Tool is about to wrap up a month long arena tour in Europe, and I attended the show in Stockholm. Maybe PJ should ask Tool for some advice what they've done to reduce the risk for infection? Of course luck is also involved when talking about Covid...
PJ need to travel forward 2 years in time to 2022. The solution is to not test every morning and come to work unless you feel ill.
Hiding in a bubble prevents exposure to lots of common bugs and viruses - simply storing up trouble for the future of your immune system.
I know it's a commonly held belief, but for adults the immune system doesn't weaken due to lack of exposure to viruses.
Airport in Atlanta, night in Vegas, GA in Fresno, two different flights to ATL. Dave Matthews two days later in Huntsville. All without mask and Rona free. Live your life. Do whatever makes you comfortable.
Or….asymptomatic and got others sick. Sharing is caring right?
I forgot to mention that I returned to work and put in 50 hours last week. I run a restaurant with 65 employees and we served 4400 guests last week. I should probably start hiring more because half my staff is going to keel over from the covid I unknowingly brought back or I should look for a new job because my clientele is definitely headed to an early grave because of my ignorance. So when you hear the news of the southeast getting annihilated from some new super strand of covid and body counts piling up, blame me for being that guy, the super spreader, some asymptomatic jerk that God forbid had some fun. But at least I cared and shared the wealth. Ha.
We too are familiar with the Japanese wearing of masks/ gloves- so we think that's what one can do, or does, for others and themselves, in a good way. It's been like that for a long time- way before the sars/covid-19
It seems those who wore masks walked away from the shows without getting COVID. Others were not so lucky.
Well, on the other side of the coin I was in GA for three off the shows as well as my wife and two sons, no masks, and none got covid. I can care less if you were a mask or not by the way. Whatever make you comfortable.
When the CDC recommended wearing a mask, I did. When they dropped it, so did I. You cant have it both ways. If you believe the science to wear a mask, well then you have to believe the science that supports no longer having to wear a mask. This is the hypocritical part of it all. Again, if you want to, power to you, if you don't, power to you. If you dont want to chance it, stay home, simple.
I thought about not wearing my mask when then CDC said it was okay, then I looked more deeply into the announcement, and saw that their recommendation wasn't based on the likelihood of getting COVID but on hospital capacity. Also, the recommendation isn't that masks aren't necessary - they are still recommending masks in MANY situations. By the letter of the recommendation, most of the west coast shows were probably in the "not necessary" category, as the community transmission rates are low in the area. However, given how many fans travel for those shows, I think it becomes an unknown transmission situation, and the CDC would most likely recommend that you mask up.
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.
They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Alpine Valley 6/26/98 Alpine Valley 6/27/98 East Lansing 8/18/98 Knoxville 9/6/98 D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98 Nobelsville 8/18/00 Alpine Valley 10/8/00 Grand Rapids 5/19/06 Detroit (EV) 6/26/11 Wrigley 8/22/16 Wrigley 8/18/18
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?
Post edited by RiotAct10 on
words seem so out of place.
8.21.00 Columbus | 6.24.03 Columbus | 7.9.03 NYC | 10.2.04 Toledo | 9.11.05 Kitchener | 5.20.06 Cleveland | 8.5.07 Chicago | 5.6.10 Columbus | 5.7.10 Noblesville | 5.9.10 Cleveland | 9.3.11 East Troy | 9.4.11 East Troy | 7.19.13 Chicago | 10.11.13 Pittsburgh | 10.1.14 Cincinnati | 4.8.16 Ft. Lauderdale | 4.9.16 Miami | 8.8.18 Seattle | 8.10.18 Seattle | 9.26.21 Dana Point | 10.1.21 Dana Point | 10.2.21 Dana Point | 9.16.22 Nashville | 9.17.22 Louisville | 9.18.22 St. Louis | 9.2.23 St. Paul | 9.15.23 Ft. Worth 6.26.11 Detroit (EdVed) | 9.23.17 Louisville (EdVed) | 9.25.21 Dana Point (EdVed) | 10.01.22 Dana Point (EdVed) | 2.6.22 Newark (EdVed)
Airport in Atlanta, night in Vegas, GA in Fresno, two different flights to ATL. Dave Matthews two days later in Huntsville. All without mask and Rona free. Live your life. Do whatever makes you comfortable.
Or….asymptomatic and got others sick. Sharing is caring right?
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?
That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done.
I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.
They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.
By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?
That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done.
It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?
That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done.
It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.
Alpine Valley 6/26/98 Alpine Valley 6/27/98 East Lansing 8/18/98 Knoxville 9/6/98 D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98 Nobelsville 8/18/00 Alpine Valley 10/8/00 Grand Rapids 5/19/06 Detroit (EV) 6/26/11 Wrigley 8/22/16 Wrigley 8/18/18
Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates. Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).
Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?
That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done.
It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.
Alpine Valley 6/26/98 Alpine Valley 6/27/98 East Lansing 8/18/98 Knoxville 9/6/98 D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98 Nobelsville 8/18/00 Alpine Valley 10/8/00 Grand Rapids 5/19/06 Detroit (EV) 6/26/11 Wrigley 8/22/16 Wrigley 8/18/18
so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's.
I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.
They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.
By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home
Or just wear a mask and have a good time. I didn't get sick. My maskless friends did. Not sure why this is so hard for people. Well fitting masks help prevent spread of disease. Wore a tight N95 the whole time.
My daughter loves Chipotle, but my wife hates it. I think it's okay, but only if I have that green tabasco hot sauce. I used to like it more, but it has faded with time in my food hierarchy.
My daughter loves Chipotle, but my wife hates it. I think it's okay, but only if I have that green tabasco hot sauce. I used to like it more, but it has faded with time in my food hierarchy.
I love it, especially the guac. It's SO MUCH FOOD, though! I used to have pretty bad anxiety about ordering, but I'm way better about it now.
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.
They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.
By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home
Or just wear a mask and have a good time. I didn't get sick. My maskless friends did. Not sure why this is so hard for people. Well fitting masks help prevent spread of disease. Wore a tight N95 the whole time.
Or don't wear a mask and have a good time. I and many others didn't and didn't get sick. Do you know for a fact that no one with a mask got sick or spread the virus? Staying home is a more effective way to prevent the spread of disease than wearing a mask to a crowded indoor venue where thousands of people are packed tightly together and singing for hours. If that is the priority, why not stay home?
so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's.
Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical.
so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's.
Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical.
It's not hypocritical. masks don't necessarily help the mask wearer, they help those around the mask wearer, so the person wearing the mask annoyed at you not wearing one is annoyed because you aren't doing your part to stop it. they are.
Tool is about to wrap up a month long arena tour in Europe, and I attended the show in Stockholm. Maybe PJ should ask Tool for some advice what they've done to reduce the risk for infection? Of course luck is also involved when talking about Covid...
PJ need to travel forward 2 years in time to 2022. The solution is to not test every morning and come to work unless you feel ill.
Hiding in a bubble prevents exposure to lots of common bugs and viruses - simply storing up trouble for the future of your immune system.
Two more years, Covid could still be here. At that point, maybe it’s time to consider whether they want a road life at all. If someone in the band is high risk,I get the caution, but perhaps they should not be in a touring band if there is an elevated health risk.
Otherwise, plenty of other bands are playing hundreds of shows with no known issues. PJ gets thru five before issues emerge. They seemingly are doing something very different than most of the other bands.
There are tons of risks greater than Covid at shows. Saw Primus the other day, mostly packed in GA. Moshing and crowd surfing were rampant. Huge risk. Packed in like sardines, a young lady passed out. Luckily they got her out, but it wasn’t easy for security and it took time. Risks at these shows are everywhere.
This is a reasonable post. I agree, except for them doing something different. Who really knows why they can't seem to make it work. I guess we will continue to speculate on why.
so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's.
Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical.
It's not hypocritical. masks don't necessarily help the mask wearer, they help those around the mask wearer, so the person wearing the mask annoyed at you not wearing one is annoyed because you aren't doing your part to stop it. they are.
True, but with mask mandates mostly gone now, you can’t really have an issue with someone else deciding not to wear one. Even though it’s kind of dumb that the mandates are gone in large indoor venues. I’m a mask-wearing show-goer and I think SHZA has a decent point - that’s the amount of risk I’m willing to take. It’s less risk than a non-mask wearing show-goer and more than a person who stays home 24/7. How much more or less depends on the quality of the mask and how often I take it off for a beer. Or three.
PJ: 2013: London (ON); Buffalo; 2014: Cincinnati; 2016: Sunrise, Miami, Toronto 1-2, Wrigley 2; 2018: London (UK) 1, Milan, Padova, Sea 2, Wrigley 1-2, Fenway 1-2; 2021: SHN, Ohana, Ohana Encore 1-2; 2022: LA 1-2, Phx, Oak 1-2, Fresno, Copenhagen, Hyde Park 1-2; Quebec, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto; MSG, Camden, Nashville, Louisville, St. Louis, OKC; 2023: St. Paul 1-2, Chicago 1-2; Fort Worth 2; Austin 1-2
EV Solo: 2017 Louisville and Franklin, 2018 Ohana, 2019 Innings Fest, Berlin, Düsseldorf, Dublin and Ohana; 2021 Ohana Friday (from beach) and Saturday; 2022 Earthlings Newark; 2023 Innings Fest and Benoraya 1-2.
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023
Comments
I know it's a commonly held belief, but for adults the immune system doesn't weaken due to lack of exposure to viruses.
But at least I cared and shared the wealth. Ha.
My wife is Japanese. We wear masks whenever one of us gets sick and often on airplanes. We had a stockpile way before the pandemic. Not complicated.
way before the sars/covid-19
I thought about not wearing my mask when then CDC said it was okay, then I looked more deeply into the announcement, and saw that their recommendation wasn't based on the likelihood of getting COVID but on hospital capacity. Also, the recommendation isn't that masks aren't necessary - they are still recommending masks in MANY situations. By the letter of the recommendation, most of the west coast shows were probably in the "not necessary" category, as the community transmission rates are low in the area. However, given how many fans travel for those shows, I think it becomes an unknown transmission situation, and the CDC would most likely recommend that you mask up.
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.
Alpine Valley 6/27/98
East Lansing 8/18/98
Knoxville 9/6/98
D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98
Nobelsville 8/18/00
Alpine Valley 10/8/00
Grand Rapids 5/19/06
Detroit (EV) 6/26/11
Wrigley 8/22/16
Wrigley 8/18/18
8.21.00 Columbus | 6.24.03 Columbus | 7.9.03 NYC | 10.2.04 Toledo | 9.11.05 Kitchener | 5.20.06 Cleveland | 8.5.07 Chicago | 5.6.10 Columbus | 5.7.10 Noblesville | 5.9.10 Cleveland | 9.3.11 East Troy | 9.4.11 East Troy | 7.19.13 Chicago | 10.11.13 Pittsburgh | 10.1.14 Cincinnati | 4.8.16 Ft. Lauderdale | 4.9.16 Miami | 8.8.18 Seattle | 8.10.18 Seattle | 9.26.21 Dana Point | 10.1.21 Dana Point | 10.2.21 Dana Point | 9.16.22 Nashville | 9.17.22 Louisville | 9.18.22 St. Louis | 9.2.23 St. Paul | 9.15.23 Ft. Worth
6.26.11 Detroit (EdVed) | 9.23.17 Louisville (EdVed) | 9.25.21 Dana Point (EdVed) | 10.01.22 Dana Point (EdVed) | 2.6.22 Newark (EdVed)
www.headstonesband.com
It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.
https://www.cureus.com/articles/93826-correlation-between-mask-compliance-and-covid-19-outcomes-in-europe
https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4586/rr-6
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article
Alpine Valley 6/27/98
East Lansing 8/18/98
Knoxville 9/6/98
D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98
Nobelsville 8/18/00
Alpine Valley 10/8/00
Grand Rapids 5/19/06
Detroit (EV) 6/26/11
Wrigley 8/22/16
Wrigley 8/18/18
https://academic.oup.com/jid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/infdis/jiac195/6582941
Alpine Valley 6/27/98
East Lansing 8/18/98
Knoxville 9/6/98
D.C. (Constitution Hall) 9/19/98
Nobelsville 8/18/00
Alpine Valley 10/8/00
Grand Rapids 5/19/06
Detroit (EV) 6/26/11
Wrigley 8/22/16
Wrigley 8/18/18
Does Chipotle count as fast food? Because if so, hands down the best.
Mansfield '08
Hartford '10
Worcester, Hartford '13
Global Citizen, NY '15
www.headstonesband.com
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
www.headstonesband.com
Gutted: London 2 2018, Sacramento 2022, Noblesville 2023