Second, banning guns on school grounds just makes everyone else defenseless.
Guns are here to stay. Banning them only makes criminals stronger.
first.. he was a supergrass.. ergo he's weak and pathetic
second... wholly moronic statement award goes to you
third... Like, I was over in England. You ever been to England, anyone, been to England? No one has handguns in England, not even the cops. True or false? True. Now-in England last year, they had fourteen deaths from handguns. FFFFFourteen. Now-the United States, and I think you know how we feel about handguns-woooo, I'm getting a warm tingly feeling just saying the fucking word, to be honest with you. I swear to you, I am hard. Twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. Now let's go through those numbers again, because they're a little baffling at first glance. England, where no one has guns, fffffffourteen deaths. United States, and I think you know how we feel about guns-woooo, I'm getting a stiffy-twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. But there's no connection, and you'd be a fool and a Communist to make one. There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone. There have been studies made and there is no connection at all there. Yes. That's absolute proof. You know, fourteen deaths from handguns. Probably American tourists, too.
(Angry tourist voice) You call this a sandwich? BANG! BANG! You don't boil pizza! BANG! BANG!
(Scared English voice) That's the way we eat here, that's the way we eat here! BANG!
(Tourist voice) This food sucks! BANG
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
Maybe the fear of someone going into a place and shooting everyone up is the motivating factor behind why people want to protect themselves with a counteroffense...........?
but if nobody had guns in the first place? not even cops.
silly thought huh.
dunkman - funny you should post right then. that was sort of my point.
*~Pearl Jam will be blasted from speakers until morale improves~*
That's the thing. There is no easy answer like "outlaw all guns" or "everyone should have a gun". Maybe we should outlaw crazy people...........or lock depressed people up to keep them from causing harm to themselves or others? The fact of the matter is that people do crazy things for a number of reasons. If it comes back that he was abused as a child will we have more strict punishments for child abusers? If he had lost his job should we find better ways of compensating those who lose their jobs? No one can predict these events, and the fault is with the person who committed this selfish act. We can be better prepared for acts like this by upgrading security features at schools, but as always, if there is a will there is a way. What would have detered a person this desperate and determined? I personally doubt any gun law could have.......
true but tougher gun laws and stiffer penalties might have prevented this or other crimes. no matter what laws are in place, bad people will still do bad things, but that should stop law makers from making things more difficult for them
third... Like, I was over in England. You ever been to England, anyone, been to England? No one has handguns in England, not even the cops. True or false? True. Now-in England last year, they had fourteen deaths from handguns. FFFFFourteen. Now-the United States, and I think you know how we feel about handguns-woooo, I'm getting a warm tingly feeling just saying the fucking word, to be honest with you. I swear to you, I am hard. Twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. Now let's go through those numbers again, because they're a little baffling at first glance. England, where no one has guns, fffffffourteen deaths. United States, and I think you know how we feel about guns-woooo, I'm getting a stiffy-twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. But there's no connection, and you'd be a fool and a Communist to make one. There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone. There have been studies made and there is no connection at all there. Yes. That's absolute proof. You know, fourteen deaths from handguns. Probably American tourists, too.
(Angry tourist voice) You call this a sandwich? BANG! BANG! You don't boil pizza! BANG! BANG!
(Scared English voice) That's the way we eat here, that's the way we eat here! BANG!
(Tourist voice) This food sucks! BANG
wow I did not know this. interesting information thanks.
first.. he was a supergrass.. ergo he's weak and pathetic
second... wholly moronic statement award goes to you
third... Like, I was over in England. You ever been to England, anyone, been to England? No one has handguns in England, not even the cops. True or false? True. Now-in England last year, they had fourteen deaths from handguns. FFFFFourteen. Now-the United States, and I think you know how we feel about handguns-woooo, I'm getting a warm tingly feeling just saying the fucking word, to be honest with you. I swear to you, I am hard. Twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. Now let's go through those numbers again, because they're a little baffling at first glance. England, where no one has guns, fffffffourteen deaths. United States, and I think you know how we feel about guns-woooo, I'm getting a stiffy-twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. But there's no connection, and you'd be a fool and a Communist to make one. There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone. There have been studies made and there is no connection at all there. Yes. That's absolute proof. You know, fourteen deaths from handguns. Probably American tourists, too.
(Angry tourist voice) You call this a sandwich? BANG! BANG! You don't boil pizza! BANG! BANG!
(Scared English voice) That's the way we eat here, that's the way we eat here! BANG!
(Tourist voice) This food sucks! BANG
true but tougher gun laws and stiffer penalties might have prevented this or other crimes. no matter what laws are in place, bad people will still do bad things, but that should stop law makers from making things more difficult for them
Generally laws only tend to curb behaviors of sane people.
It's impossible to legislate out tradegy. If you want to harm people badly enough you'll find a way to do it regardless of what is legal or illegal.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
Yeah, too bad everyone does have guns in the first place......................"in the first place" was a long time ago.
we banned handguns after the Dunblane Massacre over here in Scotland.
no guns deaths ever since...
co-incidence
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
true but tougher gun laws and stiffer penalties might have prevented this or other crimes. no matter what laws are in place, bad people will still do bad things, but that should stop law makers from making things more difficult for them
Agreed........and good point........but it's not a black and white issue. I think that education is a serious issue if not the most important one. Maybe more and cheaper outlets for people needing psychological help?
how about check points on all school campuses in this country ,and there has to be an answer no?? because if the answers is" nothing can be done to avoid these tragedies" then we sure live in a SAD WORLD ..........
If you want to harm people badly enough you'll find a way to do it regardless of what is legal or illegal.
it'd take a long time to kill 32 people with a sword or a pair of scissors though! and at least you'd have a chance to escape/fightback etc... but one man with a firing dildo... very little chance
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
we banned handguns after the Dunblane Massacre over here in Scotland.
no guns deaths ever since...
co-incidence
What is Scotland's population again? I don't see how you can even compare its society to that of the US........I do not think there is a universal solution.
Not a single gun death since then? I cry bullshit.
go look it up
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
it'd take a long time to kill 32 people with a sword or a pair of scissors though! and at least you'd have a chance to escape/fightback etc... but one man with a firing dildo... very little chance
a propane tank and a crate of nails goes a long way though.....
People assume outlawing guns means they won't be around....it's simply not the case and you can make your own bullets.
I do not believe in ruining freedom for the masses because a few lunatics can't handle it.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
The university’s employees, students, and volunteers, or any visitor or other third party attending a sporting, entertainment, or educational event, or visiting an academic or administrative office building or residence hall, are further prohibited from carrying, maintaining, or storing a firearm or weapon on any university facility, even if the owner has a valid permit, when it is not required by the individual’s job, or in accordance with the relevant University Student Life Policies. Any such individual who is reported or discovered to possess a firearm or weapon on university property will be asked to remove it immediately. Failure to comply may result in a student judicial referral and/or arrest, or an employee disciplinary action and/or arrest.
2.3 Authorized Exceptions to Prohibition on Possession of Firearms or Weapons
An employee may possess a firearm or weapon if it is:
* Used by an employee who is a certified law enforcement officer employed by the Virginia Tech Police Department;
* Required as a part of the employee’s job duties with the Commonwealth of Virginia; or
* Connected with training received by the employee in order to perform the responsibilities of their job with the university.
Employees and students may possess and use appropriate tools, such as saws, knives, and other such implements, necessary for the performance of their job duties or school work, or for student recreational purposes approved under University Student Life Policies. Certain agricultural workers have been authorized to use firearms, and hunting on university property may be authorized by the appropriate university officials. Some employees reside in university-owned houses and are permitted to keep personal firearms on these premises; however, this exception does not extend to employees living in university residence halls. As stated in The University Policies for Student Life, students may not possess, use, or store firearms or weapons on university property; however, firearms and other weapons may be stored with the Virginia Tech Police Department to be checked out for use off-campus. Organizational weapons of the Virginia Tech Corps of Cadets, approved by the Commandant, are not prohibited by this policy. Other exceptions must be approved by the Vice President for Business Affairs, in consultation with appropriate university offices.
Someone could have stopped this if these policies weren't in effect.
What is Scotland's population again? I don't see how you can even compare its society to that of the US........
6 million.. just a little less than Virginia
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
a propane tank and a crate of nails goes a long way though.....
People assume outlawing guns means they won't be around....it's simply not the case and you can make your own bullets.
I do not believe in ruining freedom for the masses because a few lunatics can't handle it.
it does.. but it also takes meticulous planning.. luck... the chance of being caught.. but planning being the major factor
this guy might have snapped and because he had the guns at the ready he just started going mental before reason or logic prevailed
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
Gun bill gets shot down by panel
HB 1572, which would have allowed handguns on college campuses, died in subcommittee.
By Greg Esposito
381-1675
A bill that would have given college students and employees the right to carry handguns on campus died with nary a shot being fired in the General Assembly.
House Bill 1572 didn't get through the House Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety. It died Monday in the subcommittee stage, the first of several hurdles bills must overcome before becoming laws.
The bill was proposed by Del. Todd Gilbert, R-Shenandoah County, on behalf of the Virginia Citizens Defense League. Gilbert was unavailable Monday and spokesman Gary Frink would not comment on the bill's defeat other than to say the issue was dead for this General Assembly session.
Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hincker was happy to hear the bill was defeated. "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."
Del. Dave Nutter, R-Christiansburg, would not comment Monday because he was not part of the subcommittee that discussed the bill.
Most universities in Virginia require students and employees, other than police, to check their guns with police or campus security upon entering campus. The legislation was designed to prohibit public universities from making "rules or regulations limiting or abridging the ability of a student who possesses a valid concealed handgun permit ... from lawfully carrying a concealed handgun."
The legislation allowed for exceptions for participants in athletic events, storage of guns in residence halls and military training programs.
Last spring a Virginia Tech student was disciplined for bringing a handgun to class, despite having a concealed handgun permit. Some gun owners questioned the university's authority, while the Virginia Association of Chiefs of Police came out against the presence of guns on campus.
In June, Tech's governing board approved a violence prevention policy reiterating its ban on students or employees carrying guns and prohibiting visitors from bringing them into campus facilities.
Just one, responsible, armed person may have been able to stem this heinous crime. Unfortunately none of the over 200,000 gun control laws on the books was able to deter this crime.
In 2005/06 there were 766 offences initially recorded as homicide by the police in England and Wales (including the 52 victims of the 7 July 2005 London bombings),[15] a rate of 1.4 per 100,000 of population. Only 50 (6.6%) were committed with firearms, one being with an air weapon.[16] The homicide rate for London was 2.4 per 100,000 in the same year (1.7 when excluding the 7 July bombings).[17]
By comparison, 5.5 murders per 100,000 of population were reported by police in the United States in 2000, of which 70% involved the use of firearms (75% of which were illegally obtained).[18] New York City, with a population size similar to London and similar firearms laws with almost all firearms prohibited to normal citizens (over 7 million residents), reported 6.9 murders per 100,000 people in 2004.[19]
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
It’s been drilled into Americans heads that we need to own firearms for so many years… that’s it our civil right. It’s hard to see another view I guess. I’m all for protecting yourself. Go buy a guard dog, a can of mace, even a samurai sword. If nobody what-so-ever had access to guns, it’s my opinion this country would be a safer place.
*~Pearl Jam will be blasted from speakers until morale improves~*
So Scotland's entire population is less than the population of 1 US state? So you think that the entire population of the US would react in the exact same way as the population of Scotland which, may I add, is probably not nearly culturally diverse?
The latest gun crime figures from Scotland show a total of 970 offences in which a firearm was alleged to have been used in 2003, a reduction of over 9% from 2002. A large proportion of the offences (43 percent) involved air weapons, and 37 percent were committed with unidentified weapons (the latter figure has increased significantly in recent years since Strathclyde (after 2001) and Lothian and Borders (after 2002) stopped making assumptions about what type of weapon was used even if it had not been identified - it was usually assumed that this was an air weapon for statistical returns and this is still likely to be the case). Handguns were involved in 29 offences, the lowest number since 1990. No handgun was used in any offence which caused injury or death.
Recorded Crimes and Offences involving Firearms, Scotland, 2003. Scottish Executive National Statistical Bulletin. October 2004
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
So Scotland's entire population is less than the population of 1 US state?
yep.. and per capita you have 10 times more crime and murder in that one state... nice
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
Also an interesting example of laws or regulations failing to prevent a tregedy ...
Just thought I'd throw that in there, dunkman.
You got one dude who kills 32 people. If one of those 32 people had a gun, he couldve been stopped. Sure he couldve. But imagine the number of guns that would be on campuses. I'm thinking there would be more than 32 gun related deaths if guns were allowed on campuses. Between the drinking, the fighting between roommates, the pressure...i dont think its a good idea.
And this is from one extreme to the other. No guns to everyone needs one.
Should we start giving them to high school students also because of columbine?
Comments
first.. he was a supergrass.. ergo he's weak and pathetic
second...
third... Like, I was over in England. You ever been to England, anyone, been to England? No one has handguns in England, not even the cops. True or false? True. Now-in England last year, they had fourteen deaths from handguns. FFFFFourteen. Now-the United States, and I think you know how we feel about handguns-woooo, I'm getting a warm tingly feeling just saying the fucking word, to be honest with you. I swear to you, I am hard. Twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. Now let's go through those numbers again, because they're a little baffling at first glance. England, where no one has guns, fffffffourteen deaths. United States, and I think you know how we feel about guns-woooo, I'm getting a stiffy-twenty-three thousand deaths from handguns. But there's no connection, and you'd be a fool and a Communist to make one. There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone. There have been studies made and there is no connection at all there. Yes. That's absolute proof. You know, fourteen deaths from handguns. Probably American tourists, too.
(Angry tourist voice) You call this a sandwich? BANG! BANG! You don't boil pizza! BANG! BANG!
(Scared English voice) That's the way we eat here, that's the way we eat here! BANG!
(Tourist voice) This food sucks! BANG
but if nobody had guns in the first place? not even cops.
silly thought huh.
dunkman - funny you should post right then. that was sort of my point.
true but tougher gun laws and stiffer penalties might have prevented this or other crimes. no matter what laws are in place, bad people will still do bad things, but that should stop law makers from making things more difficult for them
wow I did not know this. interesting information thanks.
wait a minute. Boiling pizza?
Generally laws only tend to curb behaviors of sane people.
It's impossible to legislate out tradegy. If you want to harm people badly enough you'll find a way to do it regardless of what is legal or illegal.
we banned handguns after the Dunblane Massacre over here in Scotland.
no guns deaths ever since...
co-incidence
Not a single gun death since then? I cry bullshit.
it'd take a long time to kill 32 people with a sword or a pair of scissors though! and at least you'd have a chance to escape/fightback etc... but one man with a firing dildo... very little chance
go look it up
a propane tank and a crate of nails goes a long way though.....
People assume outlawing guns means they won't be around....it's simply not the case and you can make your own bullets.
I do not believe in ruining freedom for the masses because a few lunatics can't handle it.
Someone could have stopped this if these policies weren't in effect.
6 million.. just a little less than Virginia
I understand this. but it still could prevent even some sane people from doing something tragic.
it does.. but it also takes meticulous planning.. luck... the chance of being caught.. but planning being the major factor
this guy might have snapped and because he had the guns at the ready he just started going mental before reason or logic prevailed
Gun bill gets shot down by panel
HB 1572, which would have allowed handguns on college campuses, died in subcommittee.
By Greg Esposito
381-1675
A bill that would have given college students and employees the right to carry handguns on campus died with nary a shot being fired in the General Assembly.
House Bill 1572 didn't get through the House Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety. It died Monday in the subcommittee stage, the first of several hurdles bills must overcome before becoming laws.
The bill was proposed by Del. Todd Gilbert, R-Shenandoah County, on behalf of the Virginia Citizens Defense League. Gilbert was unavailable Monday and spokesman Gary Frink would not comment on the bill's defeat other than to say the issue was dead for this General Assembly session.
Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hincker was happy to hear the bill was defeated. "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."
Del. Dave Nutter, R-Christiansburg, would not comment Monday because he was not part of the subcommittee that discussed the bill.
Most universities in Virginia require students and employees, other than police, to check their guns with police or campus security upon entering campus. The legislation was designed to prohibit public universities from making "rules or regulations limiting or abridging the ability of a student who possesses a valid concealed handgun permit ... from lawfully carrying a concealed handgun."
The legislation allowed for exceptions for participants in athletic events, storage of guns in residence halls and military training programs.
Last spring a Virginia Tech student was disciplined for bringing a handgun to class, despite having a concealed handgun permit. Some gun owners questioned the university's authority, while the Virginia Association of Chiefs of Police came out against the presence of guns on campus.
In June, Tech's governing board approved a violence prevention policy reiterating its ban on students or employees carrying guns and prohibiting visitors from bringing them into campus facilities.
http://www.roanoke.com/news/roanoke/wb/wb/xp-50658
Disgusting! :(
Just one, responsible, armed person may have been able to stem this heinous crime. Unfortunately none of the over 200,000 gun control laws on the books was able to deter this crime.
Even if its true (and I am pretty sure its not), your causal reasoning is faulty. Correlation does not equal causation.
By comparison, 5.5 murders per 100,000 of population were reported by police in the United States in 2000, of which 70% involved the use of firearms (75% of which were illegally obtained).[18] New York City, with a population size similar to London and similar firearms laws with almost all firearms prohibited to normal citizens (over 7 million residents), reported 6.9 murders per 100,000 people in 2004.[19]
*sigh*
The latest gun crime figures from Scotland show a total of 970 offences in which a firearm was alleged to have been used in 2003, a reduction of over 9% from 2002. A large proportion of the offences (43 percent) involved air weapons, and 37 percent were committed with unidentified weapons (the latter figure has increased significantly in recent years since Strathclyde (after 2001) and Lothian and Borders (after 2002) stopped making assumptions about what type of weapon was used even if it had not been identified - it was usually assumed that this was an air weapon for statistical returns and this is still likely to be the case). Handguns were involved in 29 offences, the lowest number since 1990. No handgun was used in any offence which caused injury or death.
Recorded Crimes and Offences involving Firearms, Scotland, 2003. Scottish Executive National Statistical Bulletin. October 2004
Also an interesting example of laws or regulations failing to prevent a tregedy ...
Just thought I'd throw that in there, dunkman.
yep.. and per capita you have 10 times more crime and murder in that one state... nice
You got one dude who kills 32 people. If one of those 32 people had a gun, he couldve been stopped. Sure he couldve. But imagine the number of guns that would be on campuses. I'm thinking there would be more than 32 gun related deaths if guns were allowed on campuses. Between the drinking, the fighting between roommates, the pressure...i dont think its a good idea.
And this is from one extreme to the other. No guns to everyone needs one.
Should we start giving them to high school students also because of columbine?
New York and Washington D.C. two of the most restrictive cities for firearm ownership yet thier gun crime rate is sky high.
Hmmmmm. Think about it.
Arming properly trained teachers would be a good start.