Not much very much difference at all between "may never get a vaccine, can't stay closed forever, might as well open up" And "Vaccine won't come for a long time, can't be closed until it does, might as well never close"
Not much very much difference at all between "may never get a vaccine, can't stay closed forever, might as well open up" And "Vaccine won't come for a long time, can't be closed until it does, might as well never close"
First part of the sentence: a gigantic difference.
The second part: Don't know what you bake into "closed" and "opened up" and not, so hard determine the difference.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Not much very much difference at all between "may never get a vaccine, can't stay closed forever, might as well open up" And "Vaccine won't come for a long time, can't be closed until it does, might as well never close"
First part of the sentence: a gigantic difference.
The second part: Don't know what you bake into "closed" and "opened up" and not, so hard determine the difference.
You keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better.
I wouldn't throw the first stone. You and I are as guilty here as anyone else.
That said, you do make a good point. And during this stressful time (at least speaking for myself- I'm highly stressed due to being at risk for COVID-19), it makes more sense for us to be informative, supportive, and empathetic here, not argumentative. I'll try to do better that way. I hope we all can.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I wouldn't throw the first stone. You and I are as guilty here as anyone else.
That said, you do make a good point. And during this stressful time (at least speaking for myself- I'm highly stressed due to being at risk for COVID-19), it makes more sense for us to be informative, supportive, and empathetic here, not argumentative. I'll try to do better that way. I hope we all can.
It wasn't terribly serious. Hopefully the subsequent posts show that.
I wouldn't throw the first stone. You and I are as guilty here as anyone else.
That said, you do make a good point. And during this stressful time (at least speaking for myself- I'm highly stressed due to being at risk for COVID-19), it makes more sense for us to be informative, supportive, and empathetic here, not argumentative. I'll try to do better that way. I hope we all can.
It wasn't terribly serious. Hopefully the subsequent posts show that.
No worries, pjl. If anything, I'm reminding myself not to be an a-hole on these threads. It's a tough time we're facing. I wish everyone here the best and hope we all get through this tough time.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
So after the weak protest was dispersed because no one could find a place to park, all that was left was this angry dude who sped around the neighborhood, honking his horn and otherwise behaving like a douchelord.
(Photo courtesy of a neighbor)
My town and the city that borders us have blocked street parking for weeks now to keep ignoramuses from overcrowding the beaches.
So apparently, these ignoramuses are going to make this a weekly thing (every Thursday). And most of them aren't even from the commonwealth. Look at the license plate.
So after the weak protest was dispersed because no one could find a place to park, all that was left was this angry dude who sped around the neighborhood, honking his horn and otherwise behaving like a douchelord.
(Photo courtesy of a neighbor)
My town and the city that borders us have blocked street parking for weeks now to keep ignoramuses from overcrowding the beaches.
So apparently, these ignoramuses are going to make this a weekly thing (every Thursday). And most of them aren't even from the commonwealth. Look at the license plate.
Build a wall!
There's no "Don't Tread On Me" flag, he's no fucking patriot...
So after the weak protest was dispersed because no one could find a place to park, all that was left was this angry dude who sped around the neighborhood, honking his horn and otherwise behaving like a douchelord.
(Photo courtesy of a neighbor)
My town and the city that borders us have blocked street parking for weeks now to keep ignoramuses from overcrowding the beaches.
So apparently, these ignoramuses are going to make this a weekly thing (every Thursday). And most of them aren't even from the commonwealth. Look at the license plate.
Build a wall!
Where is this? NOVA? That looks like the Potomac but it's hard to see. I can't make out the plate.
So after the weak protest was dispersed because no one could find a place to park, all that was left was this angry dude who sped around the neighborhood, honking his horn and otherwise behaving like a douchelord.
(Photo courtesy of a neighbor)
My town and the city that borders us have blocked street parking for weeks now to keep ignoramuses from overcrowding the beaches.
So apparently, these ignoramuses are going to make this a weekly thing (every Thursday). And most of them aren't even from the commonwealth. Look at the license plate.
Build a wall!
Where is this? NOVA? That looks like the Potomac but it's hard to see. I can't make out the plate.
Massachusetts.
But all the license plates I've seen for these protests of Massachusetts Gov. Charlie Baker (R) in front of his personal home, not the State House (because dickheads), are from New Hampshire.
Half of NJ (hyperbole, I know) works in NYC, or has neighbors who do... the most highly concentrated zone for this shit. If Sweden were right next door they would feel the brunt of that as well.
Being the most densely populated state doesn't help us either. Sweden and nj are in the same ballpark with respect to population but Sweden is approx 23 times bigger than NJ.
I should have read the entire page first. We really need to stop looking at Sweden. They are an isolated nation. They shut their borders and done, they are efficiently locked down and a million times safer than us.
NJ didn’t have that option because by the time we ramped up testing, thanks trump, the virus was embedded in the NYC region.
Sweden isn’t also part of a 25 million region with 3 international airports transporting thousands from Italy and China, with vast immigrant communities within its border
Right. Sweden’s plan may have been crackpot in the US but may end up in the long run the right call for Sweden. Time will ultimately tell. Need to see what happens on the other side when countries start re-opening.
Sweden isnt an island. Its 2 neighbors have a different experience and far lower numbers.
The Netherlands is a little bigger than Sweden at 17 million and has about 4500 fatalities.
California is the world wide covid rock star. They had the earliest cases, huge population and “only” 1700 fatalities.
What is the excess death rate for California for this spring?
I see you've latched onto the Fake News, Fake Hospital reporting bullshit. Hmmm...Google says, based on your previous searches you might enjoy foxnews.com.
Don't know what you are doing now.
But keep it up why don't you.
Everytime someone posts about Covid-19 deaths you are now asking... what about excess death rate...meaning you don;t believe number. Right?
"don't believe number" - what?
There being a lot of cases out there in the world not covered in the numbers out of e.g. hospitals?
Don't see where the fake news/fake hospital/fox news angle comes from regarding that.
But please, elaborate.
Not sure what you are getting at sc with "excess" death rate.
One of the right wing talking points has been people are not dying of covid, that its something else and it's all a liberal conspiracy to scare everyone. The biggest something else is hypertension.
Using NY as an example, in a typical month 225 die from hypertension. In the first month of covid over 9000 NYers died from a combo of covid and hypertension. So obviously the conservatives are trying to obfuscate?
It seems now you are arguing the opposite of that fox news talking point?
When the US beats sweden once in a blue moon at hockey, the fans blame the referee, right? I think there is alot of that going on with the counting process
We should trust California reporting. They locked down earlier than anyone else in NA and a majority of their commuters are in their cars, not packed into trains
It seems easy to figure out why Cali has done so well compared to many other places
Looks to me like a very constructed paradox to get a "smart" tweet out. Don't see what's so interesting about it..?
And who has said "we may never get a vaccin, so we might as well open back up" ?
I've seen several articles that express some doubt about a vaccine. Linked a couple below. The opening-back-up idea flows from that. Can't remember who I've seen say it specifically, but Google away if you're interested.
I agree there is certainly doubt. If science is unable to come up with a vaccine - that will certainly hurt the economy long term. Consumers will be very nervous for their safety and very cautious about spending. Especially in "every man for himself" healthcare countries like the US.
But in my opinion doctors comparing this effort to previous vaccine attempts are not being entirely forthcoming. The efforts of the entire world will be focused on a covid vaccine.
Also it's possible a different form of treatment is possible, like the article suggests. The important point is science deserves time to figure this out before we risk mass victims similar to the spanish flu. Or at least have plans to limit exposure like rapid testing and tracing on a scale the US has never seen
Looks to me like a very constructed paradox to get a "smart" tweet out. Don't see what's so interesting about it..?
And who has said "we may never get a vaccin, so we might as well open back up" ?
I've seen several articles that express some doubt about a vaccine. Linked a couple below. The opening-back-up idea flows from that. Can't remember who I've seen say it specifically, but Google away if you're interested.
I agree there is certainly doubt. If science is unable to come up with a vaccine - that will certainly hurt the economy long term. Consumers will be very nervous for their safety and very cautious about spending. Especially in "every man for himself" healthcare countries like the US.
But in my opinion doctors comparing this effort to previous vaccine attempts are not being entirely forthcoming. The efforts of the entire world will be focused on a covid vaccine.
Also it's possible a different form of treatment is possible, like the article suggests. The important point is science deserves time to figure this out before we risk mass victims similar to the spanish flu. Or at least have plans to limit exposure like rapid testing and tracing on a scale the US has never seen
Yeah, I'm with you on all of this. For a while it seemed like with a vaccine it was only a matter of time. Last couple weeks is when I started seeing people expressing doubt about whether we'd see one at all. I'm certainly hoping the former group is right.
Treatment seems like a really underrated path to me. Everyone is watching that remdesivir trial. If it works, that could come way earlier than a vaccine. Couple that with summer weather and there's a little hope.
So after the weak protest was dispersed because no one could find a place to park, all that was left was this angry dude who sped around the neighborhood, honking his horn and otherwise behaving like a douchelord.
(Photo courtesy of a neighbor)
My town and the city that borders us have blocked street parking for weeks now to keep ignoramuses from overcrowding the beaches.
So apparently, these ignoramuses are going to make this a weekly thing (every Thursday). And most of them aren't even from the commonwealth. Look at the license plate.
Build a wall!
There's no "Don't Tread On Me" flag, he's no fucking patriot...
Not much very much difference at all between "may never get a vaccine, can't stay closed forever, might as well open up" And "Vaccine won't come for a long time, can't be closed until it does, might as well never close"
At the end of the day this is what I feel like we've done. We've helped the hospitals catch their breath but that's about it. But if we start opening up again I think we only bought ourselves 6 weeks and have 2 years until a vaccine (maybe). But the cost of that six weeks was trillions and massive unemployment.
I'm not saying that I disagreed with shutting things down. Did it just delay the inevitable at a steep cost.
I heard something that is pure gossip at this point so I'm asking if anyone knows anything verifiable about this: I was told by someone that if a company outside the US produces a vaccine, that US big pharma wants complete control/ ownership or it won't get distributed here in the U.S. Now PLEASE, I repeat, this is just hearsay and I'm hoping someone hear knows the true scoop. Thanks!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Comments
"may never get a vaccine, can't stay closed forever, might as well open up"
And
"Vaccine won't come for a long time, can't be closed until it does, might as well never close"
/s
The second part: Don't know what you bake into "closed" and "opened up" and not, so hard determine the difference.
No worries, pjl. If anything, I'm reminding myself not to be an a-hole on these threads. It's a tough time we're facing. I wish everyone here the best and hope we all get through this tough time.
Build a wall!
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
But all the license plates I've seen for these protests of Massachusetts Gov. Charlie Baker (R) in front of his personal home, not the State House (because dickheads), are from New Hampshire.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
One of the right wing talking points has been people are not dying of covid, that its something else and it's all a liberal conspiracy to scare everyone. The biggest something else is hypertension.
Using NY as an example, in a typical month 225 die from hypertension. In the first month of covid over 9000 NYers died from a combo of covid and hypertension. So obviously the conservatives are trying to obfuscate?
It seems now you are arguing the opposite of that fox news talking point?
When the US beats sweden once in a blue moon at hockey, the fans blame the referee, right? I think there is alot of that going on with the counting process
We should trust California reporting. They locked down earlier than anyone else in NA and a majority of their commuters are in their cars, not packed into trains
It seems easy to figure out why Cali has done so well compared to many other places
I agree there is certainly doubt. If science is unable to come up with a vaccine - that will certainly hurt the economy long term. Consumers will be very nervous for their safety and very cautious about spending. Especially in "every man for himself" healthcare countries like the US.
But in my opinion doctors comparing this effort to previous vaccine attempts are not being entirely forthcoming. The efforts of the entire world will be focused on a covid vaccine.
Also it's possible a different form of treatment is possible, like the article suggests. The important point is science deserves time to figure this out before we risk mass victims similar to the spanish flu. Or at least have plans to limit exposure like rapid testing and tracing on a scale the US has never seen
Treatment seems like a really underrated path to me. Everyone is watching that remdesivir trial. If it works, that could come way earlier than a vaccine. Couple that with summer weather and there's a little hope.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/27/world/europe/coronavirus-vaccine-update-oxford.html
At the end of the day this is what I feel like we've done. We've helped the hospitals catch their breath but that's about it. But if we start opening up again I think we only bought ourselves 6 weeks and have 2 years until a vaccine (maybe). But the cost of that six weeks was trillions and massive unemployment.
I'm not saying that I disagreed with shutting things down. Did it just delay the inevitable at a steep cost.
The Secret Group of Scientists and Billionaires Pushing a Manhattan Project for Covid-19 https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-secret-group-of-scientists-and-billionaires-pushing-trump-on-a-covid-19-plan-11587998993
2008 Tampa - 2013 Buffalo - 2016 Tampa - 2016 Fenway II
Audioslave 2005 MSG