When a friend finds God ...

LONGRD

Heineken Helen wrote:

I don't see the problem... when I discovered PJ I thought 'everyone should listen to this' and the odd time I try to force it down somebody's throat... same when I discovered adventure books, I don't understand why people don't TRY them . If you find something that changes your life you'd think everybody should do it too. It's human nature probably.

We know you like to do that. Hehe

Heineken Helen

writersu wrote:

I found God a long time ago. But I happen to think that He doesn't like to be used as a crutch or a name dropping thing or as a reason that "I am so better than you...".

those who really find God do not need to do that. honestly.

Nicely put!

orig_long red

DeLukin wrote:

Completely indifferent? And you want to punch your friend in the throat for believing in something? Sounds like someone isn't calling what it is what it REALLY is... denial can be its own form of brainwashing.

i'm indifferent towards religion unless it grows on a friend like fungus.

Heineken Helen

in_hiding79 wrote:

Please Explain this too me....is there such a thing of thinking to logically???

so you're suggesting anyone who has any kinda belief is illogical? illogical for that reason? Hmm... where do I start!

orig_long red

i just think it's sad that some people won't accept that life is just miserable, and that they feel the need to construct a happy ending for themselves in order to feel better.

I just accept that I will be worm food, and there's no grand reason for me at all.

Heineken Helen

Rygar wrote:

On a related note, it's no less annoying to hear someone trying to force you to not try it than it is to hear the opposite.

It's funny how there are people on both sides of this debate who believe they hold the moral high ground and that they're better than the other! People are weird :rolleyes:

Brain of J.Lo

Heineken Helen wrote:

I don't see the problem... when I discovered PJ I thought 'everyone should listen to this' and the odd time I try to force it down somebody's throat... same when I discovered adventure books, I don't understand why people don't TRY them . If you find something that changes your life you'd think everybody should do it too. It's human nature probably.

Well, I should clarify. In my case I don't want to hear it because I already know all about Jesus. (In fact, I'm a big fan. ) I don't fit the narrow definition that many have of what it means to be a "Christian" because I don't attend church or subscribe to a particular religion. But I definitely try to live my life according to Jesus' teachings and plan to encourage my children to do the same.

I just find many Christians' insistence that they know something I don't, and the insistence that I'm missing out on something (or worse, am on a path straight to hell, lol) to be redundant and annoying.

And then there's the case of hypocrites. Take my brother, for example. He steals, lies habitually, etc....but if you asked him, he would tell you he's a Christian and he knows the bible like the back of his hand. I wish more people would just live like a Christian rather than tell you that they're a Christian. Lead by example, not just with words...ya know?

Heineken Helen

long red wrote:

i just think it's sad that some people won't accept that life is just miserable, and that they feel the need to construct a happy ending for themselves in order to feel better.

I just accept that I will be worm food, and there's no grand reason for me at all.

it's strange... I don't think there's a grand reason for me either

eMMI

long red wrote:

i just think it's sad that some people won't accept that life is just miserable, and that they feel the need to construct a happy ending for themselves in order to feel better.

I just accept that I will be worm food, and there's no grand reason for me at all.

but life isn't miserable! whether you believe in God or not, life doesn't have to be miserable.

if someone wants to be a little happier in this crazy world, why not let them? people do all sorts of things to feel better anyway.

I believe in God, but I know I'm gonna die and my body will be worm food..

and you know, some people who don't believe in God think/find that there's a reason for them being here.

if you want your life to be miserable, fine, that's your choice. but please, don't expect others to mope with you.

Heineken Helen

Brain of J.Lo wrote:

Well, I should clarify. In my case I don't want to hear it because I already know all about Jesus. (In fact, I'm a big fan. ) I don't fit the narrow definition that many have of what it means to be a "Christian" because I don't attend church or subscribe to a particular religion. But I definitely try to live my life according to Jesus' teachings and plan to encourage my children to do the same.

so you're already ahead of most people who claim to be religious anyway.

Brain of J.Lo wrote:

I just find many Christians' insistence that they know something I don't, and the insistence that I'm missing out on something (or worse, am on a path straight to hell, lol) to be redundant and annoying.

Trust me, I'm not a big fan either... although I do find the whole religion debate interesting. I have friends of many different religions and I've gone to their 'places of worship' simply out of interest... one thing I've found is that there are very few who actually FOLLOW the teachings that they try to force upon others.

Brain of J.Lo wrote:

And then there's the case of hypocrites. Take my brother, for example. He steals, lies habitually, etc....but if you asked him, he would tell you he's a Christian and he knows the bible like the back of his hand. I wish more people would just live like a Christian rather than tell you that they're a Christian. Lead by example, not just with words...ya know?

I agree 100%. You are NOT a christian if you live like that... not to mention all the disgusting things done all the time 'in god's name'. Those people may USE religion as an excuse... but they are certainly not religious.

Heineken Helen

eMMI wrote:

but life isn't miserable! whether you believe in God or not, life doesn't have to be miserable.

if someone wants to be a little happier in this crazy world, why not let them? people do all sorts of things to feel better anyway.

I believe in God, but I know I'm gonna die and my body will be worm food..

and you know, some people who don't believe in God think/find that there's a reason for them being here.

if you want your life to be miserable, fine, that's your choice. but please, don't expect others to mope with you.

Nice post and yeh most religious people know that their BODY will be worm food!

LONGRD

eMMI wrote:

but life isn't miserable! whether you believe in God or not, life doesn't have to be miserable.

if someone wants to be a little happier in this crazy world, why not let them? people do all sorts of things to feel better anyway.

I believe in God, but I know I'm gonna die and my body will be worm food..

and you know, some people who don't believe in God think/find that there's a reason for them being here.

if you want your life to be miserable, fine, that's your choice. but please, don't expect others to mope with you.

God and religion also brings misery to life for those trying hard to follow every single principle placed in the Good Book(s). There are temptations everywhere!!!

orig_long red

eMMI wrote:

but life isn't miserable! whether you believe in God or not, life doesn't have to be miserable.

if someone wants to be a little happier in this crazy world, why not let them? people do all sorts of things to feel better anyway.

I believe in God, but I know I'm gonna die and my body will be worm food..

and you know, some people who don't believe in God think/find that there's a reason for them being here.

if you want your life to be miserable, fine, that's your choice. but please, don't expect others to mope with you.

i'm no moper.

BUT ... Life is miserable! We each exist for a miniscule, insignificant amount of time. Nothing we do will have any kind of impact in the grand scheme of the universe. Some people find that so depressing that they need to invent a scenario that puts them on "high" at the right hand of an invisible man, resting on mattress made of clouds.

bogus!

but I, sir, am no moper. I am content in my nothingness.

Brain of J.Lo

Heineken Helen wrote:

Trust me, I'm not a big fan either... although I do find the whole religion debate interesting. I have friends of many different religions and I've gone to their 'places of worship' simply out of interest... one thing I've found is that there are very few who actually FOLLOW the teachings that they try to force upon others.

Yeah, it's amazing how few people you meet that actually work hard to do the work that they call god's work. I could write a book filled with just my own bad experiences with those who call themselves religious and/or Christians, and that's why I feel it's so pointless to talk about it. People get so caught up in the rhetoric and then it just sort of ends there... More action, less talk is what the world needs.

Heineken Helen

LongRd. wrote:

God and religion also brings misery to life for those trying hard to follow every single principle placed in the Good Book(s). There are temptations everywhere!!!

what? so you think that somebody who doesn't give into temptation is miserable? I'd imagine it to be the opposite... that it must be fantastic to have complete control over your life and body. I certainly don't. I don't' follow any religion but I know there's a god... and it certainly hasn't made me miserable

Heineken Helen

Brain of J.Lo wrote:

Yeah, it's amazing how few people you meet that actually work hard to do the work that they call god's work. I could write a book filled with just my own bad experiences with those who call themselves religious and/or Christians, and that's why I feel it's so pointless to talk about it. People get so caught up in the rhetoric and then it just sort of ends there... More action, less talk is what the world needs.

I agree... and I'm certainly no moral example to anyone either... and I don't claim to be but in my lifetime, I've seen very few selfless people... some have been religious and some have not. I don't think you need religion to be a good person but I think many truly good people at least directly or indirectly follow the morals that were set out in the bible... coincidence?

eMMI

LongRd. wrote:

God and religion also brings misery to life for those trying hard to follow every single principle placed in the Good Book(s). There are temptations everywhere!!!

the thing is.. the Bible is written by humans and most of it isn't the direct word of God. so, if someone is trying to do everything the Book tells them to and believe everything in there is true word for word, it can make them miserable, but then we're definitely talking about religioon/people making them so, and not God.

agreed, temptations are all around and people fall. we're humans, we can't help but fall into sin.. it's whether or not you know you did wrong (in the eyes of God or law) and regret it that counts.

orig_long red

all I know is, if there is a god, he's got lots of 'splaining to do. when I get to heaven, I'm going to demand immediate audience with him.

Heineken Helen

eMMI wrote:

the thing is.. the Bible is written by humans and most of it isn't the direct word of God. so, if someone is trying to do everything the Book tells them to and believe everything in there is true word for word, it can make them miserable, but then we're definitely talking about religioon/people making them so, and not God.

agreed, temptations are all around and people fall. we're humans, we can't help but fall into sin.. it's whether or not you know you did wrong (in the eyes of God or law) and regret it that counts.

Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...

orig_long red

Heineken Helen wrote:

Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...

now ur talking about morals vs. ethics. morality is ethics with a paper halo.

LONGRD

Good segue by the way.

Heineken Helen wrote:

what? so you think that somebody who doesn't give into temptation is miserable? I'd imagine it to be the opposite... that it must be fantastic to have complete control over your life and body. I certainly don't. I don't' follow any religion but I know there's a god... and it certainly hasn't made me miserable

No. I meant it's HARD not to give into temptation, and I don't believe anyone on Earth can resist. Not even those(Priest) whose are close to God.

eMMI wrote:

the thing is.. the Bible is written by humans and most of it isn't the direct word of God. so, if someone is trying to do everything the Book tells them to and believe everything in there is true word for word, it can make them miserable, but then we're definitely talking about religioon/people making them so, and not God.

agreed, temptations are all around and people fall. we're humans, we can't help but fall into sin.. it's whether or not you know you did wrong (in the eyes of God or law) and regret it that counts.

Heineken Helen wrote:

Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...

How much forgiveness can one be pardon? In life, there is good and evil!!! If there was God who have strict principles, no way He/she would just forgive that easily.

Heineken Helen

LongRd. wrote:

Good segue by the way.

No. I meant it's HARD not to give into temptation, and I don't believe anyone on Earth can resist. Not even those(Priest) whose are close to God.



How much forgiveness can one be pardon? In life, there is good and evil!!! If there was God who have strict principles, no way He/she would just forgive that easily.

You're right, it's hard not to give into temptation... and I seriously doubt there is anybody alive today who has lived a life without ONCE giving into temptation. Who said anything about forgiving EASILY? Forgiveness is only granted if you really ARE remorseful... and if you really are remorseful it's not like you're gonna go out and do the same thing straight away again. If one makes an effort for a good chunk of their life, TRYING to live a good life and being sorry for the things they've done wrong.. they will be forgiven.

Heineken Helen

long red wrote:

now ur talking about morals vs. ethics. morality is ethics with a paper halo.

It's just a different word... I'm not getting into semantics

orig_long red

Heineken Helen wrote:

It's just a different word... I'm not getting into semantics

different meanings and sources. morals have basis in religion. whereas ethics are dictated by society.

eMMI

Heineken Helen wrote:

Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...

yes! all our sins (if we regret them) are forgiven (in the eyes of God). because, mainly God knows we do stupid shite and, like a parent he will forgive us.

accepting you've done wrong and remorse are definitely not easy things. they're as hard as apologising at times. but it has to be done, like you said, whether you believe in God or not.

Heineken Helen

long red wrote:

different meanings and sources. morals have basis in religion. whereas ethics are dictated by society.

but which came first... society or religion? can anybody answer that question? So who knows whether morals came from ethics or the other way around?

noisy mind

long red wrote:

dont insult me by calling me an atheist. I am nothing. Completely indifferent.

keep lying to yourself. completely indifferent towards something doesn't include using terms like brainwashing or punching people in the throat for believing in something.

when it comes down to it, who really cares as long as your friend finds some peace....and even then, few of us will truly care.

regards,

cynical american

orig_long red

Heineken Helen wrote:

but which came first... society or religion? can anybody answer that question? So who knows whether morals came from ethics or the other way around?

i'm on summer break, I can't tackle that right now.

orig_long red

noisy mind wrote:

keep lying to yourself. completely indifferent towards something doesn't include using terms like brainwashing or punching people in the throat for believing in something.

when it comes down to it, who really cares as long as your friend finds some peace....and even then, few of us will truly care.

regards,

cynical american

like i said before ... i'm indifferent towards religion unless it grows on a friend like fungus.

Heineken Helen

long red wrote:

i'm on summer break, I can't tackle that right now.

excuses excuses... it's possible religion was the first form of society or one of. I wonder if religion came from society or if society was born out of people drawn together by a common interest such as some kinda thing they perceived to be a god. I would imagine society came first, makes sense... but words like 'ethics' or 'morals' who knows which came when or why.