The elephant in the room....Covid and these Pearl Jam shows

PJ_Soul

There is no way I'd go into a crowd where hardly anyone is wearing masks right now. Masks should be mandatory IMO, even where vaccine cards are being checked.

I'm glad they are checking vaccine records, but I'm disturbed to know that they got so lax about it at some point - they were basically just waving people in it sounds like, at least at one entrance. Not cool.

davidos

JH6056 said:

Btw @davidos, you'd originally said you got a PCR, I'm still curious what test you got the 1st time if you don't mind me asking?  You said this time you got a "proper PCR", so just wondering what the 1st test was, how did the docs/nurses who gave you the 1st one name it?

It's good to know for others because I think "PCR" is starting to be used more often than it should be, with people not realizing they may not have gotten a proper PCR, as you said.

Do you know what your docs called the 1st one you got?  Did anyone use term "Rapid test" for it?

Thanks and again wishing you speedy recovery!

Thanks for the well wishes! The positive PCR today was the exact same location and test as the negative one last Thursday. Only difference is during the first test the nurse went DEEP and made my cry… whereas the one today that came back positive was so light that I told the nurse to get in there and go deep. I was afraid that she didn’t swab properly. She said that the machine is very sensitive and you don’t have to go painfully deep in the nose…. So either I didn’t have enough of a viral load on Thursday, even though I had a scratchy throat and light cough, or she went TOO deep and didn’t get a good swab. 🤷‍♂️

Oh, and today is my wife’s birthday…. Happy birthday babe… hope you are enjoying dinner out with our daughter 😢🤬

i got id

Very few people wearing masks at Ohana. Wish more people would mask up

lastexit78

PJ_Soul said:

There is no way I'd go into a crowd where hardly anyone is wearing masks right now. Masks should be mandatory IMO, even where vaccine cards are being checked.

I'm glad they are checking vaccine records, but I'm disturbed to know that they got so lax about it at some point - they were basically just waving people in it sounds like, at least at one entrance. Not cool.

I’m all for better verification standards but at some point a lot of these other measures need to be scaled back. There have been multiple studies showing outdoor spread is basically non existent, for me that data along with confidence in the vaccine makes me more than comfortable attending an outdoor show. It’s a bummer to hear of breakthrough infections but the overwhelming evidence still says they are mild for the most part. I have two friends who are nurses and neither have seen an vaccinated patient. I also know of a family friend who ended up in the hospital, vaccinated. So it obviously happens, but at some point people have to analyze their own risk and make a decision they are comfortable with. Millions of baseball, football, soccer, and music fans have been gathering outdoors for months, many unvaccinated. I haven’t heard of any super spreader events. Pretty sure the media which is drilling for fear 24/7 would have certainly found them. Someone dies from a DUI accident every 52 minutes in the US, should we bring back prohibition? More children have died from gun violence in Chicago this year than of COVID in the US since the pandemic began. Yet basically no action gets taken. Danger lurks everywhere. I hope humans learn to live freely and embrace life again as they should. We have endured far worse than this pandemic and bounced back. I know I’ll be bouncing back Saturday night enjoying the show, not looking around worrying about what fellow fan might infect me with a breakthrough case. 

curmudgeoness

Our vax cards were checked against our IDs at the VIP entrance. I used my digital record, and that was scanned and checked against my driver's license, husband brought his actual card.

I'm less concerned about masking outdoors, but then again I stayed well back from the "pit." But for crying out loud, people, we're 18 months into this: wear your damn mask on the shuttle bus, and have it cover your nose as well as your mouth. Chin diapers offer no protection to you or to me. This isn't hard: I see little kids, preschoolers, wearing their masks properly all the time. /rant

JH6056

davidos said:

JH6056 said:

Btw @davidos, you'd originally said you got a PCR, I'm still curious what test you got the 1st time if you don't mind me asking?  You said this time you got a "proper PCR", so just wondering what the 1st test was, how did the docs/nurses who gave you the 1st one name it?

It's good to know for others because I think "PCR" is starting to be used more often than it should be, with people not realizing they may not have gotten a proper PCR, as you said.

Do you know what your docs called the 1st one you got?  Did anyone use term "Rapid test" for it?

Thanks and again wishing you speedy recovery!

Thanks for the well wishes! The positive PCR today was the exact same location and test as the negative one last Thursday. Only difference is during the first test the nurse went DEEP and made my cry… whereas the one today that came back positive was so light that I told the nurse to get in there and go deep. I was afraid that she didn’t swab properly. She said that the machine is very sensitive and you don’t have to go painfully deep in the nose…. So either I didn’t have enough of a viral load on Thursday, even though I had a scratchy throat and light cough, or she went TOO deep and didn’t get a good swab. 🤷‍♂️

Oh, and today is my wife’s birthday…. Happy birthday babe… hope you are enjoying dinner out with our daughter 😢🤬

Thanks for explaining that. Yeah, very likely your viral load wasn't great enough to trigger the positive yet, although if the nurse said the test is very sensitive, maybe having your brain swabbed that 1st time did mess up the accuracy?

Sorry you're missing celebrating your wife's birthday with her and your daughter, but far better you're doing the right thing and quarantining.

Here, I heard this song (the original) on the radio today and it reminded me that the beginning of the pandemic already feels far away, the beginning when I heard this version all the time... Feel better fast!

P.s. You only have to watch it once, but she may sing it like 40 times in this one video...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMZmmw1rMOQ

Spunkie

Zod said:

SS105464 said:

You are kidding yourself if you think a vaxxxed person is not spreading covid.  Viral loads in vaxxxed people have been shown to be similar in the Delta variant.  The most logical and scientific way to prevent spread at a festival is to require everyone to have a negative test before entering.  Excluding the vaxxxed doesn't make sense.  

I think the issue, is that yes it can spread amongst vaccinated people.  A vaccine teaches the body how to fight a virus, so they do contract it, but the body will fight it faster and more efficiently than if you didn't have a vaccine.

I think the issue is non-vaccinated people walking in a sea of of vaccinated people.   If it is spreading around the vaccinated people, and they don't have symptons, the non-vaccinated people are like a canary in a coal mine.    It makes it tough to allow them in events because there would be a high chance they would contract the virus (from other unvaxxed or vaxxed people).

that's how I feel about vaccine passports here in BC.   It's more about preventing unvaccinated from getting it from a vaccinated population than the other way around?

Agree with ya 💯, Zoddy. We get good info in BC which also states that the passports help increase vaccination uptake, so there's less community spread.

Go Beavers

i got id said:

Very few people wearing masks at Ohana. Wish more people would mask up

Masks are for indoors in poorly ventilated spaces for short periods of time. Their effectiveness is meaningless outdoors. Unfortunately, ventilation was never emphasized enough and it's one of the most important variables with regard to spreading the Covids.

Go Beavers

curmudgeoness said:

Our vax cards were checked against our IDs at the VIP entrance. I used my digital record, and that was scanned and checked against my driver's license, husband brought his actual card.

I'm less concerned about masking outdoors, but then again I stayed well back from the "pit." But for crying out loud, people, we're 18 months into this: wear your damn mask on the shuttle bus, and have it cover your nose as well as your mouth. Chin diapers offer no protection to you or to me. This isn't hard: I see little kids, preschoolers, wearing their masks properly all the time. /rant

The highest risk thing for people at Ohana was the shuttle buses because none of them had the windows open. Most of the time I got on the school buses and would open the windows near my seat. Hardly any of the other windows were open.

JH6056

Go Beavers said:

i got id said:

Very few people wearing masks at Ohana. Wish more people would mask up

Masks are for indoors in poorly ventilated spaces for short periods of time. Their effectiveness is meaningless outdoors. Unfortunately, ventilation was never emphasized enough and it's one of the most important variables with regard to spreading the Covids.

I disagree that masks are meaningless outside in a dense crowd. If I can smell someone's perfume or body odor (yes, body odor!) for an entire band set of 40 - 60 min because the person is standing close enough/the air is mostly drifting from them to me, why isn't it possible for me to breathe their respiratory droplets many times over the course of that 40 min?

And for those right behind those on the rail, that's probably the most densely populated section of any festival and many of those folks are standng together for HOURS.  Why is transmission in that situation so highly unlikely in your opinion that masks would be useless? They felt very useful to me.

Lastly, don't forget that most of the respiratory particulate studies weren't done in the GA pits of festivals.  Once the pandemic got going, "crowds" were not much of a thing other than those funerals and parties that were super-spreader events (and yes mostly indoors at the time).  But 15,000 people with many of them close up at the front of the stage... masks felt very helpful to me.

[Edited to add:]
One major super-spreader activity indentified early in Covid was singing choirs. They figured out that that emoting, that singing and projecting one's voice, also projected the virus. Guess what a BUNCH OF PEOPLE standing together for their favorite band do? They sing their asses off.  So that's another good reason to mask up if in close quarters, even outside. Singing & shouting can be like coughing in terms of projecting particles & the virus out.

Johnny Abruzzo

Outdoor events can be superspreader events - in fact the original superspreader was the Atalanta vs. Valencia match in Milan in February 2020, which set Italy and Spain into their original outbreaks. It wouldn't be the worst thing for people to mask up at festivals but it seems like overkill when vax is required. (I doubt that many brought a negative COVID test.)

HughFreakingDillon

I've been to a couple (outdoor) CFL games this summer, vaxxed only, masks optional (I'd say maybe 10% wore them), one of them was sold out 35,000 people. cramped together, shouting, drinking, cheering, standing right next to each other in beer/food/bathroom lines, etc, for 3 hours. 

no uptick in local covid case count. 

mfc2006

I didn't wear a mask when we had a lot of space at Ohana, but I always put it on when I went to the bathroom, to get food, or if our space got too crowded. If it got too crowded, we just moved back.

HughFreakingDillon

mfc2006 said:

I didn't wear a mask when we had a lot of space at Ohana, but I always put it on when I went to the bathroom, to get food, or if our space got too crowded. If it got too crowded, we just moved back.

yeah, waiting in line for food/etc I put it on too. 

JH6056

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've been to a couple (outdoor) CFL games this summer, vaxxed only, masks optional (I'd say maybe 10% wore them), one of them was sold out 35,000 people. cramped together, shouting, drinking, cheering, standing right next to each other in beer/food/bathroom lines, etc, for 3 hours. 

no uptick in local covid case count. 

How did they check/confirm vax status on your way in?  If they did a good job, it makes sense it wasn't a superspreader event or led to a notable uptick in your local covid count.

Also what state are you in if it's ok to ask?  

HughFreakingDillon

JH6056 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've been to a couple (outdoor) CFL games this summer, vaxxed only, masks optional (I'd say maybe 10% wore them), one of them was sold out 35,000 people. cramped together, shouting, drinking, cheering, standing right next to each other in beer/food/bathroom lines, etc, for 3 hours. 

no uptick in local covid case count. 

How did they check/confirm vax status on your way in?  If they did a good job, it makes sense it wasn't a superspreader event or led to a notable uptick in your local covid count.

Also what state are you in if it's ok to ask?  

Winnipeg, Manitoba. we have vaccination cards issued by the province (like a driver's license) with a QR code on the back. they scan the code, and it says your name and a checkmark or vaccinated or something. then they check your government-issued ID to make sure they match. quick and easy. no extra wait time in line. they have people further down the line where people wait to get scanned for weapons and stuff. 

there is literally no way to get in without showing proof of vaccination. 

JH6056

HughFreakingDillon said:

JH6056 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've been to a couple (outdoor) CFL games this summer, vaxxed only, masks optional (I'd say maybe 10% wore them), one of them was sold out 35,000 people. cramped together, shouting, drinking, cheering, standing right next to each other in beer/food/bathroom lines, etc, for 3 hours. 

no uptick in local covid case count. 

How did they check/confirm vax status on your way in?  If they did a good job, it makes sense it wasn't a superspreader event or led to a notable uptick in your local covid count.

Also what state are you in if it's ok to ask?  

Winnipeg, Manitoba. we have vaccination cards issued by the province (like a driver's license) with a QR code on the back. they scan the code, and it says your name and a checkmark or vaccinated or something. then they check your government-issued ID to make sure they match. quick and easy. no extra wait time in line. they have people further down the line where people wait to get scanned for weapons and stuff. 

there is literally no way to get in without showing proof of vaccination. 

See now THAT is a HUGE DIFFERENCE from something like Sea Hear Now.  I don't know how Ohana went, but SHN was a better process than many I've seen in last few months for entry, but if one "Vax checker" kinda checks out a bit and isn't really looking at government issued i.d. and comparing it to the vax info, then the system has holes in it that are not ok.

Your system, with a government-issued vax doc with a QR code on it that can then be checked against the regular government-issued i.d. is SO MUCH TIGHTER and harder to mess with, which makes events like the 35,000 one you mentioned so much safer.

Good job Manitoba!

HughFreakingDillon

yeah I think we were the first province to do the QR code thing (the news falsely credited Quebec and Ontario as being the first). BC has a stupid piece of paper where your name is literally written in that anyone can forge. it's so dumb. 

davidos

another major bummer of my breakthrough COVID from SHN is my Ohana Encore trip is cancelled and there is no way to get a refund on the passes…

mfc2006

JH6056 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

JH6056 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've been to a couple (outdoor) CFL games this summer, vaxxed only, masks optional (I'd say maybe 10% wore them), one of them was sold out 35,000 people. cramped together, shouting, drinking, cheering, standing right next to each other in beer/food/bathroom lines, etc, for 3 hours. 

no uptick in local covid case count. 

How did they check/confirm vax status on your way in?  If they did a good job, it makes sense it wasn't a superspreader event or led to a notable uptick in your local covid count.

Also what state are you in if it's ok to ask?  

Winnipeg, Manitoba. we have vaccination cards issued by the province (like a driver's license) with a QR code on the back. they scan the code, and it says your name and a checkmark or vaccinated or something. then they check your government-issued ID to make sure they match. quick and easy. no extra wait time in line. they have people further down the line where people wait to get scanned for weapons and stuff. 

there is literally no way to get in without showing proof of vaccination. 

See now THAT is a HUGE DIFFERENCE from something like Sea Hear Now.  I don't know how Ohana went, but SHN was a better process than many I've seen in last few months for entry, but if one "Vax checker" kinda checks out a bit and isn't really looking at government issued i.d. and comparing it to the vax info, then the system has holes in it that are not ok.

Your system, with a government-issued vax doc with a QR code on it that can then be checked against the regular government-issued i.d. is SO MUCH TIGHTER and harder to mess with, which makes events like the 35,000 one you mentioned so much safer.

Good job Manitoba!

I can't speak for other vax checkers at Ohana, but ours was very thorough.

I agree on the cards. I wish the US cards were a bit more robust and could not be altered or manufactured.