The Democratic Presidential Debates

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  • ecdancecdanc Posts: 1,814
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 37,746
    ask warren buffet.
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  • ecdancecdanc Posts: 1,814
    mickeyrat said:
    ask warren buffet.
    I’m asking you. 
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 37,746
    ecdanc said:
    mickeyrat said:
    ask warren buffet.
    I’m asking you. 
    since I havent made a billion dollars honestly or otherwise, perhaps you should ask those who seem to have done so. Buffet being one example.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,083
    edited February 2020
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    its up to the laws and tax codes to make sure they do it honestly. 

    I reckon a roughly 25% tax on salarys and then an extra 20% on everything above 5-6000 a month is resonable. 


    • 0% from 0 dollars to 2000 dollars
    • Circa 25%: from 2000 dollats  to 5000 dollars
    • 25%+ 20%: from 5000 dollars to 6000 dollars
    • 25%+ 25%: above 6000 dollars

    I dont see a problem initself that people make money

    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    Have a great idea,  work it up,  sell out to equity or go public.  
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    mickeyrat said:
    ask warren buffet.
    I’m asking you. 
    What did Bloomberg do that was dishonest? That's a less ambiguous question that should be easy to answer. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    its up to the laws and tax codes to make sure they do it honestly. 

    I reckon a roughly 25% tax on salarys and then an extra 20% on everything above 5-6000 a month is resonable. 


    • 0% from 0 dollars to 2000 dollars
    • Circa 25%: from 2000 dollats  to 5000 dollars
    • 25%+ 20%: from 5000 dollars to 6000 dollars
    • 25%+ 25%: above 6000 dollars

    I dont see a problem initself that people make money

    I don't know that I agree with your rates but I agree with your concept.  But Sanders did say there should be no billionaires.  Under that concept,  at some point the tax rate must be 100%.  https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/09/24/politics/bernie-sanders-ultra-wealth-tax-billionaires/index.html
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,148
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    I can get just about anything delivered to my door, sometimes within a couple hours. And I can stream a couple movies while I wait. Bezos can buy an island for all I care.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 41,620
    ecdanc said:
    brianlux said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    brianlux said:
    mcgruff10 said:

    Thank you!

    I got Tom Steyer, but he's not high on my list of favorite candidates. 
    Maybe he should be. ;)

    Here's where bias comes in:  I don't trust anyone with a net worth of $1.6 billion.
    I ♥️ you. 

    Aww shucks, now stop it- you're making me turn red!  :blush:

    Hey we got off to a bad start but we might just do alright after all!

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 41,620
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?

    My wife and I have had this discussion a thousand times.  I tell her, "There is not way a person can make a billion dollars without someone else suffering and/or being taken advantage of."  She, on the other hand, being of the eternally optimistic, positive in outlook, and forgiving type (with rare exceptions- she loathes Trump!) seems to think is is possible to be a good, decent- altruistic even- billionaire.  After almost 20 years, I'm thinking there is no way in hell she will ever convince me of that!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    mrussel1 said:
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    its up to the laws and tax codes to make sure they do it honestly. 

    I reckon a roughly 25% tax on salarys and then an extra 20% on everything above 5-6000 a month is resonable. 


    • 0% from 0 dollars to 2000 dollars
    • Circa 25%: from 2000 dollats  to 5000 dollars
    • 25%+ 20%: from 5000 dollars to 6000 dollars
    • 25%+ 25%: above 6000 dollars

    I dont see a problem initself that people make money

    I don't know that I agree with your rates but I agree with your concept.  But Sanders did say there should be no billionaires.  Under that concept,  at some point the tax rate must be 100%.  https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/09/24/politics/bernie-sanders-ultra-wealth-tax-billionaires/index.html
    Don't agree with the rates either.

    Personally, I prefer a flat tax vs. some arbitrary group deciding what at what dollar level increased taxes are justified.  I'm not all that familiar with tax terminology so perhaps "flat" is incorrectly used, but my hope is that all pay the same percentage - perhaps with more give for those with lower income.

    By the way, I don't think $6000 a month is ridiculous.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 41,620
    What do you all think of a VAT-  Value Added Tax- system?
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    Sounds like it's similar to retail taxes but already built into prices?

    As long as the system isn't misused (yeah right).  I mean, what about profit mark-ups?  And who would ensure the "added value" is actually worth X amount?

    I suppose any system can be manipulated, as I also imagine many tax lawyers pull their hair out over codes and laws and evasion.


  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 41,620
    Yeah, I imagine pretty much any system can or will be abused.  I get the feeling that manipulation the tax with VAT might be harder to do.  Here's a good brief description of how VAT works:

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,083
    edited February 2020
    what country does not have VAT? if it is what I think it is? We have 25% as default

    The value added tax (mervärdesskatt or moms) rate in Sweden is 25%, with exceptions for food and services like hotel room rental fees (12%), and for sales of publicationsadmission ticketsto cultural events and travel within Sweden (6%).[3]


    Is there a duscussion to not have a VAT system at all?

    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • ecdancecdanc Posts: 1,814
    All wealth belongs properly to labor. The accumulation of capital relies fundamentally upon exploitation (Buffett is actually a great example: his “honest” fortune derives almost entirely from “investment”).
  • ecdancecdanc Posts: 1,814
    pjl44 said:
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    I can get just about anything delivered to my door, sometimes within a couple hours. And I can stream a couple movies while I wait. Bezos can buy an island for all I care.
    And his warehouse workers can go fuck themselves, eh? 
  • Hi!Hi! Posts: 3,095

    Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022

  • "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Hi!Hi! Posts: 3,095

    Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022

  • cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,332
    I’m continually amazed that people are amazed. There is nothing but some sports and this political shit to do in Iowa in the winter
    hippiemom = goodness
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    All wealth belongs properly to labor. The accumulation of capital relies fundamentally upon exploitation (Buffett is actually a great example: his “honest” fortune derives almost entirely from “investment”).
    What's the proper wage rate for a robot?
  • ecdancecdanc Posts: 1,814
    mrussel1 said:
    ecdanc said:
    All wealth belongs properly to labor. The accumulation of capital relies fundamentally upon exploitation (Buffett is actually a great example: his “honest” fortune derives almost entirely from “investment”).
    What's the proper wage rate for a robot?
    Who said anything about wages?
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,148
    ecdanc said:
    pjl44 said:
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    I can get just about anything delivered to my door, sometimes within a couple hours. And I can stream a couple movies while I wait. Bezos can buy an island for all I care.
    And his warehouse workers can go fuck themselves, eh? 
    No, they're paid a wage for their work. One of my first jobs was with a large multinational company. The CEO made piles of money and I had a decent salary and benefits. Those things aren't mutually exclusive.
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,148
    mrussel1 said:
    ecdanc said:
    All wealth belongs properly to labor. The accumulation of capital relies fundamentally upon exploitation (Buffett is actually a great example: his “honest” fortune derives almost entirely from “investment”).
    What's the proper wage rate for a robot?
    Those Boston Dynamics robots are going to seize the means of production whether we like it or not 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    mrussel1 said:
    ecdanc said:
    All wealth belongs properly to labor. The accumulation of capital relies fundamentally upon exploitation (Buffett is actually a great example: his “honest” fortune derives almost entirely from “investment”).
    What's the proper wage rate for a robot?
    Who said anything about wages?
    Oh right, you're a real communist.  Okay, so the wealth goes to the statist government and then is redistributed to the robots who did all the work.  Got it.  I love a great 18th century agrarian economic philosophy at work in the modern age.  
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    I’m continually amazed that people are amazed. There is nothing but some sports and this political shit to do in Iowa in the winter
    The people and energy at the Trump rallies are pretty impressive too. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,348
    ecdanc said:
    pjl44 said:
    ecdanc said:
    How does one make a billion dollars honestly?
    I can get just about anything delivered to my door, sometimes within a couple hours. And I can stream a couple movies while I wait. Bezos can buy an island for all I care.
    And his warehouse workers can go fuck themselves, eh? 
    You put zero value in the idea and the work that went into starting the factory.  If one received zero for such things, what's the point of having an idea, and how do humans advance?  Again, you can look at Soviet era technological advancements compared to the US.  We don't need theories when we have results. 
  • mrussel1 said:
    I’m continually amazed that people are amazed. There is nothing but some sports and this political shit to do in Iowa in the winter
    The people and energy at the Trump rallies are pretty impressive too. 
    ...and?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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