@Spiritual_Chaos, apologies if this was already covered but is there any concern about your hospital systems being overwhelmed? Or is the thought that if you see similar outbreak rates, there is still adequate capacity? Because I could sorta see the argument for this approach if that is covered.
Trump/sports commissioners conferfence call. Full arenas and baseball by August, NFL start in September. Didn’t see it mentioned. Seems somewhat reasonable but I think stadium sized crowds could be too much. I like MLB’s idea of playing in empty stadiums in centralized location til we get a handle on how hard it will hit in the fall.
This isn't going to happen. Until they get a vaccine in place no sane leadership will support this Which means that Trump will leave it up to others to land in the correct spots on this.
Agree about no crowd activities. They could happen.
You think sports with fans are done for 12-18 months?
I sure hope not but I think that until we know if this is going to come back in the fall, as some suspect, I don't think there is a way they open stadiums for leagues. If it takes 12-18 I think we will have to do it without crowds. Or, I could see people who recover being ok to be a part of crowds if they show immunity is carrying. Who knows ....damn this sucks.
Myself?
Im not going to any baseball games, concerts, sporting events in general, for a year. They could open up baseball in July or August, offer $1.00 tickets with a free beer and a hot dog, and there is no way in hell I am going. Same for a concert. Pearl Jam can offer FREE tickets, and I still wont go, until we are in 2021.
Just me.
That’s where I fall no way am I stepping foot in a crowded event..
Trump/sports commissioners conferfence call. Full arenas and baseball by August, NFL start in September. Didn’t see it mentioned. Seems somewhat reasonable but I think stadium sized crowds could be too much. I like MLB’s idea of playing in empty stadiums in centralized location til we get a handle on how hard it will hit in the fall.
This isn't going to happen. Until they get a vaccine in place no sane leadership will support this Which means that Trump will leave it up to others to land in the correct spots on this.
Agree about no crowd activities. They could happen.
You think sports with fans are done for 12-18 months?
I sure hope not but I think that until we know if this is going to come back in the fall, as some suspect, I don't think there is a way they open stadiums for leagues. If it takes 12-18 I think we will have to do it without crowds. Or, I could see people who recover being ok to be a part of crowds if they show immunity is carrying. Who knows ....damn this sucks.
Myself?
Im not going to any baseball games, concerts, sporting events in general, for a year. They could open up baseball in July or August, offer $1.00 tickets with a free beer and a hot dog, and there is no way in hell I am going. Same for a concert. Pearl Jam can offer FREE tickets, and I still wont go, until we are in 2021.
Just me.
Sporting events and concerts are one thing, but how about something like going to the gym that is a daily part of life for many; myself included. I likely won’t feel comfortable going to a gym until there’s a vaccine. That sucks and will likely force me to set something up at home. This virus will change the psyche of so many people on such a large scale.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
thank you for confirming my opinion of you and in fact lowering it considerably with this irrelevant to the current crisis statement.
very ironic considering how superior attitude has been in stating the US or its citizens cant take criticism.
so please , do go out daily and interact with your fellow citizens. You know , following your governments lead on this.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
Right-O mate! And we both sent almost a million men to fight the Nazis. And both are super duper relevant 👍
Sounds like some kind of nerve was struck.
Surprised.
Hah! You're the one who responded to a calm, measured post with a completely irrelevant flame bait. We all know it's you with the struck nerve, maybe I should make a poll on it lol
Where exactly lies the "flame bait" in what I wrote?
I am not playing this game with you, I prefer to retain what respect I have for you, and that will quickly dissolve if you carry on pretending you didn't make that statement with the intent of instigating.
I have the guts to admit that my Giesecke posts are friendly mockery, have the guts to own yours as well.
I was not mocking you or the state of Ohio in any way.
But please, explain where the flame bait lies. Where lies the intention of "instigating"?
Every post you’ve made the last few pages.
Nope.
Yep, even if it wasn’t the intent. Posting those pics is flame worthy even if Sweden had no cases.
If showing a snapshot of how real life during corona is in another country than yours, is "flame worthy" to you.
Then perheps deal with these feelings of flame worthiness you have, instead of acting out against other posters.
I was just showing a saturday evening in Sweden in april, it being relevant to the thread.
You posted and then were flamed.
Acting out?
Trollers gonna troll I guess.
You’re either throwing it in peoples’ faces that your country is less affected or you’re throwing caution to the wind despite the advice from the world at large. . Take your pick.
Trump/sports commissioners conferfence call. Full arenas and baseball by August, NFL start in September. Didn’t see it mentioned. Seems somewhat reasonable but I think stadium sized crowds could be too much. I like MLB’s idea of playing in empty stadiums in centralized location til we get a handle on how hard it will hit in the fall.
This isn't going to happen. Until they get a vaccine in place no sane leadership will support this Which means that Trump will leave it up to others to land in the correct spots on this.
Agree about no crowd activities. They could happen.
You think sports with fans are done for 12-18 months?
I sure hope not but I think that until we know if this is going to come back in the fall, as some suspect, I don't think there is a way they open stadiums for leagues. If it takes 12-18 I think we will have to do it without crowds. Or, I could see people who recover being ok to be a part of crowds if they show immunity is carrying. Who knows ....damn this sucks.
Myself?
Im not going to any baseball games, concerts, sporting events in general, for a year. They could open up baseball in July or August, offer $1.00 tickets with a free beer and a hot dog, and there is no way in hell I am going. Same for a concert. Pearl Jam can offer FREE tickets, and I still wont go, until we are in 2021.
Just me.
Sporting events and concerts are one thing, but how about something like going to the gym that is a daily part of life for many; myself included. I likely won’t feel comfortable going to a gym until there’s a vaccine. That sucks and will likely force me to set something up at home. This virus will change the psyche of so many people on such a large scale.
Yeah as soon as things get back to normal we are going to cancel our gym membership. Gonna get a mountain bike and a elliptical for the basement and we should be set.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
thank you for confirming my opinion of you and in fact lowering it considerably with this irrelevant to the current crisis statement.
very ironic considering how superior attitude has been in stating the US or its citizens cant take criticism.
so please , do go out daily and interact with your fellow citizens. You know , following your governments lead on this.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
Right-O mate! And we both sent almost a million men to fight the Nazis. And both are super duper relevant 👍
Sounds like some kind of nerve was struck.
Surprised.
Hah! You're the one who responded to a calm, measured post with a completely irrelevant flame bait. We all know it's you with the struck nerve, maybe I should make a poll on it lol
Where exactly lies the "flame bait" in what I wrote?
I am not playing this game with you, I prefer to retain what respect I have for you, and that will quickly dissolve if you carry on pretending you didn't make that statement with the intent of instigating.
I have the guts to admit that my Giesecke posts are friendly mockery, have the guts to own yours as well.
I was not mocking you or the state of Ohio in any way.
But please, explain where the flame bait lies. Where lies the intention of "instigating"?
Every post you’ve made the last few pages.
Nope.
Yep, even if it wasn’t the intent. Posting those pics is flame worthy even if Sweden had no cases.
If showing a snapshot of how real life during corona is in another country than yours, is "flame worthy" to you.
Then perheps deal with these feelings of flame worthiness you have, instead of acting out against other posters.
I was just showing a saturday evening in Sweden in april, it being relevant to the thread.
You posted and then were flamed.
Acting out?
Trollers gonna troll I guess.
You’re either throwing it in peoples’ faces that your country is less affected or you’re throwing caution to the wind despite the advice from the world at large. . Take your pick.
@Spiritual_Chaos, apologies if this was already covered but is there any concern about your hospital systems being overwhelmed? Or is the thought that if you see similar outbreak rates, there is still adequate capacity? Because I could sorta see the argument for this approach if that is covered.
The Public Health Authorities have stated in their briefings that the system is stressed, mainly in Stockholm where the biggest problem is, but hospitals can still can handle it. There has been two military field hospitals set up too, one in Stockholm and one in Gothenburg. But I do not think these have been needed yet.
And now you ask - why just two field hospitals? Well:
With one hospital in Gothenburg and one in Stockholm, the Swedish Armed Forces has now emptied its warehouse of field hospitals in the country. At the same time, several fully equipped hospitals have been donated over the years.
Three ended up in the Baltic countries, where much of the equipment is still in use. Others went to the UN peacekeeping work.
"Without a doubt, we would have been able to use them today," says Jan Hage, who led the project to build up the Baltic countries' military healthcare - with Swedish equipment.
But at the same time there are a lot of news coverage of there beings problems in hospitals and with ICU beds.
LIke this article I read today:
Karolinska University Hospital is now forced to dust off old respirators to meet the expected onslaught of severely ill corona patients.
At the same time, the National Board of Health is now warning that there is not enough equipment in the country.
- More respirators will be needed, says Taha Alexandersson at the National Board of Health and Welfare.
Close to Karolinska Hospital in Solna, the Swedish medical technology company Getinge manufactures thousands of new respirators - but they are [mainly] for export.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
thank you for confirming my opinion of you and in fact lowering it considerably with this irrelevant to the current crisis statement.
very ironic considering how superior attitude has been in stating the US or its citizens cant take criticism.
so please , do go out daily and interact with your fellow citizens. You know , following your governments lead on this.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
Right-O mate! And we both sent almost a million men to fight the Nazis. And both are super duper relevant 👍
Sounds like some kind of nerve was struck.
Surprised.
Hah! You're the one who responded to a calm, measured post with a completely irrelevant flame bait. We all know it's you with the struck nerve, maybe I should make a poll on it lol
Where exactly lies the "flame bait" in what I wrote?
I am not playing this game with you, I prefer to retain what respect I have for you, and that will quickly dissolve if you carry on pretending you didn't make that statement with the intent of instigating.
I have the guts to admit that my Giesecke posts are friendly mockery, have the guts to own yours as well.
I was not mocking you or the state of Ohio in any way.
But please, explain where the flame bait lies. Where lies the intention of "instigating"?
Every post you’ve made the last few pages.
Nope.
Yep, even if it wasn’t the intent. Posting those pics is flame worthy even if Sweden had no cases.
If showing a snapshot of how real life during corona is in another country than yours, is "flame worthy" to you.
Then perheps deal with these feelings of flame worthiness you have, instead of acting out against other posters.
I was just showing a saturday evening in Sweden in april, it being relevant to the thread.
You posted and then were flamed.
Acting out?
Trollers gonna troll I guess.
You’re either throwing it in peoples’ faces that your country is less affected or you’re throwing caution to the wind despite the advice from the world at large. . Take your pick.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
thank you for confirming my opinion of you and in fact lowering it considerably with this irrelevant to the current crisis statement.
very ironic considering how superior attitude has been in stating the US or its citizens cant take criticism.
so please , do go out daily and interact with your fellow citizens. You know , following your governments lead on this.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
I will be putting together a little comparison on my state, Ohio, and Sweden at some point. We have roughly equivalent population sizes and are polar opposites on reaction to the pandemic, with Ohio being one of the very earliest to enact strict social distancing measures and Sweden being the very last. Should be interesting, I wish everyone well!
And we both have had famous cases of the military gunning down our own citizens during demonstrations.
Right-O mate! And we both sent almost a million men to fight the Nazis. And both are super duper relevant 👍
Sounds like some kind of nerve was struck.
Surprised.
Hah! You're the one who responded to a calm, measured post with a completely irrelevant flame bait. We all know it's you with the struck nerve, maybe I should make a poll on it lol
Where exactly lies the "flame bait" in what I wrote?
I am not playing this game with you, I prefer to retain what respect I have for you, and that will quickly dissolve if you carry on pretending you didn't make that statement with the intent of instigating.
I have the guts to admit that my Giesecke posts are friendly mockery, have the guts to own yours as well.
I was not mocking you or the state of Ohio in any way.
But please, explain where the flame bait lies. Where lies the intention of "instigating"?
Every post you’ve made the last few pages.
Nope.
Yep, even if it wasn’t the intent. Posting those pics is flame worthy even if Sweden had no cases.
If showing a snapshot of how real life during corona is in another country than yours, is "flame worthy" to you.
Then perheps deal with these feelings of flame worthiness you have, instead of acting out against other posters.
I was just showing a saturday evening in Sweden in april, it being relevant to the thread.
You posted and then were flamed.
Acting out?
Trollers gonna troll I guess.
You’re either throwing it in peoples’ faces that your country is less affected or you’re throwing caution to the wind despite the advice from the world at large. . Take your pick.
Let me tell you about two trickle down events that have risen because of Covid19, my wife is a forensic nurse she specializes in Rape & strangulation victims not dead victims but victims of abuse, she has to work in tandem with police dept here on Long Island Suffolk county to be precise normally she gets the call either from the ER or police themselves more like detectives. She has learned that since the spike in Corona cases the police have been talking victims out of going to hospital so they don’t have to go into hospitals themselves because of fear of being infected! That just sucks I understand the fear factor but I feel horrible for these victims that can’t be seen if they listen to detectives involved I’m not blaming anyone but it just sucks..
Let me tell you about two trickle down events that have risen because of Covid19, my wife is a forensic nurse she specializes in Rape & strangulation victims not dead victims but victims of abuse, she has to work in tandem with police dept here on Long Island Suffolk county to be precise normally she gets the call either from the ER or police themselves more like detectives. She has learned that since the spike in Corona cases the police have been talking victims out of going to hospital so they don’t have to go into hospitals themselves because of fear of being infected! That just sucks I understand the fear factor but I feel horrible for these victims that can’t be seen if they listen to detectives involved I’m not blaming anyone but it just sucks..
Just one of many horrible consequences.
Intimate partner violence appears to have increased significantly, with the need to quarantine. Too much time in close quarters, and no means of escape for victims.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,936
Let me tell you about two trickle down events that have risen because of Covid19, my wife is a forensic nurse she specializes in Rape & strangulation victims not dead victims but victims of abuse, she has to work in tandem with police dept here on Long Island Suffolk county to be precise normally she gets the call either from the ER or police themselves more like detectives. She has learned that since the spike in Corona cases the police have been talking victims out of going to hospital so they don’t have to go into hospitals themselves because of fear of being infected! That just sucks I understand the fear factor but I feel horrible for these victims that can’t be seen if they listen to detectives involved I’m not blaming anyone but it just sucks..
Domestic abuse cases soar as lockdown takes its toll Evidence suggests that domestic abuse is likely to increase as a result of the pandemic. In China’s Hubei province, where the virus was first detected, domestic violence reports to police more than tripled during the lockdown in February.
Special Report - How the COVID-19 lockdown will take its own toll on health rapped at home with their abusers, some domestic violence victims are already experiencing more frequent and extreme violence, said Katie Ray-Jones, the chief executive officer of the National Domestic Violence Hotline.
Domestic violence programs across the country have cited increases in calls for help, news accounts reported – from Cincinnati to Nashville, Portland, Salt Lake City and statewide in Virginia and Arizona. The YWCA of Northern New Jersey, in another example, told Reuters its domestic violence calls have risen up to 24%.
Calls for funds to house domestic violence victims during Covid-19 outbreak
Domestic abuse experts are calling on the government to provide emergency funds as refuges prepare for an influx of referrals amid fears the Covid-19 outbreak will fuel violence in the home.
At least 15 violence against women and girls organisations, including Women’s Aid, have signed a letter to the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government (MHCLG) calling for action over one of the unintended consequences of the coronavirus lockdown.
No, it's not possible to accurately count every death, and there will be both overcounting and undercounting, because some people who are positive will die of something else, or it will be impossible to figure out what the causative agent really is, such as when someone with terminal cancer dies covid-positive, or an infected person has a stroke. The figures will get more accurate over time, and whenever there is a pandemic the figures get revised over time as more information comes in.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Regardless of what "leaders" mandate for a particular state, city, country, what have you...is it not considered prudent to avoid gatherings in pubs or similar spaces without being told to do so? Doesn't common sense dictate basic safety measures for yourself, family and friends?
The mindset of some - "well, we haven't been TOLD we need to do X, Y & Z, so I'm taking advantage!" - strikes me as flouting reality for selfish reasons. Just avoid that shit, for fuck's sake.
Yes. And the people that annoy me are the most are my Facebook friends that the day before their state started some restrictions were 1) at disney world 2) out at heir kids play....
this was after the nba/NCAA/concerts had been cancelled. But because no government directive they did what they wanted. And now they bitch about other people being out and about.
Regardless of what "leaders" mandate for a particular state, city, country, what have you...is it not considered prudent to avoid gatherings in pubs or similar spaces without being told to do so? Doesn't common sense dictate basic safety measures for yourself, family and friends?
The mindset of some - "well, we haven't been TOLD we need to do X, Y & Z, so I'm taking advantage!" - strikes me as flouting reality for selfish reasons. Just avoid that shit, for fuck's sake.
So how long can a country stay on total lockdown?
Sweden's public health authorities opinion about that is "for a limited amount of time", so they do not want to lockdown more than needed until it, according to them, is needed. And instead ask the population to adhere to their recommendations regarding hygiene and social distancing and people over 70 and in a risk group to be cautious etc. So that the health care can cope with it, and focus being on everyone in a riskgroup being protected.
I use common sense regarding this every day. Even when visiting the half-empty local pub supporting it, sitting in a corner with two of my friends - neither being in a risk group or old. Not like I was Joe Biden every girl in the place. Or not washing my hands when I got home. Locking yourself up in a room, not meeting your family or anyone and eating all the toilet paper your have bunkered up last time you dared to leave your room because someone somehow could carry Corona like THE THING isn't all that feasible for everyone either. And for how long?
How long will a total lockdown work, before people start breaking it just because it turns into the new, boring, not feasible normal? And how much will have crashed because of it?
A vaccin won't come for at least 18 months.
I wish we could bet on this, if this continues to do this much harm to people and the economy... there is no way it will be 18 months. It will be streamlined some for sure. Taking some risks to move faster.
Former New Orleans Saints kicker Tom Dempsey died Saturday due to complications from the Covid-19 . He was 73.
For decades, Dempsey was known for making one of the most famous kicks in NFL history. With the Saints trailing the Detroit Lions by two points — and just two seconds remaining in the game — Dempsey lined up for a then-record 63-yard field-goal attempt.
Comments
You know damn sure he’s not at church lol it must be golf at one of his own courses and taxpayers footing the bill!
And now you ask - why just two field hospitals? Well:
But at the same time there are a lot of news coverage of there beings problems in hospitals and with ICU beds.
LIke this article I read today:
Just one of many horrible consequences.
Intimate partner violence appears to have increased significantly, with the need to quarantine. Too much time in close quarters, and no means of escape for victims.
That is tragic. Understandable, but tragic.
Damn we might not ever know the real count ..
Evidence suggests that domestic abuse is likely to increase as a result of the pandemic. In China’s Hubei province, where the virus was first detected, domestic violence reports to police more than tripled during the lockdown in February.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/04/domestic-abuse-cases-soar-as-lockdown-takes-its-toll?
rapped at home with their abusers, some domestic violence victims are already experiencing more frequent and extreme violence, said Katie Ray-Jones, the chief executive officer of the National Domestic Violence Hotline.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/special-report-covid-19-lockdown-133743439.html
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/mar/31/call-for-uk-domestic-violence-refuges-to-get-coronavirus-funding
https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/coronaviruscurve/
this was after the nba/NCAA/concerts had been cancelled. But because no government directive they did what they wanted. And now they bitch about other people being out and about.
Former New Orleans Saints kicker Tom Dempsey died Saturday due to complications from the Covid-19 . He was 73.
For decades, Dempsey was known for making one of the most famous kicks in NFL history. With the Saints trailing the Detroit Lions by two points — and just two seconds remaining in the game — Dempsey lined up for a then-record 63-yard field-goal attempt.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/legendary-nfl-kicker-tom-dempsey-dies-after-fight-with-coronavirus-134917908.html
https://www.cbs42.com/news/national/tiger-at-bronx-zoo-tests-positive-for-covid-19/