Fan-To-Fan Face Value Ticket Exchange

pjl44 · January 2020

If something dastardly occurs, we should be extremely vocal about it. Until such time it does not do us any good to fret about every potential dastardly scenario.

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan · January 2020

Lost_And_No_Guide said:

I wonder if all tickets (10C lottery, VF presale, public) will be subject to the Fan-to-Fan Face Value system.
That's the potential weak link IMO--if TM gets an allotment for their own distribution (the public onsale tickets), I do not trust them not to hold back a portion of the best seats for themselves to put on the "Ticketmaster Verified Resale" market (also known as the "everybody's in on it scalping market")

Ticketmaster verified resale is only turned on if the band wants it turned on. Pearl Jam would never allow this. People have a miss-conception that TM controls how the seats are sold, which seats are released, which seats are held back and its just not the case. All those decisions and directives generally come from the promoter which often times is Live Nation. So as long as your favorite band isn't promoted by Live Nation (Pearl Jam is not), you don't have to worry about ticket manipulation.

Dynamic ticket pricing is another example of something that is not controlled by Ticketmaster. Dynamic pricing is only allowed of the artist or promoter gives TM the blessing to implement it. Again, Peal Jam would never do this.

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan · January 2020

PJNB said:

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

PJNB said:

pjl44 said:

BennyLaRue said:

PJNB said:

You guys that are ok with this system and know you are going to a show are not factoring in that now a lot more people are going to be hurting your GA or reserved odds without a care. In the past if people did not know (most did this) they were going to be able to make a show they did not put in for it and waited till they knew to find at ticket on the forum. Now they will put in and just sell the ticket not caring that they hurt the odds and chances of people that they knew 100% for sure that they were going. There is a lot good with the new system that they have in place but this is an awful choice imo.

Oh, it's factored in. My counter-point would be that I'm not sure many people will be putting down many hundreds or even thousands of dollars to game the system in this way when their ability to make money off the strategy is basically nil. Sure, people will try but if Ten Club is diligent about voiding tickets posted for resale above face, this will be snuffed out.

And, apparently improving our odds, there are more tickets available to Ten Club member than ever before.

That's another risk for potential ticket hoarders. Tickets have become much pricier. Good point.

And so has the secondary market. To secure a ticket I bet people would rather fork over the money now to up their odds and get payed back in the future without penalty then to have lower odds and have to go to Stubhub potentially.

I am not trying to be a debbie downer here and say the system will not work just yet. I just see some obvious holes that I know will be exploited unfortunately. I am sure 10 club has thought of all angles so it will be interesting to see how this plays out. I am also sure 10 Club is sick of seeing people email them saying they want a refund or seeing good seats go to waste since the original ticket holder can no longer use them.

What tickets are going to be on Stubhub? Tickets are non-transferable even the public tickets. Unless you are talking New York or Denver of course.

Public sale are non transferable?

All tickets are non-transferable except in CO or NY. 10c, Verified Fan and public sale tickets.

Lost_And_No_Guide · January 2020

P-Town-P-
P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

Lost_And_No_Guide said:

I wonder if all tickets (10C lottery, VF presale, public) will be subject to the Fan-to-Fan Face Value system.
That's the potential weak link IMO--if TM gets an allotment for their own distribution (the public onsale tickets), I do not trust them not to hold back a portion of the best seats for themselves to put on the "Ticketmaster Verified Resale" market (also known as the "everybody's in on it scalping market")

Ticketmaster verified resale is only turned on if the band wants it turned on. Pearl Jam would never allow this. People have a miss-conception that TM controls how the seats are sold, which seats are released, which seats are held back and its just not the case. All those decisions and directives generally come from the promoter which often times is Live Nation. So as long as your favorite band isn't promoted by Live Nation (Pearl Jam is not), you don't have to worry about ticket manipulation.

This is of course true, especially with respect to the band and its promotion ultimately having control over TVR and Dynamic/Platinum Pricing. Honestly I'm just a bit cynical over how many bands are nominally against scalping but in practice don't put common sense safeguards in place to prevent it (if they want to--personally I don't care if a band allows their tickets to be scalped, I just get irritated with bands--cough, DMB, cough--that proclaim they're anti-scalping then allow their tickets to be scalped as hard as any other band's).

If there's any band that's earned the benefit of the doubt and a wait and see approach on this topic, it's PJ.

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan · January 2020

Lost_And_No_Guide said:

P-Town-P-
P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

Lost_And_No_Guide said:

I wonder if all tickets (10C lottery, VF presale, public) will be subject to the Fan-to-Fan Face Value system.
That's the potential weak link IMO--if TM gets an allotment for their own distribution (the public onsale tickets), I do not trust them not to hold back a portion of the best seats for themselves to put on the "Ticketmaster Verified Resale" market (also known as the "everybody's in on it scalping market")

Ticketmaster verified resale is only turned on if the band wants it turned on. Pearl Jam would never allow this. People have a miss-conception that TM controls how the seats are sold, which seats are released, which seats are held back and its just not the case. All those decisions and directives generally come from the promoter which often times is Live Nation. So as long as your favorite band isn't promoted by Live Nation (Pearl Jam is not), you don't have to worry about ticket manipulation.

This is of course true, especially with respect to the band and its promotion ultimately having control over TVR and Dynamic/Platinum Pricing. Honestly I'm just a bit cynical over how many bands are nominally against scalping but in practice don't put common sense safeguards in place to prevent it (if they want to--personally I don't care if a band allows their tickets to be scalped, I just get irritated with bands--cough, DMB, cough--that proclaim they're anti-scalping then allow their tickets to be scalped as hard as any other band's).

If there's any band that's earned the benefit of the doubt and a wait and see approach on this topic, it's PJ.

I agree 100%. So many of these bands secretly or not so secretly scalp their own tickets and pretend like they don't. If you are a Live Nation performer like Taylor Swift, you have 0 control over your tickets. Live Nation offers big guaranteed contracts - and in turn, they control all aspects of selling the tickets. That means, 8 different levels of VIP tickets, Platinum seats in the 300 level, dynamically priced tickets, etc. Anytime you see those being offered, the band is scalping their own tickets through Ticketmaster's system and letting Ticketmaster take all the negative publicity that comes from non-educated fans.

gatorjam · January 2020

PJNB said:

bbiggs said:

BennyLaRue said:

bbiggs said:

This process still seems to lack clarity on whether or not ONE individual ticket can be sold in the fan-to-fan exchange. Example: I buy a pair for myself and concert buddy. Concert buddy bails, but I still want to attend the show. Ideally, I can sell that unused ticket that was supposed to be for my concert buddy (face value via TM fan to fan exchange). Has anyone confirmed that this is acceptable or not? And I have thoroughly read all of the rules. This is not spelled out.

It's not clear yet. Worst case, you'd post on Lost Dogs and find a new buddy in minutes. Only issue would be meeting them outside the show as you'd have to walk in together.

Good point. Meeting up at the venue is a must though. Not complaining, but I think having the ability to sell one via TM fan to fan would have made a lot of sense for situations like I described in my original post.

What happens when your plus 1 does not want to wait in the GA line all day and you do? Is that person just going to skip the line now and go to the front since we have to go together?
You find another plus one?

PJNB · January 2020

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

PJNB said:

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

PJNB said:

pjl44 said:

BennyLaRue said:

PJNB said:

You guys that are ok with this system and know you are going to a show are not factoring in that now a lot more people are going to be hurting your GA or reserved odds without a care. In the past if people did not know (most did this) they were going to be able to make a show they did not put in for it and waited till they knew to find at ticket on the forum. Now they will put in and just sell the ticket not caring that they hurt the odds and chances of people that they knew 100% for sure that they were going. There is a lot good with the new system that they have in place but this is an awful choice imo.

Oh, it's factored in. My counter-point would be that I'm not sure many people will be putting down many hundreds or even thousands of dollars to game the system in this way when their ability to make money off the strategy is basically nil. Sure, people will try but if Ten Club is diligent about voiding tickets posted for resale above face, this will be snuffed out.

And, apparently improving our odds, there are more tickets available to Ten Club member than ever before.

That's another risk for potential ticket hoarders. Tickets have become much pricier. Good point.

And so has the secondary market. To secure a ticket I bet people would rather fork over the money now to up their odds and get payed back in the future without penalty then to have lower odds and have to go to Stubhub potentially.

I am not trying to be a debbie downer here and say the system will not work just yet. I just see some obvious holes that I know will be exploited unfortunately. I am sure 10 club has thought of all angles so it will be interesting to see how this plays out. I am also sure 10 Club is sick of seeing people email them saying they want a refund or seeing good seats go to waste since the original ticket holder can no longer use them.

What tickets are going to be on Stubhub? Tickets are non-transferable even the public tickets. Unless you are talking New York or Denver of course.

Public sale are non transferable?

All tickets are non-transferable except in CO or NY. 10c, Verified Fan and public sale tickets.

I am reading the fineprint right now and see that. That is fucking amazing if they can pull this off!

tschav · January 2020

While it’s fair to think some people will hoard or try new techniques, there’s a more robust tracking system of 10c account activity - from tickets not being used or excessive transfer/sale activity.

I doubt 10c/TM would get involved frequently, but they theoretically have a better handle on identifying accounts that are not attending the shows they buy...

Oh hey there’s my tinfoil hat!

MayDay10 · January 2020

Drone strikes on those who abuse the ticket system

Sharon_Hearts_PJ · January 2020

bbiggs said:

This process still seems to lack clarity on whether or not ONE individual ticket can be sold in the fan-to-fan exchange. Example: I buy a pair for myself and concert buddy. Concert buddy bails, but I still want to attend the show. Ideally, I can sell that unused ticket that was supposed to be for my concert buddy (face value via TM fan to fan exchange). Has anyone confirmed that this is acceptable or not? And I have thoroughly read all of the rules. This is not spelled out.

I think your best bet is just going to be to find someone, either here on the forum or via Facebook, to meet up with at the show, have them hand you money (or venmo, whatever) and walk in with you.

Bentleyspop · January 2020

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

Lost_And_No_Guide said:

I wonder if all tickets (10C lottery, VF presale, public) will be subject to the Fan-to-Fan Face Value system.
That's the potential weak link IMO--if TM gets an allotment for their own distribution (the public onsale tickets), I do not trust them not to hold back a portion of the best seats for themselves to put on the "Ticketmaster Verified Resale" market (also known as the "everybody's in on it scalping market")

Ticketmaster verified resale is only turned on if the band wants it turned on. Pearl Jam would never allow this. People have a miss-conception that TM controls how the seats are sold, which seats are released, which seats are held back and its just not the case. All those decisions and directives generally come from the promoter which often times is Live Nation. So as long as your favorite band isn't promoted by Live Nation (Pearl Jam is not), you don't have to worry about ticket manipulation.

Dynamic ticket pricing is another example of something that is not controlled by Ticketmaster. Dynamic pricing is only allowed of the artist or promoter gives TM the blessing to implement it. Again, Peal Jam would never do this.

You make many good points.
It's always funny to me all the people on here, and elsewhere, who act like TM is conspiring against them specifically.

patkelly12 · January 2020

Can we wait to see that there is no Platinum Pricing before we assume " the band would never do this"? I remember when the NY DA was working for the little guy when they went after Ticketmaster. Did everyone enjoy those lawn seats you got in the settlement? And why would NY prohibit mandatory ticket-less entry? I assume it was to help out the little guy. I just haven't figured out how. I just know they care about the little guy.

release00 · January 2020

If I put in for 1 10c msg ticket and get it but then find out I can’t make it, can I sell it on the ticket exchange?

Spoken · January 2020

Kidcloudkicker said:

Is the fan-to-fan exchange exclusive to 10C members or is it open to the public as well?

Hi did this get answered?

otto48313 · January 2020

So if I'm a very ancient/tenured 10c member and want to be a really nice dude, i'll buy tix to all the shows, and those shows I can't attend go back into the pot for 10 club members only to buy via the exchange? Or can anyone buy them on ticketmaster exchange after I post them to the exchange? thx, Otto

NewfieintheUSA · January 2020

Spoken said:

Kidcloudkicker said:

Is the fan-to-fan exchange exclusive to 10C members or is it open to the public as well?

Hi did this get answered?

It's open to the public. All tickets for these shows can only be sold on the ticket exchange

Spoken · January 2020

Hi, can you sell your two tickets to a friend on the Fan-To-Fan Face Value Ticket Exchange?
Has that been answered?

Spoken · January 2020

NewfieintheUSA said:

Spoken said:

Kidcloudkicker said:

Is the fan-to-fan exchange exclusive to 10C members or is it open to the public as well?

Hi did this get answered?

It's open to the public. All tickets for these shows can only be sold on the ticket exchange

Hi thanks for answering the question

Can you sell your two tickets to a friend on the Fan-To-Fan Face Value Ticket Exchange?
Do you know?

CPR7 · January 2020

Spoken said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

Spoken said:

Kidcloudkicker said:

Is the fan-to-fan exchange exclusive to 10C members or is it open to the public as well?

Hi did this get answered?

It's open to the public. All tickets for these shows can only be sold on the ticket exchange

Hi thanks for answering the question
Can you sell your two tickets to a friend on the Fan-To-Fan Face Value Ticket Exchange?
Do you know?

I don't think so. Your tickets gets "sold" back to TM and then it enters their system and is up for grabs for anybody to purchase.

In2Deep · January 2020

The email states: "All tickets on this tour will be mobile only, non-transferable tickets (except in NY and CO where transferability is required by state law)." So I'm rather lost as to where we are getting that 10C tix can be transferred on this exchange? I know you can sell the public ones, but there is some contradiction in the email about 10C not being transferable. Hoping my email to 10C will clarify before I put in for anything I'm not 100% I can really attend, but want.

Fan-To-Fan Face Value Ticket Exchange

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