What was the effect of not having a GA Only option?

Eddieredder

PJNB said:

Eddieredder said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

Isn't this just math and probability? More members = lower probability

I say this without knowing how the fan club has grown, but just based on longevity its a pretty safe assumption. 

The theory you should move up in seniority and better seating unknowingly since people do not renew over the years. Premium has def changed this now. 

Another thing to consider is GA now pushes all the good seats to the wings and first rows of the floor. In the past the best seats were on the floor up close to the stage so if you were getting wing seats then you are obviously pushed back even more in the lower bowl now. 

Good point about GA. But as demand has risen over the years, can we assume that more people ahead of you are also entering  each year? Especially now with f2f. Something to consider. 

mattcoz

GA pushes everyone back, having fewer shows mean a higher percentage of overall members are selecting each show and pushes everyone back, more ten club seating overall means a higher percentage of winners and pushes everyone back, and of course premium seats pushes everyone back.

Also, in those early years, we could only choose one show. So, there was just much fewer club seats and therefore our seats were a lot better.

Eddieredder

mattcoz said:

GA pushes everyone back, having fewer shows mean a higher percentage of overall members are selecting each show and pushes everyone back, more ten club seating overall means a higher percentage of winners and pushes everyone back, and of course premium seats pushes everyone back.

Also, in those early years, we could only choose one show. So, there was just much fewer club seats and therefore our seats were a lot better.

I'll bet good $ F2F also pushes people back. More entries since they can now unload tix. 

I entered Chicago with late priority with no expectation of winning, but as a backup in case the higher priority shows didn't work out. Zero risk since I can transfer. Pending re-assignment of course.......but you have to assume I pushed people back. 

PJNB

Eddieredder said:

mattcoz said:

GA pushes everyone back, having fewer shows mean a higher percentage of overall members are selecting each show and pushes everyone back, more ten club seating overall means a higher percentage of winners and pushes everyone back, and of course premium seats pushes everyone back.

Also, in those early years, we could only choose one show. So, there was just much fewer club seats and therefore our seats were a lot better.

I'll bet good $ F2F also pushes people back. More entries since they can now unload tix. 

I entered Chicago with late priority with no expectation of winning, but as a backup in case the higher priority shows didn't work out. Zero risk since I can transfer. Pending re-assignment of course.......but you have to assume I pushed people back. 

Will Call only definitely scared people away from putting in for shows they were not sure on. This resulted in less people in the pool for seats for sure. Now people can put in with no financial repercussions if they no longer can go.  

mattcoz

Eddieredder said:

mattcoz said:

GA pushes everyone back, having fewer shows mean a higher percentage of overall members are selecting each show and pushes everyone back, more ten club seating overall means a higher percentage of winners and pushes everyone back, and of course premium seats pushes everyone back.

Also, in those early years, we could only choose one show. So, there was just much fewer club seats and therefore our seats were a lot better.

I'll bet good $ F2F also pushes people back. More entries since they can now unload tix. 

I entered Chicago with late priority with no expectation of winning, but as a backup in case the higher priority shows didn't work out. Zero risk since I can transfer. Pending re-assignment of course.......but you have to assume I pushed people back. 

PJNB said:

Eddieredder said:

mattcoz said:

GA pushes everyone back, having fewer shows mean a higher percentage of overall members are selecting each show and pushes everyone back, more ten club seating overall means a higher percentage of winners and pushes everyone back, and of course premium seats pushes everyone back.

Also, in those early years, we could only choose one show. So, there was just much fewer club seats and therefore our seats were a lot better.

I'll bet good $ F2F also pushes people back. More entries since they can now unload tix. 

I entered Chicago with late priority with no expectation of winning, but as a backup in case the higher priority shows didn't work out. Zero risk since I can transfer. Pending re-assignment of course.......but you have to assume I pushed people back. 

Will Call only definitely scared people away from putting in for shows they were not sure on. This resulted in less people in the pool for seats for sure. Now people can put in with no financial repercussions if they no longer can go.  

Yeah, those are good points too.

mace1229

josevolution said:

mace1229 said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

I can't really remember where my seats were the first few tours (2000, 2003, 2006), but I'm guessing they were pretty good. For about the last 15 years they've been about the same for me. The best one may have been Universal City 2009

I can tell you for sure that those three tours my seats were front row! Jones beach,MSG, New Jersey shows.

Dang, sounds awesome. But you have like a 30xxx number don't you?
I just remembered in 2000, my first 10c show, was pretty good.maybe 10 or so rows back.
 I remember because this hot girl snuck into to the seat next to me the last few songs. She didn't want me to complain, so she was really flirty and put her arms around me for the slow songs. It worked. 

Too bad there was no Craigslist missed connections in 2000.

mattcoz

mace1229 said:

josevolution said:

mace1229 said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

I can't really remember where my seats were the first few tours (2000, 2003, 2006), but I'm guessing they were pretty good. For about the last 15 years they've been about the same for me. The best one may have been Universal City 2009

I can tell you for sure that those three tours my seats were front row! Jones beach,MSG, New Jersey shows.

Dang, sounds awesome. But you have like a 30xxx number don't you?
I just remembered in 2000, my first 10c show, was pretty good.maybe 10 or so rows back.
 I remember because this hot girl snuck into to the seat next to me the last few songs. She didn't want me to complain, so she was really flirty and put her arms around me for the slow songs. It worked. 

Too bad there was no Craigslist missed connections in 2000.

I was like 2/3 back on the floor in my first 10c show in 2000, but it was Chicago so it was a popular choice. No hot girls wrapping their arms around me either.

know1

I guess the little bit of progress my 20 years of seniority should have gained through attrition above me has been eaten up with each decision they've made along the way - lottery rows, adding GA, removing the GA only option, removing risk by creating F2F, adding Premium seats, etc.

It makes sense, but it's kind of a shame that I've naively kept the membership fathfully for so long with the hopes that I would keep creeping closer to the stage instead of farther away.

If I knew back in 2003 that I essentially would never get any closer/better with my fan club seats over the next 20 years would I have kept it up? Not sure.

josevolution

mace1229 said:

josevolution said:

mace1229 said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

I can't really remember where my seats were the first few tours (2000, 2003, 2006), but I'm guessing they were pretty good. For about the last 15 years they've been about the same for me. The best one may have been Universal City 2009

I can tell you for sure that those three tours my seats were front row! Jones beach,MSG, New Jersey shows.

Dang, sounds awesome. But you have like a 30xxx number don't you?
I just remembered in 2000, my first 10c show, was pretty good.maybe 10 or so rows back.
 I remember because this hot girl snuck into to the seat next to me the last few songs. She didn't want me to complain, so she was really flirty and put her arms around me for the slow songs. It worked. 

Too bad there was no Craigslist missed connections in 2000.

Below 30k but I’ve never had a girl put her arms around me 🤨 

tschav

know1 said:

I guess the little bit of progress my 20 years of seniority should have gained through attrition above me has been eaten up with each decision they've made along the way - lottery rows, adding GA, removing the GA only option, removing risk by creating F2F, adding Premium seats, etc.

It makes sense, but it's kind of a shame that I've naively kept the membership fathfully for so long with the hopes that I would keep creeping closer to the stage instead of farther away.

If I knew back in 2003 that I essentially would never get any closer/better with my fan club seats over the next 20 years would I have kept it up? Not sure.

In retrospect (also a member since '03), it's still not been that bad considering the price I pay for other acts to be remotely close to the stage.

While seniority hasn't done much on its own, putting in a little effort for GA position and monitoring F2F drops - as well as luck with winning a lottery row & getting into the Vic fanclub show - it's been okay. The only way to get more people upgraded and closer is to go back to older formats, limit the number of shows you can get, and reduce the pool of tickets set aside for 10c.

Kevinman

know1 said:

I guess the little bit of progress my 20 years of seniority should have gained through attrition above me has been eaten up with each decision they've made along the way - lottery rows, adding GA, removing the GA only option, removing risk by creating F2F, adding Premium seats, etc.

It makes sense, but it's kind of a shame that I've naively kept the membership fathfully for so long with the hopes that I would keep creeping closer to the stage instead of farther away.

If I knew back in 2003 that I essentially would never get any closer/better with my fan club seats over the next 20 years would I have kept it up? Not sure.

This is pretty much spot on for the way I view it also.  I also think if I dropped my membership back then........how much money I would have saved on buying 10C only items..........hmmmm.

pjl44

Eddieredder said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

Isn't this just math and probability? More members = lower probability

I say this without knowing how the fan club has grown, but just based on longevity its a pretty safe assumption. 

I'm going to assume F2F intro year had the biggest effect recently. Now with a resale option those with enough of a credit limit can just go for EVERY show. I'm certainly going for more now. Why wouldn't you? Add in that you can transfer in NY and Chi? Everyone should go for MSG. There is virtually no risk now.

We asked and received this option. This is one of the effects. 

This is an excellent point

Merkin Baller

pjl44 said:

Eddieredder said:

Kevinman said:

iOnlyownMymind said:

30 year member should be in first side section, first few rows, no?  Unless they save some of those rows for Premium to open up, which would suck.

I'm in 25 years and seats were better in the first 5 years in comparison to the last 20.

Isn't this just math and probability? More members = lower probability

I say this without knowing how the fan club has grown, but just based on longevity its a pretty safe assumption. 

I'm going to assume F2F intro year had the biggest effect recently. Now with a resale option those with enough of a credit limit can just go for EVERY show. I'm certainly going for more now. Why wouldn't you? Add in that you can transfer in NY and Chi? Everyone should go for MSG. There is virtually no risk now.

We asked and received this option. This is one of the effects. 

This is an excellent point

It is, and probably the single biggest factor to the seats getting pushed back. 

CP218430

How big is the ten club? 

Eddieredder

CP218430 said:

How big is the ten club? 

Based on this thread at least 700k

https://community.pearljam.com/discussion/268669/member-number-question/p4

iOnlyownMymind

Eddieredder said:

CP218430 said:

How big is the ten club? 

Based on this thread at least 700k

https://community.pearljam.com/discussion/268669/member-number-question/p4

Less though for anyone who quit or let their number lapse during any point so pretty hard to say. 

Eddieredder

iOnlyownMymind said:

Eddieredder said:

CP218430 said:

How big is the ten club? 

Based on this thread at least 700k

https://community.pearljam.com/discussion/268669/member-number-question/p4

Less though for anyone who quit or let their number lapse during any point so pretty hard to say. 

For sure.

I guess the better question for these conversations is "how many ticket requests were there vs active members?"

wiscojam

know1 said:

I guess the little bit of progress my 20 years of seniority should have gained through attrition above me has been eaten up with each decision they've made along the way - lottery rows, adding GA, removing the GA only option, removing risk by creating F2F, adding Premium seats, etc.

It makes sense, but it's kind of a shame that I've naively kept the membership fathfully for so long with the hopes that I would keep creeping closer to the stage instead of farther away.

If I knew back in 2003 that I essentially would never get any closer/better with my fan club seats over the next 20 years would I have kept it up? Not sure.

this

rearviewross

Just have 3 options
1. GA Only
2. GA/Reserved
3.  Reserved Only

Then youre not forcing people to buy tickets they dont want.  Not having GA only moves people to res that dont want them and pushes me, who wants res, further back

kaw753

Here is why it is not optimal to remove the GA only. Some (most?) of us are travelling from out of town. Last tour, I got GA for LA2 for the first time. A friend of mine who is a casual fan was up for going (because I had the killer tickets) and we did a week in California (added San Diego show).

My fan club number is so-so, so I am not getting any reserved seats that are going to get any friends to spend the $$ to travel. If I get GA, I can use them with a friend or swap 1 with someone on here for another show. I am totally cool getting shutout for fan club tickets if I put GA only. No problem. I promise not to cry about it. 

Every single pair that someone puts on F2F because they didn't really want seats is a pair that could have been used for other fans to be closer.