a few months ago i would have disagreed. then i started working with abused children. i jumped on a foster parent for calling my now favorite a f'n retard. she is slightly retarded b/c her mother is a crack smoker. she was raped at 10 by her mothers boyfriend. the 15 yr old i'm working with was shot by her father along with her mother and brother. she was the only survivor. she crawled to the neighbours for help. it made the news; maybe you heard about it.
anyway; people have kids and leave their care to those of us with enough love in our hearts to care.
One incident, does not account for the entire population of the world.
But I can see you are emotionally attached to your percept. And yes I agree, a loving family is mostly all that's required for proper child-rearing.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Here's your attention. Feel better? I agree but maybe not with the percentage. Is that a statistic?
no; it's an opinion. check my last post and it will explain how i came to this opinion.
and yes; i do feel better. i wish i knew asking for attention was so easy a long time ago.
You know, Mrs. Buckman, you need a license to buy a dog, to drive a car - hell, you even need a license to catch a fish. But they'll let any butt-reaming asshole be a father.
Cutback where is this quote from pls? I've got brain strain trying to recall.
One incident, does not account for the entire population of the world.
But I can see you are emotionally attached to your percept. And yes I agree, a loving family is mostly all that's required for proper child-rearing.
one incident? ONE INCIDENT??? the state is putting my baby in a group home b/c they don't have the money to support all the incidents in this state alone.
one incident? ONE INCIDENT??? the state is putting my baby in a group home b/c they don't have the money to support all the incidents in this state alone.
You said yourself, you work with abused children. How often do you work with children from loving families that aren't abused?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Obviously Point Break is an exception. He wasn't good in that but I watch it every time it's on.:D
What about Speed, Constantine and the Matrix trilogy?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
You said yourself, you work with abused children. How often do you work with children from loving families that aren't abused?
to be honest; i think all children are abused in one way or another. a loving parent can loose their temper. a loving parent can loose track of what's important when they have a bad day at work. i've seen what i thought were perfect parents call their child a f'n idiot. that's where my 90% opinion comes from. people don't see what goes on behind closed doors; but the kids tell.
no; it's an opinion. check my last post and it will explain how i came to this opinion.
and yes; i do feel better. i wish i knew asking for attention was so easy a long time ago.
All ya gotta do is ask! Reading back over your last post, (this thing is moving so fast I'm struggling to keep up!) I can see how you arrive at 90%. How truly horrific some people can be. I guess because you are involved with the worst of parents that 90% is reasonable from your perspective. I have been lucky enough (in recent years) to be surrounded by many fine examples of good parenting and happy and healthy kids so at this point in time I'd probably say I think less than 30% from my current perspective. But if you'd asked me 10 - 15 yrs ago I'd say you were right on the money! It's all relative I suppose. Oooh somewhere in the dark recesses of my addled brain I think I may have somehow agreed with Anhimus about statistics!!
All ya gotta do is ask! Reading back over your last post, (this thing is moving so fast I'm struggling to keep up!) I can see how you arrive at 90%. How truly horrific some people can be. I guess because you are involved with the worst of parents that 90% is reasonable from your perspective. I have been lucky enough (in recent years) to be surrounded by many fine examples of good parenting and happy and healthy kids so at this point in time I'd probably say I think less than 30% from my current perspective. But if you'd asked me 10 - 15 yrs ago I'd say you were right on the money! It's all relative I suppose. Oooh somewhere in the dark recesses of my addled brain I think I may have somehow agreed with Anhimus about statistics!!
That's why we have hundreds of thousands of scientists and researchers figuring this stuff out for us.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I look at this fact when contemplating if gay couples should be allowed to raise children... a la Mary Chaney. I'm not saying the government should step in, I just feel that it is morally wrong towards the child for them to be raised in a homosexual household.
I feel that it serves the parents more than the child. I have no problem with people proclaiming their homosexuality. But why would they want to put a child in the precarious situation of being raised in that environment??? It seems amoral and selfish to me. Nature has given us the rules by which species procreate. It is unatural for gays to have children, it is synthetic...
I haven't read the all 6 pages of this thread yet so this might have already come up, but, have you considered if it is morally wrong to raise a child in a single-parent household, or a divorced household where kids are shuttled from one heterosexual parent's house to another? Or even to raise them with a step-family or a commune or a kibbutz or an extended family or any other way of raising a child that is outside the "idealised norm" of a nuclear family of two parents with kids?
In fact, do you have any examples of kids who have grown up with gay parents have grown up screwed up about it (as opposed to the myriad of fucked up people that come out of other family-types)?
Also, what is "precarious" about the situation? Are you afraid that the gay parents will try and force the kid to become gay or think it normal to be so?
Also, why is it selfish and amoral for gay people to want to be parents too? Looking after and raising a child has nothing to do with your own sexuality and everything to do with how much you can love and care for the child and how much you are there for them when they are growing up. Your own sexuality has nothing to do with it, imo.
"We have to change the concept of patriotism to one of “matriotism” — love of humanity that transcends war. A matriarch would never send her own children off to wars that kill other people’s children." Cindy Sheehan --- London, Brixton, 14 July 1993 London, Wembley, 1996 London, Wembley, 18 June 2007 London, O2, 18 August 2009 London, Hammersmith Apollo (Ed solo), 31 July 2012 Milton Keynes Bowl, 11 July 2014
London, Hammersmith Apollo (Ed solo), 06 June 2017
All ya gotta do is ask! Reading back over your last post, (this thing is moving so fast I'm struggling to keep up!) I can see how you arrive at 90%. How truly horrific some people can be. I guess because you are involved with the worst of parents that 90% is reasonable from your perspective. I have been lucky enough (in recent years) to be surrounded by many fine examples of good parenting and happy and healthy kids so at this point in time I'd probably say I think less than 30% from my current perspective. But if you'd asked me 10 - 15 yrs ago I'd say you were right on the money! It's all relative I suppose. Oooh somewhere in the dark recesses of my addled brain I think I may have somehow agreed with Anhimus about statistics!!
when you consider the number of babies having babies; i think the percentage goes up. i don't get along well with adults much anymore. i stick to children and animals. when you show them unconditional love they show you loyalty. show an adult unconditional love and they take advantage of it.
That's why we have hundreds of thousands of scientists and researchers figuring this stuff out for us.
Yes, I think that research and science are wonderful things but "figuring this stuff out for us"? Hhhmmm that sounds dangerous. Isn't the idea that research can be accepted or rejected? Research and science can be highly subjective. Not that I want to argue with you about it Ahnimus I think you'll make my head explode!
We should just let all of our kids be raised by animals.
Feral children don't seem to care much about social prejudice and justice.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Yes, I think that research and science are wonderful things but "figuring this stuff out for us"? Hhhmmm that sounds dangerous. Isn't the idea that research can be accepted or rejected? Research and science can be highly subjective. Not that I want to argue with you about it Ahnimus I think you'll make my head explode!
Well, certainly, many scientists and researches deny or suppress their own findings. That's why peer review is important.
But, as an example, a study of 10,000 monozygous twins, showing only 50% share the same sexual orientation. Implies that it's not entirely genetic, or that there are other factors. So it could be interpreted that in-fact 100% of monozygous twins share sexual orientation, but due to social pressure 50% suppress it, or it could be seen that it's simply not genetic in it's entirety.
Either way, without statistical data like that, we all postulate opinions based solely on our own observations, which 90% of is sensationalized news broadcasts or drama TV shows.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
.... show an adult unconditional love and they take advantage of it.
Not all of us onelongsong! Many of us are just like you, we just don't get the media exposure! I think you are doing a fantastic job at making the world a better place, just don't get cynical about all of us "growed ups". We had no choice most of us, we just woke up one morning and it had happened!! I'm still a kid in here most days and I try my best to tread carefully with other people's hearts and minds.
Not all of us onelongsong! Many of us are just like you, we just don't get the media exposure! I think you are doing a fantastic job at making the world a better place, just don't get cynical about all of us "growed ups". We had no choice most of us, we just woke up one morning and it had happened!! I'm still a kid in here most days and I try my best to tread carefully with other people's hearts and minds.
Not me, I'm a heartless bastard, ask anyone.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I haven't read the all 6 pages of this thread yet so this might have already come up, but, have you considered if it is morally wrong to raise a child in a single-parent household, or a divorced household where kids are shuttled from one heterosexual parent's house to another? Or even to raise them with a step-family or a commune or a kibbutz or an extended family or any other way of raising a child that is outside the "idealised norm" of a nuclear family of two parents with kids?
In fact, do you have any examples of kids who have grown up with gay parents have grown up screwed up about it (as opposed to the myriad of fucked up people that come out of other family-types)?
Also, what is "precarious" about the situation? Are you afraid that the gay parents will try and force the kid to become gay or think it normal to be so?
Also, why is it selfish and amoral for gay people to want to be parents too? Looking after and raising a child has nothing to do with your own sexuality and everything to do with how much you can love and care for the child and how much you are there for them when they are growing up. Your own sexuality has nothing to do with it, imo.
i've found poorer parents to be more loving. they're not as wrapped up in keeping what they have (if that makes sense). a gay couple may have more to deal with ie: oppression; which may distract from child rearing the same as a two income family takes away from the child rearing responsability to some extent. when you enter into a stressfull situation; is it fair to ask a child to carry that cross too? i've also found that people treat children like cats and dogs. they're great when you get them; but after a while the magic wears off and you're asking how you got into this. a gay couple may be better parents because they have to fight harder for what others take for granted.
as i said earlier; nobody knows the answer. we all just play it by ear; don't we?
.......Either way, without statistical data like that, we all postulate opinions based solely on our own observations, which 90% of is sensationalized news broadcasts or drama TV shows.
Look, strangely, I think I pretty much agree with you here but I do think you are underestimating people. I may not be a mental giant but I do like to get my information from reputable sources and I do try to look at more than one side of a situation and I don't think I'm on my own there.
Not all of us onelongsong! Many of us are just like you, we just don't get the media exposure! I think you are doing a fantastic job at making the world a better place, just don't get cynical about all of us "growed ups". We had no choice most of us, we just woke up one morning and it had happened!! I'm still a kid in here most days and I try my best to tread carefully with other people's hearts and minds.
i am honored to meet you. i guess i've never really grown up. i carry too much hurt with me. when i learn to forget it only comes back to slap me in the face when it happens again.
animals show homosexual tendancies from time to time...ever had a dog try to hump your leg fellas? LOL i don't really understand the attraction to the same sex but whatever floats your boat i say.
The wind is blowing cold
Have we lost our way tonight?
Have we lost our hope to sorrow?
Feels like were all alone
Running further from what’s right
And there are no more heroes to follow
animals show homosexual tendancies from time to time...ever had a dog try to hump your leg fellas? LOL i don't really understand the attraction to the same sex but whatever floats your boat i say.
we discussed the animal thing 50 or so pages back. it's atributed to scent.
Comments
Here's your attention. Feel better? I agree but maybe not with the percentage. Is that a statistic?
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
One incident, does not account for the entire population of the world.
But I can see you are emotionally attached to your percept. And yes I agree, a loving family is mostly all that's required for proper child-rearing.
no; it's an opinion. check my last post and it will explain how i came to this opinion.
and yes; i do feel better. i wish i knew asking for attention was so easy a long time ago.
Cutback where is this quote from pls? I've got brain strain trying to recall.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
The only movie besides Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure that Keanu was ever good in.
one incident? ONE INCIDENT??? the state is putting my baby in a group home b/c they don't have the money to support all the incidents in this state alone.
Ahh! Thank you. And I agree except I do like to laugh my way through Point Break and it is nice to see him all wet & slippery!
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
You said yourself, you work with abused children. How often do you work with children from loving families that aren't abused?
Obviously Point Break is an exception. He wasn't good in that but I watch it every time it's on.:D
What about Speed, Constantine and the Matrix trilogy?
to be honest; i think all children are abused in one way or another. a loving parent can loose their temper. a loving parent can loose track of what's important when they have a bad day at work. i've seen what i thought were perfect parents call their child a f'n idiot. that's where my 90% opinion comes from. people don't see what goes on behind closed doors; but the kids tell.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
All ya gotta do is ask!
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
That's why we have hundreds of thousands of scientists and researchers figuring this stuff out for us.
I get such a cack every time they scan past the "Bell Beach" sign with the pine trees in the background!
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I haven't read the all 6 pages of this thread yet so this might have already come up, but, have you considered if it is morally wrong to raise a child in a single-parent household, or a divorced household where kids are shuttled from one heterosexual parent's house to another? Or even to raise them with a step-family or a commune or a kibbutz or an extended family or any other way of raising a child that is outside the "idealised norm" of a nuclear family of two parents with kids?
In fact, do you have any examples of kids who have grown up with gay parents have grown up screwed up about it (as opposed to the myriad of fucked up people that come out of other family-types)?
Also, what is "precarious" about the situation? Are you afraid that the gay parents will try and force the kid to become gay or think it normal to be so?
Also, why is it selfish and amoral for gay people to want to be parents too? Looking after and raising a child has nothing to do with your own sexuality and everything to do with how much you can love and care for the child and how much you are there for them when they are growing up. Your own sexuality has nothing to do with it, imo.
---
London, Brixton, 14 July 1993
London, Wembley, 1996
London, Wembley, 18 June 2007
London, O2, 18 August 2009
London, Hammersmith Apollo (Ed solo), 31 July 2012
Milton Keynes Bowl, 11 July 2014
when you consider the number of babies having babies; i think the percentage goes up. i don't get along well with adults much anymore. i stick to children and animals. when you show them unconditional love they show you loyalty. show an adult unconditional love and they take advantage of it.
ps: i may ask again some day!
Yes, I think that research and science are wonderful things but "figuring this stuff out for us"? Hhhmmm that sounds dangerous. Isn't the idea that research can be accepted or rejected? Research and science can be highly subjective. Not that I want to argue with you about it Ahnimus I think you'll make my head explode!
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Feral children don't seem to care much about social prejudice and justice.
Well, certainly, many scientists and researches deny or suppress their own findings. That's why peer review is important.
But, as an example, a study of 10,000 monozygous twins, showing only 50% share the same sexual orientation. Implies that it's not entirely genetic, or that there are other factors. So it could be interpreted that in-fact 100% of monozygous twins share sexual orientation, but due to social pressure 50% suppress it, or it could be seen that it's simply not genetic in it's entirety.
Either way, without statistical data like that, we all postulate opinions based solely on our own observations, which 90% of is sensationalized news broadcasts or drama TV shows.
Not all of us onelongsong! Many of us are just like you, we just don't get the media exposure! I think you are doing a fantastic job at making the world a better place, just don't get cynical about all of us "growed ups". We had no choice most of us, we just woke up one morning and it had happened!! I'm still a kid in here most days and I try my best to tread carefully with other people's hearts and minds.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Not me, I'm a heartless bastard, ask anyone.
i've found poorer parents to be more loving. they're not as wrapped up in keeping what they have (if that makes sense). a gay couple may have more to deal with ie: oppression; which may distract from child rearing the same as a two income family takes away from the child rearing responsability to some extent. when you enter into a stressfull situation; is it fair to ask a child to carry that cross too? i've also found that people treat children like cats and dogs. they're great when you get them; but after a while the magic wears off and you're asking how you got into this. a gay couple may be better parents because they have to fight harder for what others take for granted.
as i said earlier; nobody knows the answer. we all just play it by ear; don't we?
Yeah but peer review can also be subjective.
.......... BBBOOOOMMM!!!!! Told ya! No just kidding!
Look, strangely, I think I pretty much agree with you here but I do think you are underestimating people. I may not be a mental giant but I do like to get my information from reputable sources and I do try to look at more than one side of a situation and I don't think I'm on my own there.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
i am honored to meet you. i guess i've never really grown up. i carry too much hurt with me. when i learn to forget it only comes back to slap me in the face when it happens again.
Ha!!! I've been reading, you seem more like a Caramello Koala to me!
That's not an insult btw. Carmello Koala's are hard on the outside, soft on the inside.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Have we lost our way tonight?
Have we lost our hope to sorrow?
Feels like were all alone
Running further from what’s right
And there are no more heroes to follow
So what are we becoming?
Where did we go wrong?
we discussed the animal thing 50 or so pages back. it's atributed to scent.