Anyone can gamble or in some fashion have some sort of ring if they really applied themselves to doing such... whether its illegal machines, card games, betting on sports, etc.
Training and killing innocent animals for your own purposes (gambling) is truly sick. It takes a cold, demented individual to have no remorse for these kind of actions and it's the same time of behavior and thought process that people who kill other people use. That doesn't mean it's better/worse than to kill animals than humans - it's just the same thought process.
And if an average Joe had committed these same exact crimes, they'd go to jail for 25+ yrs. Their life would be over. Vick is gonna get like a yr or two with a fine and walk out of jail and still be the Millionaire he was previously, except he wont be able to play the sport he loves cause he so terribly ruined his image and broke so many policies, it's no longer an option.
True again.
And anyone who tries to relate this to hunting......
When was the last time a deer was electrocuted, strangled, hung, or drowned. I dont really condone hunting either, but hunting thins the herd, and keeps populations from becoming unmanageable in a world where the DEER has lost its natural predators. (Wolves, mountain lions, etc).
Plus, people hunt for food. I know people hunt for sport, but most hunters are as humane as hunters can be.
These dogs were forced to fight, to possibly die, then if they failed to perform, they were brutally executed.
And people dont train deer to attack other deer, then turn on them and attack the owners. Dogs are trained for violence.
And people dont train deer to attack other deer, then turn on them and attack the owners.
Been hearing rumors of some outfit out of the North....run by a Claus fellow...strange doings with some deer. Watch out for this fellow.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
And anyone who tries to relate this to hunting......
When was the last time a deer was electrocuted, strangled, hung, or drowned. I dont really condone hunting either, but hunting thins the herd, and keeps populations from becoming unmanageable in a world where the DEER has lost its natural predators. (Wolves, mountain lions, etc).
Plus, people hunt for food. I know people hunt for sport, but most hunters are as humane as hunters can be.
These dogs were forced to fight, to possibly die, then if they failed to perform, they were brutally executed.
And people dont train deer to attack other deer, then turn on them and attack the owners. Dogs are trained for violence.
so, hunting is "ok" because the animal is killed with a bullet or an arrow...?
interesting how we can ignore the killing animals when in suits our wants and needs...how many feel bad after enjoying that tasty burger or yummy hot wings...how about that tasty turkey on the thanksgiving table...mmmmm...good stuff...
dead is dead, folks...but it's somehow ok for a person to hunt and kill a bear because it makes a sweet rug...
You're trying to play logistics here. He will primarily going to jail and in trouble for "wrong doing" for his gambling operation which included training and executing dogs... not merely animal cruelty.
so, hunting is "ok" because the animal is killed with a bullet or an arrow...?
interesting how we can ignore the killing animals when in suits our wants and needs...how many feel bad after enjoying that tasty burger or yummy hot wings...how about that tasty turkey on the thanksgiving table...mmmmm...good stuff...
dead is dead, folks...but it's somehow ok for a person to hunt and kill a bear because it makes a sweet rug...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You're trying to play logistics here. He will primarily going to jail and in trouble for "wrong doing" for his gambling operation which included training and executing dogs... not merely animal cruelty.
well, why does everyone seem to focus solely on the anminal cruelty...here are some quotes from this thread on the subject...
"I'm no PETA fanatic but I find it hard for anyone to give valid, logical and rational explanation why this criminal should be given a 2nd chance whatsoever"
"He is a scumbag. He murdered animals, for the sake of fun and money.
He should go to jail, the cocksucker. "
"I say they do to him what he did to the dogs."
"I hope Vick has a real big cellmate that does him DOGGY-style everynight"
so, hunting is "ok" because the animal is killed with a bullet or an arrow...?
interesting how we can ignore the killing animals when in suits our wants and needs...how many feel bad after enjoying that tasty burger or yummy hot wings...how about that tasty turkey on the thanksgiving table...mmmmm...good stuff...
dead is dead, folks...but it's somehow ok for a person to hunt and kill a bear because it makes a sweet rug...
I never said anything about bears.
I was talking about deer, and their population increases due to lack of natural predators.
And I never said anything about cows, chicken, or pigs.
Yes, hunting is ok, and yes, with a bullet or arrow. They arent hung, strangled, electrocuted, or drowned. They arent placed on rape stands. They arent tought to fight other deer, and they arent placed in rings with people gambling on them killing the other deer.
People hunt deer for food. (visit Wisconsin) Many times, deer meat that isnt used for food for the hunter is donated to local homeless shelters. And venison is tasty, although has a wild flavor to it.
I am not in favor of people killing bears, or any other animal purely for "sport". "Hey look, I bagged me an endangered species!"
Hunting and torture are two very different things. And I dont feel bad after a tasty burger, I mainly just feel full.
Ok, here's an example. If Michael Vick was caught running a gambling ring of some type in which he funded as well as gambling in - perhaps illegal casino's from property. Do you not think he would go to jail for a long time for such an act? Of course he would. It'd be no different from a mobster/ big time bookie being caught for illegal gambling and the like.
In this instance, you add onto of the gambling ring, the fact that it regards training and executing innocent animals - well yes it will become a much greater issue of topic.
People talk about the animal cruelty because it is such a disgusting aspect of it, but the hard charges are that of the gambling ring coupled with the animal cruelty.
well, why does everyone seem to focus solely on the anminal cruelty...here are some quotes from this thread on the subject...
"I'm no PETA fanatic but I find it hard for anyone to give valid, logical and rational explanation why this criminal should be given a 2nd chance whatsoever"
"He is a scumbag. He murdered animals, for the sake of fun and money.
He should go to jail, the cocksucker. "
"I say they do to him what he did to the dogs."
"I hope Vick has a real big cellmate that does him DOGGY-style everynight"
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Ok, here's an example. If Michael Vick was caught running a gambling ring of some type in which he funded as well as gambling in - perhaps illegal casino's from property. Do you not think he would go to jail for a long time for such an act? Of course he would. It'd be no different from a mobster/ big time bookie being caught for illegal gambling and the like.
I agree and he should be punished accordingly...and once he has completed his punishment, he should have a chance do what he pleases, within the law of course.
In this instance, you add onto of the gambling ring, the fact that it regards training and executing innocent animals - well yes it will become a much greater issue of topic.
People talk about the animal cruelty because it is such a disgusting aspect of it, but the hard charges are that of the gambling ring coupled with the animal cruelty.
again I agree, and it also clouds their judgment...
I hope Vick is beaten and drowned while in jail. Or bleeds to death from his anus. I'd drink a beer to that.
which makes you as bad as vick...he is accused of killing dogs who did not perform, and your pretty advocating the same...vick has not performed up to your standards, therefore you wish him dead, while drinking a beer...
nice...
0
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
I hope Vick is beaten and drowned while in jail. Or bleeds to death from his anus. I'd drink a beer to that.
After saying that what makes you so much different than MV. He will suffer in many different ways for sure and rightfully so. If this gives you pleasure to vent this way well then pile it on. You appear to be as scary as he appears to be to those dogs.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I agree and he should be punished accordingly...and once he has completed his punishment, he should have a chance do what he pleases, within the law of course.
again I agree, and it also clouds their judgment...
totally agree but would you hire him back to you're company after something like this .....
totally agree but would you hire him back to you're company after something like this .....
Yeah but we're talking about the NFL (Not For Long players), where the game is a game of violence. Our modern day gladiator sport and if he's allowed back in after serving his time/paying his fines someone will pick him up.
The Not For Long league forgives as time passes by. A corporate company that's another story but the violent nature of this particular sport a team I believe will bring him back.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Each professional/job has some standard of codes and conduct as well as policies and procedures. If you break them, it does not mean you will be welcomed back after you've made your mistake or broke some laws.
Vick put his job at risk by running these illegal operations and as a result, does not have to be let back into his prior job once serving his time and won't be.
Once you break the law on several levels, you lose many rights as a citizen. Some may be related to your crime (area) you committed, others might be related in demanor (perspective), but rightly so, it goes back to the fact that Vick risked his own status and once being guilty, he loses them and there's never a guarantee of returning to it ever again.
Lastly, you keep pointing out the fact that people are all emotionally charged by this and that clouds their opinion, yet you're so set in saying Vick should be let back to NFL, you don't recognize all the implications being ignored by that statement. Things like NFL procedures and factual items which aren't simply grey - they're black and white. The law and codes will dictate him not playing, not simply people getting all riled up cause he committed animal cruelty.
I agree and he should be punished accordingly...and once he has completed his punishment, he should have a chance do what he pleases, within the law of course.
again I agree, and it also clouds their judgment...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Absolutely wrong. The NFL is very big on it's appearence especially of late with players having off the field issues. The new Commish (Goodall) is coming down hard and wants to nip these issues in the bud.
You can talk all you want about violence, etc... the NFL is a business, but unlike most sports, they run a tight ship and unlike most major sports, aren't dumb enough to let their reputation be ruined by things like unrully players, strikes and the similar (like the MLB, NBA, etc) have.
Yeah but we're talking about the NFL (Not For Long players), where the game is a game of violence. Our modern day gladiator sport and if he's allowed back in after serving his time/paying his fines someone will pick him up.
The Not For Long league forgives as time passes by. A corporate company that's another story but the violent nature of this particular sport a team I believe will bring him back.
Peace
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Well I think this shows how far from reality you're coming with this line of thinking.
No businessman in their right mind would make a felon the center piece of their publicly run company. Not in something like sports where the media is all over it and viewers watch every aspect of the players on and off the field.
It's all about business, image and results. Michael Vick has now black-listed himself in all 3 aspects and even if he's not given a lifetime ban from the NFL, no one will want to give him another chance cause it won't be worth it in any aspect.
if he interviews well and can tow the company line, yes...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
They get attention the legal system, just not the press. Don't assume that just because you are not seeing it or hearing it that it is not happening.
I dont assume, and I follow some of it. The press affects the legal system, which is why I dont think Vick is getting a fair deal. Admitting a wrong usually brings a lighter sentence. Doesnt seem true here because of the spotlight.
I dont know, there is just something about Vick's vilification that strikes me as scapegoating.
which makes you as bad as vick...he is accused of killing dogs who did not perform, and your pretty advocating the same...vick has not performed up to your standards, therefore you wish him dead, while drinking a beer...
nice...
Try your psychobabble somewhere else. Vick is a dispicable killer and deserves the same. Perhaps you can show him some compassion by making him a Build a Bear or some hand-holding bullshit but I think he wastes air with his breathing.
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
After saying that what makes you so much different than MV. He will suffer in many different ways for sure and rightfully so. If this gives you pleasure to vent this way well then pile it on. You appear to be as scary as he appears to be to those dogs.
Peace
Above thread to you as well. Peace.
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
He's no scapegoat whatsoever. He's brought this all upon himself. He's in a high profile position and which the fame and good things he receives from it, if he does bad, it goes in hand.
I dont assume, and I follow some of it. The press affects the legal system, which is why I dont think Vick is getting a fair deal. Admitting a wrong usually brings a lighter sentence. Doesnt seem true here because of the spotlight.
I dont know, there is just something about Vick's vilification that strikes me as scapegoating.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Well I think this shows how far from reality you're coming with this line of thinking.
No businessman in their right mind would make a felon the center piece of their publicly run company. Not in something like sports where the media is all over it and viewers watch every aspect of the players on and off the field.
It's all about business, image and results. Michael Vick has now black-listed himself in all 3 aspects and even if he's not given a lifetime ban from the NFL, no one will want to give him another chance cause it won't be worth it in any aspect.
Presently, it's difficult to think of MV coming back to the NFL and being the face of a franchise. He's going to have to attempt to repair his image, and who knows, maybe after he's served the time, and perhaps donated millions to animal rights groups and made whatever restitution possible, the public will be forgiving and grant him a 2nd chance. Only time will tell.
Well I think this shows how far from reality you're coming with this line of thinking.
No businessman in their right mind would make a felon the center piece of their publicly run company. Not in something like sports where the media is all over it and viewers watch every aspect of the players on and off the field.
It's all about business, image and results. Michael Vick has now black-listed himself in all 3 aspects and even if he's not given a lifetime ban from the NFL, no one will want to give him another chance cause it won't be worth it in any aspect.
you seem to like to speak for others...the nfl, businessmen and no one...
I was asked a question and I answered...is it that hard to understand that no everyone feels like you do...?
Try your psychobabble somewhere else. Vick is a dispicable killer and deserves the same. Perhaps you can show him some compassion by making him a Build a Bear or some hand-holding bullshit but I think he wastes air with his breathing.
again, you are akin with vick in your thinking...nicely done...
Comments
True again.
And anyone who tries to relate this to hunting......
When was the last time a deer was electrocuted, strangled, hung, or drowned. I dont really condone hunting either, but hunting thins the herd, and keeps populations from becoming unmanageable in a world where the DEER has lost its natural predators. (Wolves, mountain lions, etc).
Plus, people hunt for food. I know people hunt for sport, but most hunters are as humane as hunters can be.
These dogs were forced to fight, to possibly die, then if they failed to perform, they were brutally executed.
And people dont train deer to attack other deer, then turn on them and attack the owners. Dogs are trained for violence.
Nuclear fission
so, hunting is "ok" because the animal is killed with a bullet or an arrow...?
interesting how we can ignore the killing animals when in suits our wants and needs...how many feel bad after enjoying that tasty burger or yummy hot wings...how about that tasty turkey on the thanksgiving table...mmmmm...good stuff...
dead is dead, folks...but it's somehow ok for a person to hunt and kill a bear because it makes a sweet rug...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Thats my beef right there.
Im just troubled by the other arrests, some for felonies, that dont make into the papers or get attention from the legal system like this one is.
well, why does everyone seem to focus solely on the anminal cruelty...here are some quotes from this thread on the subject...
"I'm no PETA fanatic but I find it hard for anyone to give valid, logical and rational explanation why this criminal should be given a 2nd chance whatsoever"
"He is a scumbag. He murdered animals, for the sake of fun and money.
He should go to jail, the cocksucker. "
"I say they do to him what he did to the dogs."
"I hope Vick has a real big cellmate that does him DOGGY-style everynight"
I never said anything about bears.
I was talking about deer, and their population increases due to lack of natural predators.
And I never said anything about cows, chicken, or pigs.
Yes, hunting is ok, and yes, with a bullet or arrow. They arent hung, strangled, electrocuted, or drowned. They arent placed on rape stands. They arent tought to fight other deer, and they arent placed in rings with people gambling on them killing the other deer.
People hunt deer for food. (visit Wisconsin) Many times, deer meat that isnt used for food for the hunter is donated to local homeless shelters. And venison is tasty, although has a wild flavor to it.
I am not in favor of people killing bears, or any other animal purely for "sport". "Hey look, I bagged me an endangered species!"
Hunting and torture are two very different things. And I dont feel bad after a tasty burger, I mainly just feel full.
Nuclear fission
Yeah! And how are you gonna be able to yell at your ole lady and tell her to fry you up some meat if you aren't allowed to eat meat?
In this instance, you add onto of the gambling ring, the fact that it regards training and executing innocent animals - well yes it will become a much greater issue of topic.
People talk about the animal cruelty because it is such a disgusting aspect of it, but the hard charges are that of the gambling ring coupled with the animal cruelty.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
I agree and he should be punished accordingly...and once he has completed his punishment, he should have a chance do what he pleases, within the law of course.
again I agree, and it also clouds their judgment...
which makes you as bad as vick...he is accused of killing dogs who did not perform, and your pretty advocating the same...vick has not performed up to your standards, therefore you wish him dead, while drinking a beer...
nice...
After saying that what makes you so much different than MV. He will suffer in many different ways for sure and rightfully so. If this gives you pleasure to vent this way well then pile it on. You appear to be as scary as he appears to be to those dogs.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
totally agree but would you hire him back to you're company after something like this .....
Obviously you've never been hunting with me.
"The leads are weak? Fuckin' leads are weak? You're Weak! I've Been in this business 15 years"
"What's your name?"
"FUCK YOU! THAT"S MY NAME!"
Yeah but we're talking about the NFL (Not For Long players), where the game is a game of violence. Our modern day gladiator sport and if he's allowed back in after serving his time/paying his fines someone will pick him up.
The Not For Long league forgives as time passes by. A corporate company that's another story but the violent nature of this particular sport a team I believe will bring him back.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
They get attention the legal system, just not the press. Don't assume that just because you are not seeing it or hearing it that it is not happening.
Vick put his job at risk by running these illegal operations and as a result, does not have to be let back into his prior job once serving his time and won't be.
Once you break the law on several levels, you lose many rights as a citizen. Some may be related to your crime (area) you committed, others might be related in demanor (perspective), but rightly so, it goes back to the fact that Vick risked his own status and once being guilty, he loses them and there's never a guarantee of returning to it ever again.
Lastly, you keep pointing out the fact that people are all emotionally charged by this and that clouds their opinion, yet you're so set in saying Vick should be let back to NFL, you don't recognize all the implications being ignored by that statement. Things like NFL procedures and factual items which aren't simply grey - they're black and white. The law and codes will dictate him not playing, not simply people getting all riled up cause he committed animal cruelty.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You can talk all you want about violence, etc... the NFL is a business, but unlike most sports, they run a tight ship and unlike most major sports, aren't dumb enough to let their reputation be ruined by things like unrully players, strikes and the similar (like the MLB, NBA, etc) have.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
if he interviews well and can tow the company line, yes...
No businessman in their right mind would make a felon the center piece of their publicly run company. Not in something like sports where the media is all over it and viewers watch every aspect of the players on and off the field.
It's all about business, image and results. Michael Vick has now black-listed himself in all 3 aspects and even if he's not given a lifetime ban from the NFL, no one will want to give him another chance cause it won't be worth it in any aspect.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I dont assume, and I follow some of it. The press affects the legal system, which is why I dont think Vick is getting a fair deal. Admitting a wrong usually brings a lighter sentence. Doesnt seem true here because of the spotlight.
I dont know, there is just something about Vick's vilification that strikes me as scapegoating.
Try your psychobabble somewhere else. Vick is a dispicable killer and deserves the same. Perhaps you can show him some compassion by making him a Build a Bear or some hand-holding bullshit but I think he wastes air with his breathing.
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Above thread to you as well. Peace.
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Presently, it's difficult to think of MV coming back to the NFL and being the face of a franchise. He's going to have to attempt to repair his image, and who knows, maybe after he's served the time, and perhaps donated millions to animal rights groups and made whatever restitution possible, the public will be forgiving and grant him a 2nd chance. Only time will tell.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/08/22/bc.fbn.vick.dogs.ap/index.html
Nuclear fission
you seem to like to speak for others...the nfl, businessmen and no one...
I was asked a question and I answered...is it that hard to understand that no everyone feels like you do...?
again, you are akin with vick in your thinking...nicely done...
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/law/08/22/vick/index.html