dr. Feelgood kickstart my heart shout at the devil
They still suck though.
Pearl jam is head and shoulders above a band like motley crue. Its not close.
If you want to use album sales or concert sales, its pj.
If you’re saying being popular shouldnt matter, which i agree, it shouldnt, then we can talk critical acclaim. Here we can safely say that critically pearl jam has fared better as well. Its the reason why 80s hair metal is looked down upon compared to the 90s seattle movement that is a darling of the critics.
If we are talking musicianship, here again, its no contest. Ed is an all time great singer, who has worked with many of the all time greats,(Elton, daltrey, plant, beyonce, stevie, Etc). In general vince neils voice is annoying and nasally. While tommy lee is a fine drummer, here again matt is the better musician. Jeffs a better bassist than nikki whos quite average. I like Mick mars, who always seemed weird and genuine but pjs guitar combo wins this as well. Too bad motley has one guitarist in this battle of the bands.
If we are talking the live experience, please. Pj is one of the greatest live bands ever. You wont find motley crue on any greatest live bands list.
There are bands that are better than pj, its just that, motley crue is 100% not one of them.
Also we need to accept that we can listen to music and separate that experience from the artist to some degree. Yea I also hate motley crues general demeanor, beliefs etc. But im pretty sure they are still playing michael jackson everywhere, and most people tend to look the other way. This is the same with many artists. Phil anselmo is a racist douchebag but there are so many good pantera songs. We know led zep loved women the same way motley crue did. Its a tough choice between great songs and maybe bad people or ethics. And you cant judge what people did generations ago when the societal norms were different. Mtv was eating up and glamorizing everything that motley did.
The point is, I saw dirty frank at the beacon, so where are these fucking tour dates pearl jam you bastards.
You had me at “they have three songs… and they still suck” Great post
DC '03 - Reading '04 - Philly '05 - Camden 1 '06 - DC '06 - E. Rutherford '06 - The Vic '07 - Lollapalooza '07 - DC '08 - EV DC 1 & 2 '08 (Met Ed!!) - EV Baltimore 1 & 2 '09 - EV NYC 1 '11 (Met Ed!) - Hartford '13 - GCF '15 - MSG 2 '16 - TOTD MSG '16 - Boston 1 & 2 '18 - SHN '21 - EV NYC 1 & 2 '22 - MSG '22
Doing theatrics isn't the same as "needing theatrics". I've never heard anyone put down Tommy Lees drum abilities? And he seems entertaining (if his thing is what you dig) on stage also without the gimmicks.
Amazing. My entire post had nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee (I said the rollercoaster was “wild”). When I see an amazing drummer on stage, I can’t stop watching. With Tool and Rush, it’s the entire show. With PJ and Primus, certain songs draw me to the drummer.
Anyways… Tommy Lee is far from the biggest problem of that band live, it was only an example. You can send in your hurt feelings report wherever you want 😂
Why should I respond to the rest of your entire post that has nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee, when everything you said was sound.
Most of my post was disparaging Vince Neil. Tommy Lee was shrapnel. The show was lame full of boring planned theatrics. The rollercoaster was wild (cool, interesting) but wasn’t as entertaining to me as more talented drummers who don’t require theatrics to entertain me.
I’ve never heard anyone compare Tommy Lee to those guys so if anything I was putting him in some rarified air. Perhaps your admiration for Tommy Lee goes beyond his drumming abilities because you came in to his defence pretty quickly 😂.
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Vince Neil got 20 days in jail (if memory serves me) for killing his friend driving blind drunk. But the creep factor was the grinding of the poor young backup dancer in the concert. It was laughable, until you realized this is one sick puppy.
dr. Feelgood kickstart my heart shout at the devil
They still suck though.
Pearl jam is head and shoulders above a band like motley crue. Its not close.
If you want to use album sales or concert sales, its pj.
If you’re saying being popular shouldnt matter, which i agree, it shouldnt, then we can talk critical acclaim. Here we can safely say that critically pearl jam has fared better as well. Its the reason why 80s hair metal is looked down upon compared to the 90s seattle movement that is a darling of the critics.
If we are talking musicianship, here again, its no contest. Ed is an all time great singer, who has worked with many of the all time greats,(Elton, daltrey, plant, beyonce, stevie, Etc). In general vince neils voice is annoying and nasally. While tommy lee is a fine drummer, here again matt is the better musician. Jeffs a better bassist than nikki whos quite average. I like Mick mars, who always seemed weird and genuine but pjs guitar combo wins this as well. Too bad motley has one guitarist in this battle of the bands.
If we are talking the live experience, please. Pj is one of the greatest live bands ever. You wont find motley crue on any greatest live bands list.
There are bands that are better than pj, its just that, motley crue is 100% not one of them.
Also we need to accept that we can listen to music and separate that experience from the artist to some degree. Yea I also hate motley crues general demeanor, beliefs etc. But im pretty sure they are still playing michael jackson everywhere, and most people tend to look the other way. This is the same with many artists. Phil anselmo is a racist douchebag but there are so many good pantera songs. We know led zep loved women the same way motley crue did. Its a tough choice between great songs and maybe bad people or ethics. And you cant judge what people did generations ago when the societal norms were different. Mtv was eating up and glamorizing everything that motley did.
The point is, I saw dirty frank at the beacon, so where are these fucking tour dates pearl jam you bastards.
I don't think anyone here said Crue was better than Pearl Jam. I did say that I like some MC records better than some PJ records if they want head to head....I think that is about as close as anyone came to really comparing them
BTW, album sales isn't close. MC by 3x.
My bad! Just checked US sales. But this article says they’ve sold 100 mil worldwide. So I guess album sales is a draw.
dr. Feelgood kickstart my heart shout at the devil
They still suck though.
Pearl jam is head and shoulders above a band like motley crue. Its not close.
If you want to use album sales or concert sales, its pj.
If you’re saying being popular shouldnt matter, which i agree, it shouldnt, then we can talk critical acclaim. Here we can safely say that critically pearl jam has fared better as well. Its the reason why 80s hair metal is looked down upon compared to the 90s seattle movement that is a darling of the critics.
If we are talking musicianship, here again, its no contest. Ed is an all time great singer, who has worked with many of the all time greats,(Elton, daltrey, plant, beyonce, stevie, Etc). In general vince neils voice is annoying and nasally. While tommy lee is a fine drummer, here again matt is the better musician. Jeffs a better bassist than nikki whos quite average. I like Mick mars, who always seemed weird and genuine but pjs guitar combo wins this as well. Too bad motley has one guitarist in this battle of the bands.
If we are talking the live experience, please. Pj is one of the greatest live bands ever. You wont find motley crue on any greatest live bands list.
There are bands that are better than pj, its just that, motley crue is 100% not one of them.
Also we need to accept that we can listen to music and separate that experience from the artist to some degree. Yea I also hate motley crues general demeanor, beliefs etc. But im pretty sure they are still playing michael jackson everywhere, and most people tend to look the other way. This is the same with many artists. Phil anselmo is a racist douchebag but there are so many good pantera songs. We know led zep loved women the same way motley crue did. Its a tough choice between great songs and maybe bad people or ethics. And you cant judge what people did generations ago when the societal norms were different. Mtv was eating up and glamorizing everything that motley did.
The point is, I saw dirty frank at the beacon, so where are these fucking tour dates pearl jam you bastards.
You had me at “they have three songs… and they still suck” Great post
Vince Neil got 20 days in jail (if memory serves me) for killing his friend driving blind drunk. But the creep factor was the grinding of the poor young backup dancer in the concert. It was laughable, until you realized this is one sick puppy.
Karma caught up to him in a way, unfortunately it cost his young daughter her life.
Doing theatrics isn't the same as "needing theatrics". I've never heard anyone put down Tommy Lees drum abilities? And he seems entertaining (if his thing is what you dig) on stage also without the gimmicks.
Amazing. My entire post had nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee (I said the rollercoaster was “wild”). When I see an amazing drummer on stage, I can’t stop watching. With Tool and Rush, it’s the entire show. With PJ and Primus, certain songs draw me to the drummer.
Anyways… Tommy Lee is far from the biggest problem of that band live, it was only an example. You can send in your hurt feelings report wherever you want 😂
Why should I respond to the rest of your entire post that has nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee, when everything you said was sound.
Most of my post was disparaging Vince Neil. Tommy Lee was shrapnel. The show was lame full of boring planned theatrics. The rollercoaster was wild (cool, interesting) but wasn’t as entertaining to me as more talented drummers who don’t require theatrics to entertain me.
I’ve never heard anyone compare Tommy Lee to those guys so if anything I was putting him in some rarified air. Perhaps your admiration for Tommy Lee goes beyond his drumming abilities because you came in to his defence pretty quickly 😂.
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
My admiration for Tommy Lee comes from their producer saying he was always positive and easy going.
I have never care for or listened to Mötley Crüe.
But I have some form of sympathy for Vince Neil. I would not care how bad he sings at a show. As long ss he has fun. That would be my least problem at at Crüe-show.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Doing theatrics isn't the same as "needing theatrics". I've never heard anyone put down Tommy Lees drum abilities? And he seems entertaining (if his thing is what you dig) on stage also without the gimmicks.
Amazing. My entire post had nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee (I said the rollercoaster was “wild”). When I see an amazing drummer on stage, I can’t stop watching. With Tool and Rush, it’s the entire show. With PJ and Primus, certain songs draw me to the drummer.
Anyways… Tommy Lee is far from the biggest problem of that band live, it was only an example. You can send in your hurt feelings report wherever you want 😂
Why should I respond to the rest of your entire post that has nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee, when everything you said was sound.
Most of my post was disparaging Vince Neil. Tommy Lee was shrapnel. The show was lame full of boring planned theatrics. The rollercoaster was wild (cool, interesting) but wasn’t as entertaining to me as more talented drummers who don’t require theatrics to entertain me.
I’ve never heard anyone compare Tommy Lee to those guys so if anything I was putting him in some rarified air. Perhaps your admiration for Tommy Lee goes beyond his drumming abilities because you came in to his defence pretty quickly 😂.
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
My admiration for Tommy Lee comes from their producer saying he was always positive and easy going.
I have never care for or listened to Mötley Crüe.
But I have some form of sympathy for Vince Neil. I would not care how bad he sings at a show. As long ss he has fun. That would be my least problem at at Crüe-show.
You didn’t pay $500+ for four people to see it, this is where my sympathy ends. His performance was unprofessional. The fact is the boys did enjoy it… so maybe you could say it was worth it. Personally? I felt ripped off. Tommy Lee is part of the band and took my money with the rest of them.
Value in a performance can only be measured by the person who paid for the show.
Pearl Jam has always been worth every penny. In many cases… it has been priceless.
Doing theatrics isn't the same as "needing theatrics". I've never heard anyone put down Tommy Lees drum abilities? And he seems entertaining (if his thing is what you dig) on stage also without the gimmicks.
Amazing. My entire post had nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee (I said the rollercoaster was “wild”). When I see an amazing drummer on stage, I can’t stop watching. With Tool and Rush, it’s the entire show. With PJ and Primus, certain songs draw me to the drummer.
Anyways… Tommy Lee is far from the biggest problem of that band live, it was only an example. You can send in your hurt feelings report wherever you want 😂
Why should I respond to the rest of your entire post that has nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee, when everything you said was sound.
Most of my post was disparaging Vince Neil. Tommy Lee was shrapnel. The show was lame full of boring planned theatrics. The rollercoaster was wild (cool, interesting) but wasn’t as entertaining to me as more talented drummers who don’t require theatrics to entertain me.
I’ve never heard anyone compare Tommy Lee to those guys so if anything I was putting him in some rarified air. Perhaps your admiration for Tommy Lee goes beyond his drumming abilities because you came in to his defence pretty quickly 😂.
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
My admiration for Tommy Lee comes from their producer saying he was always positive and easy going.
I have never care for or listened to Mötley Crüe.
But I have some form of sympathy for Vince Neil. I would not care how bad he sings at a show. As long ss he has fun. That would be my least problem at at Crüe-show.
You didn’t pay $500+ for four people to see it, this is where my sympathy ends. His performance was unprofessional. The fact is the boys did enjoy it… so maybe you could say it was worth it. Personally? I felt ripped off. Tommy Lee is part of the band and took my money with the rest of them.
Value in a performance can only be measured by the person who paid for the show.
Pearl Jam has always been worth every penny. In many cases… it has been priceless.
I did not pay that, no. I imagine for some people, it was priceless though.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Doing theatrics isn't the same as "needing theatrics". I've never heard anyone put down Tommy Lees drum abilities? And he seems entertaining (if his thing is what you dig) on stage also without the gimmicks.
Amazing. My entire post had nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee (I said the rollercoaster was “wild”). When I see an amazing drummer on stage, I can’t stop watching. With Tool and Rush, it’s the entire show. With PJ and Primus, certain songs draw me to the drummer.
Anyways… Tommy Lee is far from the biggest problem of that band live, it was only an example. You can send in your hurt feelings report wherever you want 😂
Why should I respond to the rest of your entire post that has nothing to do with disparaging Tommy Lee, when everything you said was sound.
Most of my post was disparaging Vince Neil. Tommy Lee was shrapnel. The show was lame full of boring planned theatrics. The rollercoaster was wild (cool, interesting) but wasn’t as entertaining to me as more talented drummers who don’t require theatrics to entertain me.
I’ve never heard anyone compare Tommy Lee to those guys so if anything I was putting him in some rarified air. Perhaps your admiration for Tommy Lee goes beyond his drumming abilities because you came in to his defence pretty quickly 😂.
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
My admiration for Tommy Lee comes from their producer saying he was always positive and easy going.
I have never care for or listened to Mötley Crüe.
But I have some form of sympathy for Vince Neil. I would not care how bad he sings at a show. As long ss he has fun. That would be my least problem at at Crüe-show.
You didn’t pay $500+ for four people to see it, this is where my sympathy ends. His performance was unprofessional. The fact is the boys did enjoy it… so maybe you could say it was worth it. Personally? I felt ripped off. Tommy Lee is part of the band and took my money with the rest of them.
Value in a performance can only be measured by the person who paid for the show.
Pearl Jam has always been worth every penny. In many cases… it has been priceless.
I did not pay that, no. I imagine for some people, it was priceless though.
Seeing fat Vince Neil struggle to get up the stairs to the stage and wheeze for air on the simplest notes and grind his fat gut against a backup dancer. Poor decrepit Mick Mars stand there and not move for an entire show. Tommy and his rollercoaster (honestly the best part of the show) and Nikki Sixx and whatever he does, none of it memorable. People who enjoyed it can enjoy it. Priceless.
Unbelievably, 70-some year old Alice Cooper opened for them and blew Motley Crüe out of the place… so it wasn’t a total loss. 😂
Post edited by 1ThoughtKnown on
0
F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 31,321
Nikki and Vince are amazing song writers 🙄…WTF?!?!
… She's only fifteen, she's the reason The reason that I can't sleep You say illegal I say, legal's never been my scene, oh yeah I try like hell but I'm out of control
… All in the name of, all in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock All in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock For sex and sex I'd sell my soul All in the name of, all in the name of rock
… Pretty, pretty so innocent She says you ain't seen nothing yet Brings me a dirty, dirty magazine There she was for all the world to see, oh yeah I try like hell but I'm out of control
… All in the name of, all in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock All in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock For sex and sex I'd sell my soul All in the name of, all in the name of rock
… Says to me, Daddy Can I have some candy? Wanna be your nasty Anytime you want You know you can have me
… All in the name of, all in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock All in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock
… All in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock All in the name of rock 'n' roll All in the name of rock All in the name of, all in the name of rock
The Crue are a bunch of scuzzbuckets. Total scum. So gross.
0
F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 31,321
Girl, You'll Be A Woman Soon
All sorts of this in music...agree that it is sleezey rock thing that was accepted for some reason. Jerry Lee to Led Zepp to Aerosmith to Neil Diamond (urge overkill) to, yes, Motley Crue.
Should not be playing that song. Was about Traci Lords filming porn at 15, I believe.
Too many examples of this bad taste type of crap lyrics to count, in rock and roll.
Just to be clear… I’m only joking about my wife. She is amazing and trusts me completely. There is no ball or chain. I cannot imagine my life without her 😎
I’d go off with her to Uranus… where creeps like Vince Neil and Steven Tyler don’t share the same “air”.
Steven Tyler is not a creep!
dude puts/allows his own daughter in his videos in extremely sexual performances (and especially since it's stereotypically male fantasy stuff). that's beyond fucking creepy to me.
I think gaining legal guardianship of a teenage girl so you can impregnate her outweighs Liv in skimpy shorts in a music video by a mile.
Saw this over Twitter, finally checking in to read the forum’s take. Happy to see there have been responses that I can relate to and not just fanbois jumping to Ed’s defense.
After reading some of the Ed quotes from the article, I had a couple of initial questions:
1.) How does Ed’s opinion sit with Mike? Cause Mike had tried hard to be a part of that scene. (Didn’t know about Stone’s experience w/the scene. That just adds to my question.)
2.) Has Ed ever criticized the surf scene for their treatment of women?
Then there are my reactions to the thread. Eddie Vedder gets called a feminist simply because that is what he brands himself as. Personally, I wouldn’t rank him as one.
In fact, his suggestion that women were taken seriously because of the clothes they were wearing is both misogynistic and not true.
(I threw a trench coat over my t-shirt and jeans to avoid getting groped at the Drop in the Park show.) And, uh, the only person he could appreciate in a bustier was Perry Ferrell?! I beg his pardon
L
(I know, not a bustier. But, same category, so...)
Anyway, my impression of this whole thing is that Ed is projecting like a motherfucker.
Saw this over Twitter, finally checking in to read the forum’s take. Happy to see there have been responses that I can relate to and not just fanbois jumping to Ed’s defense.
After reading some of the Ed quotes from the article, I had a couple of initial questions:
1.) How does Ed’s opinion sit with Mike? Cause Mike had tried hard to be a part of that scene. (Didn’t know about Stone’s experience w/the scene. That just adds to my question.)
2.) Has Ed ever criticized the surf scene for their treatment of women?
Then there are my reactions to the thread. Eddie Vedder gets called a feminist simply because that is what he brands himself as. Personally, I wouldn’t rank him as one.
In fact, his suggestion that women were taken seriously because of the clothes they were wearing is both misogynistic and not true.
(I threw a trench coat over my t-shirt and jeans to avoid getting groped at the Drop in the Park show.) And, uh, the only person he could appreciate in a bustier was Perry Ferrell?! I beg his pardon
L
(I know, not a bustier. But, same category, so...)
Anyway, my impression of this whole thing is that Ed is projecting like a motherfucker.
I think he was saying women were taken seriously. Not taken seriously because of the clothes they wore.
Looks like your response falls into the category of 'how can I reject what Ed's saying by applying these rules of hypocrisy to it?'
Saw this over Twitter, finally checking in to read the forum’s take. Happy to see there have been responses that I can relate to and not just fanbois jumping to Ed’s defense.
After reading some of the Ed quotes from the article, I had a couple of initial questions:
1.) How does Ed’s opinion sit with Mike? Cause Mike had tried hard to be a part of that scene. (Didn’t know about Stone’s experience w/the scene. That just adds to my question.)
2.) Has Ed ever criticized the surf scene for their treatment of women?
Then there are my reactions to the thread. Eddie Vedder gets called a feminist simply because that is what he brands himself as. Personally, I wouldn’t rank him as one.
In fact, his suggestion that women were taken seriously because of the clothes they were wearing is both misogynistic and not true.
(I threw a trench coat over my t-shirt and jeans to avoid getting groped at the Drop in the Park show.) And, uh, the only person he could appreciate in a bustier was Perry Ferrell?! I beg his pardon
L
(I know, not a bustier. But, same category, so...)
Anyway, my impression of this whole thing is that Ed is projecting like a motherfucker.
I think he was saying women were taken seriously. Not taken seriously because of the clothes they wore.
Looks like your response falls into the category of 'how can I reject what Ed's saying by applying these rules of hypocrisy to it?'
He said women who wore their hair not like Heather Locklear’s, but like Cat Powers were taken seriously. He associated the change in how women were treated with their appearances.
But that’s the thing: women were not automatically respected. They still had to fight for their space. Kathleen Hanna and the entire Riot Grrrl movement has talked about this openly and frequently, so I don’t know why he’s saying we were respected.
Actually, I guess he said we “could” be respected, not that we were.
My bad - we had “access” to respect, though it was not a guaranteed given.
Saw this over Twitter, finally checking in to read the forum’s take. Happy to see there have been responses that I can relate to and not just fanbois jumping to Ed’s defense.
After reading some of the Ed quotes from the article, I had a couple of initial questions:
1.) How does Ed’s opinion sit with Mike? Cause Mike had tried hard to be a part of that scene. (Didn’t know about Stone’s experience w/the scene. That just adds to my question.)
2.) Has Ed ever criticized the surf scene for their treatment of women?
Then there are my reactions to the thread. Eddie Vedder gets called a feminist simply because that is what he brands himself as. Personally, I wouldn’t rank him as one.
In fact, his suggestion that women were taken seriously because of the clothes they were wearing is both misogynistic and not true.
(I threw a trench coat over my t-shirt and jeans to avoid getting groped at the Drop in the Park show.) And, uh, the only person he could appreciate in a bustier was Perry Ferrell?! I beg his pardon
L
(I know, not a bustier. But, same category, so...)
Anyway, my impression of this whole thing is that Ed is projecting like a motherfucker.
I think he was saying women were taken seriously. Not taken seriously because of the clothes they wore.
Looks like your response falls into the category of 'how can I reject what Ed's saying by applying these rules of hypocrisy to it?'
He said women who wore their hair not like Heather Locklear’s, but like Cat Powers were taken seriously. He associated the change in how women were treated with their appearances.
But that’s the thing: women were not automatically respected. They still had to fight for their space. Kathleen Hanna and the entire Riot Grrrl movement has talked about this openly and frequently, so I don’t know why he’s saying we were respected.
Actually, I guess he said we “could” be respected, not that we were.
My bad - we had “access” to respect, though it was not a guaranteed given.
That's not really what he said. The quote is this:
" But I’m circling back to say that one thing that I appreciated was that
in Seattle and the alternative crowd, the girls could wear their combat
boots and sweaters, and their hair looked like Cat Power’s and not
Heather Locklear’s — nothing against her. They weren’t selling
themselves short. They could have an opinion and be respected."
The last sentence is his point, and he's probably talking about the contrast from being in SoCal and seeing the hair metal scene, vs. the Northwest music scene. From my personal perspective, I'm someone who moved from the Midwest to the Northwest in the early 90s and I noticed the greater respect toward women across the board very quickly.
Comments
Dave Lombardo is another drummer who is amazing to watch.. mad skills, no gimmicks.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
-EV 8/14/93
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Steven Tyler Once Had A 14 Year Old Girlfriend That Her Parents Signed Over To Him | FeelNumb.com
-EV 8/14/93
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
I have never care for or listened to Mötley Crüe.
But I have some form of sympathy for Vince Neil. I would not care how bad he sings at a show. As long ss he has fun. That would be my least problem at at Crüe-show.
Seeing fat Vince Neil struggle to get up the stairs to the stage and wheeze for air on the simplest notes and grind his fat gut against a backup dancer. Poor decrepit Mick Mars stand there and not move for an entire show. Tommy and his rollercoaster (honestly the best part of the show) and Nikki Sixx and whatever he does, none of it memorable. People who enjoyed it can enjoy it. Priceless.
The reason that I can't sleep
You say illegal
I say, legal's never been my scene, oh yeah
I try like hell but I'm out of control
All in the name of rock
All in the name of rock 'n' roll
All in the name of rock
For sex and sex I'd sell my soul
All in the name of, all in the name of rock
She says you ain't seen nothing yet
Brings me a dirty, dirty magazine
There she was for all the world to see, oh yeah
I try like hell but I'm out of control
All in the name of rock
All in the name of rock 'n' roll
All in the name of rock
For sex and sex I'd sell my soul
All in the name of, all in the name of rock
Can I have some candy?
Wanna be your nasty
Anytime you want
You know you can have me
All in the name of rock
All in the name of rock 'n' roll
All in the name of rock
All in the name of rock
All in the name of rock 'n' roll
All in the name of rock
All in the name of, all in the name of rock
The Crue are a bunch of scuzzbuckets. Total scum. So gross.
All sorts of this in music...agree that it is sleezey rock thing that was accepted for some reason.
Jerry Lee to Led Zepp to Aerosmith to Neil Diamond (urge overkill) to, yes, Motley Crue.
Should not be playing that song. Was about Traci Lords filming porn at 15, I believe.
Too many examples of this bad taste type of crap lyrics to count, in rock and roll.
Crossed up my Nuge signals, too.
1.) How does Ed’s opinion sit with Mike? Cause Mike had tried hard to be a part of that scene. (Didn’t know about Stone’s experience w/the scene. That just adds to my question.)
2.) Has Ed ever criticized the surf scene for their treatment of women?
Then there are my reactions to the thread. Eddie Vedder gets called a feminist simply because that is what he brands himself as. Personally, I wouldn’t rank him as one.
And, uh, the only person he could appreciate in a bustier was Perry Ferrell?! I beg his pardon
(I know, not a bustier. But, same category, so...)
Anyway, my impression of this whole thing is that Ed is projecting like a motherfucker.
But that’s the thing: women were not automatically respected. They still had to fight for their space. Kathleen Hanna and the entire Riot Grrrl movement has talked about this openly and frequently, so I don’t know why he’s saying we were respected.