if it was discovered that the US govt was complicit...

jlew24asu

MakingWaves wrote:

Yes and the families got to hear the black box recordings.

These threads would be more legitamite if people asked questions about what the government knew before hand and such, and didn't say stupid shit about it not being a plane that hit the Pentagon.

hey waves. dont do it man!!!! its so easy to get sucked back in these threads. the no plane theory has to be near the top of tin hat insanity. there are a few who ask good questions. but its rare.


and fyi for those keeping score.... "No plane hit the pentagon" is not a question. its a statement.

MakingWaves

jlew24asu wrote:

hey waves. dont do it man!!!! its so easy to get sucked back in these threads. the no plane theory has to be near the top of tin hat insanity. there are a few who ask good questions. but its rare.


and fyi for those keeping score.... "No plane hit the pentagon" is not a question. its a statement.

Hey Jlew, you're right. I will step out as quickly as I stepped in

jlew24asu

MakingWaves wrote:

You're right. I will step out as quickly as I stepped in

well I hope you check back from time to time. you bring a level of common sense rarely seen by the conspiracy nuts.

ledvedderman

The only thing that makes me question the whole 9/11 story is the plane in PA. I've been told by someone off the record that the plane was shot down. This is someone that I go pretty far back with and they wouldn't bullshit me.

I have no problem with the plane being shot down at all. It saved many lives in doing so. I do have a problem though w/ the propeganda that was put out about Flight 93 and the whole "Let's Roll" craze. It makes me sick to think that this government would try to capitalize on such a tragedy to establish a catch phrase for a military invasion.

MakingWaves

ledvedderman wrote:

The only thing that makes me question the whole 9/11 story is the plane in PA. I've been told by someone off the record that the plane was shot down. This is someone that I go pretty far back with and they wouldn't bullshit me.

I have no problem with the plane being shot down at all. It saved many lives in doing so. I do have a problem though w/ the propeganda that was put out about Flight 93 and the whole "Let's Roll" craze. It makes me sick to think that this government would try to capitalize on such a tragedy to establish a catch phrase for a military invasion.

See, this is a legitimate question. I really wouldn't be surprised if they shot down Flight 93.

ledvedderman

MakingWaves wrote:

See, this is a legitimate question. I really wouldn't be surprised if they shot down Flight 93.

The thing I don't get is if they did shoot it down...why not tell us? I think the American people are strong enough to handle it. I think that's an easier pill to swallow than seeing a plane fly into a building.

jlew24asu

ledvedderman wrote:

The only thing that makes me question the whole 9/11 story is the plane in PA. I've been told by someone off the record that the plane was shot down. This is someone that I go pretty far back with and they wouldn't bullshit me.

I have no problem with the plane being shot down at all. It saved many lives in doing so. I do have a problem though w/ the propeganda that was put out about Flight 93 and the whole "Let's Roll" craze. It makes me sick to think that this government would try to capitalize on such a tragedy to establish a catch phrase for a military invasion.

I agree its certainly possible the plane was shot down.

but I think its documented fact that people on board made decisions to try and get into the cockpit.

there are recorded phone conversations with verizon .....no?

ledvedderman

jlew24asu wrote:

I agree its certainly possible the plane was shot down.

but I think its documented fact that people on board made decisions to try and get into the cockpit.

there are recorded phone conversations with verizon .....no?

I think you are right. I've heard people say that the conversations were really odd and didn't "sound" legit. I have yet to hear them, so I will reserve judgement on that.

jlew24asu

ledvedderman wrote:

I think you are right. I've heard people say that the conversations were really odd and didn't "sound" legit. I have yet to hear them, so I will reserve judgement on that.

I dont think they have ever been released to the public. just for the families. so I'm not sure how the people you've spoken to know that.

it would be nice to hear though. that is as much fact as one can ask for regarding what actually happened on that plane.

MakingWaves

ledvedderman wrote:

The thing I don't get is if they did shoot it down...why not tell us? I think the American people are strong enough to handle it. I think that's an easier pill to swallow than seeing a plane fly into a building.

You are right but in the end i think the politicians involved in making the decision would have been too scared to be remembered as having ordered the shooting down of a plane. Better to just blame it on the terrorists and be done with it in their eyes.

g under p

ledvedderman wrote:

The thing I don't get is if they did shoot it down...why not tell us? I think the American people are strong enough to handle it. I think that's an easier pill to swallow than seeing a plane fly into a building.

If this plane was shot down and announcing it to the public would detract from the drama of the day. Then that may raise discuss as to WHY this plane had to be shot down.

You know those family members would be pissed royally.

Peace

jlew24asu

g under p wrote:

If this plane was shot down and announcing it to the public would detract from the drama of the day. Then that may raise discuss as to WHY this plane had to be shot down.

You know those family members would be pissed royally.

Peace

I would guess those family members would be more pissed being lied to. and would accept the fact, like most americans, that the plane was shot down to prevent the loss of possible hundreds/thousands more lives.

ledvedderman

jlew24asu wrote:

I would guess those family members would be more pissed being lied to. and would accept the fact, like most americans, that the plane was shot down to prevent the loss of possible hundreds/thousands more lives.

I agree. While the back story would be a lie, the underlying theme would remain the same---the people on Flight 93 died so that others didn't have to. Nothing non-heroic about that..."lets roll" or not.

catefrances

even flow? wrote:

We have all been in airplanes and we all know that you can't see a building from 30,000 feet. Thus please tell me how those brown boys, came down from that height with no communication with a tower and the preplanned flight path of Boston to LA in the system and still were able to pick the towers (of which they found the coast they could have been very lucky) and picked the pentagon out with ease. Things like that just don't "happen" by chance. They were not ace pilots and there is not a chance in hell they were able to pull that off without help or not even being in the airplane at all.

So my question for you to answer is how did they do that? Have you been in an airplane? Have you been able to see buildings and know what they are from 30,000 feet? I didn't think you have nor could those brown boys in the cockpit of those planes that day.


YOU OR ANY OTHER PROFESSED NONBELIEVER CAN TAKE A SWIPE AT THAT ONE.

whilst i have to admit hitting the pentagon was a mighty fine piece of flying, i also have to ask whether the planes were at cruising altitude though?
and not knowing the men in question i have no knowledge of just how intelligent they were. but as someoone said, the pentagon is quite a unique building. tis not like these guys woke up one day and decided to crash into the pentagon. it took planning and they did their homework well.

as for the twin towers. holy shit they stick out like a single tree in the desert.

jlew24asu

catefrances wrote:

whilst i have to admit hitting the pentagon was a mighty fine piece of flying, i also have to ask whether the planes were at cruising altitude though?
and not knowing the men in question i have no knowledge of just how intelligent they were. but as someoone said, the pentagon is quite a unique building. tis not like these guys woke up one day and decided to crash into the pentagon. it took planning and they did their homework well.

as for the twin towers. holy shit they stick out like a single tree in the desert.

this is a freakin image from space.

http://media.maps.com/images/promo/pentagon-after.jpg


it just amazes me that people are willing to say the whole thing was a conspiracy based on silly little assumptions that "the pilot couldnt see the pentagon."


im not yelling at you cate. just venting a lil. I like when u post here.

catefrances

jlew24asu wrote:

this is a freakin image from space.

http://media.maps.com/images/promo/pentagon-after.jpg


it just amazes me that people are willing to say the whole thing was a conspiracy based on silly little assumptions that "the pilot couldnt see the pentagon."


im not yelling at you cate. just venting a lil. I like when u post here.

why would i think you were yelling at me j? i don't. i know i didnt say anything that would warrant.

g under p

catefrances wrote:

whilst i have to admit hitting the pentagon was a mighty fine piece of flying, i also have to ask whether the planes were at cruising altitude though?
and not knowing the men in question i have no knowledge of just how intelligent they were. but as someoone said, the pentagon is quite a unique building. tis not like these guys woke up one day and decided to crash into the pentagon. it took planning and they did their homework well.

as for the twin towers. holy shit they stick out like a single tree in the desert.

Again the demographics of the Northern VA area is very difficult to navigate for the inexperienced. Those flying that plane had no dry runs and where the Pentagon is situated in a low lying area and partly surrounded by highways. It's very difficult to maneuver in that tight space, without hitting the grounds or highway out front of the building.

I personally went down there to look at the smoldering building the next day on my bike just to take the whole scene in and it takes some serious flying to get that plane in such a tight space without hitting anything along the way.

Peace

jlew24asu

catefrances wrote:

why would i think you were yelling at me j? i don't. i know i didnt say anything that would warrant.

just makin sure

jlew24asu

g under p wrote:

Again the demographics of the Northern VA area is very difficult to navigate for the inexperienced. Those flying that plane had no dry runs and where the Pentagon is situated in a low lying area and partly surrounded by highways. It's very difficult to maneuver in that tight space, without hitting the grounds or highway out front of the building.

I personally went down there to look at the smoldering building the next day on my bike just to take the whole scene in and it takes some serious flying to get that plane in such a tight space without hitting anything along the way.

Peace

so what are you implying?

g under p

jlew24asu wrote:

so what are you implying?

Just what I said, it takes quite a bit of experience to fly a plane that large through that maze of a place under those stressful conditions into that Pentagon buildng on that day.


Peace