the death penalty

TriumphantAngel · July 2010

eyedclaar wrote:

But then we are back to them possibly escaping and doing God knows what, or they stay behind bars possibly injuring or killing other prisoners or guards. That is the very realistic chance you take when wharehousing monsters. Why are those chances acceptable?

i don't know how many times i have to say it. murdering the murderer doesn't make it right, in my opinion. state sanctioned murder is murder too. why is the life of the person that killed someone I love, considered an equal trade for my loved one? how can some total stranger assume that by sentencing the offender to death, things will automatically be squared up? It's not and it never will be.

chadwick · July 2010

throwing someone in a cold damp concrete hole is far more barbaric than a death sentence.
ppl are affraid of the word death.
ppl are affraid to die.

if i were a piece of dog shit i'd be affraid to die too.
the darkness might not be so kind to a monster.

to me death is the beginning.
i hope when my chance comes along i can embrace the death and run with it.
the next light shall be life.

bad guys?
probably not very nice.

just my opinions... i have many :twisted:

chadwick · July 2010

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

chadwick wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

nobody is hiding from anything. where are these monsters that you feel the need to warn us of oh great catcher in the rye? why do you have no opinion on the other thread? because when faced with the reality of a real situation you don't speak up because you know you are wrong?

i hope your poetry is better than your rhetoric and hyperbole, otherwise nobody would buy it...

what other thread, mr. guitars?

how foolish of me, this is the only thread you pay attention to...

and yes thank you my guitars are quite nice.

im all over these threads.
i have friends all over the world on here.
your little poetry book comment early was a stab at me.
i enjoyed it.

what is your music doing?
do death row immates have guitars, yes/no?

eyedclaar · July 2010

TriumphantAngel wrote:

eyedclaar wrote:

But then we are back to them possibly escaping and doing God knows what, or they stay behind bars possibly injuring or killing other prisoners or guards. That is the very realistic chance you take when wharehousing monsters. Why are those chances acceptable?

i don't know how many times i have to say it. murdering the murderer doesn't make it right, in my opinion. state sanctioned murder is murder too. why is the life of the person that killed someone I love, considered an equal trade for my loved one? how can some total stranger assume that by sentencing the offender to death, things will automatically be squared up? It's not and it never will be.

You're right, killing someone is not going to square up the past, or replace a lost or shattered love one. However, it might stop others from suffering the same unimaginable pain (actual victims and their loved ones).

Hugh Freaking Dillon · July 2010

but no one can make that decision for you, nor can you make that decision for someone else.

eyedclaar wrote:

Neither do I, thus this conversation. All I know is that I'd rather someone just kill me than send me to one of those places for the rest of my life.

gimmesometruth27 · July 2010

chadwick wrote:

im all over these threads.
i have friends all over the world on here.
your little poetry book comment early was a stab at me.
i enjoyed it.

what is your music doing?
do death row immates have guitars, yes/no?

:roll:

Hugh Freaking Dillon · July 2010

people should not be killed for what they might do. if that's the case, you'd have to off half or more of the human race.

eyedclaar wrote:

But then we are back to them possibly escaping and doing God knows what, or they stay behind bars possibly injuring or killing other prisoners or guards. That is the very realistic chance you take when wharehousing monsters. Why are those chances acceptable?

eyedclaar · July 2010

Billy Pumpkin wrote:

but no one can make that decision for you, nor can you make that decision for someone else.

eyedclaar wrote:

Neither do I, thus this conversation. All I know is that I'd rather someone just kill me than send me to one of those places for the rest of my life.

But that's just it, people make life and death decisions for others all the time. I hear you saying that isn't right, however, it is what is. So we can deal with the universal right and wrong of things (where we will, oddly enough, find very little universal agreement), or we can deal with the reality of the situation.

eyedclaar · July 2010

Billy Pumpkin wrote:

people should not be killed for what they might do. if that's the case, you'd have to off half or more of the human race.

eyedclaar wrote:

But then we are back to them possibly escaping and doing God knows what, or they stay behind bars possibly injuring or killing other prisoners or guards. That is the very realistic chance you take when wharehousing monsters. Why are those chances acceptable?

We're talking about somebody who has already done something horrible here, so the potential that it happens again is the issue.

gimmesometruth27 · July 2010

doesn't anyone find it mildly ironic that a lot of the pro Dp people tend to be conservative, right wing, or religious and one of the commandments they are supposed to follow is "thou shalt not kill"??

eyedclaar · July 2010

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

doesn't anyone find it mildly ironic that a lot of the pro Dp people tend to be conservative, right wing, or religious and one of the commandments they are supposed to follow is "thou shalt not kill"??

Hope you aren't referring to Chad, Ed, or myself, or you just couldn't be more wrong. I am as anti all those things as you will ever find.

TriumphantAngel · July 2010

i know that this thread is 66 pages long now, and please forgive me for reposting something i posted back in the very beginning. i just want to mention it again in case new people to the thread don't go back to the beginning. no one has commented on this, and that's ok, i just thought it might give a victims insight. there's some heartbreaking stories here. the death penalty is not the answer. please don't think it gives the victims families closure. it really doesn't.

if anyone is interested, there's a very good website out there that opposes the death penalty. they campaign on behalf of murder victims and their families.

their aim is "to put real faces on victim opposition to the death penalty by presenting photos and statements from survivors throughout the United States and around the world, along with photos of the murder victim and links to further information."

these a real people, real stories. absolutely heartbreaking. these people know what it's like to lose someone they loved very much, and they are completely against the death penalty. some of them have witnessed the dealth penalty being carried out and they say that it gives them absolutely no peace at all. in fact it just creates more victims.

http://www.mvfhr.org/victims-stories

gimmesometruth27 · July 2010

eyedclaar wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

doesn't anyone find it mildly ironic that a lot of the pro Dp people tend to be conservative, right wing, or religious and one of the commandments they are supposed to follow is "thou shalt not kill"??

Hope you aren't referring to Chad, Ed, or myself, or you just couldn't be more wrong. I am as anti all those things as you will ever find.

i was talking in general. not you three specifically. look at the states that carry out such penalties, texas (who kills mentally challenged prisoners by the way), florida, missouri, utah, and those countries in the middle east are all right wing religious countries and all of the governments in those states and countries support the DP..

JonnyPistachio · July 2010

Personally, I think an good guage of stance on the DP is whether or not you, YOURSELF, could pull the trigger as the executioner on a person and live with it.

Can you support something that you couldnt do yourself?
I get angry as fuck hearing about murderers and people who wear other peoples skin and keep their eyeballs in jars and heads in refrigerators... but could I end their life? me personally? no fucking way.

eyedclaar · July 2010

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

eyedclaar wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

doesn't anyone find it mildly ironic that a lot of the pro Dp people tend to be conservative, right wing, or religious and one of the commandments they are supposed to follow is "thou shalt not kill"??

Hope you aren't referring to Chad, Ed, or myself, or you just couldn't be more wrong. I am as anti all those things as you will ever find.

i was talking in general. not you three specifically. look at the states that carry out such penalties, texas (who kills mentally challenged prisoners by the way), florida, missouri, utah, and those countries in the middle east are all right wing religious countries and all of the governments in those states and countries support the DP..

Yes, it is one giant hypocritical clusterfuck. That's why I don't hamstring myself with religious conviction.

eyedclaar · July 2010

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Personally, I think an good guage of stance on the DP is whether or not you, YOURSELF, could pull the trigger as the executioner on a person and live with it.

Can you support something that you couldnt do yourself?
I get angry as fuck hearing about murderers and people who wear other peoples skin and keep their eyeballs in jars and heads in refrigerators... but could I end their life? me personally? no fucking way.

Around here, you gotta know when to not answer a question...

JonnyPistachio · July 2010

chadwick wrote:

ppl like eyed and myself and others in this thread who don't stand for evil bullshit.

but please dont confuse this debate with some of us not standing up to evil people, aka murderers, animals, and monsters. It's just the punishment we're talking about. I don't stand for evil and I doubt anyone else in here does.

I love all you people, I really do.

cincybearcat · July 2010

Billy Pumpkin wrote:

eyedclaar wrote:

And I still don't buy any kind of definitive morality about taking another life. Just because you feel that way, doesn't make it so.

how can you even pretend that it's not immoral to take another human life? that's what seperates us from the "monsters" that Chadwick keeps regailing us with stories of!

I'll say it for an 87th time..........and please answer this time...........someone........WHAT gives anyone the right to take the life of another human being? And don't use "they gave up their rights to live yadda yadda yadda". Where was it stated in some divine book that told you that they gave up their right to live for x crime? Who decided this? Tell me! Who??

I always like it when someone asks a question and then tells people how they can or can't answer them.

Look, I get your position, and I move closer to the same most everyday. But I will try and answer you question even using the rules you laid out.

What gives anyone the right to take the life of another? Well, it is called laws. Written by man. Some have been good, other have been bad. But that is what gives someone the right. And, in my case, when I believe the death penalty is appropriate, it is because I don't believe it is worth the risk to other human beings to keep someone alive. Risk to the general population, risk to other inmates of lesser crimes, risk to correctional officers (maybe my main concern). Should we be putting these people at risk by dealing with a murderous individual? If you take away the death penalty and give life without parole, why would an inmate comply with the correction officers? What keeps them from doing something terrible? It concerns me. If they are put to death, then there is no way for them to kill again. So, that how I justify it. Though, as I said, I waver on it often. I'm a flip-flopper.

cincybearcat · July 2010

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

doesn't anyone find it mildly ironic that a lot of the pro Dp people tend to be conservative, right wing, or religious and one of the commandments they are supposed to follow is "thou shalt not kill"??

Do you realize that you can have fiscal conservative views and not be religious?

cincybearcat · July 2010

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Can you support something that you couldnt do yourself?

I'm not sure the pro-choice people would agree that you'd have to be willing to do something yourself in order to support it....or so they have told me.

the death penalty

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