Swedish Professor Johan Giesecke has given a follow-up interview to the main Swedish broadsheet, Svenska Dagbladet, in which he responds to Professor Neil Ferguson’s interview on UnHerd: “I know [Ferguson] a little and he is normally quite arrogant, but I have never seen him as tense and nervous as during that interview,” he said.
Giesecke stands by his fundamentally different assessment of the threat of the Covid-19 threat:
Ferguson modified quite a few of the straightforward statements [from his report], but still seems to think that the lethality is somewhere at just under one percent, while I think it is actually much lower, perhaps as low as 0.1%.
- JOHAN GIESECKE
He flatly rejects Professor Ferguson’s prediction that deaths in Sweden will continue to rise.
No, on the contrary, I think the number will go down — although it may tick up slightly when we get an outbreak in West Götaland or Skåne [provinces of Sweden that have so far been less badly affected].
- JOHAN GIESECKE
Challenged on the apparent success of New Zealand in eliminating the virus completely, with a highly interventionist approach, Professor Giesecke asked whether that will really look like success in the long term:
Yes, it seems they have [suppressed the virus completely]. But what are they going to do now? To keep the country virus free, they will have to keep their borders closed. Everyone travelling in must be quarantined for 14 days before being admitted to the country, and if no good vaccine arrives, New Zealand will have to keep that quarantine for a long time. A very long time…
- JOHAN GIESECKE
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Why would anyone want to go to one of those sites? Fuck those people, at this point.
Confirmation bias, branded and bottled.
Not sure what you are saying there, but people who comment below new stories on social media and on libertarian / conservative sites are not anything I want to read at this point. I certainly don't want to read them from sites that are specifically liberal, either.
I barely want to see the comments many days on the message board of a rock band when it comes to politics, never mind sites where that is the sole purpose for their existing....to promote their political agendas.
It turns out three of them did have preexisting conditions: one had suffered another mild stroke previous to Co-Vid. One was discovered to have previously undiagnosed diabetes while being treated for Covid, another had hypertension and hyperlipidemia.Two of them said what I suggested earlier, based on prior reading -- they delayed going to hospital with stroke symptoms because of coVid fears.
Remarkably, when interviewed on NPR this morning and asked about underlying conditions connected to these cases, the doctor flat out LIED and said NO. So, I go to the letter mentioned on NPR to read his report myself, simply out of curiosity, and see facts in his own report that counter the LIE he told on the radio. Unbelievable.
There is a footnote in the letter regarding a 5% incidence of related strokes in Wuhan. Makes me wonder about lies being told everywhere.
That is untrue. Dr Makko (spelling?) did not lie. He was speaking about the 7x increase in stroke occurance that's been observed, and making a general assessment that overall, they did not have the expected usual underlying conditions that would precede a severe stroke. Your desire to see the media as inherently dishonest and alarmist is skewing your perception. It's one thing to distrust the media, but you should take a breathe and reassess before you throw medical professionals under the bus.
40% = 5, not 4.8, remember? 7x, he says (out of no baseline number provided) "About half" he says (of no total patients given)
Statistics never tell the whole story, and they mostly serve to confuse average people who don't know how to question them. And to @oftenreading, you're right, I forgot to extrapolate to the population at large in my denominator in my original post on this issue.
If 3/5 in the report I link where preexisting conditions DO exist is extrapolated to the "about half" he discusses in this article -- does that equal the 5% Wuhan reports? Can we go there instead of confusing everyone?
And it is absolutely true when he said NO on preexisting conditions.
I'm not throwing him under the bus. He could just tell America that there are unknown numbers of you walking around with diabetes and don't even know it. If you had a stroke before, you might have another one. Get your blood pressure under control. Forget CoVid, and go to the emergency room at the first sign of a stroke.
The discussion makes it seem like half the people who get CoVid will have a stroke, and it's just not fucking true.
I have one doctor, one, whom I trust with my life. He helped me beat cancer, after a previous doctor ignored my reported, and well-known, obvious symptoms of it for years. She even missed the damned lump in my neck, for Chist sake, when she checked my lymph nodes on a routine exam.
You know the first thing this trusted doctor told me every time I had to make a treatment decision? "There are no guarantees in medicine."
Ok, so I listened and transcribed the relevant portion so that those who might be following along can have an accurate view...
His exact words were:
"We saw a 7x increase in the number of patients in their 30s and 40s who were presenting with severe strokes, and those patients did not have many (note, he didn't say "any") of the typical risk factors we worry about for stroke. This immediately alerted us that it's likely the disease has a component that's causing clots and potentially putting people at increased risk for stroke, but also other diseases caused by clots... During the peak of the surge of Coronavirus in NYC we saw a doubling of all of the strokes, overall that we saw, and what we noticed was that over half of the patients were positive for COVID-19, and those patients behaved very different, looked very different than the normal stroke population. They looked younger, they were more likely to be men, things that made us realize it appears very strongly that there's an association between Coronavirus and having these strokes and forming these blood clots. Interviewer: Have you seen enough such patients to be sure that this isn't just a coincidence? We have. So, our initial urgent communication to the NEJM, which has just come out, was more of an alert, it was only 5 patients that were very young, but it was such a stark contrast that it drew our attention. We've now analysed all of the strokes seen over that period and there's clearly a strong association identified."
Now, why I bothered to do that, and this is not meant personally toward you alone, but more generally toward an attitude expressed here recently to which you seem to be a party...
The criticism is always put forward that the media should just give the facts and not interpretations. It's the interpretations that verge into opinion and people get all up in arms over biased media. But this right here shows the folly in that, you heard a report that gives the facts (as known) and you provided your own (incorrect) interpretation of what was being said according to your own confirmation biases. So the media is damned if they do and damned if they don't and the truth is lost in the mix either way?
The discussion, in no way, made it sound like half the people who get Covid will have a stroke. The discussion made it sound like half the people who had a stroke had Covid, and that's a HUGE difference.
You said yourself that people don't understand the significance of statistics, so do we want the media to interpret the data for us, or do we not?
U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests
Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Sweden is shutting down bars and restaurants where people defied social distancing guidelines
Officials in Sweden ordered five Stockholm bars and restaurants to close on Sunday after the establishments failed to follow social distancing guidelines.
Restaurants can still provide table service, but tables have to be spaced 6 feet apart to keep up with government social distancing guidelines. According to AFP, some Stockholm bars defied those guidelines over the weekend and were forced to close because of overcrowding.
Stockholm health official Per Follin told news agency TT, that four of the five bars and restaurants that were forced to close were located in Sodermalm, a trendy and bustling neighborhood of the city.
"The main problem was overcrowding, both inside the premises and outdoors," he said, according to AFP. He said that the establishments will be closed until further notice.
Authorities announced last week that they were increasing measures to enforce social distancing guidelines and that gatherings of more than 50 people have been banned.
While Sweden has faced criticism over having far more deaths from the virus than its Nordic neighbors, the country's goal with limited restrictions is to reach herd immunity, meaning the majority of the population would become immune to COVID-19 through either having the virus or through a vaccine. At the moment, it's unknown if antibodies from the virus give full immunity or how long they last.
Karin Ulrika Olofsdotter, Sweden's ambassador to the US, told NPR that despite no scientific evidence, she believes herd immunity will prove to be successful.
"About 30% of people in Stockholm have reached a level of immunity," she said. "We could reach herd immunity in the capital as early as next month."
Live on the opposite coast. And no. I was playing "fyra i rad" and drinking wine at a friends flat.
So, not practicing social distancing voluntarily? Same friend you went to lunch with or a different one?
Different one.
I'm sure hoping you keep 6 feet away from your family if you have any.
social distancing at all costs or you are part of the problem. Am I right?
I haven't seen anyone who doesn't live in my home socially in 6 weeks. You'll find that probably more than 90% of the people posting in this thread will say the same.
The rich part is that one of your Johan Savior Giesecke's biggest defenses of Sweden's lax regulations is the high level of Swedish compliance with voluntary recommendations. You've even defended this "compliance", while not complying.
But I sure hope you keep 6 feet away from everyone inside your home also right?
I mean we have to beat this? So, you are keeping 6 feet away from your wife, brothers/sisters, children etc?
I've not seen a mandate or suggestion anywhere to maintain distance from those in your household.
Have you seen anyone say you are allowed to visit a restaurant or a bar?
Certainly not in the US
But here's my secret Cap,
I don't live in the US.
Understood. But you attempted to justify apparently violating even the more relaxed guidelines of your country by saying that others should be social distancing from people in their own household, which is not something that any country in the world requires or recommends. The ability to go to a bar or restaurant while maintaining social distancing is a separate issue.
I am not violating anything. So your "apparently" is wrong.
So anyone blaming me for violating whatever and for not taking steps enough to stop the spread, should look at their own steps they are taking that are risking spreading the virus. That was my point.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Incredibly fast to pump out a vaccine. Crazy if this comes out this early and actually works.
I thought I read about another 1-2 places that said somewhat similar things, though they thought more like Dec/Jan for emergency use and spring 2021 for regular. This moves the time table up significantly. I knew these vaccines would be discovered and approved way earlier than 12-18 months. That was just talking normal vaccines in an abnormal world.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Incredibly fast to pump out a vaccine. Crazy if this comes out this early and actually works.
I thought I read about another 1-2 places that said somewhat similar things, though they thought more like Dec/Jan for emergency use and spring 2021 for regular. This moves the time table up significantly. I knew these vaccines would be discovered and approved way earlier than 12-18 months. That was just talking normal vaccines in an abnormal world.
Good for them.
Oxford is the only other one I've seen touting this timeline. Like you said, most are estimating very late this year or early next.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
I knew these vaccines would be discovered and approved way earlier than 12-18 months. That was just talking normal vaccines in an abnormal world.
What normal vaccines take 12-18 months to develop? I _believe_ Giesecke said that 18 months would pretty much be a world record in getting a vaccine out. I'm no vaccine expert, what normal vaccines take 12-18 months?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
Apparently some BC schools have been open, for the children of essential workers, with what sound to be a lot of changes in how the programming is delivered.
BC is currently considering how they will be reopening for all students. I had assumed that schools would not reopen this academic year, but it looks like there is a strong possibility of this in several provinces by the end of May.
VICTORIA — British Columbia's education minister says he wants to learn from other provinces and countries like New Zealand before starting to reopen schools, but no plans will be announced until the health and safety of staff and students are fully addressed.
Rob Fleming said Tuesday scenarios are being considered for what would be a controlled and measured return to classrooms, though timelines have not been set.
Officials are also discussing opportunities for students who may need help from speech and language pathologists for an hour or two a day at school to allow some respite for parents, he said.
He said 23,000 computers and devices have been loaned to families. Printed material and flash drives have also been delivered to students in remote areas without access to the internet.
Several thousand children whose parents are essential service workers are attending schools and there are plans to accommodate more of them, Fleming said.
"We will continue taking direction from the provincial health officer and from the premier and cabinet on when and how schools would be able to increase the number of students receiving in-class instruction and what a phased approach would look like," he said.
Schools are set to reopen after more than a month in New Zealand on Wednesday for most students whose parents need to return to work. Fleming said the province is monitoring that country for its own plan.
"This will help us in B.C. inform an evidence-based plan that minimizes the risk for COVID-19 transmission," he said, adding that data from updated modelling on the pandemic expected to be released on Friday will be considered.
"We will return to regular school life down the road and that road will be sooner and shorter if we continue to act together and act now with measures to prevent the further spread of COVID-19."
Quebec, which has been hardest hit by COVID-19, is reopening some primary schools in mid-May. Ontario expects to keep schools closed until at least the end of May, but Premier Doug Ford has said that will depend on whether the virus remains a threat.
Fleming said B.C. will announce plans only after considering what personal protective equipment and handwashing stations are available, and the number of students who would be permitted to attend school at any given time.
Stephanie Higginson, president of the B.C. School Trustees Association, said parents of younger children in particular need a break as they try to provide care and be teachers.
"Remember that what you're doing is good enough and this is happening to (our children) too. My nine-year-old reminds me of that sometimes in ways that I don't actually see until about three hours later. And then I remember why he's acting the way he is."
Most of the students attending school in B.C. are in elementary grades.
The highest priority has been given to students whose parents work in essential jobs including health care, social services and law enforcement.
Grocery store workers and those in transportation, agriculture and sanitation jobs are part of the second category of essential workers whose kids are provided a child-care space in school.
Ritinder Matthew, a spokeswoman for the Surrey School District, said a fourth elementary school opened this week to accommodate Grades 1 to 7 students.
"We are prepared to open more sites if necessary," Matthew said.
Children from one family are kept together at the schools, which have 138 students who are practising physical distancing, Matthew said. Support workers and substitute teachers are guiding activities while teachers provide online learning for students at home.
— By Camille Bains in Vancouver.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
'So what?': Bolsonaro shrugs off Brazil's rising coronavirus death toll
More than 5,000 Brazilians have lost their lives to the coronavirus – even more people than in China, if its official statistics are to be believed.
But on Tuesday night Brazil’s president shrugged off the news. “So what?” Jair Bolsonaro told reporters when asked about the record 474 deaths that day. “I’m sorry. What do you want me to do?”
Bolsonaro’s 11-word response – the latest in a series of remarks belittling the pandemic – sparked immediate fury. One newspaper, the Estado de Minas, stamped the president’s words on to a black front page beside Brazil’s death toll: 5,017.
“Bolsonaro isn’t just an awful politician and a bad president, he’s a despicable human being,” tweeted Marcelo Freixo, a leftwing opponent.
“My name’s Messiah,” Bolsonaro also told reporters on Tuesday, in reference to his second name, Messias. “But I can’t work miracles.”
A wave of disgust swept over social media as word of the president’s comments spread. “A sociopath,” tweeted the musician Nando Moura. “What a tragedy,” wrote the journalist Sônia Bridi.
“It’s a mockery. An insult. It is intolerable,” tweeted Mariliz Pereira Jorge, a scriptwriter and commentator.
Since Brazil confirmed its first case on 26 February, Bolsonaro has continually minimised the pandemic. Photograph: Evaristo Sa/AFP via Getty Images
Another critic superimposed Bolsonaro’s words on to a photograph of the muddy graves into which scores of Brazilian bodies are being deposited each day.
“Bolsonaro wants to turn Brazil into the Republic of So What,” the political commentator Bernardo Mello Franco wrote in his column on Wednesday.
The president’s son Carlos Bolsonaro claimed on Twitter that his father’s comments were being distorted by liberal journalists seeking to destroy his reputation.
Last week, Bolsonaro’s popular justice minister, Sérgio Moro, resigned from government, partly as a result of the president’s anti-scientific stance on Covid-19, according to one person who knows him.
There is no escaping the scale of the tragedy unfolding in Brazil, with daily images of gravediggers in protective suits emerging from some of the worst-hit cities, including Rio de Janeiro, São Paulo, Recife and Manaus.
As Bolsonaro made his remarks, newspapers and television programmes filled with stories about the mothers, fathers, sons and daughters losing their lives to the pandemic.
In Rio, the victims included Ana Maria, a 56-year-old nursing assistant who had worked in one of the city’s biggest public hospitals and was laid to rest on Tuesday by men in white suits.
“She gave everything to her job until the very end,” her daughter Taina told Associated Press.
In Vila Operária, a redbrick favela to the north of Rio, at least 10 residents were reported to have died, including four members of the same family.
Health specialists fear Covid-19 – which is moving into poor regions, having initially affected middle- and upper-class areas – could wreak havoc on Brazil’s most deprived and vulnerable communities.
“I’m scared,” Josiete Pereira do Carmo, who lost her mother and three uncles, told one local TV network. “We can’t lose anyone else.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
“It kind of emphasizes the importance of avoiding small confined spaces,” Dr. Marr said.
Would a classroom of 28 students and myself be considered a small confined space?
You should be more worried about being in the lunchroom with your colleague than in the classroom. G says.
How about when I am on duty in a lunchroom with 400 students?
Food fight!!!!
No, really, all kidding aside. I work at a College and we are beginning early stage planning for fall semester and expecting significant reduction in on-campus activity and possibly down to 25% of students from classes that must meet in person (trade & tech, chem, bio, etc.) in a room at a time. Current guidance is no more than 10 people for gatherings so we are basing it off of that right now and determining how we set-up the rooms and which rooms can even be used. After that it comes down to points of access and pre and post access disinfecting and sanitizing for the next group. Hopefully, we have a lot more information and guidance before August, but if not we'll at least have a game plan.
Greece move to stage number 2 on Monday..small shops and hair salons will open..the mask on those places and in the public transport IS obligatory..schools on 11th of month and bar-restauranrs 1st of June.. now are the hards..
Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015. Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022 EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.
I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
'So what?': Bolsonaro shrugs off Brazil's rising coronavirus death toll
More than 5,000 Brazilians have lost their lives to the coronavirus – even more people than in China, if its official statistics are to be believed.
But on Tuesday night Brazil’s president shrugged off the news. “So what?” Jair Bolsonaro told reporters when asked about the record 474 deaths that day. “I’m sorry. What do you want me to do?”
Bolsonaro’s 11-word response – the latest in a series of remarks belittling the pandemic – sparked immediate fury. One newspaper, the Estado de Minas, stamped the president’s words on to a black front page beside Brazil’s death toll: 5,017.
“Bolsonaro isn’t just an awful politician and a bad president, he’s a despicable human being,” tweeted Marcelo Freixo, a leftwing opponent.
“My name’s Messiah,” Bolsonaro also told reporters on Tuesday, in reference to his second name, Messias. “But I can’t work miracles.”
A wave of disgust swept over social media as word of the president’s comments spread. “A sociopath,” tweeted the musician Nando Moura. “What a tragedy,” wrote the journalist Sônia Bridi.
“It’s a mockery. An insult. It is intolerable,” tweeted Mariliz Pereira Jorge, a scriptwriter and commentator.
Since Brazil confirmed its first case on 26 February, Bolsonaro has continually minimised the pandemic. Photograph: Evaristo Sa/AFP via Getty Images
Another critic superimposed Bolsonaro’s words on to a photograph of the muddy graves into which scores of Brazilian bodies are being deposited each day.
“Bolsonaro wants to turn Brazil into the Republic of So What,” the political commentator Bernardo Mello Franco wrote in his column on Wednesday.
The president’s son Carlos Bolsonaro claimed on Twitter that his father’s comments were being distorted by liberal journalists seeking to destroy his reputation.
Last week, Bolsonaro’s popular justice minister, Sérgio Moro, resigned from government, partly as a result of the president’s anti-scientific stance on Covid-19, according to one person who knows him.
There is no escaping the scale of the tragedy unfolding in Brazil, with daily images of gravediggers in protective suits emerging from some of the worst-hit cities, including Rio de Janeiro, São Paulo, Recife and Manaus.
As Bolsonaro made his remarks, newspapers and television programmes filled with stories about the mothers, fathers, sons and daughters losing their lives to the pandemic.
In Rio, the victims included Ana Maria, a 56-year-old nursing assistant who had worked in one of the city’s biggest public hospitals and was laid to rest on Tuesday by men in white suits.
“She gave everything to her job until the very end,” her daughter Taina told Associated Press.
In Vila Operária, a redbrick favela to the north of Rio, at least 10 residents were reported to have died, including four members of the same family.
Health specialists fear Covid-19 – which is moving into poor regions, having initially affected middle- and upper-class areas – could wreak havoc on Brazil’s most deprived and vulnerable communities.
“I’m scared,” Josiete Pereira do Carmo, who lost her mother and three uncles, told one local TV network. “We can’t lose anyone else.
Well, Team Trump Treason did say, and I'm paraphrasing, when asked if he would wear a mask, "No. No. I can't see wearing a mask when I sit in the Oval Office, at the resolute desk, the resolute desk. That mighty resolute desk, when I meet with prime ministers, world leaders, a great many of them, and dictators." The fucking guy brags, with a smirk on his face, during a pandemic, about not wearing a mask and MEETING WITH DICTATORS. But hey, Florida is going to ban travel from Brazil, so there is that.
Interesting findings regarding the airborne qualities of the virus. It looks like we should know within a week or two if the airborne virus particles are infectious or not. Let's hope not.
“It kind of emphasizes the importance of avoiding small confined spaces,” Dr. Marr said.
Would a classroom of 28 students and myself be considered a small confined space?
You should be more worried about being in the lunchroom with your colleague than in the classroom. G says.
How about when I am on duty in a lunchroom with 400 students?
Food fight!!!!
No, really, all kidding aside. I work at a College and we are beginning early stage planning for fall semester and expecting significant reduction in on-campus activity and possibly down to 25% of students from classes that must meet in person (trade & tech, chem, bio, etc.) in a room at a time. Current guidance is no more than 10 people for gatherings so we are basing it off of that right now and determining how we set-up the rooms and which rooms can even be used. After that it comes down to points of access and pre and post access disinfecting and sanitizing for the next group. Hopefully, we have a lot more information and guidance before August, but if not we'll at least have a game plan.
I have no clue how any of that would work in a public school setting.
Comments
Swedish Professor Johan Giesecke has given a follow-up interview to the main Swedish broadsheet, Svenska Dagbladet, in which he responds to Professor Neil Ferguson’s interview on UnHerd: “I know [Ferguson] a little and he is normally quite arrogant, but I have never seen him as tense and nervous as during that interview,” he said.
Giesecke stands by his fundamentally different assessment of the threat of the Covid-19 threat:
He flatly rejects Professor Ferguson’s prediction that deaths in Sweden will continue to rise.
Challenged on the apparent success of New Zealand in eliminating the virus completely, with a highly interventionist approach, Professor Giesecke asked whether that will really look like success in the long term:
His exact words were:
"We saw a 7x increase in the number of patients in their 30s and 40s who were presenting with severe strokes, and those patients did not have many (note, he didn't say "any") of the typical risk factors we worry about for stroke. This immediately alerted us that it's likely the disease has a component that's causing clots and potentially putting people at increased risk for stroke, but also other diseases caused by clots... During the peak of the surge of Coronavirus in NYC we saw a doubling of all of the strokes, overall that we saw, and what we noticed was that over half of the patients were positive for COVID-19, and those patients behaved very different, looked very different than the normal stroke population. They looked younger, they were more likely to be men, things that made us realize it appears very strongly that there's an association between Coronavirus and having these strokes and forming these blood clots.
Interviewer: Have you seen enough such patients to be sure that this isn't just a coincidence?
We have. So, our initial urgent communication to the NEJM, which has just come out, was more of an alert, it was only 5 patients that were very young, but it was such a stark contrast that it drew our attention. We've now analysed all of the strokes seen over that period and there's clearly a strong association identified."
Now, why I bothered to do that, and this is not meant personally toward you alone, but more generally toward an attitude expressed here recently to which you seem to be a party...
The criticism is always put forward that the media should just give the facts and not interpretations. It's the interpretations that verge into opinion and people get all up in arms over biased media. But this right here shows the folly in that, you heard a report that gives the facts (as known) and you provided your own (incorrect) interpretation of what was being said according to your own confirmation biases. So the media is damned if they do and damned if they don't and the truth is lost in the mix either way?
The discussion, in no way, made it sound like half the people who get Covid will have a stroke. The discussion made it sound like half the people who had a stroke had Covid, and that's a HUGE difference.
You said yourself that people don't understand the significance of statistics, so do we want the media to interpret the data for us, or do we not?
Incredibly fast to pump out a vaccine. Crazy if this comes out this early and actually works.
U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests
Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/28/us/coronavirus-death-toll-total.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage
Would a classroom of 28 students and myself be considered a small confined space?
So anyone blaming me for violating whatever and for not taking steps enough to stop the spread, should look at their own steps they are taking that are risking spreading the virus. That was my point.
Good for them.
BC is currently considering how they will be reopening for all students. I had assumed that schools would not reopen this academic year, but it looks like there is a strong possibility of this in several provinces by the end of May.
https://www.timescolonist.com/b-c-wants-to-learn-from-new-zealand-other-provinces-before-opening-schools-1.24125824
VICTORIA — British Columbia's education minister says he wants to learn from other provinces and countries like New Zealand before starting to reopen schools, but no plans will be announced until the health and safety of staff and students are fully addressed.
Rob Fleming said Tuesday scenarios are being considered for what would be a controlled and measured return to classrooms, though timelines have not been set.
He said 23,000 computers and devices have been loaned to families. Printed material and flash drives have also been delivered to students in remote areas without access to the internet.
Several thousand children whose parents are essential service workers are attending schools and there are plans to accommodate more of them, Fleming said.
"We will continue taking direction from the provincial health officer and from the premier and cabinet on when and how schools would be able to increase the number of students receiving in-class instruction and what a phased approach would look like," he said.
Schools are set to reopen after more than a month in New Zealand on Wednesday for most students whose parents need to return to work. Fleming said the province is monitoring that country for its own plan.
"This will help us in B.C. inform an evidence-based plan that minimizes the risk for COVID-19 transmission," he said, adding that data from updated modelling on the pandemic expected to be released on Friday will be considered.
"We will return to regular school life down the road and that road will be sooner and shorter if we continue to act together and act now with measures to prevent the further spread of COVID-19."
Quebec, which has been hardest hit by COVID-19, is reopening some primary schools in mid-May. Ontario expects to keep schools closed until at least the end of May, but Premier Doug Ford has said that will depend on whether the virus remains a threat.
Fleming said B.C. will announce plans only after considering what personal protective equipment and handwashing stations are available, and the number of students who would be permitted to attend school at any given time.
Stephanie Higginson, president of the B.C. School Trustees Association, said parents of younger children in particular need a break as they try to provide care and be teachers.
"Remember that what you're doing is good enough and this is happening to (our children) too. My nine-year-old reminds me of that sometimes in ways that I don't actually see until about three hours later. And then I remember why he's acting the way he is."
Most of the students attending school in B.C. are in elementary grades.
The highest priority has been given to students whose parents work in essential jobs including health care, social services and law enforcement.
Grocery store workers and those in transportation, agriculture and sanitation jobs are part of the second category of essential workers whose kids are provided a child-care space in school.
Ritinder Matthew, a spokeswoman for the Surrey School District, said a fourth elementary school opened this week to accommodate Grades 1 to 7 students.
"We are prepared to open more sites if necessary," Matthew said.
Children from one family are kept together at the schools, which have 138 students who are practising physical distancing, Matthew said. Support workers and substitute teachers are guiding activities while teachers provide online learning for students at home.
— By Camille Bains in Vancouver.
Jarred says it’s a total success 58k dead and this is success damn how low is the bar for accomplishments? What will he say once we hit 100k deaths? Total victory?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/29/so-what-bolsonaro-shrugs-off-brazil-rising-coronavirus-death-toll
'So what?': Bolsonaro shrugs off Brazil's rising coronavirus death toll
More than 5,000 Brazilians have lost their lives to the coronavirus – even more people than in China, if its official statistics are to be believed.
But on Tuesday night Brazil’s president shrugged off the news. “So what?” Jair Bolsonaro told reporters when asked about the record 474 deaths that day. “I’m sorry. What do you want me to do?”
Bolsonaro’s 11-word response – the latest in a series of remarks belittling the pandemic – sparked immediate fury. One newspaper, the Estado de Minas, stamped the president’s words on to a black front page beside Brazil’s death toll: 5,017.
“Bolsonaro isn’t just an awful politician and a bad president, he’s a despicable human being,” tweeted Marcelo Freixo, a leftwing opponent.
“My name’s Messiah,” Bolsonaro also told reporters on Tuesday, in reference to his second name, Messias. “But I can’t work miracles.”
A wave of disgust swept over social media as word of the president’s comments spread. “A sociopath,” tweeted the musician Nando Moura. “What a tragedy,” wrote the journalist Sônia Bridi.
“It’s a mockery. An insult. It is intolerable,” tweeted Mariliz Pereira Jorge, a scriptwriter and commentator.
Another critic superimposed Bolsonaro’s words on to a photograph of the muddy graves into which scores of Brazilian bodies are being deposited each day.
“Bolsonaro wants to turn Brazil into the Republic of So What,” the political commentator Bernardo Mello Franco wrote in his column on Wednesday.
The president’s son Carlos Bolsonaro claimed on Twitter that his father’s comments were being distorted by liberal journalists seeking to destroy his reputation.
Since Brazil confirmed its first coronavirus case on 26 February, Bolsonaro has continually minimised the pandemic, rejecting media “hysteria” over its dangers and suggesting Brazilians could swim in excrement and emerge unscathed.
The Trump-admiring populist has also purposefully undermined social distancing guidelines, mingling with supporters and sacking his health minister on 16 April after he publicly challenged the president’s behaviour.
There is no escaping the scale of the tragedy unfolding in Brazil, with daily images of gravediggers in protective suits emerging from some of the worst-hit cities, including Rio de Janeiro, São Paulo, Recife and Manaus.
As Bolsonaro made his remarks, newspapers and television programmes filled with stories about the mothers, fathers, sons and daughters losing their lives to the pandemic.
In Rio, the victims included Ana Maria, a 56-year-old nursing assistant who had worked in one of the city’s biggest public hospitals and was laid to rest on Tuesday by men in white suits.
“She gave everything to her job until the very end,” her daughter Taina told Associated Press.
In Vila Operária, a redbrick favela to the north of Rio, at least 10 residents were reported to have died, including four members of the same family.
Health specialists fear Covid-19 – which is moving into poor regions, having initially affected middle- and upper-class areas – could wreak havoc on Brazil’s most deprived and vulnerable communities.
“I’m scared,” Josiete Pereira do Carmo, who lost her mother and three uncles, told one local TV network. “We can’t lose anyone else.
No, really, all kidding aside. I work at a College and we are beginning early stage planning for fall semester and expecting significant reduction in on-campus activity and possibly down to 25% of students from classes that must meet in person (trade & tech, chem, bio, etc.) in a room at a time. Current guidance is no more than 10 people for gatherings so we are basing it off of that right now and determining how we set-up the rooms and which rooms can even be used. After that it comes down to points of access and pre and post access disinfecting and sanitizing for the next group. Hopefully, we have a lot more information and guidance before August, but if not we'll at least have a game plan.
Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.
I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/turkeys-erdogan-supports-cleric-who-says-homosexuality-brings-disease-626207
Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.
I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
now are the hards..
Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.
I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©