The big 10 isn't necessarily slow, they recruit the same areas, but they are a little antique when it comes to offensive systems (same was said and proven about the SEC as well in the 90's) and they aren't quite as prepared physically because thier in league schedules are not as difficult as the SEC. They are mainly just getting crap because they are basically set up to have an easier road to the championship not to mention historical alliances like the absolute ridiculousness that gave us USC vs Illinois and Hawaii vs Georgia in bowl games last season which essentially wasted everyones time as neither of those was close even on paper and all they did was maintain garbage conference alliances. Who cares?
.......
OSU, Michigan, PSU, Wisconsin would all do fine in the SEC and compete well you just wouldn't see them run through undefeated because at the top echelon of CFB everyone is pretty damn close generally one or two exceptional players put teams over the top. The conference as a whole has less depth so it's a relatively easier run to a Big 10 championship when compared to other conferences.
I was about to post these same thoughts, although you said it much better than I ever could have....
Another thing that needs to be stated is that in thunderDAN's post with the Capital 1 and Outback bowl results, it's not necessarily SEC #2 vs Big 10 #3 and SEC #3 vs Big 10 #4. That's just a hierarchy in the order that the bowls get to pick. The Capital 1 bowl gets the 2nd choice of SEC teams (after the bcs bowls) and doesn't have to pick the second place team. Likewise they get the third choice from the Big 10 after the bcs and some other bowl). They can pick a team that they think will draw a bigger crowd, make more money, etc. When I get home I'll do the research and figure out tie breakers and post the actual conference seedings for those two bowls....
I honestly think that the 2006 Ohio State team was a better team than Florida- HOWEVER, they took them lightly and thought that it would be a cakewalk so they didn't focus on winning that game. It's the only way to explain how guys were so out of shape they were throwing up on the sidelines, or how Troy Smith gained 12 pounds in 2 months. They thought getting past Michigan was the only thing they had to worry about, so they wasted 2 months just patting themselves on the back
LSU was better than Ohio State last year no question
i agree. losing ginn on the first play threw off their whole offense too. he showed they could play with speed with the best, then was gone. and florida was hungry and never gave them a moment to adjust, to their credit. what hurt the worst about that game was just watching it and knowing all day that that was NOT the ohio state team i had been watching all season. not even close.
hell, they played lsu closer the next season despite the fact that lsu was a stronger team and the buckeyes were much weaker and probably shouldn't have even been there.
I honestly think that the 2006 Ohio State team was a better team than Florida- HOWEVER, they took them lightly and thought that it would be a cakewalk so they didn't focus on winning that game. It's the only way to explain how guys were so out of shape they were throwing up on the sidelines, or how Troy Smith gained 12 pounds in 2 months. They thought getting past Michigan was the only thing they had to worry about, so they wasted 2 months just patting themselves on the back
LSU was better than Ohio State last year no question
Yeah that's true, I guess it's been a while since then. That Ohio State team was probably better than the one that they won the championship with in 2002. They really got victimised by all that time off.
The same thing happened to USC against Vince Young and Georgia against West Virginia and it happens quite a bit to the SEC teams that end up in the Outback bowl upset to be there. Wisconisin smoked Auburn one year and Tony Hunt Ran over Tennessee.
Florida methodically beat OSU. That was the year Meyer changed that offense slightly to better fit the strengths that Leak had. They really had a good scheme and losing Ginn hurt the effectiveness of Robiskie which hurt the running game.
I guess I just expected it more. I thought Florida matched up better with OSU than the Buckeyes did with the gators. Laterally, Florida was incredible. Percy harvin just needs a crease and they had Caldwell to make the tough catches and End Zone stuff. They also had a strong front DL and linebackers that were quick enough to recover and not get trapped down inside and a tremendous safety. Once Ginn was gone the safeties could walk a little closer.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
Also, if the Big 10 sucks so bad, like you say, how can you explain out #4 team beating your beloved Gators who were the SEC #3 last year.
Let's Take a Look Deeper...
The Capitol One Bowl has been won by the Big 10 the last 5 years- even though they were faced against a better SEC team. That is, within the conference standings, the Big 10 team was the Big 10 #3, facing the SEC #2.
2004 January 1, 2005 Iowa 30 LSU 25
2005 January 2, 2006 Wisconsin 24 Auburn 10
2006 January 1, 2007 Wisconsin 17 Arkansas 14
2007 January 1, 2008 Michigan 41 Florida 35
How about the Outback Bowl, where the same phenomenon happens- in this case, the Big Ten #4 faces the SEC #3
2002 January 1, 2003 Michigan 38 Florida 30
2003 January 1, 2004 Iowa 37 Florida 17
2004 January 1, 2005 Georgia 24 Wisconsin 21
2005 January 2, 2006 Florida 31 Iowa 24
2006 January 1, 2007 Penn State 20 Tennessee 10
2007 January 1, 2008 Tennessee 21 Wisconsin 17
If the SEC were so powerful, wouldn't they dominate these games against lesser (and I mean that in terms of conference standings) Big 10 opponents.
Using the same years for both bowls and figuring out the tiebreakers for teams with tied records, the bowls actually look like:
Capital 1 Bowl
2002: Auburn 13 - Penn St 9 (SEC #5 vs Big 10 #4)
2003: Georgia 34 - Purdue 27 (SEC #2 vs Big 10 #3)
2004: Iowa 30 - LSU 25 (Big 10 #2 vs SEC #4)
2005: Wisconsin 24 - Auburn 10 (Big 10 #6 vs SEC #3)
2006: Wisconsin 17 - Arkansas 14 (Big 10 #3 vs SEC #2)
2007: Michigan 41 - Florida 35 (Big 10 #2 vs SEC #5)
Outback Bowl
2002: Michigan 38 - Florida 30 (Big 10 #3 vs SEC #3)
2003: Iowa 37 - Florida 17 (Big 10 #5 vs SEC #5)
2004: Georgia 24 - Wisconsin 21 (SEC #3 vs Big 10 #3)
2005: Florida 31 - Iowa 24 (SEC #6 vs Big 10 #5)
2006: Penn St 20 - Tennessee 10 (Big 10 #4 vs SEC #5)
2007: Tennessee 21 - Wisconsin 17 (SEC #2 vs Big 10 #4)
Relative to conference standing, the Big 10 was 3-2 with a favored team, 2-2 as the underdog, and 2-1 against the same standing. The argument using relative conference standings doesn't hold any water because in 8 of these 12 games, the Big 10 had the better or same position. If it was always the SEC as the higher team, there might be a case.
so Michigan finished ahead of Illinois last year in the Big Ten? Why didn't they play in the Rose Bowl? Interesting
both Michigan and Illinois finished 6-2 in Big 10 play....technically, Michigan was in second place because they won the head to head matchup with Illinois
The Rose Bowl chose Illinois because the Illini for 2 reasons. 1) They had a better overall record going into the bowl season at 9-3 vs Michigan's 8-4. 2) Illinois beat Ohio State, something that Michigan couldn't do in the past few years.
Hell yes! Illinois vs. Missourah Saturday nite. Illinois is going to surprise a lot of people this year (again). They won't win the Big Ten but I think they'll finish with 9 or 10 wins... and they'll only be better in 2009!
Zook em!
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
Hell yes! Illinois vs. Missourah Saturday nite. Illinois is going to surprise a lot of people this year (again). They won't win the Big Ten but I think they'll finish with 9 or 10 wins... and they'll only be better in 2009!
Zook em!
I think it's gonna be the opposite. They won't be surprising anybody this year. They had a tremendous year last year, beating then #1 O-State in the Horseshoe and playing in the Rose Bowl for the 1st time in while. Hard to sneak up on anyone after a season like that. I think they'll be hard-pressed to better last year's record of 9-4. Looking at their schedule, they could very well lose 4 conference games. I'm looking for Benn to have a huge break-out year at receiver as well as from Martez Wilson at LB. But they lost a lot and I'm not sure they have the guys to replace them right away. Juice will have to play well every week, something he didn't do last year. I still expect them to be in a New Years Day bowl and you're right, they will only get better in years to come.
He floated back down 'cause he wanted to share, his key to the locks on the chains he saw everywhere.
About 24 hours until kickoff of college football season.... anyone excited?
I'm really excited!
In about 5 hours or so I'm headed down to Williams-Brice Stadium to tailgate and then hopefully watch the U of South Carolina Gamecocks beat the NC State Wolfpack! It's a long day at work, but I can already taste the beer and smell the grill.....
In about 5 hours or so I'm headed down to Williams-Brice Stadium to tailgate and then hopefully watch the U of South Carolina Gamecocks beat the NC State Wolfpack! It's a long day at work, but I can already taste the beer and smell the grill.....
Make sure Mike Davis doesn't swipe your sports drink. (Sorry )
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
I'll be at the WVU-Villanova tailgate on Saturday. Gametime 330pm, tailgate time 9am!
And then Saturday I will watch the game I really care about, the Louisville vs Univ of Kentucky game. That will be ugly, smack & hate is at an all-time high with UL on the down and UK on the up, hungry for revenge after many losses to UL over the last decade.
Ugly win last night, but I'll take it. As long as we improve over last night. 3 picks against a weaker defense should never have happened with a vet qb. Ran the opening kick back for a touch only to be called back. Hofstra showed a lot of heart though.
Ugly win last night, but I'll take it. As long as we improve over last night. 3 picks against a weaker defense should never have happened with a vet qb. Ran the opening kick back for a touch only to be called back. Hofstra showed a lot of heart though.
I don't have a very good feeling about UL this year. I think the offense will be fine if someone can show up at WR (they have lost their top two WR's going into this season to injury - and none of those WR's were starters last year).
The defense is incredibly thin at LB. None of the three starting LBers have played any Div I time AT ALL. I shudder to think what a running team (read: WVU) could do to them. I'm glad WVU is later in teh season so they will have some experience by then.
Hope is eternal at the beginning of the season, but I'm just trying to be realistic.
Ugly win last night, but I'll take it. As long as we improve over last night. 3 picks against a weaker defense should never have happened with a vet qb. Ran the opening kick back for a touch only to be called back. Hofstra showed a lot of heart though.
Our game was ugly too and our starting qb threw 4 interceptions. The only reason Spurrier took him out was because he got hit in the head. If that didn't happen, he might have had 5 or 6 ints. :eek:
We had a lot of OL penalties and then a really really stupid unsportsmanlike penalty. We were bailed out though, because as bad as our offense performed, NC State's was worse...
Our game was ugly too and our starting qb threw 4 interceptions. The only reason Spurrier took him out was because he got hit in the head. If that didn't happen, he might have had 5 or 6 ints.
wtf was up with that? I remember Spurrier throwing his visor and yanking guys like Danny Wuerffel and Rex Grossman if they threw one pick and the Gators were up by 30. He's definitely mellowed a lot since his humbling NFL experience, plus he's got limited talent up here I suppose.
Chris Smelley ran things really well, although the Wolfpack D was probably exhausted by then. Hopefully he gets the start against Vandy.
Being a Gator fan at heart, though graduated from USC...
Tim Tebow's 2nd straight Heisman campaign starts tomorrow against Hawaii...
F' Yea!.... Florida tearin it up in the Swamp... Bring on the Bulldogs, I want them now! Ill be in Gainesville next Saturday to see the Gators repeat this performance against the Hurricanes.
"I would love to see a forklift life a crate of forks. It would be so damn literal." - Mitch Hedberg
Being a Gator fan at heart, though graduated from USC...
Tim Tebow's 2nd straight Heisman campaign starts tomorrow against Hawaii...
As much as I would love to see Tebow get another Heisman, I don't see the Heisman voters giving it to him, unless of course Florida seems poised to win the national title. Don't get me wrong, I bleed orange and blue, but I get the feeling there will be some Tebow hating this year.... just jealousy, I guess
Did you hear that Superman wears Tim Tebow pajamas?
"I would love to see a forklift life a crate of forks. It would be so damn literal." - Mitch Hedberg
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
Man I just noticed that the college football season just started.
[size=+4]MARYLAND TERPS[/size] Let's GO BIG RED.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
As much as I would love to see Tebow get another Heisman, I don't see the Heisman voters giving it to him, unless of course Florida wins the seems poised to win the national title. Don't get me wrong, I bleed orange and blue, but I get the feeling there will be some Tebow hating this year.... just jealousy, I guess
Did you hear that Superman wears Tim Tebow pajamas?
Yeah and I fully expect his numbers to be significantly down this season. As they were today. But if he somehow accounts for 50+ TDs again this year how could you not give it to him?
Lot of guys made plays today. Chris Raney will be a force to be reckoned with. No Harvin, no matter. Hopefully he'll be back against the 'Canes. I too am heading down for that one, to see my family and watch the Gators destroy.
I talk shit about Tebow winning a 2nd but in reality I think it could very well be Knowshon Moreno or Chase Daniel, depending on if Mizzou lives up to the hype
Comments
Another thing that needs to be stated is that in thunderDAN's post with the Capital 1 and Outback bowl results, it's not necessarily SEC #2 vs Big 10 #3 and SEC #3 vs Big 10 #4. That's just a hierarchy in the order that the bowls get to pick. The Capital 1 bowl gets the 2nd choice of SEC teams (after the bcs bowls) and doesn't have to pick the second place team. Likewise they get the third choice from the Big 10 after the bcs and some other bowl). They can pick a team that they think will draw a bigger crowd, make more money, etc. When I get home I'll do the research and figure out tie breakers and post the actual conference seedings for those two bowls....
i agree. losing ginn on the first play threw off their whole offense too. he showed they could play with speed with the best, then was gone. and florida was hungry and never gave them a moment to adjust, to their credit. what hurt the worst about that game was just watching it and knowing all day that that was NOT the ohio state team i had been watching all season. not even close.
hell, they played lsu closer the next season despite the fact that lsu was a stronger team and the buckeyes were much weaker and probably shouldn't have even been there.
Yeah that's true, I guess it's been a while since then. That Ohio State team was probably better than the one that they won the championship with in 2002. They really got victimised by all that time off.
The same thing happened to USC against Vince Young and Georgia against West Virginia and it happens quite a bit to the SEC teams that end up in the Outback bowl upset to be there. Wisconisin smoked Auburn one year and Tony Hunt Ran over Tennessee.
Florida methodically beat OSU. That was the year Meyer changed that offense slightly to better fit the strengths that Leak had. They really had a good scheme and losing Ginn hurt the effectiveness of Robiskie which hurt the running game.
I guess I just expected it more. I thought Florida matched up better with OSU than the Buckeyes did with the gators. Laterally, Florida was incredible. Percy harvin just needs a crease and they had Caldwell to make the tough catches and End Zone stuff. They also had a strong front DL and linebackers that were quick enough to recover and not get trapped down inside and a tremendous safety. Once Ginn was gone the safeties could walk a little closer.
Capital 1 Bowl
2002: Auburn 13 - Penn St 9 (SEC #5 vs Big 10 #4)
2003: Georgia 34 - Purdue 27 (SEC #2 vs Big 10 #3)
2004: Iowa 30 - LSU 25 (Big 10 #2 vs SEC #4)
2005: Wisconsin 24 - Auburn 10 (Big 10 #6 vs SEC #3)
2006: Wisconsin 17 - Arkansas 14 (Big 10 #3 vs SEC #2)
2007: Michigan 41 - Florida 35 (Big 10 #2 vs SEC #5)
Outback Bowl
2002: Michigan 38 - Florida 30 (Big 10 #3 vs SEC #3)
2003: Iowa 37 - Florida 17 (Big 10 #5 vs SEC #5)
2004: Georgia 24 - Wisconsin 21 (SEC #3 vs Big 10 #3)
2005: Florida 31 - Iowa 24 (SEC #6 vs Big 10 #5)
2006: Penn St 20 - Tennessee 10 (Big 10 #4 vs SEC #5)
2007: Tennessee 21 - Wisconsin 17 (SEC #2 vs Big 10 #4)
Relative to conference standing, the Big 10 was 3-2 with a favored team, 2-2 as the underdog, and 2-1 against the same standing. The argument using relative conference standings doesn't hold any water because in 8 of these 12 games, the Big 10 had the better or same position. If it was always the SEC as the higher team, there might be a case.
The Rose Bowl chose Illinois because the Illini for 2 reasons. 1) They had a better overall record going into the bowl season at 9-3 vs Michigan's 8-4. 2) Illinois beat Ohio State, something that Michigan couldn't do in the past few years.
9/23/98 WPB, 8/10/00 WPB, 4/11/03 WPB, 4/13/03 Tampa, 10/4/04 Kissimmee, 6/11/08 WPB, 6/12/08 Tampa
Zook em!
I think it's gonna be the opposite. They won't be surprising anybody this year. They had a tremendous year last year, beating then #1 O-State in the Horseshoe and playing in the Rose Bowl for the 1st time in while. Hard to sneak up on anyone after a season like that. I think they'll be hard-pressed to better last year's record of 9-4. Looking at their schedule, they could very well lose 4 conference games. I'm looking for Benn to have a huge break-out year at receiver as well as from Martez Wilson at LB. But they lost a lot and I'm not sure they have the guys to replace them right away. Juice will have to play well every week, something he didn't do last year. I still expect them to be in a New Years Day bowl and you're right, they will only get better in years to come.
In about 5 hours or so I'm headed down to Williams-Brice Stadium to tailgate and then hopefully watch the U of South Carolina Gamecocks beat the NC State Wolfpack! It's a long day at work, but I can already taste the beer and smell the grill.....
Make sure Mike Davis doesn't swipe your sports drink. (Sorry
Tailgating commences in 2 hours.
Steve Dunne is one happy dude right now.
WOOHOO!!!!!
mark, steve.....have fun!
i'll have a couple for ya!!!
Steve, who you tailgating for?
and thanks cutback....I've been excited all day...even when I was at the dentist this morning
I'll be at the WVU-Villanova tailgate on Saturday. Gametime 330pm, tailgate time 9am!
And then Saturday I will watch the game I really care about, the Louisville vs Univ of Kentucky game. That will be ugly, smack & hate is at an all-time high with UL on the down and UK on the up, hungry for revenge after many losses to UL over the last decade.
Did he fake the "fair catch"?
hahahahaha
big weekend down in KY!
The defense is incredibly thin at LB. None of the three starting LBers have played any Div I time AT ALL. I shudder to think what a running team (read: WVU) could do to them. I'm glad WVU is later in teh season so they will have some experience by then.
Hope is eternal at the beginning of the season, but I'm just trying to be realistic.
We had a lot of OL penalties and then a really really stupid unsportsmanlike penalty. We were bailed out though, because as bad as our offense performed, NC State's was worse...
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sorry man - i'm a bit HO this morning. i missed this. to answer your question...uconn!
wtf was up with that? I remember Spurrier throwing his visor and yanking guys like Danny Wuerffel and Rex Grossman if they threw one pick and the Gators were up by 30. He's definitely mellowed a lot since his humbling NFL experience, plus he's got limited talent up here I suppose.
Chris Smelley ran things really well, although the Wolfpack D was probably exhausted by then. Hopefully he gets the start against Vandy.
Being a Gator fan at heart, though graduated from USC...
Tim Tebow's 2nd straight Heisman campaign starts tomorrow against Hawaii...
8/25/92, 10/4/96, 10/5/96, 9/1/98, 9/4/98, 8/4/00, 8/6/00, 4/15/03, 4/16/03, 10/6/04, 6/16/08
9/23/98 WPB, 8/10/00 WPB, 4/11/03 WPB, 4/13/03 Tampa, 10/4/04 Kissimmee, 6/11/08 WPB, 6/12/08 Tampa
As much as I would love to see Tebow get another Heisman, I don't see the Heisman voters giving it to him, unless of course Florida seems poised to win the national title. Don't get me wrong, I bleed orange and blue, but I get the feeling there will be some Tebow hating this year.... just jealousy, I guess
Did you hear that Superman wears Tim Tebow pajamas?
9/23/98 WPB, 8/10/00 WPB, 4/11/03 WPB, 4/13/03 Tampa, 10/4/04 Kissimmee, 6/11/08 WPB, 6/12/08 Tampa
[size=+4]MARYLAND TERPS[/size] Let's GO BIG RED.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Yeah and I fully expect his numbers to be significantly down this season. As they were today. But if he somehow accounts for 50+ TDs again this year how could you not give it to him?
Lot of guys made plays today. Chris Raney will be a force to be reckoned with. No Harvin, no matter. Hopefully he'll be back against the 'Canes. I too am heading down for that one, to see my family and watch the Gators destroy.
I talk shit about Tebow winning a 2nd but in reality I think it could very well be Knowshon Moreno or Chase Daniel, depending on if Mizzou lives up to the hype
8/25/92, 10/4/96, 10/5/96, 9/1/98, 9/4/98, 8/4/00, 8/6/00, 4/15/03, 4/16/03, 10/6/04, 6/16/08