I see no reason why politics have to come into the discussion at this point. Almost everyone agrees that this punk is scum of the earth and either should be dead or dying in a jail cell.
I agree. It's ridiculous and insulting to suggest that liberals might feel sympathy for that guy just because they don't support the DP and want better mental healthcare.
It's ridiculous and insulting to suggest people that view the DP as an appropriate form of justice for this loser are bloodthirsty savages hell bent on revenge.
F**k you can be daft at times. Seriously.
Wow, what a harsh reply. I am always careful to be respectful with you, it would be nice if you did the same. Yes, I do think that those who want people to be killed are out for vengeance through killing, which definitely can fairly be called a bloodthirsty desire (particularly in the context that I referenced, which are all those posts where people are talking about inflicting real violence on the person). You call it justice, but I don't think there is a difference when said justice is vigilante murder. Do you see the difference here? Liberals have never said "poor poor mass murderer" or anything close to it (as as far as the context that you keep trying to point out... dude, you've said this stuff before). Some have, though, made comments calling for violent revenge against criminals (in a perfect world). If memory serves, you have made such comments yourself.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
I see no reason why politics have to come into the discussion at this point. Almost everyone agrees that this punk is scum of the earth and either should be dead or dying in a jail cell.
I agree. It's ridiculous and insulting to suggest that liberals might feel sympathy for that guy just because they don't support the DP and want better mental healthcare.
It's ridiculous and insulting to suggest people that view the DP as an appropriate form of justice for this loser are bloodthirsty savages hell bent on revenge.
F**k you can be daft at times. Seriously.
If the death penalty isn't about revenge, then what is it about?
Justice
I'm not sure that the government killing it's own people is the definition of justice.
I'm not sure clothing, feeding, and entertaining a mass murderer is either.
So rather than the government keep society safe from the guy killing again, they need to do something more?
Keeping society safe from the guy isn't administering justice.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
I have to disagree. I think some proponents do say "blood blood blood" (per se). I've seen as much said with my very own eyes. I have seen posts where people have detailed the torture they would personally inflict on some murderer or rapist .... Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure you've never seen a liberal saying "poor poor murderer".
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
But for the most part, those who oppose the DP don't do so because they want the criminal to be okay. They oppose it because of what it entails for the government and society, and because of the possibility of someone innocent being on death row and/or killed. The welfare of a guilty criminal honestly has absolutely nothing to do with it for most opponents.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
I have to disagree. I think some proponents do say "blood blood blood" (per se). I've seen as much said with my very own eyes. I have seen posts where people have detailed the torture they would personally inflict on some murderer or rapist .... Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure you've never seen a liberal saying "poor poor murderer".
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
But for the most part, those who oppose the DP don't do so because they want the criminal to be okay. They oppose it because of what it entails for the government and society, and because of the possibility of someone innocent being on death row and/or killed. The welfare of a guilty criminal honestly has absolutely nothing to do with it for most opponents.
Well in this case... there's no question of guilt.
I don't think executing these types hurts society at all. I think stomaching their existence as they complain of prison conditions, apply for parole, and chair their fan clubs does worse.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
I have to disagree. I think some proponents do say "blood blood blood" (per se). I've seen as much said with my very own eyes. I have seen posts where people have detailed the torture they would personally inflict on some murderer or rapist .... Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure you've never seen a liberal saying "poor poor murderer".
Maybe not so succinctly.
No, not in any way at all.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
I have to disagree. I think some proponents do say "blood blood blood" (per se). I've seen as much said with my very own eyes. I have seen posts where people have detailed the torture they would personally inflict on some murderer or rapist .... Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure you've never seen a liberal saying "poor poor murderer".
Maybe not so succinctly.
No, not in any way at all.
According to you who rests squarely on that side of the argument.
Your failure to see your lack of objectivity with regards to categorizing inflammatory posts equally on both sides of the equation doesn't make you right.
To squash this argument... Byrnzie succinctly stated that awaiting an execution date is far worse than any fate a murder victim may have incurred. To my way of thinking... yup... poor poor murderer. And there have been countless other comments not quite so extreme, but in the same dimension.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Yes. That is precisely what revenge/vengeance is.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Yes. That is precisely what revenge/vengeance is.
Wrong again. That is what justice means.
All you're doing is playing semantics. An eye for an eye... that is vengeance. If you want to call it justice too, that doesn't make it any less vengeful. You're just using a nicer word for the same thing in this context.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Who cares if it's called vengeance or justice? Seriously? In this case, where there is no question of guilt, this person does not deserve the treatment he'd get in prison. It's not enough of a punishment. He's guilty of the most heinous of crimes. Rehabilitation? Does that really apply here? Can he be rehabilitated? Does it matter if he can be if he's just going to spend the rest of his pathetic life in jail? The death penalty is the only acceptable punishment.
I have weakened my stance on the DP. I do not think it should be used if there is even the slightest but of doubt of the persons guilt. But why does it bother you when it's clear cut like this? Saying you oppose government sanctioned killing is naive, in my opinion. Almost every country on the planet has been associated with some type of war, which is government sanctioned kilking. Not that makes it right. But it is what it is. No amount of protest is going to change that fact.
What do you suggest we do to Dylan Roof if you don't want to see him executed? Allow him to live, eat, watch tv, and breathe all at the tax payers expense? Why isn't death appropriate here?
Post edited by Degeneratefk on
will myself to find a home, a home within myself we will find a way, we will find our place
Who cares if it's called vengeance or justice? Seriously? In this case, where there is no question of guilt, this person does not deserve the treatment he'd get in prison. It's not enough of a punishment. He's guilty of the most heinous of crimes. Rehabilitation? Does that really apply here? Can he be rehabilitated? Does it matter if he can be if he's just going to spend the rest of his pathetic life in jail? The death penalty is the only acceptable punishment.
I have weakened my stance on the DP. I do not think it should be used if there is even the slightest but of doubt of the persons guilt. But why does it bother you when it's clear cut like this? Saying you oppose government sanctioned killing is naive, in my opinion. Almost every country on the planet has been associated with some type of war, which is government sanctioned kilking. Not that makes it right. But it is what it is. No amount of protest is going to change that fact.
What do you suggest we do to Dylan Roof if you don't want to see him executed? Allow him to live, eat, watch tv, and breathe all at the tax payers expense? Why isn't death appropriate here?
He should be in prison for life. Why do you think the US is one of the few western countries with the death penalty? Being anti- war and anti-death penalty are in the same moral area, but the death penalty is more clear cut. Either the state can decide to kill someone or they won't. It can also be fairly easily removed, while war has more variables and is more complicated. The death penalty is never appropriate.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
He's human, but you raise the point that we have to de-humanize someone in order to kill them.
I think we all know that opponents of the DP aren't changing their minds and neither are supporters. I do 100% believe that the DP is ONLY about vengeance - as GoBeavers said, the justice system is able to keep society safe from these people without killing them. Opponents have several good, logical arguments against the DP that have nothing to do with the welfare of murderers. But it's my opinion that supporters only have one reason behind their belief: revenge. They can call it "justice" all they want... I should think that that kind of "justice" is never justice that any human has the right to dole out. I am an Atheist, but if I did believe in God, I would definitely say that only God should be able to dole out that kind of "justice", because that kind of "justice" handed out by people just drags down everyone. Punishing murder with murder is a moral absurdity that I don't abide by. And when that method of "justice" (the DP) endangers even one innocent person in the process (which it absolutely does), there is no excuse that will suffice.
As for Roof... he will almost certainly appeal the death sentence. That will go on for years and years and years, dragging all the victims through it over and over again so that they can't move on for probably a decade or whatever, and all that will cost just as much as keeping the prick in a cell. If he died, I would be happy. I couldn't care less about the life of the guy, or lack thereof. I just don't think that a government should have the power to kill for vengeance or send the message to everyone that punishing murder by killing is morally acceptable, because it's not. I stand for the high road, not the low road. The low road belongs to the criminals.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I completely disagree with the notion that the DP is never appropriate. This case is the perfect example of that.
I gathered that. I am against the DP 100% of the time. The extent of the atrocity is totally irrelevant to my stance on capital punishment. Now, if it actually prevented violent crimes, I would very likely have a different viewpoint (although the problem of innocents being found guilty would still be an issue). But it doesn't prevent violent crime. So no, I do not support it no matter what the circumstances are.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I completely disagree with the notion that the DP is never appropriate. This case is the perfect example of that.
I gathered that. I am against the DP 100% of the time. The extent of the atrocity is totally irrelevant to my stance on capital punishment. Now, if it actually prevented violent crimes, I would very likely have a different viewpoint (although the problem of innocents being found guilty would still be an issue). But it doesn't prevent violent crime. So no, I do not support it no matter what the circumstances are.
But the DP does prevent violent crimes. The person executed will never again be able to harm another person, either on the streets or in prison committing violence against another inmate or corrections officer.
I'm generally uneasy with the DP, but make exceptions when there is a clear case (video, a confession, etc...). This one is pretty clear to me.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
Who cares if it's called vengeance or justice? Seriously? In this case, where there is no question of guilt, this person does not deserve the treatment he'd get in prison. It's not enough of a punishment. He's guilty of the most heinous of crimes. Rehabilitation? Does that really apply here? Can he be rehabilitated? Does it matter if he can be if he's just going to spend the rest of his pathetic life in jail? The death penalty is the only acceptable punishment.
I have weakened my stance on the DP. I do not think it should be used if there is even the slightest but of doubt of the persons guilt. But why does it bother you when it's clear cut like this? Saying you oppose government sanctioned killing is naive, in my opinion. Almost every country on the planet has been associated with some type of war, which is government sanctioned kilking. Not that makes it right. But it is what it is. No amount of protest is going to change that fact.
What do you suggest we do to Dylan Roof if you don't want to see him executed? Allow him to live, eat, watch tv, and breathe all at the tax payers expense? Why isn't death appropriate here?
100% appropriate. i see nothing wrong at all with death by electrocution for him.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
He's human, but you raise the point that we have to de-humanize someone in order to kill them.
That's not a valid point at all and more philosophical fluff.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
He's human, but you raise the point that we have to de-humanize someone in order to kill them.
That's not a valid point at all and more philosophical fluff.
It's not fluff. There's a mental process that needs to happen for someone to kill someone else. It's part of military training, also.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
He's human, but you raise the point that we have to de-humanize someone in order to kill them.
That's not a valid point at all and more philosophical fluff.
It's not fluff. There's a mental process that needs to happen for someone to kill someone else. It's part of military training, also.
Maybe I'm just a simpleton. But in order to kill someone on death row, you must put needles in his arms. And push a button. That's it. The machine does the rest.
will myself to find a home, a home within myself we will find a way, we will find our place
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
Proponents want someone dead, using whatever words, and then call it justice.
Well... yah.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
Isn't punishment that matches the crime revenge?
Isn't any punishment at all revenge (if you're inclined to think that way)?
Some punishment by courts is to make amends, some is supposed to be a deterrent to committing future crimes, some is just to keep society safe. The state can do these things with out killing the offender. It seems like the death penalty is about individuals emotions rather than justice.
Well in the case of a sick individual that killed 9 innocent people he never even knew... the courts are doing all of the above with a particular emphasis on making amends. It seems to me that the DP reserved and applied for cases such as these most accurately reflects our level of disdain for the crime.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
He's human, but you raise the point that we have to de-humanize someone in order to kill them.
That's not a valid point at all and more philosophical fluff.
It's not fluff. There's a mental process that needs to happen for someone to kill someone else. It's part of military training, also.
Maybe I'm just a simpleton. But in order to kill someone on death row, you must put needles in his arms. And push a button. That's it. The machine does the rest.
In order for people to be okay with the government killing people and oeople being sentenced to death, they have to dehumanize the person first, and say things like they are a "lower form of life than a worm".
Comments
Yes, I do think that those who want people to be killed are out for vengeance through killing, which definitely can fairly be called a bloodthirsty desire (particularly in the context that I referenced, which are all those posts where people are talking about inflicting real violence on the person). You call it justice, but I don't think there is a difference when said justice is vigilante murder. Do you see the difference here? Liberals have never said "poor poor mass murderer" or anything close to it (as as far as the context that you keep trying to point out... dude, you've said this stuff before). Some have, though, made comments calling for violent revenge against criminals (in a perfect world). If memory serves, you have made such comments yourself.
Liberals have never said poor poor murderer just like proponents have never said blood blood blood.
Implying proponents are saying blood blood blood when they say something like 'good riddance' is tantamount to implying liberals empathize with the murderer when they concern themselves so much with his fate.
In this case... we have a mushroom headed, hate filled mutant that killed some innocent people in a church. Proponents think that a warm cell, clean clothing, cooked meals, and internet use is not fitting for a punishment.
I don't think executing these types hurts society at all. I think stomaching their existence as they complain of prison conditions, apply for parole, and chair their fan clubs does worse.
Your failure to see your lack of objectivity with regards to categorizing inflammatory posts equally on both sides of the equation doesn't make you right.
To squash this argument... Byrnzie succinctly stated that awaiting an execution date is far worse than any fate a murder victim may have incurred. To my way of thinking... yup... poor poor murderer. And there have been countless other comments not quite so extreme, but in the same dimension.
Roof is a lower form of life than a worm.
I have weakened my stance on the DP. I do not think it should be used if there is even the slightest but of doubt of the persons guilt. But why does it bother you when it's clear cut like this? Saying you oppose government sanctioned killing is naive, in my opinion. Almost every country on the planet has been associated with some type of war, which is government sanctioned kilking. Not that makes it right. But it is what it is. No amount of protest is going to change that fact.
What do you suggest we do to Dylan Roof if you don't want to see him executed? Allow him to live, eat, watch tv, and breathe all at the tax payers expense? Why isn't death appropriate here?
we will find a way, we will find our place
As for Roof... he will almost certainly appeal the death sentence. That will go on for years and years and years, dragging all the victims through it over and over again so that they can't move on for probably a decade or whatever, and all that will cost just as much as keeping the prick in a cell. If he died, I would be happy. I couldn't care less about the life of the guy, or lack thereof. I just don't think that a government should have the power to kill for vengeance or send the message to everyone that punishing murder by killing is morally acceptable, because it's not. I stand for the high road, not the low road. The low road belongs to the criminals.
we will find a way, we will find our place
I am against the DP 100% of the time. The extent of the atrocity is totally irrelevant to my stance on capital punishment. Now, if it actually prevented violent crimes, I would very likely have a different viewpoint (although the problem of innocents being found guilty would still be an issue). But it doesn't prevent violent crime. So no, I do not support it no matter what the circumstances are.
I'm generally uneasy with the DP, but make exceptions when there is a clear case (video, a confession, etc...). This one is pretty clear to me.
we will find a way, we will find our place