The 2008 New York Yankees

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  • Chicago Posts: 7,775
    Champagne Breakfast wrote:
    Sooooo Mr. Johan Santana.
    I'm not sure how I feel about the idea of trading Phil Hughes and Melky. But Johan is a rare breed. I prefer trading Kennedy than Hughes. Either way Robinson Cano would have a heart attack. But,..I did hear if Melky goes Yanks would pursue Aaron Rowand. That would be sick

    it would be real tough to see melky go. good switch hitter, with a rocket for an arm. i'm not too sure about getting rid of hughes either......... tough calls all around.
  • Posts: 31,532
    folks all i know is that SANTANA cannot i repeat cannot end up in BOSTON ,so if he ends up withthe METS OR YANKEES it will be ok by me but i can't stress enough he can not end up as a RED SOX ,that would be an unbeatable staff ,BECKET,SANTANA,SHILLING,DICEK ,enough said .....
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Posts: 7,249
    If the yankees can send Melky, Kennedy, and another prospect and keep Phil, Joba, & Cano I would be very happy with that.

    I'm sure the twins will want hughes/melky though. Also austin jackson's name has floated out there too. I'd like to see the yankees hold on to him if they can to see what he can do.

    If they trade melky the yanks will go after Rowand and he might be good for this team as long as they don't overpay for him.
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  • Posts: 1,526
    i read one rumor today that had red sox as the front runner sending coco crisp, lester, and 2 prospects (lowrie ss & masterson sp).

    minnesota would be completely dementedto make that trade. i just can't see how that would make sense. not even including ellsbury or bucholz??
    no way
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  • Posts: 302
    the panic in the air makes me want to dance.....
    "This guy back here is giving me the ole one more....one more back to you buddy."

    - Mr. Edward Vedder 7/11/03


  • Posts: 15,813
    posada=

    4 years @ 52 million.


    sweet
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  • Posts: 3,175
    $52 Million
  • Posts: 15,813
    Fighting Hellfish wrote:
    $52 Million


    whoops

    :)
    For the ones who had a notion, a notion deep inside
    That it ain't no sin to be glad you're alive
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    Donate Organs and Save a Life
  • Posts: 777
    Champagne Breakfast wrote:
    i read one rumor today that had red sox as the front runner sending coco crisp, lester, and 2 prospects (lowrie ss & masterson sp).

    minnesota would be completely dementedto make that trade. i just can't see how that would make sense. not even including ellsbury or bucholz??
    no way

    they're not making this trade. not even close. i don't think boston is seriously interested in santana. this is all just an attempt to make hank "isiah" steinbrenner panic. and it sounds like it's working.

    i don't know if i can deal with the yankees this year if it turns out that hank is actually dumb enough to trade phil hughes.

    and now we're supposed to believe that not only is santana better than the yankees' package (hughes, cabrera, alan horne, jose tabata, and possibly kennedy), he's $150 to $200 million better. because that's what it's gonna cost to get him signed. i don't know that i'd give him that kind of money even without having to sacrifice half the team.

    why? because josh beckett beats johan santana in game 7. every single time.

    http://keephughes.blogspot.com/
  • Posts: 28,596
    I hope they don't trade Hughes. They spend the last 3 years refusing to trade him. And now it's like he's a throwaway. I was getting excited about next year with Hughes,Chamberlain, and Kennedy in the rotation. I hope the Twins wait til mid-season to see if they're still in the race to keep him or not.
    I miss igotid88
  • Posts: 1,902
    So this is where all the Yanks talk has gone. Shoulda known there was already a thread for 08.

    I don't get the owner of the Twins. He is one of the richest guys (worth a couple BILLION) anywhere, yet he won't pay to keep Johan.
    I think the Boston rumors are just to drive the price up in hopes that Cashman budges on one of the "untouchables".
    Brian
  • Posts: 777
    igotid88 wrote:
    I hope they don't trade Hughes. They spend the last 3 years refusing to trade him. And now it's like he's a throwaway. I was getting excited about next year with Hughes,Chamberlain, and Kennedy in the rotation. I hope the Twins wait til mid-season to see if they're still in the race to keep him or not.

    well... i wouldn't exactly use the term "throwaway" when the return on him is the best pitcher in baseball. but i certainly agree that it's a dumb move.

    there were many reasons why the yankees lost to cleveland. for me, "lack of johan santana" was no higher than number five on the list.

    right now, the guy who should be their top priority is in houston trying to hide from george mitchell's "independent" investigation. :rolleyes: and that's a damn shame...

    andy pettitte defines the concept of a big game pitcher, which is something that all the sabermetric statistics in the world can't account for.
  • Posts: 777
    NCBRI wrote:
    So this is where all the Yanks talk has gone. Shoulda known there was already a thread for 08.

    I don't get the owner of the Twins. He is one of the richest guys (worth a couple BILLION) anywhere, yet he won't pay to keep Johan.
    I think the Boston rumors are just to drive the price up in hopes that Cashman budges on one of the "untouchables".

    he's worth more money than steinbrenner, and yet steinbrenner has to write him a check every year to "balance things out." what's wrong with this picture?

    maybe he should spend a little bit of that money on a financial advisor who can explain to him that the resulting loss in revenue from trading santana will in fact exceed santana's projected salary over the next five to seven years.

    and perhaps an even bigger issue here is that phil hughes will be right back on the market in three or four years when the twins decide that he's too expensive to keep. at that point, they'll once again be able to hold the yankees hostage while threatening to send hughes to boston. is this what we really want???
  • Posts: 1,078
    i hope the latest boston rumor is true (crisp, lester, lowrie and a prospect) because i, as a red sox fan, would do that in a heart beat.

    that being said, i don't know what to think about the yankees right now. i'm not sure who is in charge (i'll say hank has the upper hand over cashman). the yanks say one thing (if a-rod ops out, we will not sign him) and then do another (re-sign a-rod).

    if the yanks were to get santana (we'll say hughes, melky and 2 prospects - one mid-level and one low-level - gets it done) and then they sign santana to a contract for an average of $22-25mil/year, that would be an average of $50mil+ to TWO players.

    the one thing that irks me is what posada said today about needing an ace. yeah, we all know that wang really isn't a true ace, but he's 'technically' the ace of the staff as of right now. posada could have had a nice buffer statement praising chien-ming wang (i mean, he does have the most wins in the majors the last couple years) and then said something to the effect of "when you have a chance to get a player of johan santana's caliber..."

    between that and hank's comment a couple weeks ago after signing posada and rivera (saying now we have everyone back without a single mention of pettitte) doesn't really give me a "team" vibe. just my opinion.
  • Posts: 1,078
    BetterManningNYG wrote:
    he's worth more money than steinbrenner, and yet steinbrenner has to write him a check every year to "balance things out." what's wrong with this picture?

    any team that gets money from luxury tax is in no way, shape or form poor. i mean, they OWN a baseball team. i know it is not a perfect system, but i'll take baseball under these rules rather than no baseball at all (aka - strike).

    i would love to see a minimum salary introduced, even if it is something as "small" as $35-40mil.

    the fact that the twins owner is worth $3 BILLION and doesn't ante up a little is a complete joke.
  • Posts: 3,175
    It's Baseball Welfare, and the math is simple. Teams collect $30 million from the TV deal, and $30 million in revenue sharing (Steinbrenner Socialism). Now with that $60 million in hand on Opening day, without selling one ticket, or one ad during your games, you can either:

    Spend some money, and field a competitive team

    Field a squad of AAA'ers, with a $10-15 mil payroll, and clear an instant $45 mil profit, and put George's handout into your pocket.

    Obviously most teams that are on baseball welfare choose option # 2. As noted above, pohlad (Twins owner) is one of the richest men in the world. If I'm a Minnesota fan, I'm disgusted. You have the best pitcher in baseball, and one of the best closers. Both could very well be playing elsewhere next year. And don't get too attached to whomever comes over in any trades. They'll be on the block in a few years when they have to be paid more than the league minimum
  • Posts: 777
    JSBE wrote:
    i hope the latest boston rumor is true (crisp, lester, lowrie and a prospect) because i, as a red sox fan, would do that in a heart beat.

    i have to tell you though, i just don't think it makes much sense from the twins point of view. i'm personally still of the opinion that a third team will end up making a huge offer, and that's fine by me.
    JSBE wrote:
    if the yanks were to get santana (we'll say hughes, melky and 2 prospects - one mid-level and one low-level - gets it done) and then they sign santana to a contract for an average of $22-25mil/year, that would be an average of $50mil+ to TWO players.

    right. now add in the $18 million per year that they'd be forced to pay aaron rowand to replace melky in CF. now it's getting ridiculous.

    then look at how much they're neglecting andy pettitte and the whole thing looks like a mirror image of the 2003-04 offseason. where's paul quantrill?
    JSBE wrote:
    between that and hank's comment a couple weeks ago after signing posada and rivera (saying now we have everyone back without a single mention of pettitte) doesn't really give me a "team" vibe. just my opinion.

    i agree 100%. all the more reason to keep the homegrown pitchers. rooting for the uniform (rather than the players) gets old really quickly.
    JSBE wrote:
    any team that gets money from luxury tax is in no way, shape or form poor. i mean, they OWN a baseball team. i know it is not a perfect system, but i'll take baseball under these rules rather than no baseball at all (aka - strike).

    i would love to see a minimum salary introduced, even if it is something as "small" as $35-40mil.

    the fact that the twins owner is worth $3 BILLION and doesn't ante up a little is a complete joke.

    a minimum salary cap would be a great idea.

    another possibility would be to require the owners to invest their luxury tax/revenue sharing money into their team. why should they get to pocket that money?
  • Posts: 777
    the bottom line on revenue sharing:

    it's supposed to be for the fans, not the owners.
  • Posts: 6,996
    BetterManningNYG wrote:
    i have to tell you though, i just don't think it makes much sense from the twins point of view. i'm personally still of the opinion that a third team will end up making a huge offer, and that's fine by me.

    As a Red Sox fan I kind of agree with you that the Sox aren't offering that much - in terms of players from their major league roster - for Santana.

    Here's why I think is why the Twins are receptive of their offer (but I think another team can definitely top it):

    Coco Crisp - he only has 2 years on his contract and is shade below Hunter defensively, but has a bad arm. Comparable hitter to Melky and the Twins have always liked him. Plus he'd just be keeping the spot warm for Ben Revere who is the Twins top Prospect and should be major league ready in 2 seasons

    Jed Lowrie - can play either 2nd or SS - is major league ready and the Twins need a ss now that they traded their ss Bartlett in the Young deal - currently the Sox 2nd best hitting prospect

    Jon Lester - Sox second best pitching prospect - obviously has a tough makeup after battling cancer - could be a good 2 or 3 starter - 11-2 in the majors after 26 starts

    Either Justin Masterson or Michel Bowden - don't know too much about them except they were both in AA and are the Sox 3rd and 4th best pitching prospects respectively
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  • Posts: 777
    Solat13 wrote:
    As a Red Sox fan I kind of agree with you that the Sox aren't offering that much - in terms of players from their major league roster - for Santana.

    Here's why I think is why the Twins are receptive of their offer (but I think another team can definitely top it):

    Coco Crisp - he only has 2 years on his contract and is shade below Hunter defensively, but has a bad arm. Comparable hitter to Melky and the Twins have always liked him. Plus he'd just be keeping the spot warm for Ben Revere who is the Twins top Prospect and should be major league ready in 2 seasons

    Jed Lowrie - can play either 2nd or SS - is major league ready and the Twins need a ss now that they traded their ss Bartlett in the Young deal - currently the Sox 2nd best hitting prospect

    Jon Lester - Sox second best pitching prospect - obviously has a tough makeup after battling cancer - could be a good 2 or 3 starter - 11-2 in the majors after 26 starts

    Either Justin Masterson or Michel Bowden - don't know too much about them except they were both in AA and are the Sox 3rd and 4th best pitching prospects respectively

    it's not that it's a bad package. but usually, a trade like this has to include that one prospect who has the potential to eventually be as valuable as the guy he's replacing. in this case, it would have to be either ellsbury or buchholz. jon lester is gonna be a very good pitcher, but he's never gonna make twins fans forget about santana. this is exactly the reason why i don't think the yankees can get it done without giving up hughes.

    and while i understand the crisp argument, i really can't imagine that a stopgap CF is gonna make or break a deal for the best pitcher in baseball. they could find their CF elsewhere if they needed to.

    i don't really know enough about lowrie to comment. i know that a lot of people seem to think highly of masterson and bowden. their value is probably similar to that of alan horne (who many scouts believe will be better than ian kennedy, and will likely be the second pitcher sent to minnesota if the yankees acquire santana).

    but the bottom line is this: if the red sox aren't willing to part with clay buchholz, the yankees shouldn't be willing to part with phil hughes.

    and one thing that bothers me is the popular notion among the media (and among yankee fans) that it is the yankees' responsibility to prevent the red sox from getting better. it isn't. the yankees can only worry about the yankees.

    the last time the yankees panicked like this, they ended up with kevin brown, gary sheffield, alex rodriguez, kenny lofton, and an absolute trainwreck of a team. let's be honest here: that team was a disaster even with a 3-0 lead in the ALCS. there's no reason why it should have even gotten to that point in the first place.

    the indians, angels, mariners, and tigers have just as much to worry about as the yankees do in regards to the red sox. those are the teams that will be facing boston in the first round every october. maybe one of those teams could jump in here with a competitive offer. that might be fun. :)

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