Do you mean as in age? If so, I happen to be 36 years old.
My question comes from being a woman for 36 of those years, loosing two babies (beyond my control), doing IVF to finally have one, and running a pregnancy loss website for the last 10 years. Beyond that--I am pro-choice in the sense that I feel that it isn't my obligation or right to tell anyone else what to do. My "choice" might not be what others would choose, but it's not my "right" to inflict my opinions on others.
It was just a question, and while I can't tell if you are being a smart-ass, don't reply if you can't answer it!
There's a lot of non-answering of questions going on around here.
I'm so sorry for the loss of your two babies though. :(
That is how you see it, but not have the people on the other side see it. At least I'm willing to concede to you that you see it that way -- but the way the other side sees it is that you are making a 'choice' to kill. Yet you're more than willing and happy to kill baby after baby.
What's amazing is how original that is... what's sad though is how many people just buy into what a celebrity says without having a thought of their own.
when I was in HS I took the pro-abortion side of a debate because I had seen all of the Rock for Choice stuff PJ was doing. Amazingly once I read all of what goes on I came out of it completely pro-life... I guess what the media doesn't want you to see is pretty powerful.
I was pro-choice way before I knew who Ed Vedder was.....
Sorry you find yourself so easily swayed and pulled by these two groups.
I was pro-choice way before I knew who Ed Vedder was.....
Sorry you find yourself so easily swayed and pulled by these two groups.
But that's just it - I was swayed to take the pro-choice side because all I had heard was the PJ/MTV stuff. Once I actually did the research (keep in mind I went into the research part pro-choice) I saw how savage it was, how bad it can screw people up mentally, and then of course the obvious moral issues that are glossed over when abortion is glamourized as a choice. So at that point I was open-minded... but now I'm not since I did my own research and stopped using a guy writing on his arm during a concert as my basis...
No one WANTS to have an abortion. Sometimes it can be the lesser of two evils.
Women using birth control get pregnant. And it's not just unmarried women who don't want children. It happens. If having sex is irresponsible then God help us all.
but u really have to be in the situation. i agree if you are raped or incest you should have one if u choose. it should not be used as birth control though. its a child not a choice i believe. everyone is tilted to their own opionon
And I have never met a woman who believes that it should be used as a form of contraception.
Neither have I. Not one. (Although it has been used this way in some countries without access to birth control.)
It's interesting that so many people say that though. Reminds me of a recent article that found that many women believe that they, although they are having an abortion, are somehow not like those other women who have abortions. Those other women must be irresponsible or callous, but they actually have a unique circumstance and a good reason.
So I’ll just ask you straight-up: are you pro-choice?
Thanks again for the thoughtful conversation.
Likewise...great conversation. I am most certainly pro-choice and am usually arguing with conservatives about this issue, but I do have a tendency to play devil's advocate when the opportunity arises. Without getting any deeper into the argument, I think that the Church has a long way to go (priests that can marry, female clergy, homosexuality fully accepted, etc) but so does humanity. My philosophy of life and religion goes like this:
People read too much into religion (whether they follow it or do not). For the most part, the morals of religions are not in place to ensure a nice cozy spot in heaven through Jesus' 10 club membership. Rather, people don't realize that morals actually make our corporeal lives better and the lives of those around us too. Jesus taught two commandments and said they replace all others: Love God above all else and love your neighbour. The second is found in all beliefs system as the "golden rule". That is why although I identify myself as a Catholic, I believe equally in the validity of pretty much all faiths. That is to say I do not exclude the teachings of the Prophet, Buddha, or anyone else for that matter from the development of my own beliefs. So, we should love everyone no matter how much we disagree with them. And honestly it's hard-I mean I have very little tolerance for the ignorant but notwithstanding what I said in this thread, I have no aversion to anyone no matter how many abortions they have. It's more likely that I have a problem with them if they are an obnoxious idiot-just being a little tongue-in-cheek.
People need to understand that pro-choice is NOT pro-abortion. No one in their right mind believes that it is a good solution.
It is simply that. A womans right to CHOOSE what she believes is the right and best way.
And I have never met a woman who believes that it should be used as a form of contraception.
No, I am sure very few "women" would use it as a form of contraception. Ni woman who would be fully aware that this is still a surgical procedure that after the decision is made to go forth and have an abortion, it is trauma to her body.
But I know when I was a teenager, there were many girls who had multiple abortions and that is what I mean by saying that it was used as a contraception method, an afterthought of unprotected sex that resulted in pregnancy. I do hope that girls nowadays are better equipped to be able to be ammune from that.
I was not judging I do hope you know. And no, pro choice is not anti baby by any means. I was simply stating that we can't ever begin to know what goes on inside someone's mind or body or life to judge them; we can only say what we might do given the same set of circumstance.
I wish to be respectful to people here as well as everywhere else I might encounter them, so I do hope you didn't think I was putting anyone down.
Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
No, I am sure very few "women" would use it as a form of contraception. Ni woman who would be fully aware that this is still a surgical procedure that after the decision is made to go forth and have an abortion, it is trauma to her body.
But I know when I was a teenager, there were many girls who had multiple abortions and that is what I mean by saying that it was used as a contraception method, an afterthought of unprotected sex that resulted in pregnancy. I do hope that girls nowadays are better equipped to be able to be ammune from that.
I was not judging I do hope you know. And no, pro choice is not anti baby by any means. I was simply stating that we can't ever begin to know what goes on inside someone's mind or body or life to judge them; we can only say what we might do given the same set of circumstance.
I wish to be respectful to people here as well as everywhere else I might encounter them, so I do hope you didn't think I was putting anyone down.
I agree with you, but just have a few comments:
1. Abortion is not necessarily a surgical procedure. For one thing, there is now the abortion pill (not the same thing as the morning after pill) available for pregnancies up to 9 weeks (which accounts for most abortions). This is completely non-invasive. Secondly, it's debatable whether even a "surgical abortion" should be called that since, although it is an invasive procedure, it's not a surgery in the sense that most people think of the term. I mean, there are no incisions or anything.
2. I don't know how you define trauma to the body, but I always think it's important to note that abortion is a quick, simple, and common procedure that is considerably safer than having a baby. So, when faced with the decision of whether to have a baby or an abortion, the abortion is by far the safest bet.
we can only say what we might do given the same set of circumstance.
I think your use of the word "might" is what's most important in this statement. Many, many, many people think they know what they would do in the same situation, but even they don't really know until each time they're faced with it. (Each time meaning that even if you've been in this situation before, you still don't know for sure what you'll do if ever you're in it again.)
Ya, because my top priority in life is dominating your body. I really don't care about saving an innocent life from becoming another victim in a pointless genocide. Ya, just to control you. Definitely, that's it.
Isn't you view based on your religion? I don't want your religion to be in control of America.
Your sarcasm does not refute the fact that you want to control what medical decisions a woman makes about her own body.
1. Abortion is not necessarily a surgical procedure. For one thing, there is now the abortion pill (not the same thing as the morning after pill) available for pregnancies up to 9 weeks (which accounts for most abortions). This is completely non-invasive. Secondly, it's debatable whether even a "surgical abortion" should be called that since, although it is an invasive procedure, it's not a surgery in the sense that most people think of the term. I mean, there are no incisions or anything.
2. I don't know how you define trauma to the body, but I always think it's important to note that abortion is a quick, simple, and common procedure that is considerably safer than having a baby. So, when faced with the decision of whether to have a baby or an abortion, the abortion is by far the safest bet.
3.
EXACTLY!! And that's the most important point.
4.
I think your use of the word "might" is what's most important in this statement. Many, many, many people think they know what they would do in the same situation, but even they don't really know until each time they're faced with it. (Each time meaning that even if you've been in this situation before, you still don't know for sure what you'll do if ever you're in it again.)
Ok, well here is my spin. One abortion I knew of was awake, and the girl was given whatever the substance is to induce an orchestrated "miscarriage" so to speak, and the other friend of mine, both first trimester was put to sleep and had it done. One, the last one, had to face the protesters who yelled to her "don't kill your baby!", she was 16! Then I had a friend who was like maybe 22 and she got pregnant from a guy that wasn't her boyfriend with twins and she had a second trimester abortion where you have the labor and deliver.........well, you get it.
I am no dr by any means or close to it, but I can't help but wonder when your body begins to expell fetus' just because of the past history of abortions. Is that even possible? Idk...........anyone?
Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
I am no dr by any means or close to it, but I can't help but wonder when your body begins to expell fetus' just because of the past history of abortions. Is that even possible? Idk...........anyone?
I have not had an elective abortion, but the answer is "no." EDIT: the body will not just start to expel subsequent pregnancies. I know several people who had abortions in their teens that have gone on to have several children. There could, theorectically, be damage from multiple abortions (scarring, etc. which is normal after any surgery) which could cause problems with conception later on. I am not answering the question as a "plus" for elective abortions, just answering the question to answer it.
Take care,
I still want you all to "take care"--I am just damn tired of typing it.
I have not had an elective abortion, but the answer is "no." EDIT: the body will not just start to expel subsequent pregnancies. I know several people who had abortions in their teens that have gone on to have several children. There could, theorectically, be damage from multiple abortions (scarring, etc. which is normal after any surgery) which could cause problems with conception later on. I am not answering the question as a "plus" for elective abortions, just answering the question to answer it.
Take care,
thanks. I wasn't sure. I just think that as with anything, we all have to protect ourselves from undue stress and damage to our bodies. but damn, why do I know that NOW and not when I was younger????
Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
thanks. I wasn't sure. I just think that as with anything, we all have to protect ourselves from undue stress and damage to our bodies. but damn, why do I know that NOW and not when I was younger????
It's a myth that legal abortion increases the risk of future infertility.
That's not to say that no woman in the history of the world has ever had an abortion, experienced some extremely rare & serious complication, and then later had difficulty having kids. But most of the complications that can affect your future fertility - like a serious, untreated, uterine infection - more frequently happen from things like STDs and childbirth.
Continuing a pregnancy to term is much more stressful and damaging to the body than having a legal abortion.
I know one thing
if it wasn't available I wouldn't have done it and still regretting it to this day.
It's no one's fault but my own.
I'm sorry to hear that. :( Abortion certainly isn't always the right decision for everyone's situation. It's often difficult to decide what decision is right for you, and all you can do is try your best to figure it out. You're only human, after all. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk about it.
I know one thing
if it wasn't available I wouldn't have done it and still regretting it to this day.
It's no one's fault but my own.
I am sorry for you. That is the abuse that is on both counts of this whole thing; those who truly desire to abort should have that choice and those who do not should not be forced to.
May I ask, (since you pointed this out) were you forced by your parents?
Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
No, I am sure very few "women" would use it as a form of contraception. Ni woman who would be fully aware that this is still a surgical procedure that after the decision is made to go forth and have an abortion, it is trauma to her body.
But I know when I was a teenager, there were many girls who had multiple abortions and that is what I mean by saying that it was used as a contraception method, an afterthought of unprotected sex that resulted in pregnancy. I do hope that girls nowadays are better equipped to be able to be ammune from that.
I was not judging I do hope you know. And no, pro choice is not anti baby by any means. I was simply stating that we can't ever begin to know what goes on inside someone's mind or body or life to judge them; we can only say what we might do given the same set of circumstance.
I wish to be respectful to people here as well as everywhere else I might encounter them, so I do hope you didn't think I was putting anyone down.
I never thought you were putting me down. I was just clarifying my opinion
Comments
There's a lot of non-answering of questions going on around here.
I'm so sorry for the loss of your two babies though. :(
Just that--thank you.
http://www.youtube.com/user/kcherub#p/a/u/0/N-UQprRqSwo
You're not changing me, I'm not changing you...
No one here is open-minded... myself included...
You're not changing me, I'm not changing you...
No one here is open-minded... myself included...
You're not changing me, I'm not changing you...
No one here is open-minded... myself included...
At what point do you consider it a baby?
Conception?
Are you Anit-IUD's?
Are you anti Day after pill?
I really am curious....
I was pro-choice way before I knew who Ed Vedder was.....
Sorry you find yourself so easily swayed and pulled by these two groups.
WOW!!!
You must know some CRAZY people.
I guess I KIND OF understand why you feel as you do if you think that statement is true. :(
That's sad....
Anyway... I'm done now...
Women using birth control get pregnant. And it's not just unmarried women who don't want children. It happens. If having sex is irresponsible then God help us all.
Wembley 18/06/07
If there was a reason, it was you.
O2 Arena 18/09/09
It is simply that. A womans right to CHOOSE what she believes is the right and best way.
And I have never met a woman who believes that it should be used as a form of contraception.
Wembley 18/06/07
If there was a reason, it was you.
O2 Arena 18/09/09
Neither have I. Not one. (Although it has been used this way in some countries without access to birth control.)
It's interesting that so many people say that though. Reminds me of a recent article that found that many women believe that they, although they are having an abortion, are somehow not like those other women who have abortions. Those other women must be irresponsible or callous, but they actually have a unique circumstance and a good reason.
Likewise...great conversation. I am most certainly pro-choice and am usually arguing with conservatives about this issue, but I do have a tendency to play devil's advocate when the opportunity arises. Without getting any deeper into the argument, I think that the Church has a long way to go (priests that can marry, female clergy, homosexuality fully accepted, etc) but so does humanity. My philosophy of life and religion goes like this:
People read too much into religion (whether they follow it or do not). For the most part, the morals of religions are not in place to ensure a nice cozy spot in heaven through Jesus' 10 club membership. Rather, people don't realize that morals actually make our corporeal lives better and the lives of those around us too. Jesus taught two commandments and said they replace all others: Love God above all else and love your neighbour. The second is found in all beliefs system as the "golden rule". That is why although I identify myself as a Catholic, I believe equally in the validity of pretty much all faiths. That is to say I do not exclude the teachings of the Prophet, Buddha, or anyone else for that matter from the development of my own beliefs. So, we should love everyone no matter how much we disagree with them. And honestly it's hard-I mean I have very little tolerance for the ignorant but notwithstanding what I said in this thread, I have no aversion to anyone no matter how many abortions they have. It's more likely that I have a problem with them if they are an obnoxious idiot-just being a little tongue-in-cheek.
tom.
No, I am sure very few "women" would use it as a form of contraception. Ni woman who would be fully aware that this is still a surgical procedure that after the decision is made to go forth and have an abortion, it is trauma to her body.
But I know when I was a teenager, there were many girls who had multiple abortions and that is what I mean by saying that it was used as a contraception method, an afterthought of unprotected sex that resulted in pregnancy. I do hope that girls nowadays are better equipped to be able to be ammune from that.
I was not judging I do hope you know. And no, pro choice is not anti baby by any means. I was simply stating that we can't ever begin to know what goes on inside someone's mind or body or life to judge them; we can only say what we might do given the same set of circumstance.
I wish to be respectful to people here as well as everywhere else I might encounter them, so I do hope you didn't think I was putting anyone down.
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
I agree with you, but just have a few comments:
1. Abortion is not necessarily a surgical procedure. For one thing, there is now the abortion pill (not the same thing as the morning after pill) available for pregnancies up to 9 weeks (which accounts for most abortions). This is completely non-invasive. Secondly, it's debatable whether even a "surgical abortion" should be called that since, although it is an invasive procedure, it's not a surgery in the sense that most people think of the term. I mean, there are no incisions or anything.
2. I don't know how you define trauma to the body, but I always think it's important to note that abortion is a quick, simple, and common procedure that is considerably safer than having a baby. So, when faced with the decision of whether to have a baby or an abortion, the abortion is by far the safest bet.
3. EXACTLY!! And that's the most important point.
4. I think your use of the word "might" is what's most important in this statement. Many, many, many people think they know what they would do in the same situation, but even they don't really know until each time they're faced with it. (Each time meaning that even if you've been in this situation before, you still don't know for sure what you'll do if ever you're in it again.)
So what exactly are you looking for from this thread?
Good Grief.
Isn't you view based on your religion? I don't want your religion to be in control of America.
Your sarcasm does not refute the fact that you want to control what medical decisions a woman makes about her own body.
Point 2: Life> Choice
id rather be dead then live in world where i cant make my own choices, life is choices.
Ok, well here is my spin. One abortion I knew of was awake, and the girl was given whatever the substance is to induce an orchestrated "miscarriage" so to speak, and the other friend of mine, both first trimester was put to sleep and had it done. One, the last one, had to face the protesters who yelled to her "don't kill your baby!", she was 16! Then I had a friend who was like maybe 22 and she got pregnant from a guy that wasn't her boyfriend with twins and she had a second trimester abortion where you have the labor and deliver.........well, you get it.
I am no dr by any means or close to it, but I can't help but wonder when your body begins to expell fetus' just because of the past history of abortions. Is that even possible? Idk...........anyone?
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
I have not had an elective abortion, but the answer is "no." EDIT: the body will not just start to expel subsequent pregnancies. I know several people who had abortions in their teens that have gone on to have several children. There could, theorectically, be damage from multiple abortions (scarring, etc. which is normal after any surgery) which could cause problems with conception later on. I am not answering the question as a "plus" for elective abortions, just answering the question to answer it.
Take care,
http://www.youtube.com/user/kcherub#p/a/u/0/N-UQprRqSwo
thanks. I wasn't sure. I just think that as with anything, we all have to protect ourselves from undue stress and damage to our bodies. but damn, why do I know that NOW and not when I was younger????
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
It's a myth that legal abortion increases the risk of future infertility.
That's not to say that no woman in the history of the world has ever had an abortion, experienced some extremely rare & serious complication, and then later had difficulty having kids. But most of the complications that can affect your future fertility - like a serious, untreated, uterine infection - more frequently happen from things like STDs and childbirth.
Continuing a pregnancy to term is much more stressful and damaging to the body than having a legal abortion.
if it wasn't available I wouldn't have done it and still regretting it to this day.
It's no one's fault but my own.
want to be enlightened"
And FYI, the OFFICIAL position from the Vatican (head of the catholic church) is pro-life, anti-death penalty, and anti-guns.
I'm sorry to hear that. :( Abortion certainly isn't always the right decision for everyone's situation. It's often difficult to decide what decision is right for you, and all you can do is try your best to figure it out. You're only human, after all. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk about it.
I am sorry for you. That is the abuse that is on both counts of this whole thing; those who truly desire to abort should have that choice and those who do not should not be forced to.
May I ask, (since you pointed this out) were you forced by your parents?
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
and doing alter boys..........be real.........pleeeease!!
Together we will float like angels.........
In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
Not for the baby.
Wembley 18/06/07
If there was a reason, it was you.
O2 Arena 18/09/09