***The Official Philadelphia Phillies 2012 Thread***

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  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,919
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Blanton locked up through 2012 for $24 mil. Not bad at all. Liking the moves, Rube! Liking the moves!

    if only Charlie would have started him in the playoffs instead of our 5th (or 6th) starter in Pedro maybe we would have beaten the Yanks. thought Charlie screwed Joe in the playoffs this year - he pitched real well all year and was great in the 2008 playoffs.
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    pjhawks wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Blanton locked up through 2012 for $24 mil. Not bad at all. Liking the moves, Rube! Liking the moves!

    if only Charlie would have started him in the playoffs instead of our 5th (or 6th) starter in Pedro maybe we would have beaten the Yanks. thought Charlie screwed Joe in the playoffs this year - he pitched real well all year and was great in the 2008 playoffs.


    ...if only

    if only we let him go before his was arbitration eligable so we could have kept cliff lee for '10!

    DOH! :mrgreen:
    www.myspace.com
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    The Jeagler wrote:
    pjhawks wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Blanton locked up through 2012 for $24 mil. Not bad at all. Liking the moves, Rube! Liking the moves!

    if only Charlie would have started him in the playoffs instead of our 5th (or 6th) starter in Pedro maybe we would have beaten the Yanks. thought Charlie screwed Joe in the playoffs this year - he pitched real well all year and was great in the 2008 playoffs.


    ...if only

    if only we let him go before his was arbitration eligable so we could have kept cliff lee for '10!

    DOH! :mrgreen:
    Don't get me started on this again please ;)
    Go Birds!!!!
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    jamminpearls wrote:
    The Jeagler wrote:
    pjhawks wrote:

    ...if only

    if only we let him go before his was arbitration eligable so we could have kept cliff lee for '10!

    DOH! :mrgreen:
    Don't get me started on this again please ;)


    hahaha....sad thing is its probably gonna be a constant theme around here if our pitching starts off the same way it did last year...
    www.myspace.com
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,533
    pjhawks wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Blanton locked up through 2012 for $24 mil. Not bad at all. Liking the moves, Rube! Liking the moves!

    if only Charlie would have started him in the playoffs instead of our 5th (or 6th) starter in Pedro maybe we would have beaten the Yanks. thought Charlie screwed Joe in the playoffs this year - he pitched real well all year and was great in the 2008 playoffs.

    ABSOLUTELY.

    And I don't wanna hear about Cliff Lee anymore. Enough.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    if only we let him go before his was arbitration eligable so we could have kept cliff lee for '10!

    DOH! :mrgreen:[/quote]
    Don't get me started on this again please ;)[/quote][/quote]


    hahaha....sad thing is its probably gonna be a constant theme around here if our pitching starts off the same way it did last year...[/quote]

    I here u i think buster onley has a insider thing about why the phillies messed up the whole lee situation. Im not an insider so i couldn't read the whole article.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    jamminpearls wrote:
    if only we let him go before his was arbitration eligable so we could have kept cliff lee for '10!

    DOH! :mrgreen:
    Don't get me started on this again please ;)[/quote][/quote]


    hahaha....sad thing is its probably gonna be a constant theme around here if our pitching starts off the same way it did last year...[/quote]

    I here u i think buster onley has a insider thing about why the phillies messed up the whole lee situation. Im not an insider so i couldn't read the whole article.[/quote]

    do you need to quote properly to gain "insider" status? :mrgreen:
    www.myspace.com
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    pjhawks wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Blanton locked up through 2012 for $24 mil. Not bad at all. Liking the moves, Rube! Liking the moves!

    if only Charlie would have started him in the playoffs instead of our 5th (or 6th) starter in Pedro maybe we would have beaten the Yanks. thought Charlie screwed Joe in the playoffs this year - he pitched real well all year and was great in the 2008 playoffs.

    ABSOLUTELY.

    And I don't wanna hear about Cliff Lee anymore. Enough.

    the ghost of 2010 cliff lee will haunt you for years to come
    www.myspace.com
  • Cliffy6745
    Cliffy6745 Posts: 34,026
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    This could be me nit picking, but I was just looking at Utley's numbers....What's everyone think of Chase's drop in doubles? The 40's to the 20's? I guess that could just be bad luck, but doubles tell me a lot about a hitter more than homers, triples, etc.

    Pretty intersting and looking at his stats the last couple years are really interesting. I am sure you guys could explain this a lot better than most as you watch him every day, but his numbers are fun to look at. The decline in doubles has really taken a toll on his SLG% which is to be expected since his 3B and HR's remained fairly consistent.

    What I do find interesting is that since 2007 he has gone from a .332/.410/.566 (BA/OBP/SLG) to a .282/.397/.508 in 2009 (2008 was down from 2007 as well). Also his walk and K numbers have also increased over the last 3 years from 50 walks and 89 K's in 2007 to 88 walks and 110 K's in 2009.

    Taking a look at FanGraphs, last year he had his lowest line drive % and highest fly ball % of his career. It also looks like he swung at a WHOLE lot less pitches last year than in 2008. In 2009 he only swung at 37% of pitches compared to a career average of 42%.

    It seems to me like he may have been much more selective on pitches over the past year or so which may have hurt him. Has he gone from more of a see the ball-hit the ball hitter to a much more patient hitter?

    This is no knock on Utley at all. He is one of the best players in baseball period. I just love talking baseball and looking at players stats.
  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,919
    Cliffy6745 wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    This could be me nit picking, but I was just looking at Utley's numbers....What's everyone think of Chase's drop in doubles? The 40's to the 20's? I guess that could just be bad luck, but doubles tell me a lot about a hitter more than homers, triples, etc.

    Pretty intersting and looking at his stats the last couple years are really interesting. I am sure you guys could explain this a lot better than most as you watch him every day, but his numbers are fun to look at. The decline in doubles has really taken a toll on his SLG% which is to be expected since his 3B and HR's remained fairly consistent.

    What I do find interesting is that since 2007 he has gone from a .332/.410/.566 (BA/OBP/SLG) to a .282/.397/.508 in 2009 (2008 was down from 2007 as well). Also his walk and K numbers have also increased over the last 3 years from 50 walks and 89 K's in 2007 to 88 walks and 110 K's in 2009.

    Taking a look at FanGraphs, last year he had his lowest line drive % and highest fly ball % of his career. It also looks like he swung at a WHOLE lot less pitches last year than in 2008. In 2009 he only swung at 37% of pitches compared to a career average of 42%.

    It seems to me like he may have been much more selective on pitches over the past year or so which may have hurt him. Has he gone from more of a see the ball-hit the ball hitter to a much more patient hitter?

    This is no knock on Utley at all. He is one of the best players in baseball period. I just love talking baseball and looking at players stats.

    i think the hip problem is something that never really goes away and has affected his swing to some degree. he is still awesome but his swing is not quite as fluid as it once was.
  • Cliffy6745
    Cliffy6745 Posts: 34,026
    pjhawks wrote:
    Cliffy6745 wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    This could be me nit picking, but I was just looking at Utley's numbers....What's everyone think of Chase's drop in doubles? The 40's to the 20's? I guess that could just be bad luck, but doubles tell me a lot about a hitter more than homers, triples, etc.

    Pretty intersting and looking at his stats the last couple years are really interesting. I am sure you guys could explain this a lot better than most as you watch him every day, but his numbers are fun to look at. The decline in doubles has really taken a toll on his SLG% which is to be expected since his 3B and HR's remained fairly consistent.

    What I do find interesting is that since 2007 he has gone from a .332/.410/.566 (BA/OBP/SLG) to a .282/.397/.508 in 2009 (2008 was down from 2007 as well). Also his walk and K numbers have also increased over the last 3 years from 50 walks and 89 K's in 2007 to 88 walks and 110 K's in 2009.

    Taking a look at FanGraphs, last year he had his lowest line drive % and highest fly ball % of his career. It also looks like he swung at a WHOLE lot less pitches last year than in 2008. In 2009 he only swung at 37% of pitches compared to a career average of 42%.

    It seems to me like he may have been much more selective on pitches over the past year or so which may have hurt him. Has he gone from more of a see the ball-hit the ball hitter to a much more patient hitter?

    This is no knock on Utley at all. He is one of the best players in baseball period. I just love talking baseball and looking at players stats.

    i think the hip problem is something that never really goes away and has affected his swing to some degree. he is still awesome but his swing is not quite as fluid as it once was.

    Interesting you say that because I originally had a whole thing about his hip in there but then saw that last year he had more stolen bases than any year in his career so that kind of threw me off.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    The Philadelphia Phillies and All-Star center fielder Shane Victorino have agreed to a three-year contract extension worth $22 million, a source familiar with the club's negotiations told ESPN.com's Jayson Stark.




    Victorino

    The deal would keep him under contract with the Phillies through 2012.

    Victorino earned his second straight Golden Glove award in 2009 while hitting .292 with 62 RBIs, 10 home runs, 13 triples, 39 doubles, and 25 stolen bases.

    The Victorino deal follows Thursday's announcement that the Phillies had signed 29-year-old right-hander Joe Blanton to a three-year, $24 million extension.

    Victorino made $3.125 million in 2009. He asked for $5.8 million in arbitration, and the Phillies had offered $4.75 million.

    Assistant GM Scott Proefrock told The Associated Press the Phillies were also negotiating with catcher Carlos Ruiz, the only other Phillie in arbitration, and hoped to sign him within a week.

    Now this is a damn good deal
    Go Birds!!!!
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,533
    Yes, and.....YES.

    http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/201 ... a_day.html
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    Manuel talks about what could have been had we kept Lee. Obviously Blanton wouldn't have stayed, but you have to appreciate the honesty here:

    http://www.csnphilly.com/pages/landing_ ... feedID=704

    The downside to the acquisition of Halladay was that it resulted in Cliff Lee’s departure to Seattle. The team said it dealt Lee because it wanted to add prospects to a minor-league system that had been hit hard by trades. It’s also possible that finances played a part in the Phillies’ thinking, though team officials have downplayed that.

    Lee was due to make $9 million in 2010; Halladay $15.75. The Phils received $6 million from Toronto in the Halladay trade. All this will help the Phils keep their payroll at about $140 million, which will be one of the highest in the game.

    Manuel would have loved to have kept Lee, but that doesn’t make him unique. Phillies fans far and wide share the sentiment.

    “I’m not necessarily disappointed because I understand the baseball aspect of it,’’ Manuel said. “When I was a player-development guy, I was more of a long-range guy. But now I’m a major league manager and I’m more for the now, not three or four years down the road.

    “As a manager in the big leagues, I look to put the best team on the field that’s possible at that moment. That’s where Lee comes into play. The financial part, I have nothing to do with that. I want to put the best possible team on the field. I don’t know if that makes me selfish, but that’s how you play the game. That’s how the Yankees do it.

    “I talked to Lee. He liked us and wanted to stay. If Halladay is the best pitcher in the game, Lee isn’t too far behind. With Halladay and Lee – it’s a no-brainer – we’re better. Don’t get me wrong, I like our pitching. I think [Cole] Hamels is going to turn it around. He’s probably the biggest reason we won the World Series [in 2008], and he can be that guy again. But with Halladay, Lee, Hamels, Blanton and [J.A.] Happ, we’re better.’’

    With Jamie Moyer recovering from groin and knee surgeries, Manuel said that Kyle Kendrick would get a long look for the No. 5 starter’s job in spring training. The top four is set with Halladay, Hamels, Blanton and Happ
    www.myspace.com
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    jamminpearls wrote:
    The Philadelphia Phillies and All-Star center fielder Shane Victorino have agreed to a three-year contract extension worth $22 million, a source familiar with the club's negotiations told ESPN.com's Jayson Stark.




    Victorino

    The deal would keep him under contract with the Phillies through 2012.

    Victorino earned his second straight Golden Glove award in 2009 while hitting .292 with 62 RBIs, 10 home runs, 13 triples, 39 doubles, and 25 stolen bases.

    The Victorino deal follows Thursday's announcement that the Phillies had signed 29-year-old right-hander Joe Blanton to a three-year, $24 million extension.

    Victorino made $3.125 million in 2009. He asked for $5.8 million in arbitration, and the Phillies had offered $4.75 million.

    Assistant GM Scott Proefrock told The Associated Press the Phillies were also negotiating with catcher Carlos Ruiz, the only other Phillie in arbitration, and hoped to sign him within a week.

    Now this is a damn good deal
    :clap::clap:
    www.myspace.com
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,533
    Phils have the best beat writers......an interesting article from Andy Martino...

    http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/Loo ... _2011.html

    "Just a thought: For everyone who is still upset about paying Joe Blanton and not Cliff Lee, keep 2011 and beyond in your mind. Knowing the money they had tied up for 2011, the team had an idea it was basically impossible to meet what Lee will bring in free agency next offseason. So instead, the team chose three years of an affordable Joe Blanton along with three prospects over one year of Cliff Lee. Will that backfire? It's certainly possible.

    Even if Werth ends up being out of the picture, does the team still have enough flexibility to fill out the rest of the roster for 2011? Or does someone under contract need to be traded to free up cash?

    It's all a ways down the road, but nearly every move the Phillies have made this offseason was done with 2011 in mind, too."

    Thank you, Andy. Now please let the Cliff Lee nonsense go.
  • booomm11
    booomm11 Posts: 865
    anxiously waiting...
    being so KiND.. tO LEt me RiDe!!!
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Phils have the best beat writers......an interesting article from Andy Martino...

    http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/Loo ... _2011.html

    "Just a thought: For everyone who is still upset about paying Joe Blanton and not Cliff Lee, keep 2011 and beyond in your mind. Knowing the money they had tied up for 2011, the team had an idea it was basically impossible to meet what Lee will bring in free agency next offseason. So instead, the team chose three years of an affordable Joe Blanton along with three prospects over one year of Cliff Lee. Will that backfire? It's certainly possible.

    Even if Werth ends up being out of the picture, does the team still have enough flexibility to fill out the rest of the roster for 2011? Or does someone under contract need to be traded to free up cash?

    It's all a ways down the road, but nearly every move the Phillies have made this offseason was done with 2011 in mind, too."

    Thank you, Andy. Now please let the Cliff Lee nonsense go.

    see, that doesnt do it for me. i agree this is a stale argument that never goes anwhere and i know we got these prospects, but thats all they are prospects. no guarantees. if we kept lee, we would have gotten 2 first rounders after he walked who would have taken longer to develop, but they're first rounders none the less. we still have your boy brown to take over in the outfield if/when werth walks. and keeping lee would have meant we'd be odds on favorites to win the world series, not just get there again....and it would have meant a once in a liftime opportunity of having the greatest rotation in the 150 year old history of the phils...it's not nonsense. its something that could have happened and will haunt this team if the staff performs like they did much of last year.

    how bout a lefty in the pen? any updates on that?
    www.myspace.com
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    The Jeagler wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Phils have the best beat writers......an interesting article from Andy Martino...

    http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/Loo ... _2011.html

    "Just a thought: For everyone who is still upset about paying Joe Blanton and not Cliff Lee, keep 2011 and beyond in your mind. Knowing the money they had tied up for 2011, the team had an idea it was basically impossible to meet what Lee will bring in free agency next offseason. So instead, the team chose three years of an affordable Joe Blanton along with three prospects over one year of Cliff Lee. Will that backfire? It's certainly possible.

    Even if Werth ends up being out of the picture, does the team still have enough flexibility to fill out the rest of the roster for 2011? Or does someone under contract need to be traded to free up cash?

    It's all a ways down the road, but nearly every move the Phillies have made this offseason was done with 2011 in mind, too."

    Thank you, Andy. Now please let the Cliff Lee nonsense go.

    see, that doesnt do it for me. i agree this is a stale argument that never goes anwhere and i know we got these prospects, but thats all they are prospects. no guarantees. if we kept lee, we would have gotten 2 first rounders after he walked who would have taken longer to develop, but they're first rounders none the less. we still have your boy brown to take over in the outfield if/when werth walks. and keeping lee would have meant we'd be odds on favorites to win the world series, not just get there again....and it would have meant a once in a liftime opportunity of having the greatest rotation in the 150 year old history of the phils...it's not nonsense. its something that could have happened and will haunt this team if the staff performs like they did much of last year.

    how bout a lefty in the pen? any updates on that?
    Agree 100% wow :)
    Go Birds!!!!
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,597
    jamminpearls wrote:
    The Jeagler wrote:
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Phils have the best beat writers......an interesting article from Andy Martino...

    http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/Loo ... _2011.html

    "Just a thought: For everyone who is still upset about paying Joe Blanton and not Cliff Lee, keep 2011 and beyond in your mind. Knowing the money they had tied up for 2011, the team had an idea it was basically impossible to meet what Lee will bring in free agency next offseason. So instead, the team chose three years of an affordable Joe Blanton along with three prospects over one year of Cliff Lee. Will that backfire? It's certainly possible.

    Even if Werth ends up being out of the picture, does the team still have enough flexibility to fill out the rest of the roster for 2011? Or does someone under contract need to be traded to free up cash?

    It's all a ways down the road, but nearly every move the Phillies have made this offseason was done with 2011 in mind, too."

    Thank you, Andy. Now please let the Cliff Lee nonsense go.

    see, that doesnt do it for me. i agree this is a stale argument that never goes anwhere and i know we got these prospects, but thats all they are prospects. no guarantees. if we kept lee, we would have gotten 2 first rounders after he walked who would have taken longer to develop, but they're first rounders none the less. we still have your boy brown to take over in the outfield if/when werth walks. and keeping lee would have meant we'd be odds on favorites to win the world series, not just get there again....and it would have meant a once in a liftime opportunity of having the greatest rotation in the 150 year old history of the phils...it's not nonsense. its something that could have happened and will haunt this team if the staff performs like they did much of last year.

    how bout a lefty in the pen? any updates on that?
    Agree 100% wow :)

    that's cuz its a different sport i guess! :mrgreen:
    www.myspace.com
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