Who will be the Democratic nominee?
Comments
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Joe BidenThe party is showing what a Mickey Mouse organization it is.
This should have been happening a year ago (preferably more privately). NOTHING has changed...I have to believe his "bad performance" at the debate is just how he comes off sometimes given his age. Yeah, he has good/coherent moments. But at the debates he showed what he'll be like at least some of the time and it's not going to get better. Maybe Rob Reiner and Stone didn't see this but those close to him did. This should have been taken care of last year. Every possible outcome with the nomination is bad for the party.1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine
2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
2024 Napa, Wrigley, Wrigley0 -
Kamala Harrisbenjs said:
I get the feeling Biden already knows he has to drop out. That said, he has to be 100% in until he's 100% out. Honest question though - if he bows out because of his current mental health, will there be impeachment efforts between now and November?lastexitlondon said:If you don't do something trump will walk it.. do something now to stop thatOf Kamala Harris? Possibly.I had been wondering why the right wing wasn't calling for the 25th amendment to be invoked (to remove Biden from office) -- apparently Harris now polls as well as or better than Biden against the orange menace, and she'd make the orange one look even worse when compared to her rather than Biden. So the GOP actually wants Biden to stay in the race, as he looks more vulnerable at this point.There is the question of, if Biden drops out of the race, does he also resign from office? It would make the transition to the Scary Black Lady /s less scary once people realized she wasn't going to make us all start using litter boxes and whatnot. I imagine some of our more auspicious members of the House :ahem: would launch impeachment proceedings on day one, if Harris were to take over from Biden.All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.0 -
Josh ShapiroOn what grounds would Congress impeach Harris if Biden stepped down? And is the insinuation that she would also be removed from office if impeached? I don't see where the time much less the rationale or appetite would be for that. Very bizarre train of thought.0
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Joe Biden
I don't think he has to acknowledge anything about current mental health. He just has to state that he's not getting younger and it's time for him to retire. I don't think he could be impeached* for simply getting older during his term. As I discuss a couple of posts above, he should have done this a year ago and just said "It's time for me to retire." Nobody would hold that against him. Lots of people announce a retirement many months in advance and it doesn't mean "I'm currently mentally unfit."benjs said:
I get the feeling Biden already knows he has to drop out. That said, he has to be 100% in until he's 100% out. Honest question though - if he bows out because of his current mental health, will there be impeachment efforts between now and November?lastexitlondon said:If you don't do something trump will walk it.. do something now to stop that
*OK, given the state of politics today, I suppose it's possible. He could also be 25thed.1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine
2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
2024 Napa, Wrigley, Wrigley0 -
Kamala Harrisbenjs said:
I thought he could ride it out if only the debate was bad but he was otherwise well - unfortunately, that really doesn't sound like it's the case, or there's been an effective sabotage campaign to make it seem like he's unwell. In either case, I don't think he can bounce back from this. I agree with Jon Stewart - if Democrats nominate someone who can be 1/10th as inspiring as people found Obama, able to communicate effectively, given the existing loathing of Trump, they can win.tbergs said:I think people recognize that they either say something and keep the pressure mounting or sit idly by, cross their fingers, and hope that we don't have a Project 2025 puppet as dictator. We have eyes and ears so if what they are saying could be disputed we wouldn't be at this juncture. We need a new candidate and that person could ride the wave even more than Obama generated 16 years ago if done correctly. However, I don't know how you get around that person being anyone other than Kamala, but she won't pick up the middle so it's probably still a gamble, but a better one than Biden right now.Kamala Harris in prosecutor mode is quite inspiring, I think -- so do a lot of people. She has been stepping up and speaking out more recently, and she's actually doing a very good job. For any Bulwark subscribers -- or for the Bulwark (or Harris)- curious, check out Tim Miller's Bulwark podcast from Monday, where he talks with The Atlantic's Elaina Plott Calabro about Kamala Harris; Harris has been doing a lot more than people think she has been doing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BnFxCSp7VYThe editorial from George Clooney was remarkable. He's saying explicitly that the debate was not just a "bad night."I also think it's noteworthy that Nancy Pelosi continues to refrain from offering a full-throated defense of Biden.And it makes me sad to say it, but I am distressed to hear Joe Biden saying and doing things ("The polls are wrong!") that I would expect from the other guy.
All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.0 -
Kamala Harrispjl44 said:On what grounds would Congress impeach Harris if Biden stepped down? And is the insinuation that she would also be removed from office if impeached? I don't see where the time much less the rationale or appetite would be for that. Very bizarre train of thought.
Rationale has nothing to do with it. Certain members of the GOP clown car caucus will move to impeach just because they want the attention, they think they work in pro wrestling, not Congress, and because they think that if they impeach everyone, all the time, impeachment will become normalized and we all will forget that it's actually NOT normal for a POTUS to be impeached, let alone impeached twice. If they turn it into just another blunt political object, then "impeachment" is just something you do to your opponents.
All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.0 -
Josh Shapiro
This doesn't make any sensecurmudgeoness said:pjl44 said:On what grounds would Congress impeach Harris if Biden stepped down? And is the insinuation that she would also be removed from office if impeached? I don't see where the time much less the rationale or appetite would be for that. Very bizarre train of thought.
Rationale has nothing to do with it. Certain members of the GOP clown car caucus will move to impeach just because they want the attention, they think they work in pro wrestling, not Congress, and because they think that if they impeach everyone, all the time, impeachment will become normalized and we all will forget that it's actually NOT normal for a POTUS to be impeached, let alone impeached twice. If they turn it into just another blunt political object, then "impeachment" is just something you do to your opponents.0 -
Joe Biden
First time I have almost agreed to Moore. The biggest travesty is if people knew it was this bad for certain a year ago...curmudgeoness said:Halifax2TheMax said:I’m waiting for the Bowling for Columbine guy to chime in and tell me what to do, not that it’ll matter.
I hate that I know this, since I've thought Michael Moore is a self-aggrandizing sack of sh!t since he was just a loudmouth on local radio, but he's saying that trotting Biden out there and pretending all is well is "elder abuse."hippiemom = goodness0 -
Kamala HarrisOnWis97 said:
I don't think he has to acknowledge anything about current mental health. He just has to state that he's not getting younger and it's time for him to retire. I don't think he could be impeached* for simply getting older during his term. As I discuss a couple of posts above, he should have done this a year ago and just said "It's time for me to retire." Nobody would hold that against him. Lots of people announce a retirement many months in advance and it doesn't mean "I'm currently mentally unfit."benjs said:
I get the feeling Biden already knows he has to drop out. That said, he has to be 100% in until he's 100% out. Honest question though - if he bows out because of his current mental health, will there be impeachment efforts between now and November?lastexitlondon said:If you don't do something trump will walk it.. do something now to stop that
*OK, given the state of politics today, I suppose it's possible. He could also be 25thed.
No, being old isn't (normally) grounds for impeachment, as opposed to, say, extorting another nation or trying to stage a coup. I think of impeachment as being akin to indictment (I'm not a lawyer!) -- there is a vote as to whether or not the official is guilty of "high crimes and misdemeanors," and then the actual trial is held in the Senate. If I recall correctly, MTG or another clown (Boebert?) tried to move to impeach Biden on his first day in office. If he's truly incapacitated/ incompetent, the 25th Amendment is the way to go.
All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.0 -
Kamala Harrispjl44 said:
This doesn't make any sensecurmudgeoness said:pjl44 said:On what grounds would Congress impeach Harris if Biden stepped down? And is the insinuation that she would also be removed from office if impeached? I don't see where the time much less the rationale or appetite would be for that. Very bizarre train of thought.
Rationale has nothing to do with it. Certain members of the GOP clown car caucus will move to impeach just because they want the attention, they think they work in pro wrestling, not Congress, and because they think that if they impeach everyone, all the time, impeachment will become normalized and we all will forget that it's actually NOT normal for a POTUS to be impeached, let alone impeached twice. If they turn it into just another blunt political object, then "impeachment" is just something you do to your opponents.Which part -- my explanation, or the GOP's behavior? I'm describing what they've already done over the past few years. Does their behavior make sense? No -- they haven't done much over the past 8-9 years that makes any sense (and I'm a small-"c" conservative who wants us to have more than one healthy party).I don't know how to say this without sounding snarky, but snark is not my intention here: Do you live in the US? If so, are you really not aware of GOP House members' repeated efforts to impeach Biden, Mayorkas, Buttigieg, "because reasons"?All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.0 -
Everyone knew and everyone acted like it was fake. Now at the 11th hour everyone wants to throw him out right before one of the most crucial elections. It should’ve never gotten this far!!!! It should’ve been known from the beginning he would only serve one term.cincybearcat said:
First time I have almost agreed to Moore. The biggest travesty is if people knew it was this bad for certain a year ago...curmudgeoness said:Halifax2TheMax said:I’m waiting for the Bowling for Columbine guy to chime in and tell me what to do, not that it’ll matter.
I hate that I know this, since I've thought Michael Moore is a self-aggrandizing sack of sh!t since he was just a loudmouth on local radio, but he's saying that trotting Biden out there and pretending all is well is "elder abuse."0 -
I like Harris and did when she was running for the nomination 4 years ago, but I worry about her broader appeal to swing voters. One of the plusses right now is that because she is not the candidate, she has not been subjected to as much of the mud slinging so people will have a less disdainful opinion of her and she can still attach herself to the accomplishments of the administration.curmudgeoness said:benjs said:
I thought he could ride it out if only the debate was bad but he was otherwise well - unfortunately, that really doesn't sound like it's the case, or there's been an effective sabotage campaign to make it seem like he's unwell. In either case, I don't think he can bounce back from this. I agree with Jon Stewart - if Democrats nominate someone who can be 1/10th as inspiring as people found Obama, able to communicate effectively, given the existing loathing of Trump, they can win.tbergs said:I think people recognize that they either say something and keep the pressure mounting or sit idly by, cross their fingers, and hope that we don't have a Project 2025 puppet as dictator. We have eyes and ears so if what they are saying could be disputed we wouldn't be at this juncture. We need a new candidate and that person could ride the wave even more than Obama generated 16 years ago if done correctly. However, I don't know how you get around that person being anyone other than Kamala, but she won't pick up the middle so it's probably still a gamble, but a better one than Biden right now.Kamala Harris in prosecutor mode is quite inspiring, I think -- so do a lot of people. She has been stepping up and speaking out more recently, and she's actually doing a very good job. For any Bulwark subscribers -- or for the Bulwark (or Harris)- curious, check out Tim Miller's Bulwark podcast from Monday, where he talks with The Atlantic's Elaina Plott Calabro about Kamala Harris; Harris has been doing a lot more than people think she has been doing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BnFxCSp7VYThe editorial from George Clooney was remarkable. He's saying explicitly that the debate was not just a "bad night."I also think it's noteworthy that Nancy Pelosi continues to refrain from offering a full-throated defense of Biden.And it makes me sad to say it, but I am distressed to hear Joe Biden saying and doing things ("The polls are wrong!") that I would expect from the other guy.It's a hopeless situation...0 -
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Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Joe Biden
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
nicknyr15 said:
Everyone knew and everyone acted like it was fake. Now at the 11th hour everyone wants to throw him out right before one of the most crucial elections. It should’ve never gotten this far!!!! It should’ve been known from the beginning he would only serve one term.cincybearcat said:
First time I have almost agreed to Moore. The biggest travesty is if people knew it was this bad for certain a year ago...curmudgeoness said:Halifax2TheMax said:I’m waiting for the Bowling for Columbine guy to chime in and tell me what to do, not that it’ll matter.
I hate that I know this, since I've thought Michael Moore is a self-aggrandizing sack of sh!t since he was just a loudmouth on local radio, but he's saying that trotting Biden out there and pretending all is well is "elder abuse."Who knew? All we could do was guess. They were clearly hiding him and he was never as terrible as he was at the debate.
The democrats are in this bind because they thought they could sneak him thru two debates and now it imploded on them.
We need every democrat with an audience, whether a senator, governor or actor, to speak out before it’s too late. He is dropping like a stone in the polls, and telling the voters to eff off.
they claim to care about democracy, that this is the ultimate election about democracy, yet they withheld critically important and relevant information from the voters, and now they’re telling us to shut up.
yeah the Dems are all for democracy and honesty.0 -
Joe Biden
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Joe Bidennicknyr15 said:
Agreed. Not a good lookpjhawks said:This is getting stupid. All the Dems publicly calling for Biden to get out is not helping the Dems cause. Either do it quietly in back channels or shut your trap. Doing it publicly just gives the issue more attention for those that might be on the fence.
I suspect you guys are right but the other argument has it's merits. To be honest, I don't know anymore, Nick. So for now, I'm going surfing in my mind, or my dreams, or maybe just play some old Beach Boys records.
"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
Josh ShapiroMan it's just all coming out. Starts with Ezra Klein quoting an elected Democrat.
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