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Michael Moore proving once again...

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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 36,031
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    people aren't always mocked for their opinion, but when they look down on others and tell them that their opinion/faith is truth/fact, that's when that person is attacked, and rightly so.

    anyone who presents their opinion as fact without any proof, in addition to claiming they are enlightened and others are not, is ignorant. and that person can and will be called as such.

    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 36,031
    brianlux wrote: »
    Moore...balls? Yes, balls (guts. nerve whatever you want to call it). I can say anything I want here and no one with any pull in the world will give one tiny shit. None. Nada. Why should they? I'm just some old fuck on a rock and roll web site going blah blah blah. But when someone like Moore says something people don't want to hear you better believe someone cares. Yeah, balls. Saying "Fuck Michale Moore"- that takes no balls. That is weak.

    posting something on the internet that may or may not offend someone and may or may not get you much-wanted attention that may or may not help your career is not balls. it's opportunistic. and in many cases, completely stupid.

    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    JimmyVJimmyV Boston's MetroWest Posts: 18,994
    "Opportunistic" is a great word to describe Moore. He rarely misses one.
    ___________________________________________

    "...I changed by not changing at all..."
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    hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
    paulonious wrote: »
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    people aren't always mocked for their opinion, but when they look down on others and tell them that their opinion/faith is truth/fact, that's when that person is attacked, and rightly so.

    anyone who presents their opinion as fact without any proof, in addition to claiming they are enlightened and others are not, is ignorant. and that person can and will be called as such.
    Cannot disagree with that at all; I just wish that mindset and response were consistently applied, you know?

    Also, much agreed with your comment after the above.
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    dignindignin Posts: 9,304
    This thread sure has legs.
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    riotgrlriotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,892
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    Nicely said Hedonist!

    I rarely feel the need to comment on posts because this is a group that has widely varying perspectives and most seem to keep up with current events and have interesting thoughts about all these topics so I just check in to see those varying perspectives. While I'm no longer a huge fan of Moore and I haven't seen American Sniper yet, I have to wonder if our current round of soldiers do have some culpability in the war machine. I have the utmost respect for the men and women who risk their lives and are sent by the powers that be to fight various enemies around the world for a war they didn't create. But this is, and has been for a long while, a volunteer army. When you sign up you know that there is a good possibility that you have to fight and kill and probably go against your own moral code. Why choose that? No idea if that's what Moore meant but that is the question that keeps popping up in my mind as I read this thread.

    As the child of a Vietnam vet who suffered for over 40 years from untreated PTSD, I think these are conversations that should happen because the mental damage done to these soldiers is profound. And they affect everyone not just the soldier. If we have the conversation, then perhaps our government wouldn't be so eager to engage in war. Perhaps our children wouldn't be so eager to sign up for the military if recruiters had to be really honest with these kids about what it really entails - not just free college and good job skills training.
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 36,031
    riotgrl wrote: »
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    Nicely said Hedonist!

    I rarely feel the need to comment on posts because this is a group that has widely varying perspectives and most seem to keep up with current events and have interesting thoughts about all these topics so I just check in to see those varying perspectives. While I'm no longer a huge fan of Moore and I haven't seen American Sniper yet, I have to wonder if our current round of soldiers do have some culpability in the war machine. I have the utmost respect for the men and women who risk their lives and are sent by the powers that be to fight various enemies around the world for a war they didn't create. But this is, and has been for a long while, a volunteer army. When you sign up you know that there is a good possibility that you have to fight and kill and probably go against your own moral code. Why choose that? No idea if that's what Moore meant but that is the question that keeps popping up in my mind as I read this thread.

    As the child of a Vietnam vet who suffered for over 40 years from untreated PTSD, I think these are conversations that should happen because the mental damage done to these soldiers is profound. And they affect everyone not just the soldier. If we have the conversation, then perhaps our government wouldn't be so eager to engage in war. Perhaps our children wouldn't be so eager to sign up for the military if recruiters had to be really honest with these kids about what it really entails - not just free college and good job skills training.

    and riding in a tank to a Godsmack tune.

    I think many enter the army because economically it's the only thing that makes sense for them. or they have a long family tradition of serving, and they feel it is in their lineage to "serve in the family business". and some literally get all caught up in the hero propaganda machine.

    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,442
    what moore did took balls. what moore did, did not take balls.

    but...

    were they deflated?
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Options
    paulonious wrote: »
    riotgrl wrote: »
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    Nicely said Hedonist!

    I rarely feel the need to comment on posts because this is a group that has widely varying perspectives and most seem to keep up with current events and have interesting thoughts about all these topics so I just check in to see those varying perspectives. While I'm no longer a huge fan of Moore and I haven't seen American Sniper yet, I have to wonder if our current round of soldiers do have some culpability in the war machine. I have the utmost respect for the men and women who risk their lives and are sent by the powers that be to fight various enemies around the world for a war they didn't create. But this is, and has been for a long while, a volunteer army. When you sign up you know that there is a good possibility that you have to fight and kill and probably go against your own moral code. Why choose that? No idea if that's what Moore meant but that is the question that keeps popping up in my mind as I read this thread.

    As the child of a Vietnam vet who suffered for over 40 years from untreated PTSD, I think these are conversations that should happen because the mental damage done to these soldiers is profound. And they affect everyone not just the soldier. If we have the conversation, then perhaps our government wouldn't be so eager to engage in war. Perhaps our children wouldn't be so eager to sign up for the military if recruiters had to be really honest with these kids about what it really entails - not just free college and good job skills training.

    and riding in a tank to a Godsmack tune.

    I think many enter the army because economically it's the only thing that makes sense for them. or they have a long family tradition of serving, and they feel it is in their lineage to "serve in the family business". and some literally get all caught up in the hero propaganda machine.

    Is that the only two reasons that "they" have for joining as you see it?
  • Options
    Last-12-ExitLast-12-Exit Charleston, SC Posts: 8,661
    paulonious wrote: »
    riotgrl wrote: »
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    Nicely said Hedonist!

    I rarely feel the need to comment on posts because this is a group that has widely varying perspectives and most seem to keep up with current events and have interesting thoughts about all these topics so I just check in to see those varying perspectives. While I'm no longer a huge fan of Moore and I haven't seen American Sniper yet, I have to wonder if our current round of soldiers do have some culpability in the war machine. I have the utmost respect for the men and women who risk their lives and are sent by the powers that be to fight various enemies around the world for a war they didn't create. But this is, and has been for a long while, a volunteer army. When you sign up you know that there is a good possibility that you have to fight and kill and probably go against your own moral code. Why choose that? No idea if that's what Moore meant but that is the question that keeps popping up in my mind as I read this thread.

    As the child of a Vietnam vet who suffered for over 40 years from untreated PTSD, I think these are conversations that should happen because the mental damage done to these soldiers is profound. And they affect everyone not just the soldier. If we have the conversation, then perhaps our government wouldn't be so eager to engage in war. Perhaps our children wouldn't be so eager to sign up for the military if recruiters had to be really honest with these kids about what it really entails - not just free college and good job skills training.

    and riding in a tank to a Godsmack tune.

    I think many enter the army because economically it's the only thing that makes sense for them. or they have a long family tradition of serving, and they feel it is in their lineage to "serve in the family business". and some literally get all caught up in the hero propaganda machine.

    I don't see kids wanting to follow in their parents footsteps as a negative. I would think they get a detailed briefing from their family as to what they are getting into.
  • Options
    Dirtie_FrankDirtie_Frank Posts: 1,348
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.
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    PJfanwillneverleave1PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    edited January 2015
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.

    Back in the day when this guy was headlines Jay Leno referred to him as Mahmoud I'm A Nut Job.
  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 36,031
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.

    Saying it is someone's belief is the same as saying it is their truth, not THE truth.

    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
    bsL, I don't give a shit if he (or anyone) gives not a rat's ass nor shit what others think; that's never been my point of this, and honestly, I wish that were the norm for more people.

    Speak your mind! I'd rather know where people stand, where their heart and mind lie, than keep it hidden or danced around.

    And I'll not set aside my right to applaud or critique it or anywhere in between - myself included.
  • Options
    paulonious wrote: »
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.

    Saying it is someone's belief is the same as saying it is their truth, not THE truth.

    Thank you Paul, yes. And yeah, when you make racist remarks you're speaking the truth. You're a racist. But if you swear out loud that you're not a racist, yet deep down you are, you're not speaking your truth. It would be better for all of us to stop the phoniness and just be who we really are. Ugly, yes, but truthful.
  • Options
    hedonist wrote: »
    bsL, I don't give a shit if he (or anyone) gives not a rat's ass nor shit what others think; that's never been my point of this, and honestly, I wish that were the norm for more people.

    Speak your mind! I'd rather know where people stand, where their heart and mind lie, than keep it hidden or danced around.

    And I'll not set aside my right to applaud or critique it or anywhere in between - myself included.

    Me too, hedonist. I know so many people who are other what they appear to be. And that drives me crazy. Just be your freaking self so we are not disillusioned.
  • Options
    rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    My data was out so I couldn't jump in on thos thread but it has been a pleasure catching up.

    Lots of good stuff. Some folks posted some disturbing comments that place Iraqi lives below American lives... I was pretty surprised at how much nationalist zeal and glorification of war there is to be found in a forum for lovers of such anti-war scions as Pearl Jam. Sort of reminded me of the early 2000's, when our nationalism was strong and deluded, like the soviets of old or the national socialists, or NK today.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • Options
    riotgrlriotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,892
    paulonious wrote: »
    riotgrl wrote: »
    hedonist wrote: »
    I remember on some thread about god, a poster spoke of her "truths" and was mocked for daring to speak her mind. Here, in this little place, I for one, did / do give a shit about that and many other comments by said poster as well as by other posters on a plethora of topics.

    I'm willing to hear all views, whether by those who are "celebrated" or not. I'm also free to discount or disagree with those stances, and declare "no balls for you!"

    (who's to say we aren't doing something useful while speaking OUR minds? Not mutually-exclusive and actions need not be flaunted to have an impact)

    Moore essentially said "fuck snipers", by the way.

    Balls to the wall!

    Nicely said Hedonist!

    I rarely feel the need to comment on posts because this is a group that has widely varying perspectives and most seem to keep up with current events and have interesting thoughts about all these topics so I just check in to see those varying perspectives. While I'm no longer a huge fan of Moore and I haven't seen American Sniper yet, I have to wonder if our current round of soldiers do have some culpability in the war machine. I have the utmost respect for the men and women who risk their lives and are sent by the powers that be to fight various enemies around the world for a war they didn't create. But this is, and has been for a long while, a volunteer army. When you sign up you know that there is a good possibility that you have to fight and kill and probably go against your own moral code. Why choose that? No idea if that's what Moore meant but that is the question that keeps popping up in my mind as I read this thread.

    As the child of a Vietnam vet who suffered for over 40 years from untreated PTSD, I think these are conversations that should happen because the mental damage done to these soldiers is profound. And they affect everyone not just the soldier. If we have the conversation, then perhaps our government wouldn't be so eager to engage in war. Perhaps our children wouldn't be so eager to sign up for the military if recruiters had to be really honest with these kids about what it really entails - not just free college and good job skills training.

    and riding in a tank to a Godsmack tune.

    I think many enter the army because economically it's the only thing that makes sense for them. or they have a long family tradition of serving, and they feel it is in their lineage to "serve in the family business". and some literally get all caught up in the hero propaganda machine.

    I don't see kids wanting to follow in their parents footsteps as a negative. I would think they get a detailed briefing from their family as to what they are getting into.

    Unless they'v been so shattered by their experiences that they can't remember a great deal of it then I highly doubt the kids would get the full briefing that they need.
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • Options
    Jason PJason P Posts: 19,124
    what moore did took balls. what moore did, did not take balls.

    but...

    were they deflated?

    I wish he wore a Patriots hat instead of a Spartans hat. Then I could die in peace.
  • Options
    mikepegg44mikepegg44 Posts: 3,353
    paulonious wrote: »
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.

    Saying it is someone's belief is the same as saying it is their truth, not THE truth.


    But don't you think it dilutes and obfuscates the word `truth`? We don't get our own, that is the beauty of truth
    that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
    It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
    - Joe Rogan
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    callencallen Posts: 6,388
    edited January 2015
    Feel Moore has added to us society. Balls? He did interview and get into the face of the powerful.
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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 36,031
    mikepegg44 wrote: »
    paulonious wrote: »
    He uttered an opinion. What he said doesn't make it the truth.

    It's HIS truth. And he doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks of it. And that angers people. That's the point.

    Just to jump on this again, does it make it truth when people say racist remarks? They believe them to be true. When Ahmadinejad said the holocaust never happened is that the truth? It his belief not a truth.

    Saying it is someone's belief is the same as saying it is their truth, not THE truth.


    But don't you think it dilutes and obfuscates the word `truth`? We don't get our own, that is the beauty of truth

    I think maybe you are making that out to be more than it is. I'd say it's really just a figure of speech, just a way of saying that was his belief.

    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    mikepegg44mikepegg44 Posts: 3,353



    But don't you think it dilutes and obfuscates the word `truth`? We don't get our own, that is the beauty of truth
    [/quote]

    I think maybe you are making that out to be more than it is. I'd say it's really just a figure of speech, just a way of saying that was his belief.

    [/quote]
    you certainly could be right, I just don't particularly care for the phrase...

    On a side note, has any native english speaker tried to get through a day with out using a figure of speech or idiom? it is almost impossible. It is a fun drinking game that is for sure.
    that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
    It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
    - Joe Rogan
  • Options
    JimmyVJimmyV Boston's MetroWest Posts: 18,994
    Jason P wrote: »
    what moore did took balls. what moore did, did not take balls.

    but...

    were they deflated?

    I wish he wore a Patriots hat instead of a Spartans hat. Then I could die in peace.

    :|

    Safe to say this has been the least enjoyable Super Bowl fortnight ever.
    ___________________________________________

    "...I changed by not changing at all..."
  • Options
    hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
    JimmyV wrote: »
    Jason P wrote: »
    what moore did took balls. what moore did, did not take balls.

    but...

    were they deflated?

    I wish he wore a Patriots hat instead of a Spartans hat. Then I could die in peace.

    :|

    Safe to say this has been the least enjoyable Super Bowl fortnight ever.
    Pfft! I'll be watching the Puppy Bowl anyway.

    mike, your last comment reminded me of a scene from the Big Chill.

    I don't know anyone who could get through the day without two or three juicy rationalizations. They're more important than sex.
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    That he is a blowhard asshat.

    oh no you didnScreen-Shot-2014-10-19-at-2.15.50-PM.jpg
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    The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,442
    That he is a blowhard asshat.

    oh no you didnScreen-Shot-2014-10-19-at-2.15.50-PM.jpg

    How long do you think it took him to eat that microphone?
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Options
    It drives me crazy that we talk about things on here for days and then it becomes headlines to others.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/23/entertainment/american-sniper-misunderstood-feat/
  • Options
    oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,844
    It drives me crazy that we talk about things on here for days and then it becomes headlines to others.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/23/entertainment/american-sniper-misunderstood-feat/

    Doesn't that just mean we are ahead of the curve? :D

    Or perhaps the journalists are among us.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Options
    It drives me crazy that we talk about things on here for days and then it becomes headlines to others.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/23/entertainment/american-sniper-misunderstood-feat/

    Doesn't that just mean we are ahead of the curve? :D

    Or perhaps the journalists are among us.

    I feel sorry for them, they have entered the Pearl Jam zone.
    do do do do do do do do
    where is the pic when I need one?
This discussion has been closed.