Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
cultural appropriation. it stops when the appropriation stops. no culture wants to be another culture's caricature or mascot.
So the Boston Celtics are up next? Come on man, this is all becoming such a joke.
you don't see a difference between the treatment of Irish people and the treatment of Indigenous peoples?
I don’t know where you got that from but again my question is, where does it all end? Again, what is wrong with the word “Chiefs”? Are people actually complaining about that? Is there mascot bad? I can totally see Chief Wahoo and the Redskins but Chiefs?
you don't know where I got that from? it's the entire point.
you do know that a Chief is the leader of a Native American tribe, right? and that fans wear Native American head dresses to games, and that after a touchdown a person in Native American clothing mounts a horse named Warpaint (which they are retiring)?
did you think they were named after a chief of police? it's not just the name; it's the entire package that is usually the issue.
No shit it s not named after the chief of police, but what is wrong with the word Chiefs in this context? The leader of a tribe? How is that offensive? Fans wear god damn cheese on their heads in Wisconsin.
I m good with war paint retiring.
But on the other note, not in the same league but Irish people were treated pretty shitty in this country.
I'm not sure i'm ever going to get through if you don't understand the problem of the word chief, intermingled with the history of the organization and it's caricaturization of aboriginals in this context.
how can you be ok with war paint retiring but still fail to see the problem with the team name? it's all part of the same parcel.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
cultural appropriation. it stops when the appropriation stops. no culture wants to be another culture's caricature or mascot.
So the Boston Celtics are up next? Come on man, this is all becoming such a joke.
you don't see a difference between the treatment of Irish people and the treatment of Indigenous peoples?
I don’t know where you got that from but again my question is, where does it all end? Again, what is wrong with the word “Chiefs”? Are people actually complaining about that? Is there mascot bad? I can totally see Chief Wahoo and the Redskins but Chiefs?
you don't know where I got that from? it's the entire point.
you do know that a Chief is the leader of a Native American tribe, right? and that fans wear Native American head dresses to games, and that after a touchdown a person in Native American clothing mounts a horse named Warpaint (which they are retiring)?
did you think they were named after a chief of police? it's not just the name; it's the entire package that is usually the issue.
No shit it s not named after the chief of police, but what is wrong with the word Chiefs in this context? The leader of a tribe? How is that offensive? Fans wear god damn cheese on their heads in Wisconsin.
I m good with war paint retiring.
But on the other note, not in the same league but Irish people were treated pretty shitty in this country.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
cultural appropriation. it stops when the appropriation stops. no culture wants to be another culture's caricature or mascot.
So the Boston Celtics are up next? Come on man, this is all becoming such a joke.
you don't see a difference between the treatment of Irish people and the treatment of Indigenous peoples?
I don’t know where you got that from but again my question is, where does it all end? Again, what is wrong with the word “Chiefs”? Are people actually complaining about that? Is there mascot bad? I can totally see Chief Wahoo and the Redskins but Chiefs?
you don't know where I got that from? it's the entire point.
you do know that a Chief is the leader of a Native American tribe, right? and that fans wear Native American head dresses to games, and that after a touchdown a person in Native American clothing mounts a horse named Warpaint (which they are retiring)?
did you think they were named after a chief of police? it's not just the name; it's the entire package that is usually the issue.
No shit it s not named after the chief of police, but what is wrong with the word Chiefs in this context? The leader of a tribe? How is that offensive? Fans wear god damn cheese on their heads in Wisconsin.
I m good with war paint retiring.
But on the other note, not in the same league but Irish people were treated pretty shitty in this country.
Does the cheese 🧀 in Wisconsin get offended? Or is this a cause that the woke crowd may take up some day?
Give Peas A Chance…
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
I don't dispute that it's cultural appropriation, but as Russel points out, is that, in and of itself, bad? It can be. It can be disrespectful. But it's not wrong in itself to take cues from elsewhere. Lines in fashion, music, and other cultural areas can (and sometimes should) be blurred. It gets tricky because I see some people doing some really cringeworthy things that, while probably not badly intended maliciously, might come off as disrespectful.
Sometimes it feels like that's where we are with teams. Was the name "Indians" meant to be disrespectful? Probably not. Maybe even so with R******s (as crazy as that seems), but they still come off that way and fans still react to it that way (see the tomahawk chop). Is Chief Wahoo "cultural appropriation?" Who cares? It was flat out disrespectful even if that's not how we saw it when it was designed in the 1940s. Calling that logo "cultural appropriation" is like calling the n-word "slang" (i.e., it's true but such an under-sell).
As for the names, it gets trickier. The very idea of naming yourself after a group of people that you are not is kind of odd. Then again, you could assign that to the Packers, Oilers, Brewers,* Cowboys, etc., but it comes off differently when it's a group that's been traditionally marginalized/bullied/shit on in this country. I don't care what the intentions were, a critical mass of fan behavior in response to these names has been pretty abhorrent.
These lines are difficult to draw, though. But in the long run, I suspect most fans of the team(s) will adjust. I think that's pretty much what's happened to college teams (Marquette, Miami OH, Syracuse), though the jury's still out at North Dakota...that fanbase is still pretty upset.
*In fairness, those of us old enough to remember Gorman Thomas may suspect that he was, in fact, a Brewer in his spare time.
"I don't dispute that it's cultural appropriation, but as Russel points out, is that, in and of itself, bad?"
Interesting question well worth exploring!
My own take is that it depends on what the culture being appropriated says about it. If most indigenous people in America are opposed to using their culture in sports names or white women hanging dream catchers from their rear view mirrors (sorry ladies- I've just seen that so many times), then it is not appropriate.
But them what about John Coltrane and Pharoah Sanders incorporating eastern musical influences in their music? Well, Japan has treated both (especially Coltrane) as gods, so I would say in that case- regarding the Japanese influences- no problem! Being aware and sensitive to the reaction of others cultures is, I would say, the key.
See here's the issue. Your argument is reasonable except the bar of "most" people. That information that's impossible to obtain.
And what if 50.1% of Black women were against hoop earrings in white girls? What then? Do you outlaw it or just get to harass them in public?
I'm not picking on your argument, rather the silliness of it all, to me.
I see your point and I guess I could have been more accurate by saying "quite a large percentage" instead of "most". Of course, the exact figure or even a close approximation is not available, but it you read widely on, and follow current event related to Native Americans and explored some of their websites, what I said I strongly believe would be verified. But rather than take my word for it, if anyone cares, they might do that research on their own! But alas, the average person gets their "information" from headlines, brief tweets, FB nonsense, and the like. Fewer and fewer people actually do research, read full articles, etc.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
cultural appropriation. it stops when the appropriation stops. no culture wants to be another culture's caricature or mascot.
So the Boston Celtics are up next? Come on man, this is all becoming such a joke.
you don't see a difference between the treatment of Irish people and the treatment of Indigenous peoples?
I don’t know where you got that from but again my question is, where does it all end? Again, what is wrong with the word “Chiefs”? Are people actually complaining about that? Is there mascot bad? I can totally see Chief Wahoo and the Redskins but Chiefs?
you don't know where I got that from? it's the entire point.
you do know that a Chief is the leader of a Native American tribe, right? and that fans wear Native American head dresses to games, and that after a touchdown a person in Native American clothing mounts a horse named Warpaint (which they are retiring)?
did you think they were named after a chief of police? it's not just the name; it's the entire package that is usually the issue.
No shit it s not named after the chief of police, but what is wrong with the word Chiefs in this context? The leader of a tribe? How is that offensive? Fans wear god damn cheese on their heads in Wisconsin.
I m good with war paint retiring.
But on the other note, not in the same league but Irish people were treated pretty shitty in this country.
Does the cheese 🧀 in Wisconsin get offended? Or is this a cause that the woke crowd may take up some day?
I was making the comparison that Fans dress up no matter what the mascot. I still say keep the Chiefs.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
Wow- guys, it's so obvious the Chiefs are using Native American images against the wishes of indigenous people. How is that not wrong?
Google "Kansas City Chiefs racist images" and go to "images". It's so freakin' obvious I can't believe we are discussing this.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
And the mentality behind it. What does this remind you of?
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 30,643
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Name Scrutiny Extends From Redskins To Chiefs, But Kansas City’s Mascot Has A Different Origin Story
With Washington’s NFL team officially changing its nickname from the Redskins, Kansas City’s team name of the Chiefs has come under scrutiny.
That name, however, was not derived from Native Americans. The Chiefs were named after former Kansas City mayor H. Roe Bartle, who helped the city land a pro football team in the early 1960s.
The franchise, of course, has adopted Native American themes since then. Fans — some dressed in Native American attire — do the tomahawk chop in Arrowhead Stadium while Warpaint the horse gallops after touchdowns.
One can make a strong case that those franchise staples offensively depict Native Americans as “savages” and should be changed.
The mere nickname, though, has more innocuous roots. According to the Chiefs media guide, the Chiefs moniker was selected in honor of Bartle, who helped convince Lamar Hunt to move the Dallas Texans to Kansas City, as part of a name-the-team contest.
Bartle, who was nearing the end of his second and final term as mayor when he persuaded Hunt, had tried to land pro football in Kansas City at least two other times during the AFL days.
The mayor was nicknamed “the Chief” not only because of his 6-3, 300-pound-plus girth, but also his work with the Boy Scouts of America.
After serving in the military during World War I and getting his law degree from the University of Chattanooga, Bartle started as a scout executive in Wyoming, following a training session in Kansas City. The number of scouts in his Wyoming area grew tenfold.
After Bartle and Hunt initially met in Dallas, only Bartle and his chauffeur knew that Hunt was scouting the Kansas City location because he didn’t want to compete with the Dallas Cowboys for fans.
Hunt surreptitiously checked into Kansas City’s Muehlebach Hotel under an assumed name, and when Bartle had to introduce him, he called him “Mr. Lamar,” according to Matt Fulks’ 100 Things Chiefs Fans Should Know & Do Before They Die.
(Disclosure: I am an editor at Triumph Books, the publisher of 100 Things Chiefs Fans Should Know & Do Before They Die.)
Bartle’s two four-year, mayoral terms ended in 1963. Hunt officially announced his team was moving from Dallas to Kansas City that year, and the Chiefs name was established in May.
During the Chiefs’ franchise history, their Native American traditions have come under scrutiny as well.
In 1992 the team stopped playing the tomahawk chop war chant at its home games. Fans, however, still sang the tune and did the arm motion before the franchise reinstituted it shortly thereafter.
Vahe Gregorian, the columnist for The Kansas City Star, suggested rebranding the Chiefs name as a way to memorialize the six Kansas City firefighters who died in an explosion in 1988.
And the City of Fountains actually has a prominent fountain located at the south end of Penn Valley Park, which features two bronze sculptures of firefighters.
Less than two miles from that fountain is Bartle Hall. The major convention center in downtown Kansas City, Mo. is named in honor of the Chief who passed away on May 9, 1974.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
I don't dispute that it's cultural appropriation, but as Russel points out, is that, in and of itself, bad? It can be. It can be disrespectful. But it's not wrong in itself to take cues from elsewhere. Lines in fashion, music, and other cultural areas can (and sometimes should) be blurred. It gets tricky because I see some people doing some really cringeworthy things that, while probably not badly intended maliciously, might come off as disrespectful.
Sometimes it feels like that's where we are with teams. Was the name "Indians" meant to be disrespectful? Probably not. Maybe even so with R******s (as crazy as that seems), but they still come off that way and fans still react to it that way (see the tomahawk chop). Is Chief Wahoo "cultural appropriation?" Who cares? It was flat out disrespectful even if that's not how we saw it when it was designed in the 1940s. Calling that logo "cultural appropriation" is like calling the n-word "slang" (i.e., it's true but such an under-sell).
As for the names, it gets trickier. The very idea of naming yourself after a group of people that you are not is kind of odd. Then again, you could assign that to the Packers, Oilers, Brewers,* Cowboys, etc., but it comes off differently when it's a group that's been traditionally marginalized/bullied/shit on in this country. I don't care what the intentions were, a critical mass of fan behavior in response to these names has been pretty abhorrent.
These lines are difficult to draw, though. But in the long run, I suspect most fans of the team(s) will adjust. I think that's pretty much what's happened to college teams (Marquette, Miami OH, Syracuse), though the jury's still out at North Dakota...that fanbase is still pretty upset.
*In fairness, those of us old enough to remember Gorman Thomas may suspect that he was, in fact, a Brewer in his spare time.
"I don't dispute that it's cultural appropriation, but as Russel points out, is that, in and of itself, bad?"
Interesting question well worth exploring!
My own take is that it depends on what the culture being appropriated says about it. If most indigenous people in America are opposed to using their culture in sports names or white women hanging dream catchers from their rear view mirrors (sorry ladies- I've just seen that so many times), then it is not appropriate.
But them what about John Coltrane and Pharoah Sanders incorporating eastern musical influences in their music? Well, Japan has treated both (especially Coltrane) as gods, so I would say in that case- regarding the Japanese influences- no problem! Being aware and sensitive to the reaction of others cultures is, I would say, the key.
See here's the issue. Your argument is reasonable except the bar of "most" people. That information that's impossible to obtain.
And what if 50.1% of Black women were against hoop earrings in white girls? What then? Do you outlaw it or just get to harass them in public?
I'm not picking on your argument, rather the silliness of it all, to me.
I see your point and I guess I could have been more accurate by saying "quite a large percentage" instead of "most". Of course, the exact figure or even a close approximation is not available, but it you read widely on, and follow current event related to Native Americans and explored some of their websites, what I said I strongly believe would be verified. But rather than take my word for it, if anyone cares, they might do that research on their own! But alas, the average person gets their "information" from headlines, brief tweets, FB nonsense, and the like. Fewer and fewer people actually do research, read full articles, etc.
I won't argue on the native American deal, but I was more thinking about cultural appropriation accusations of music, hair, clothes, earring, FOOD etc. Things that I would argue are positive, where one culture adopts styles from another. Where does it end?
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Asking for a friend, is it okay that certain native tribes are so into gambling? Did they appropriate Blackjack, Poker, Rouelette from the White man? Should I be okay with this or try to cancel it?
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Asking for a friend, is it okay that certain native tribes are so into gambling? Did they appropriate Blackjack, Poker, Rouelette from the White man? Should I be okay with this or try to cancel it?
That Chiefs story is why I don’t a lot of weight on the original intent. Well it appears that the intent was pure, if you will, that no longer matters since they have handled everything through stereotypes since.
The logo they use in their very first season in KC makes me question that story anyway.
1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine 2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
That Chiefs story is why I don’t a lot of weight on the original intent. Well it appears that the intent was pure, if you will, that no longer matters since they have handled everything through stereotypes since.
The logo they use in their very first season in KC makes me question that story anyway.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Please don't leave out Fighting Irish. As someone who is a quarter Irish this always offended me. I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads. Tools would be acceptable, also.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Padres…gots to go.
Seriously where does it stop? Side note, I would love to see a game in San Diego. Gorgeous stadium.
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Yet the Kansas City Chiefs refuse to change their name.
Tell me why the Chiefs should change their name. What is insulting about the Chiefs?
again, where does it end?
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
Chief and the N word are definitely not equals, not even close.
So the world will be at peace when we get rid of the Braves, Chiefs, Seminoles, Vikings, Angels, Devils, Blackhawks...who am I missing?
Padres…gots to go.
Seriously where does it stop? Side note, I would love to see a game in San Diego.
I'm in SD right now, 5 min from the stadium. Was going to go tonight to see the A's but my son feels like crap after eating two doubles from In n Out (who knew that was a bad idea?), so we're going Thursday against the Rockies. It's a nice park.
That Chiefs story is why I don’t a lot of weight on the original intent. Well it appears that the intent was pure, if you will, that no longer matters since they have handled everything through stereotypes since.
The logo they use in their very first season in KC makes me question that story anyway.
Is an arrowhead as a mascot that bad? And I love the name of the stadium, I hope they never change that.
Im referring to everything in the story—the chop, the guy on the horse, and yes, the arrowhead. As bad as Wahoo? No. But weaponry images portray an image. Anyway, my point was that the team has been native since day 2 so I don’t know that the intention on day 1 matters.
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how can you be ok with war paint retiring but still fail to see the problem with the team name? it's all part of the same parcel.
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I see your point and I guess I could have been more accurate by saying "quite a large percentage" instead of "most". Of course, the exact figure or even a close approximation is not available, but it you read widely on, and follow current event related to Native Americans and explored some of their websites, what I said I strongly believe would be verified. But rather than take my word for it, if anyone cares, they might do that research on their own! But alas, the average person gets their "information" from headlines, brief tweets, FB nonsense, and the like. Fewer and fewer people actually do research, read full articles, etc.
The word "Chief" technically refers to the leader of any group of people but, as well all likely well known, the way it is used, especially as a sports name, is related to Native Americans. And ask a Native American what he or she thinks of using the word "Chief" that way and they are likely to respond, "So do you use the work n***** to describe something related to a black person?" They really are similar words that way. It's REALLY not cool to refer to an Indian as "chief" because historically it has been similar to calling a black person "n*****".
I would like to support a name change to the Weasels. Or, Dickwads.
Tools would be acceptable, also.
@darwinstheory
Am I right or am I right?
/s
Name Scrutiny Extends From Redskins To Chiefs, But Kansas City’s Mascot Has A Different Origin Story
With Washington’s NFL team officially changing its nickname from the Redskins, Kansas City’s team name of the Chiefs has come under scrutiny.
That name, however, was not derived from Native Americans. The Chiefs were named after former Kansas City mayor H. Roe Bartle, who helped the city land a pro football team in the early 1960s.
The franchise, of course, has adopted Native American themes since then. Fans — some dressed in Native American attire — do the tomahawk chop in Arrowhead Stadium while Warpaint the horse gallops after touchdowns.
One can make a strong case that those franchise staples offensively depict Native Americans as “savages” and should be changed.
The mere nickname, though, has more innocuous roots. According to the Chiefs media guide, the Chiefs moniker was selected in honor of Bartle, who helped convince Lamar Hunt to move the Dallas Texans to Kansas City, as part of a name-the-team contest.
Bartle, who was nearing the end of his second and final term as mayor when he persuaded Hunt, had tried to land pro football in Kansas City at least two other times during the AFL days.
The mayor was nicknamed “the Chief” not only because of his 6-3, 300-pound-plus girth, but also his work with the Boy Scouts of America.
After serving in the military during World War I and getting his law degree from the University of Chattanooga, Bartle started as a scout executive in Wyoming, following a training session in Kansas City. The number of scouts in his Wyoming area grew tenfold.
After Bartle and Hunt initially met in Dallas, only Bartle and his chauffeur knew that Hunt was scouting the Kansas City location because he didn’t want to compete with the Dallas Cowboys for fans.
Hunt surreptitiously checked into Kansas City’s Muehlebach Hotel under an assumed name, and when Bartle had to introduce him, he called him “Mr. Lamar,” according to Matt Fulks’ 100 Things Chiefs Fans Should Know & Do Before They Die.
(Disclosure: I am an editor at Triumph Books, the publisher of 100 Things Chiefs Fans Should Know & Do Before They Die.)
Bartle’s two four-year, mayoral terms ended in 1963. Hunt officially announced his team was moving from Dallas to Kansas City that year, and the Chiefs name was established in May.
During the Chiefs’ franchise history, their Native American traditions have come under scrutiny as well.
In 1992 the team stopped playing the tomahawk chop war chant at its home games. Fans, however, still sang the tune and did the arm motion before the franchise reinstituted it shortly thereafter.
Vahe Gregorian, the columnist for The Kansas City Star, suggested rebranding the Chiefs name as a way to memorialize the six Kansas City firefighters who died in an explosion in 1988.
And the City of Fountains actually has a prominent fountain located at the south end of Penn Valley Park, which features two bronze sculptures of firefighters.
Less than two miles from that fountain is Bartle Hall. The major convention center in downtown Kansas City, Mo. is named in honor of the Chief who passed away on May 9, 1974.
And I agree, stereotypes are very harmful to communities.
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That jealously doesn't look very good on him does it? I'm Irish as well. But I have too many ND related items to afford them to change their name!
love to see a game in San Diego. Gorgeous stadium.
2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin