PJ fans in 12 step Recovery

Heatherj43 wrote:

soulsinging wrote:

locked wrote:

I tend to be more of a rebel AA'er..
a buddy of mine in AA once said to me..
"I've met alot of long timers and I've concluded that I don't want SOME PEOPLE's sobriety"!

I agree 100%...

AA is a loosely run organization that saved my life..
but because it is so loosely run, we can meet alot of A** holes who think they are the CEO's of AA...

But don't let some jerks in the program run you out of the program..

It worked once when nothing else did.. right?

Both of you put together some serious time being sober.

If you look back on that time and would rather "do life" using...then your decision is easy?

If not, jump back into a new group.. frankly most of us are too self-centered to spend time taking your inventory...

oh i'd have no qualms going back if needed. i'm not a proud guy. i was just wound so tight i figured what was the point if i was no happier than when i was using? guess the honeymoon ended for me here's hoping the rest of y'all find what i couldn't in the rooms!

I remember when you first joined the program. I thought you'd make it, and I guess you did. I wish they had meetings for people like us. It seems once you relapse, you are put in some other catagory. Frick, we are addicts. Relapse is a huge part of the disease. The hoighty toighty's act like after a relapse, we are some kind of second class people in the program, or its almost like we are visitors in THEIR neetings. Them tables are mine too, but I hate that additude. Once again, I know many like us and have been talking about doing step studies in our homes, where we can do are own thing without being looked down on by these prima donna addicts. I don't know how they got such a big head that they think relapse is so far away from them. I only hope God is with them when it happens. It will be a shock for a minute, well until their next high. I wish you lived near us, You would love that type of meeting.

Heatherj43 wrote:

hollow bottle wrote:

What happened to me was that they all put me on a pedastal so high that when I relapsed you'd of thought WWIII started. I've been back out on a relapse about 10 years, yet those 11 years clean won't go away. I still get shit from my kids and they have no idea just what I use and how much. They both use and justify it somehow. They are both addicts!
They piss me off. Theye expect way too much out of me. I am an addict, duh!

This isn't an N.A. or A.A. forum, so not a place to get clean. They have forums like that, by the way.
The title read PJ fans in 12 step recovery. I spent most of my adult life in recovery. I feel my story has room here. If someone can relapse after 11 years, it clearly shows that complacency is nothing to mess around with. Also, I have lots, too many to count, of people I know from the program who all relapsed around their 8 to 9 year mark! That is something everyone in recovery should be aware of. It does happen and too many people, with a lot of clean time, get some kind of thought in their head that they are far removed from using again, they are not, and I know mnay people who have proven that.
I am being honest. I know too many who went back out after 8 years or so. These people worked a good solid program too. They attended meetings often, did service work, did all the things they were suppose to and some. They were pillars of recovery, people most would want as a sponsor, yet they all went back out.
When talking about recovery, you can't bury your head in the sand and act like relapses don't happen, they do and are part of the program. Isn't there a chapter in the N. A. book titled "Relapse and Recovery"? There is cuz its part of the program. I welcome you wishing me hope I get clean, but in return I am wishing you keep that part in your recovery and realize a relapse is a split second away. It is needed to be talked about.
Just you saying this isn't the place to talk about that is one of the reasons I am still staying away from meetings. Meetings are for addicts! You don't have to be clean to attend, and you surely better know the reasons you do attend, its cuz of the possibility of relapse, otherwise you must be cured, eh?

Read the 12 steps of AA again and then read your posts. If you were so involved with AA or NA, you would know that you can't possibly use or drink and work a 12 step program if you are trully and addict/alcoholic. I know that it is a 24 hour program and I am 1 sip away from insanity. Are you telling me that you have figured out a way to use successfully? You must have because you work the 12 steps in every other part of your life. That is bullshit. You are not fulling anybody. Either you forgot what the big book or NA book says or you are in serious denial. Either way, you are really not going to help anybody who wants to stop drinking, especially a newcomer. Save your old AA stories of how much service work you did. You are using and that is the bottom line. I know I don't want to use and I know I have an allergy. I also know there are others here reading this who are just like me. Possibly even you. Your posts are poison to them.

The one thing I've noticed about AA is that if the program is working everyone wants to stay sober and wants everyone else to stay sober, too. That is the core of the whole thing, isn't it? Relapse or no relapse, we're not counting the days behind us but counting the 24 hours ahead. I respect the guy who comes to his first meeting just as much as the guy who has been there for 20 years, they are both focusing on the days ahead with equal intent.

As a newcomer, I agree that it is hard to hear about people relapsing and it does shake my confidence a little. But on the other hand, it is a warning sign that I can't ignore, so I do appreciate people who have decided to go back to using sharing that experience with us.

'United we stand and divided we fall', it's an old adage but a good one that I found in the Big Book.

I know you all have Thanksgiving coming up, so I wish you all happy, sober holidays and hope that you all stay safe.

i shit and i stink wrote:

The one thing I've noticed about AA is that if the program is working everyone wants to stay sober and wants everyone else to stay sober, too. That is the core of the whole thing, isn't it? Relapse or no relapse, we're not counting the days behind us but counting the 24 hours ahead. I respect the guy who comes to his first meeting just as much as the guy who has been there for 20 years, they are both focusing on the days ahead with equal intent.

As a newcomer, I agree that it is hard to hear about people relapsing and it does shake my confidence a little. But on the other hand, it is a warning sign that I can't ignore, so I do appreciate people who have decided to go back to using sharing that experience with us.

'United we stand and divided we fall', it's an old adage but a good one that I found in the Big Book.

I know you all have Thanksgiving coming up, so I wish you all happy, sober holidays and hope that you all stay safe.

Right on. But don't forget the "Twelve Steps." That is what I have to be working on to stay sober. The rooms are the fellowship. There are active and recovering alcoholics in their. Some are lieing and others are telling the truth about their experience. Even if it is true for them, it has to jive with the Big Book. If they can back up what they are sharing in the Big Book, it is useful. If not, it is unhealthy for the newcomer. I am so glad that you are taking this seriously. 24 hours at a time I stay free!

hollow bottle wrote:

Heatherj43 wrote:

hollow bottle wrote:

What happened to me was that they all put me on a pedastal so high that when I relapsed you'd of thought WWIII started. I've been back out on a relapse about 10 years, yet those 11 years clean won't go away. I still get shit from my kids and they have no idea just what I use and how much. They both use and justify it somehow. They are both addicts!
They piss me off. Theye expect way too much out of me. I am an addict, duh!

This isn't an N.A. or A.A. forum, so not a place to get clean. They have forums like that, by the way.
The title read PJ fans in 12 step recovery. I spent most of my adult life in recovery. I feel my story has room here. If someone can relapse after 11 years, it clearly shows that complacency is nothing to mess around with. Also, I have lots, too many to count, of people I know from the program who all relapsed around their 8 to 9 year mark! That is something everyone in recovery should be aware of. It does happen and too many people, with a lot of clean time, get some kind of thought in their head that they are far removed from using again, they are not, and I know mnay people who have proven that.
I am being honest. I know too many who went back out after 8 years or so. These people worked a good solid program too. They attended meetings often, did service work, did all the things they were suppose to and some. They were pillars of recovery, people most would want as a sponsor, yet they all went back out.
When talking about recovery, you can't bury your head in the sand and act like relapses don't happen, they do and are part of the program. Isn't there a chapter in the N. A. book titled "Relapse and Recovery"? There is cuz its part of the program. I welcome you wishing me hope I get clean, but in return I am wishing you keep that part in your recovery and realize a relapse is a split second away. It is needed to be talked about.
Just you saying this isn't the place to talk about that is one of the reasons I am still staying away from meetings. Meetings are for addicts! You don't have to be clean to attend, and you surely better know the reasons you do attend, its cuz of the possibility of relapse, otherwise you must be cured, eh?

Read the 12 steps of AA again and then read your posts. If you were so involved with AA or NA, you would know that you can't possibly use or drink and work a 12 step program if you are trully and addict/alcoholic. I know that it is a 24 hour program and I am 1 sip away from insanity. Are you telling me that you have figured out a way to use successfully? You must have because you work the 12 steps in every other part of your life. That is bullshit. You are not fulling anybody. Either you forgot what the big book or NA book says or you are in serious denial. Either way, you are really not going to help anybody who wants to stop drinking, especially a newcomer. Save your old AA stories of how much service work you did. You are using and that is the bottom line. I know I don't want to use and I know I have an allergy. I also know there are others here reading this who are just like me. Possibly even you. Your posts are poison to them.

Nope, I haven't found a way to use successfully. But, after so many years in recovery, a lot of those cliche's, that we all end up living by, don't just disappear cuz you relapsed. Therefore, they are just there. It is second nature to use those steps in all your affairs, even thought it has nothing to do with using. You do know that only the first step mentions drugs or alochol, after that all the thinsg you learn in the program are for all areas of your life, and yes, I naturally use them for all areas of my life.
Nw, your langauge to me makes me wonder if you've reached step 12 yet?
All I can say, is I hope you never relapse to learn what I am telling you, but please don't tell me my own experience. It is MINE, not yours, so you haven't a clue.

nice to see this thread. i'll be back here in a month. i was supposed to leave this morning for a 28 day program but i need to have some teeth pulled so i leave in a couple days.
can't wait...

Does everyone understand that if the 12 steps were only for those who have quit whatever they go to 12 step meetings for, we wouldn't need meetings. If it were that easy, then just quit and be done with it. It isn't that easy.
I had 11 years. I do understand the steps, etc. I do enjoy being around people who are in a 12 step program. But, there are many things said at meetings that drive me crazy.
Like, "stay with the winners". Well, that would mean no one would want to be around me, since I did relapse. People will say, "don't get in a relationship the first year". There is no where in any book that says that. What it says is, don't make any major changes in the fisrt year.
I could go on and on.
I am happy for those who have found their way to meetings, but it will take me awhile to get past how much I hate them. They did save me all those years, but at this point I need to be around people who have relapsed, after a long time of sobriety, and understand that all that BS said at meetings is just that, BS.
I need to find winners. And it won't be with people who pass all that junk off as truth. My winners at this time are these people who are out here with me and talking with me about getting clean again. We talk about what drove us away, what keeps us away, and what it will take to get back.
I hope I will make it back, until then, I shouldn't be shunned. If people at meetings shun users, then what is the purpose of meetings. None of us went in clean, unless you were locked up or soemthing. Everyone comes in as a user and everyone is one minute away from being what you are shunning. Its the nature of the beast.
okay, I am done. I don't want to have a meeting on a PJ site. They have sites online for that, by the way.

i shit and i stink wrote:

Heatherj43 wrote:

I

If you are looking for a reason not to go back to meetings, you'll always find it..

.

Agree 100%..

and please don't put too much meaning into the "stick with the winners" expression..

My take on it is not about exclusion, it encourages you to surround yourself with people who want to stay sober.. rather than people who will create a temptation to use..