In the beginning, there was no baseball. But ever since there have been few beginnings as good as the start of a new baseball season. It is the most splendid time in sport.
B.J. Phillips (Time, 1981)
I’m reading a book on baseball, and I just loved this.
apparently si ranked ruben as the 19th best gm in baseball. yikes...although i am not as big a fan of him as some, 19 is pretty ridiculous. here is gonzo's take on it from the inquirer:
Gonzo: Sports Illustrated short-shrifts Amaro
POSTED: March 9, 2010 By John Gonzalez
There was a time when I was really into Sports Illustrated. Kathy Ireland had a lot to do with that, but I dug the stories, too - so much so that I kept every issue of SI from when I was 8 years old until I turned 18. (As you might imagine, I was a huge hit with the ladies back then.)
At some point, for reasons I can't fully remember, I stopped archiving the magazine. Then I gave up reading it all together. I was thinking about renewing my subscription until I recently stumbled upon SI's rankings of baseball's general managers. I doubt Time Warner will be getting a check from me anytime soon.
The Phils' Ruben Amaro Jr. didn't even make it into the top half of MLB's general managers in Sports Illustrated's puzzling assessment. The Cliff Lee trade apparently hurt his ranking.
Phils spring training Phils spring training Slim Charlie Manuel
If you expected Phils shot-caller Ruben Amaro Jr. - a guy who made some of the biggest trades in baseball over the last year and also helped build a team that reached two straight World Series - to be in the top 10, you guessed too high. If you thought the Fightin's' 93 wins last season were enough to move Amaro into the top half of MLB's 30 GMs, you thought wrong. And if you believe he's done better work than Chicago Cubs GM Jim Hendry - who came in at No. 16 on SI's list, despite the fact that his club cratered last season and he threw lots of money at walking tantrum Milton Bradley - then you obviously fail to follow SI's peculiar logic.
Amaro was rated 19th, just four spots in front of Mike Rizzo from the Nationals and seven ahead of Omar Minaya of the Mets. Combined, the Nats and Mets won only 36 more games than the Phils last season. Even stranger: Amaro barely beat out Pirates GM Neal Huntington, who filled the No. 20 slot. Did you know they still played baseball in Pittsburgh? Me, either.
Here's SI's curious explanation: "One pennant in one year is a nice record, and having landed two of baseball's five best pitchers - Roy Halladay and Cliff Lee - in trade within a few months is even better given that these were moves he alone gets credit for. On the other hand the truly strange trade sending Lee to Seattle and the odd, if so far successful, decision to sign 37-year-old designated hitter-masquerading-as-an-outfielder Raul Ibanez to a long-term contract have to count heavily against him."
Uh-huh. To review: The mag stipulated that going one-for-one on the pennant front is impressive and gave Amaro credit for acquiring Halladay and Lee and the "so far successful" Ibanez. (By the way: Ibanez turns 38 this June, but his deal expires next season. When did three years become a "long-term" contract?)
The big beef seems to be Amaro's decision to ship Lee to Seattle, and that's fair enough. But when measured against Amaro's obvious success and the fact that he locked up one of the game's best pitchers without paying a hefty open-market free-agent price, how does the good not outweigh the bad and secure the guy a higher spot on the list? No credit for grabbing Placido Polanco? No nod for keeping Shane Victorino in town? SI makes Amaro sound like a slightly less worrisome version of Ed Wade - a man potentially capable of drowning facedown in his Froot Loops if left unattended too long.
If you're curious, SI had Wade ranked 29th. At least the mag got something right
I guess they are looking at it like they don't have enough information yet since he is only a year or two in. Probably too early to tell and that is why he is ranked so low.
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
I guess they are looking at it like they don't have enough information yet since he is only a year or two in. Probably too early to tell and that is why he is ranked so low.
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
yeah i am not a fan of 3 years for ibanez. not fan of the lee trade. and not a fan of giving moyer 2 years at age 60....all that said, and with only a year under his belt, i was thinking he'd at least be in the top half of gm's.
sports illustrated is pretty much irrelevant at this point anyway though.
I guess they are looking at it like they don't have enough information yet since he is only a year or two in. Probably too early to tell and that is why he is ranked so low.
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
yeah i am not a fan of 3 years for ibanez. not fan of the lee trade. and not a fan of giving moyer 2 years at age 60....all that said, and with only a year under his belt, i was thinking he'd at least be in the top half of gm's.
sports illustrated is pretty much irrelevant at this point anyway though.
I hear you and didn't read the explanation on all the GM's ahead of him. I completely forgot about the Moyer deal, yeah.....
I agree with you though.
I still like SI. They have Poznanski writing for them now, who I think is one of the best baseball writers ever. I also still like Verducci, even though he has a hard on for Selena Roberts and won't criticize her.
I guess they are looking at it like they don't have enough information yet since he is only a year or two in. Probably too early to tell and that is why he is ranked so low.
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
yeah i am not a fan of 3 years for ibanez. not fan of the lee trade. and not a fan of giving moyer 2 years at age 60....all that said, and with only a year under his belt, i was thinking he'd at least be in the top half of gm's.
sports illustrated is pretty much irrelevant at this point anyway though.
I'm not a fan of locking up Victorino for three years. Basically they had a choice this off season lock up Werth or Shane and they chose Shane. I know he's valuable as a CF, but unless the owners raise the payroll threshhold for next year allowing them to keep Werth letting your only righty bat walk away is not good.
I guess they are looking at it like they don't have enough information yet since he is only a year or two in. Probably too early to tell and that is why he is ranked so low.
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
yeah i am not a fan of 3 years for ibanez. not fan of the lee trade. and not a fan of giving moyer 2 years at age 60....all that said, and with only a year under his belt, i was thinking he'd at least be in the top half of gm's.
sports illustrated is pretty much irrelevant at this point anyway though.
I'm not a fan of locking up Victorino for three years. Basically they had a choice this off season lock up Werth or Shane and they chose Shane. I know he's valuable as a CF, but unless the owners raise the payroll threshhold for next year allowing them to keep Werth letting your only righty bat walk away is not good.
The Victorino deal was to avoid arbitration though wasn't it? Doesn't it only extend him 1 year past his arbtration eligible years?
The Victorino deal was to avoid arbitration though wasn't it? Doesn't it only extend him 1 year past his arbtration eligible years?
It was, but Werth is a free agent at the end of this year. Werth bats 5th and is protection for Howard and the only righty bat. Victorino now bats 7th and you can find a defensive CF. If you extended Werth, offense wouldn't be a big concern for the Phils going forward. Now they will have a big hole in their lineup.
The Victorino deal was to avoid arbitration though wasn't it? Doesn't it only extend him 1 year past his arbtration eligible years?
It was, but Werth is a free agent at the end of this year. Werth bats 5th and is protection for Howard and the only righty bat. Victorino now bats 7th and you can find a defensive CF. If you extended Werth, offense wouldn't be a big concern for the Phils going forward. Now they will have a big hole in their lineup.
I hear you. Werths' bat is much more valuable than what Victorino brings to the table, especially now that he is batting 7th. Will be interesting to see if Werth can keep it up.
I am just not so sure that Victorino is a trade off for Werth, unless they traded Victorino and found a cheap CF. They will be paying Victorino either way if they keep him, since he is in arbitration.
is there any shot at them possibly packaging ibanez before next year...thus being able to keep werth? then they can throw dom brown out in left or something. just seems like a waste in having brown replace werth who is like 7 years younger than ibanez. i realize another team wont want to take on ibanez's salary, but we've paid portions of other players salaries in trades before with thome being a prime example.
My thinking with Werth is that it does not come down to 2011. I don't really think the Phillies saving $11 or $12 mil in 2011 is going to make or break a deal for Werth. I think it is more long term. Werth is going to be 31 or so and is going to be looking for a 5+ year deal (doubt he will get it). I think it more comes down to the Phillies keeping Werth vs. Rollins or Howard. Dude has some pretty good numbers, but if I were the Phillies I would probably let him walk and try and pick up a cheaper right handed bat. He is going to want too much. Although the fact he is hitting the market the same time as Crawford is going to hurt him.
what's the word on cole hamels? ... i'm in a keeper fantasy league and i'm not too sure whether to keep him or not ... is he gonna bounce back this year?
what's the word on cole hamels? ... i'm in a keeper fantasy league and i'm not too sure whether to keep him or not ... is he gonna bounce back this year?
1. Why would the Phillies do this? They have a shot at resigning Howard, I highly doubt they would give Pujols $25 mil a year for 10 years or anything close to that. Why would the Cards do this? Pujols makes less and is 100 time better than Howard. Edit: Obviously the Phillies would do it in a heartbeat, I just don't think it makes any sense for either team.
2. It is going to take a whole lot more than Howard to get Pujols.
3. I have also considered banging Jessica Alba and Penolope Cruz at the same time.
pujols probably will wanna test the free agent waters. He's gonna want at least 30 mil a season maybe even more for 10-12 years A talent like him won't come on the cheap side.
I would pay to be on the line if Amaro proposes this trade.
imagine
j-roll
planco
utley
pujols
werth
ibanez or flip flop with werth
victarino
chooch
damn rub do it
The conversation will go a little something like this....
Amaro: Hey, I was wondering if you would be interesting is swapping Pujols for Howard, I think you have a better chance at resigning Howard since you know, he is from St. Louis...
Its funny seeing the phils fan turing into that spoiled part of yanks fanbase. Its almost like trying to buy a world series huh phils fans. The very thing you all detest on here. Took you long enough to join the club.
Ron: I just don't feel like going out tonight
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
Its funny seeing the phils fan turing into that spoiled part of yanks fanbase. Its almost like trying to buy a world series huh phils fans. The very thing you all detest on here. Took you long enough to join the club.
Go away mutsfan this is a thread for winners. :shock:
Its funny seeing the phils fan turing into that spoiled part of yanks fanbase. Its almost like trying to buy a world series huh phils fans. The very thing you all detest on here. Took you long enough to join the club.
Go away mutsfan this is a thread for winners. :shock:
sup joey
I thought the thread for winners was the yankees thread. Ya know that team that's won 27 world series. I'm so damn good, I'm tweaking phils fans wit the da team I hate most.
Ron: I just don't feel like going out tonight
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
Its funny seeing the phils fan turing into that spoiled part of yanks fanbase. Its almost like trying to buy a world series huh phils fans. The very thing you all detest on here. Took you long enough to join the club.
Go away mutsfan this is a thread for winners. :shock:
sup joey
I thought the thread for winners was the yankees thread. Ya know that team that's won 27 world series. I'm so damn good, I'm tweaking phils fans wit the da team I hate most.
I go on a drinking binge, in the spirit of St. Patrick mind you, for 48 hours and this is what I come home to?
You must have been with Buster Olney.
Olney never said the trade was going to happen...he said it was discussed internally by the phils. why is that so far fetched?
The deal is a long shot, but I think it would make sense for the cards, assuming they are willing and able to lock howard up long term. I think any team that gives howard $25 million per year is stupid, especially if said team extends him into his mid to late 30's.
And whoever said the phils were becoming the yanks needs to get a clue. the phils are working on a fixed payroll of approximately $140 million. the yanks have never had salary limitations.
Comments
B.J. Phillips (Time, 1981)
I’m reading a book on baseball, and I just loved this.
Gonzo: Sports Illustrated short-shrifts Amaro
POSTED: March 9, 2010 By John Gonzalez
There was a time when I was really into Sports Illustrated. Kathy Ireland had a lot to do with that, but I dug the stories, too - so much so that I kept every issue of SI from when I was 8 years old until I turned 18. (As you might imagine, I was a huge hit with the ladies back then.)
At some point, for reasons I can't fully remember, I stopped archiving the magazine. Then I gave up reading it all together. I was thinking about renewing my subscription until I recently stumbled upon SI's rankings of baseball's general managers. I doubt Time Warner will be getting a check from me anytime soon.
The Phils' Ruben Amaro Jr. didn't even make it into the top half of MLB's general managers in Sports Illustrated's puzzling assessment. The Cliff Lee trade apparently hurt his ranking.
Phils spring training Phils spring training Slim Charlie Manuel
If you expected Phils shot-caller Ruben Amaro Jr. - a guy who made some of the biggest trades in baseball over the last year and also helped build a team that reached two straight World Series - to be in the top 10, you guessed too high. If you thought the Fightin's' 93 wins last season were enough to move Amaro into the top half of MLB's 30 GMs, you thought wrong. And if you believe he's done better work than Chicago Cubs GM Jim Hendry - who came in at No. 16 on SI's list, despite the fact that his club cratered last season and he threw lots of money at walking tantrum Milton Bradley - then you obviously fail to follow SI's peculiar logic.
Amaro was rated 19th, just four spots in front of Mike Rizzo from the Nationals and seven ahead of Omar Minaya of the Mets. Combined, the Nats and Mets won only 36 more games than the Phils last season. Even stranger: Amaro barely beat out Pirates GM Neal Huntington, who filled the No. 20 slot. Did you know they still played baseball in Pittsburgh? Me, either.
Here's SI's curious explanation: "One pennant in one year is a nice record, and having landed two of baseball's five best pitchers - Roy Halladay and Cliff Lee - in trade within a few months is even better given that these were moves he alone gets credit for. On the other hand the truly strange trade sending Lee to Seattle and the odd, if so far successful, decision to sign 37-year-old designated hitter-masquerading-as-an-outfielder Raul Ibanez to a long-term contract have to count heavily against him."
Uh-huh. To review: The mag stipulated that going one-for-one on the pennant front is impressive and gave Amaro credit for acquiring Halladay and Lee and the "so far successful" Ibanez. (By the way: Ibanez turns 38 this June, but his deal expires next season. When did three years become a "long-term" contract?)
The big beef seems to be Amaro's decision to ship Lee to Seattle, and that's fair enough. But when measured against Amaro's obvious success and the fact that he locked up one of the game's best pitchers without paying a hefty open-market free-agent price, how does the good not outweigh the bad and secure the guy a higher spot on the list? No credit for grabbing Placido Polanco? No nod for keeping Shane Victorino in town? SI makes Amaro sound like a slightly less worrisome version of Ed Wade - a man potentially capable of drowning facedown in his Froot Loops if left unattended too long.
If you're curious, SI had Wade ranked 29th. At least the mag got something right
If all goes well he should be much higher. 3 years for a 37 year old outfielder is long term and I am not a fan of the Lee trade either (no need to get into it again). If he didn't trade Lee I think he would be much higher on this list.
yeah i am not a fan of 3 years for ibanez. not fan of the lee trade. and not a fan of giving moyer 2 years at age 60....all that said, and with only a year under his belt, i was thinking he'd at least be in the top half of gm's.
sports illustrated is pretty much irrelevant at this point anyway though.
I hear you and didn't read the explanation on all the GM's ahead of him. I completely forgot about the Moyer deal, yeah.....
I agree with you though.
I still like SI. They have Poznanski writing for them now, who I think is one of the best baseball writers ever. I also still like Verducci, even though he has a hard on for Selena Roberts and won't criticize her.
I'm not a fan of locking up Victorino for three years. Basically they had a choice this off season lock up Werth or Shane and they chose Shane. I know he's valuable as a CF, but unless the owners raise the payroll threshhold for next year allowing them to keep Werth letting your only righty bat walk away is not good.
- 8/28/98
- 9/2/00
- 4/28/03, 5/3/03, 7/3/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/9/03, 7/11/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03
- 9/28/04, 9/29/04, 10/1/04, 10/2/04
- 9/11/05, 9/12/05, 9/13/05, 9/30/05, 10/1/05, 10/3/05
- 5/12/06, 5/13/06, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 5/30/06, 6/1/06, 6/3/06, 6/23/06, 7/22/06, 7/23/06, 12/2/06, 12/9/06
- 8/2/07, 8/5/07
- 6/19/08, 6/20/08, 6/22/08, 6/24/08, 6/25/08, 6/27/08, 6/28/08, 6/30/08, 7/1/08
- 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 9/21/09, 9/22/09, 10/27/09, 10/28/09, 10/30/09, 10/31/09
- 5/15/10, 5/17/10, 5/18/10, 5/20/10, 5/21/10, 10/23/10, 10/24/10
- 9/11/11, 9/12/11
- 10/18/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 11/30/13, 12/4/13
The Victorino deal was to avoid arbitration though wasn't it? Doesn't it only extend him 1 year past his arbtration eligible years?
It was, but Werth is a free agent at the end of this year. Werth bats 5th and is protection for Howard and the only righty bat. Victorino now bats 7th and you can find a defensive CF. If you extended Werth, offense wouldn't be a big concern for the Phils going forward. Now they will have a big hole in their lineup.
- 8/28/98
- 9/2/00
- 4/28/03, 5/3/03, 7/3/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/9/03, 7/11/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03
- 9/28/04, 9/29/04, 10/1/04, 10/2/04
- 9/11/05, 9/12/05, 9/13/05, 9/30/05, 10/1/05, 10/3/05
- 5/12/06, 5/13/06, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 5/30/06, 6/1/06, 6/3/06, 6/23/06, 7/22/06, 7/23/06, 12/2/06, 12/9/06
- 8/2/07, 8/5/07
- 6/19/08, 6/20/08, 6/22/08, 6/24/08, 6/25/08, 6/27/08, 6/28/08, 6/30/08, 7/1/08
- 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 9/21/09, 9/22/09, 10/27/09, 10/28/09, 10/30/09, 10/31/09
- 5/15/10, 5/17/10, 5/18/10, 5/20/10, 5/21/10, 10/23/10, 10/24/10
- 9/11/11, 9/12/11
- 10/18/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 11/30/13, 12/4/13
I hear you. Werths' bat is much more valuable than what Victorino brings to the table, especially now that he is batting 7th. Will be interesting to see if Werth can keep it up.
I am just not so sure that Victorino is a trade off for Werth, unless they traded Victorino and found a cheap CF. They will be paying Victorino either way if they keep him, since he is in arbitration.
just a thought...
Here comes the summer kids!!!!
lock him up.
i'm saying 16 wins this year.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4994845
3 Things...
1. Why would the Phillies do this? They have a shot at resigning Howard, I highly doubt they would give Pujols $25 mil a year for 10 years or anything close to that. Why would the Cards do this? Pujols makes less and is 100 time better than Howard. Edit: Obviously the Phillies would do it in a heartbeat, I just don't think it makes any sense for either team.
2. It is going to take a whole lot more than Howard to get Pujols.
3. I have also considered banging Jessica Alba and Penolope Cruz at the same time.
I'd do this trade today tomorrow next week yesterday.I love howard but holy hell pujols would be amazing here.
I would pay to be on the line if Amaro proposes this trade.
j-roll
planco
utley
pujols
werth
ibanez or flip flop with werth
victarino
chooch
damn rub do it
I think any of the 29 other teams would trade for pujols in a heartbeat. He's probably the best pure hitter since teddy baseball.
It take a teams whole farm system and bout 3 good major league players to get him
Watch the yanks get him lol
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
The conversation will go a little something like this....
Amaro: Hey, I was wondering if you would be interesting is swapping Pujols for Howard, I think you have a better chance at resigning Howard since you know, he is from St. Louis...
Mozeliak: BAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA
Amaro: Wait you didn't let me finish....
Mozeliak: HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA
click
Its funny seeing the phils fan turing into that spoiled part of yanks fanbase. Its almost like trying to buy a world series huh phils fans. The very thing you all detest on here. Took you long enough to join the club.
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
I thought the thread for winners was the yankees thread. Ya know that team that's won 27 world series. I'm so damn good, I'm tweaking phils fans wit the da team I hate most.
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
Haha good comeback joey
Sammi: Wanna just break up?
You must have been with Buster Olney.
Olney never said the trade was going to happen...he said it was discussed internally by the phils. why is that so far fetched?
The deal is a long shot, but I think it would make sense for the cards, assuming they are willing and able to lock howard up long term. I think any team that gives howard $25 million per year is stupid, especially if said team extends him into his mid to late 30's.
And whoever said the phils were becoming the yanks needs to get a clue. the phils are working on a fixed payroll of approximately $140 million. the yanks have never had salary limitations.