little over a year ... red flag... was the neighborhood that bad?
He might be mentally ill or paranoid.

Edit....
Just heard this am on the Today show that it 46 times since 2004


I guess background checks on neighborhood watch captains now :wtf:

g under p

Sanford Chief of police given a no vote of confidence.

http://www.wesh.com/hometest/30734271/detail.html

Something I didn't know a background check was done on Trayvon and a drug test NONE was done on Zimmerman. No wonder they were given a no vote of confidence.

Peace

marcos

cincybearcat wrote:

I agree with everything you said, except I'm not 100% sure it was because the kid was black. May have been, but also may not have mattered.

Something seriously wrong with that guy.

I agree that maybe it wasn't a 100% race issue but maybe more of a class issue. This guy seems like he would have used his gun on anyone that didn't look like they lived in that community. I think Zimmerman was looking for a bad guy and to use his gun that night. I think he would have used it on anybody that looked poor whether white or black.

Though the media and corporate America will try to make it a race issue when it really is a gun issue. Sorry but this is exactly why people should not have access to guns; because they're are too many nuts who don't know how to be reasonable, unfortunately he and other nuts ruin it for everybody.

g under p

marcos wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

I agree with everything you said, except I'm not 100% sure it was because the kid was black. May have been, but also may not have mattered.

Something seriously wrong with that guy.

I agree that maybe it wasn't a 100% race issue but maybe more of a class issue. This guy seems like he would have used his gun on anyone that didn't look like they lived in that community. I think Zimmerman was looking for a bad guy and to use his gun that night. I think he would have used it on anybody that looked poor whether white or black.

Though the media and corporate America will try to make it a race issue when it really is a gun issue. Sorry but this is exactly why people should not have access to guns; because they're are too many nuts who don't know how to be reasonable, unfortunately he and other nuts ruin it for everybody.

I have to ask a question how do you tell if a person looks poor or look like they live in a gated community? What is the make up of the community....are they few blacks there that's one way to tell he doesn't belong? I live in a gated community and for the most part we never lock our doors or cars or anything. i mean was crime that high or rampant in this community for this kind of vigirous community watch?

Peace

gimmesometruth27

interesting.....the sheriff just got a vote of no confidence and the city manager is either going to ask for his resignation of fire him....the public pressure is getting pretty intense now....


Sanford Commission Votes 'No Confidence' In Chief Lee

City Manager Issues Statement With Chief Q&A On Trayvon Martin Case

Read more: http://www.wesh.com/news/30734271/detai ... z1pnjYySgE


SANFORD, Fla. -- The Sanford City Commission passed a vote of "no confidence" in police Chief Bill Lee Wednesday night.

City Manager Norton N. Bonaparte Jr. will decide whether to ask for the chief's resignation or fire him. If Bonaparte decides to do neither, he can then be held accountable for any future problems with the chief.

Lee became a target of advocates pleading for justice in the shooting
death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin at the hands of neighborhood watch captain George Zimmerman last week.

"Although the Police Department is the target of the troubling questions, let me assure you we too feel the pain of this senseless tragedy that has dramatically affected our community," Bonaparte said in a statement. "Therefore, as we move forward and strive to answer the questions that are a point of controversy in the community, we ask for your patience, understanding and assistance in getting the correct information to the community."

Bonaparte issued a release addressed to "Fellow Citizens" listing the chief's answers to some of the most frequently asked questions in the Trayvon Martin case, including why George Zimmerman wasn't arrested the night of the shooting.

"When the Sanford Police Department arrived at the scene of the incident, Mr. Zimmerman provided a statement claiming he acted in self-defense, which at the time was supported by physical evidence and testimony," the chief responded. "By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time."


here is the full statement from the sheriff...
http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/ ... ooting.pdf

Fellow Citizens:
There has been a lot of media attention to the recent incident where George Zimmerman shot and
killed Trayvon Martin. This is indeed a tragic situation and has caused a flood of questions and
strong emotions from within our community, the region and nation. On behalf of the employees
of the City of Sanford, Our deepest sympathy and prayers go out to the family and friends of
Trayvon Martin. As a father, I can only image the pain Trayvon’s family must be going though.
In an effort to continue to be as responsive as possible to the public seeking information on the
incident, I have asked Chief Lee to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked
questions regarding this matter. Below are his responses. Please understand that since this is
still an ongoing investigation, the Police Department is limited in what information it can
publicly release.

The City of Sanford is committed to insuring that justice is served and, therefore, the City of
Sanford has contacted the United States Attorney General’s Office for assistance in this matter.
The men and women of the Sanford Police Department extend our heartfelt sympathies to the
Martin family. This is indeed a tragic situation. The death of anyone due to violence, especially a
17 year old young man, is morally appalling. As this incident has generated a lot of media
attention, we wanted to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked questions.

Why was George Zimmerman not arrested the night of the shooting?
When the Sanford Police Department arrived at the scene of the incident, Mr. Zimmerman
provided a statement claiming he acted in self defense which at the time was supported by
physical evidence and testimony. By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from
making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time. Additionally, when
any police officer makes an arrest for any reason, the officer MUST swear and affirm that he/she
is making the arrest in good faith and with probable cause. If the arrest is done maliciously and
in bad faith, the officer and the City may be held liable.
According to Florida Statute 776.032 :
776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of
force.—
(1) A person who uses force as permitted in s. 776.012, s. 776.013, or s. 776.031 is
justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for
the use of such force, unless the person against whom force was used is a law
enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who was acting in the performance of
his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with
any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that
the person was a law enforcement officer. As used in this subsection, the term “criminal
prosecution” includes arresting, detaining in custody, and charging or prosecuting the
defendant.
(2) A law enforcement agency may use standard procedures for investigating the use of
force as described in subsection (1), but the agency may not arrest the person for using
force unless it determines that there is probable cause that the force that was used was
unlawful.

Why the 911 tapes are not yet released?
There are exemptions to the public records laws for active criminal intelligence and for ongoing
investigations. In this instance, the 911 calls made by neighbors in the subdivision, and the nonemergency
call made by Mr. Zimmerman are all key to the investigation by Sanford Police
Department. In consultation with the Office of the State Attorney, the Sanford police department
has decided not to release the audio recordings of the 911 calls due to the ongoing investigation.
Many times, specific information is contained in those recordings which is vital to the integrity
of the investigation. Should it be revealed, the information may compromise the integrity of the
investigation prior to its completion.

Why did Mr. Zimmerman have a firearm in his possession while acting in the role of a
neighborhood watch member?
Mr. Zimmerman holds a concealed weapon permit issued from the State of Florida. He is
authorized to carry the weapon in a concealed manner wherever Florida Statute dictates.
Neighborhood Watch programs are designed for members of a neighborhood to be “eyes and
ears” for police and to watch out for their neighbors. They are not members of the Police
Department nor are they vigilantes. Training provided by law enforcement agencies to
Neighborhood Watch organizations stresses non-contact surveillance of suspicious situations and
notifying police of those situations so that law enforcement can respond and take control of the
situation.
Mr. Zimmerman was not acting outside the legal boundaries of Florida Statute by carrying his
weapon when this incident occurred. He was in fact on a personal errand in his vehicle when he
observed Mr. Martin in the community and called the Sanford Police Department.

If Zimmerman was told not to continue to follow Trayvon, can that be considered in this
investigation?
Yes it will; however, the telecommunications call taker asked Zimmerman “are you following
him”. Zimmerman replied, “yes”. The call taker stated “you don’t need to do that”. The call
taker’s suggestion is not a lawful order that Mr. Zimmerman would be required to follow.
Zimmerman’s statement was that he had lost sight of Trayvon and was returning to his truck to
meet the police officer when he says he was attacked by Trayvon.

Why was George Zimmerman labeled as “squeaky clean” when in fact he has a prior
arrest history?
In one of the initial meetings with the father of the victim the investigator related to him the
account that Mr. Zimmerman provided of the incident. At that time the investigator said that Mr.
Zimmerman portrayed himself to be “squeaky clean”. We are aware of the background
information regarding both individuals involved in this event. We believe Mr. Martin may have
misconstrued this information.

What about media reenactments of the shooting incident?
Any media reenactments of the shooting incident are purely speculation. To date the Sanford
Police Department has not released any rendition of the events of the evening to anyone other
than the Office of the State Attorney. The renditions we have seen are not consistent with the
evidence in this case.

The Sanford Police Department has conducted a complete and fair investigation of this incident.
We have provided the results of our investigation to the Office of the State Attorney for their
review and consideration for possible criminal prosecution.

Although the Police Department is the target of the troubling questions, let me assure you we too
feel the pain of this senseless tragedy that has dramatically affected our community. Therefore,
as we move forward and strive to answer the questions that are a point of controversy in the
community, we ask for your patience, understanding and assistance in getting the correct
information to the community.

Thank you,
Norton N. Bonaparte, Jr., ICMA-CM
City Manager

marcos

g under p wrote:

I have to ask a question how do you tell if a person looks poor or look like they live in a gated community? What is the make up of the community....are they few blacks there that's one way to tell he doesn't belong? I live in a gated community and for the most part we never lock our doors or cars of anything. i mean was crime that high or rampant in this community for this kind of vigirous community watch?

Peace

I read a report that this guy had made 50 911 calls since the beginning of this year and that some of his neighbors were afraid of his over zealousness as block captain. Often times people confuse racial prejudices with class prejudices.

I think that if the person was wearing a suit & tie or such; maybe he wouldn't have shot him? Though this guy seems fairly unbalanced period, so who knows.

goingtoverona

sorry homeslice, gonna have to disagree with you here. there are millions of people that own guns and that don't go out shooting people and commiting crimes. there is no reason that they should have their guns taken away because of the choices of others. people kill other people every single day because of drinking and driving, your logic suggests we should ban cars and alcohol as well. right? a few bad people have to ruin it for everyone? people have been beaten to death with baseball bats, stabbed to death with steak knives and suffocated to death with pillows. not only will banning all these things not make them disappear, but it certainly won't destroy the intent to do harm that people will always have.

Though the media and corporate America will try to make it a race issue when it really is a gun issue. Sorry but this is exactly why people should not have access to guns; because they're are too many nuts who don't know how to be reasonable, unfortunately he and other nuts ruin it for everybody.[/quote]

goingtoverona

my statement was directed at marcos, i messed up the quote thing sorry