I think we'd all like to see some of the rarer cuts of YIELD played at some point in time.
I think YIH has seen a majority of YIELD in some form in concert...he's only missing a few songs.
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
I think we'd all like to see some of the rarer cuts of YIELD played at some point in time.
I think YIH has seen a majority of YIELD in some form in concert...he's only missing a few songs.
PBM
For only seeing four shows, I've been pretty fortunate...Brain of J, Faithfull, GTF, Wishlist, DTE, In Hiding. Considering I haven't seen Go, Daughter, or Small Town once, I consider it damn lucky.
BRAIN OF J and IN HIDING are hard to come by. Of course, a lot of those songs were more readily accessible during the '98 tour.
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
BRAIN OF J and IN HIDING are hard to come by. Of course, a lot of those songs were more readily accessible during the '98 tour.
PBM
re what fanch said about faithfull, everyone likes it, when it comes to Brain OF J, and IN HIDING, most people that enjoy good rock like those tunes.
To try and elevate my discussion on this album, I have come to the conclusion that with No Code I kind of grew up in that era. But with YIELD I grew into a man, I was 26 when it came out, its no coincidence after GIVEN TO FLY, I became engaged, partyed the whole summer, wife got pregnant, there was alot of change going on back than. After about 2 yerars of this album everyday, baught a house and rebuilt it. YIELD has always been the album that put me into orbit as far as my connection with music and life. The last album that did this for me was 1984 from Van Halen. And I was young than.
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
I'm only 20, so I didn't really "grow up" with Pearl Jam as the band evolved, and I actually had heard many of the songs on Yield on live albums before I actually heard the studio versions. For me, Yield just represents the big transitioning point for the band, musically speaking. I felt like it was a middle ground, combining alot of things from the first 4 albums, and adding new things as well. No matter what my mood is, I can always put Yield in, and find a song that I can completely relate to. You don't find that very much.
For me, Yield just represents the big transitioning point for the band, musically speaking.
YIELD was the climax...I'll give Binaural some due credit...but it's been spotty since '98.
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
YIELD was the climax...I'll give Binaural some due credit...but it's been spotty since '98.
PBM
Yeah, I'd agree with that. Binaural has some great tracks, as does Riot Act, but doesn't have the balance that Yield has. And I'd say Avocado has some good tracks as well, but musically the album isn't as diverse.
It's been a rather long refractory period, don't you think?
Just bring in Jack as a creative consultant for Christ's sake.
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
Are you of the belief that Jack is a better drummer than Matt?
I'm not saying he's a better drummer technically...but creative inspiration lends itself to a lot of great music.
That's just me.
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
I'm not saying he's a better drummer technically...but creative inspiration lends itself to a lot of great music.
That's just me.
PBM
A valid point. Never thought of it that way, but I'd say that it'd be hard to gauge that sort of thing no? It's hard to say that No Code or Yield are fantastic purely because Jack was there. However, I do see your point. Personally though, I prefer Matt's drumming style to Jack's. Matt does some great stuff rhythmically, and has some really good drum fills too.
Just bring in Jack as a creative consultant for Christ's sake.
PBM
They should use 2 drummers, just like The Greatfull Dead did. I AM DEAD SERIOUS.
I love Matt Cameron.
But anyone who doesnt hear what Jack did on those 2 albums is deaf, Honestly the production alone speaks for itself. They have a more well balanced equal sound on his 2 albums, some of the other albums early and late the drums are a bit more silent along with the bass.
Are you of the belief that Jack is a better drummer than Matt?
Its hard to say better in music becasue there are so many differant things the 2 guys braught, Matt obviously physically is better.
But in the beggining when they started the band Stone and Jeff had Jack in mind, even before Ed.
So its a no brainer they were going to slip into the pocket tighter with him. Nothing aginst Matt, but in a band that thrives on feeling, they are going to exxcell with Dad on the drums before they recruit the guy from another team.
They should use 2 drummers, just like The Greatfull Dead did. I AM DEAD SERIOUS.
I love Matt Cameron.
But anyone who doesnt hear what Jack did on those 2 albums is deaf, Honestly the production alone speaks for itself. They have a more well balanced equal sound on his 2 albums, some of the other albums early and late the drums are a bit more silent along with the bass.
Jack just pounds the bass drum too much IMO. Matt is much more balanced. And I think live, just listening to the boots, Matt does a better job
A valid point. Never thought of it that way, but I'd say that it'd be hard to gauge that sort of thing no? It's hard to say that No Code or Yield are fantastic purely because Jack was there. However, I do see your point. Personally though, I prefer Matt's drumming style to Jack's. Matt does some great stuff rhythmically, and has some really good drum fills too.
very tru, but honestly the fill ins on No Code, YIELD, and Mirrorball, arfe probably as good as they can sound for Pearl Jam, but that lends itself to production also, which goes back to Jeff and Stone's vision on their sound initially.
Jack just pounds the bass drum too much IMO. Matt is much more balanced. And I think live, just listening to the boots, Matt does a better job
Yes Matt is physically better live, shit he is tight, Jack obviously couldnt take the touring, who could at his age, this is why the Dead had 2 drummers, they really didnt tour much when he joined. Matt is fabulous live I love what he brings to the band.
Honestly you dont think the 3 albums I mentioned fit better in the studio as far as drums compared to every other album?
Yes Matt is physically better live, shit he is tight, Jack obviously couldnt take the touring, who could at his age, this is why the Dead had 2 drummers, they really didnt tour much when he joined. Matt is fabulous live I love what he brings to the band.
Honestly you dont think the 3 albums I mentioned fit better in the studio as far as drums compared to every other album?
No, I would agree with you on the studio end. It's hard to say though. I mean, could Jack do justice to a song like Grievance, or Cropduster? I don't know.
In a band that thrives on feeling, they are going to exxcell with Dad on the drums before they recruit the guy from another team.
I like this analogy a lot. Thumbs up man!
PBM
"We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"
No, I would agree with you on the studio end. It's hard to say though. I mean, could Jack do justice to a song like Grievance, or Cropduster? I don't know.
Great songs to mention. Every rocker on Binaurul was off, everyone blamed production, personally I thought Grievance, Breakerfall, and Gods Dice were lacking the punch of songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, Faithfull, now obviously they are not the same songs, but the flow and raw emotion was on the generic side for Eds screaming. I thought the drums were good enough but the fills were a lil to quick and had more of a basic 4/4 50s kind of beat, where Jack had these drum rolls on YIELD and No Code that seemd to have a lil more substance. Now live the Binaurul songs were much better. Now this is from the perspective of a fan, I am not a drummer, I am just giving pure opinion.
As far as Cropduster well that is a purely differant direction, so I doubt the band woukld have done that with Jack, I like Matts Harmonizing at the end of that one, but in Jacks defense I love his singing on The Whale song.
So the easy answer comes down to this the band respects Matt enough to write his songs, but when it really comes down to it they probably dont bow down to him when they write theirs.
They should bring back Jack to a certain degree, it would not hurt things at all. Matt is proved he is no headcase, and wouldnt mind.
Every rocker on Binaurul was off, everyone blamed production, personally I thought Grievance, Breakerfall, and Gods Dice were lacking the punch of songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, Faithfull
I don't know if that's so much Matt as it is Tchad Blake's producing. Live, Matt really nails those songs. The drums on Binaural had a funky sound to em, but live those songs are much better. Plus, I would say on songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, and Faithfull, Matt doesn't really miss a step.
I don't know if that's so much Matt as it is Tchad Blake's producing. Live, Matt really nails those songs. The drums on Binaural had a funky sound to em, but live those songs are much better. Plus, I would say on songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, and Faithfull, Matt doesn't really miss a step.
Matt never misses a step, live he is great, Im talking feeling, as far as studio production, but on those songs matt opts for an almost 4/4 early rock kind of simplistic drum beat, where I feel jack adds a lil off beat fill in.
Matt never misses a step, live he is great, Im talking feeling, as far as studio production, but on those songs matt opts for an almost 4/4 early rock kind of simplistic drum beat, where I feel jack adds a lil off beat fill in.
Yeah, I'd agree with you on that, a very good point. How do you feel about what Matt did with In My Tree in 2000? I think he did alright with it. Personally, I prefer the newer In My Tree, I'm one of the few.
Yeah, I'd agree with you on that, a very good point. How do you feel about what Matt did with In My Tree in 2000? I think he did alright with it. Personally, I prefer the newer In My Tree, I'm one of the few.
Matts is fine with everything, I have no problem with his drunning, I liked in my tree, I think the point here is how the band responded to jack.
I thoguth this while Im here listening to my shuffle.
1 Its safe to say Matts drums in SG are better than his PJ drums. I vote yes.
2 Jacks drums on these 2 albums are on the level of Matts drums in SG.
Matt was an integral part of SG his drums were almost the bands signature behind Chris with his rolls and time signatures, and off beats. I feel the same way when I listen to Jack on YIELD and No Code, they are a very serious part of the vibe, more so on YIELD becasue Im guessing the band felt more cohesive after a tour and album.
I just dont think the drums are as involved in the overall sound, its like they write their songs and he puts the drums in. Now of course severed hand and other stuff they rock out in but its differant, its almost more technical rather than grooveing
A good part to feel the differance is in Present Tense, right before they rock out the band kinda slows down and speeds up with the bass and drums kind of holding eachother together. Now Matt misses that but speeds the song up at the end.
Matts is fine with everything, I have no problem with his drunning, I liked in my tree, I think the point here is how the band responded to jack.
I thoguth this while Im here listening to my shuffle.
1 Its safe to say Matts drums in SG are better than his PJ drums. I vote yes.
2 Jacks drums on these 2 albums are on the level of Matts drums in SG.
Matt was an integral part of SG his drums were almost the bands signature behind Chris with his rolls and time signatures, and off beats. I feel the same way when I listen to Jack on YIELD and No Code, they are a very serious part of the vibe, more so on YIELD becasue Im guessing the band felt more cohesive after a tour and album.
I just dont think the drums are as involved in the overall sound, its like they write their songs and he puts the drums in. Now of course severed hand and other stuff they rock out in but its differant, its almost more technical rather than grooveing
A good part to feel the differance is in Present Tense, right before they rock out the band kinda slows down and speeds up with the bass and drums kind of holding eachother together. Now Matt misses that but speeds the song up at the end.
I will say the band as a whole plays songs, like Severed Hand, much faster than they should. You are right though, Matt's drums in SG aren't the same as they are now in PJ. Not better or worse in my opinion, just different.
I think a good song to hear where Matt is better is listening to a live boot of Animal or Corduroy, where Jack's little fills would get him in trouble live, and could throw things off a bit. Plus on Animal, Jack would try to do too much with the song. It isn't about the drums on Animal, but at times he'd try and make it about the drums.
Edit: Just listened to Glorified G from 95 at soldier field, and I think the reason I don't like what Jack does is because he uses the bass drum alot more than Matt does and it feels like the song plods along.
Comments
I think we'd all like to see some of the rarer cuts of YIELD played at some point in time.
I think YIH has seen a majority of YIELD in some form in concert...he's only missing a few songs.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
For only seeing four shows, I've been pretty fortunate...Brain of J, Faithfull, GTF, Wishlist, DTE, In Hiding. Considering I haven't seen Go, Daughter, or Small Town once, I consider it damn lucky.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
re what fanch said about faithfull, everyone likes it, when it comes to Brain OF J, and IN HIDING, most people that enjoy good rock like those tunes.
To try and elevate my discussion on this album, I have come to the conclusion that with No Code I kind of grew up in that era. But with YIELD I grew into a man, I was 26 when it came out, its no coincidence after GIVEN TO FLY, I became engaged, partyed the whole summer, wife got pregnant, there was alot of change going on back than. After about 2 yerars of this album everyday, baught a house and rebuilt it. YIELD has always been the album that put me into orbit as far as my connection with music and life. The last album that did this for me was 1984 from Van Halen. And I was young than.
no more shows
I can get on board with that.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
YIELD was the climax...I'll give Binaural some due credit...but it's been spotty since '98.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
Yeah, I'd agree with that. Binaural has some great tracks, as does Riot Act, but doesn't have the balance that Yield has. And I'd say Avocado has some good tracks as well, but musically the album isn't as diverse.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
It's been a rather long refractory period, don't you think?
Just bring in Jack as a creative consultant for Christ's sake.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
Are you of the belief that Jack is a better drummer than Matt?
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
I'm not saying he's a better drummer technically...but creative inspiration lends itself to a lot of great music.
That's just me.
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
A valid point. Never thought of it that way, but I'd say that it'd be hard to gauge that sort of thing no? It's hard to say that No Code or Yield are fantastic purely because Jack was there. However, I do see your point. Personally though, I prefer Matt's drumming style to Jack's. Matt does some great stuff rhythmically, and has some really good drum fills too.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
Why are you not going to any shows this tour, you are going to be so upset when they play tons of YIELD.
Funny as I sit hear FAITHFULL rocking on my computer.
no more shows
Yes but Binaurul is a fans only album, its hard to celebrate life with that album, it is great though.
no more shows
They should use 2 drummers, just like The Greatfull Dead did. I AM DEAD SERIOUS.
I love Matt Cameron.
But anyone who doesnt hear what Jack did on those 2 albums is deaf, Honestly the production alone speaks for itself. They have a more well balanced equal sound on his 2 albums, some of the other albums early and late the drums are a bit more silent along with the bass.
no more shows
But in the beggining when they started the band Stone and Jeff had Jack in mind, even before Ed.
So its a no brainer they were going to slip into the pocket tighter with him. Nothing aginst Matt, but in a band that thrives on feeling, they are going to exxcell with Dad on the drums before they recruit the guy from another team.
no more shows
Jack just pounds the bass drum too much IMO. Matt is much more balanced. And I think live, just listening to the boots, Matt does a better job
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
very tru, but honestly the fill ins on No Code, YIELD, and Mirrorball, arfe probably as good as they can sound for Pearl Jam, but that lends itself to production also, which goes back to Jeff and Stone's vision on their sound initially.
no more shows
Yes Matt is physically better live, shit he is tight, Jack obviously couldnt take the touring, who could at his age, this is why the Dead had 2 drummers, they really didnt tour much when he joined. Matt is fabulous live I love what he brings to the band.
Honestly you dont think the 3 albums I mentioned fit better in the studio as far as drums compared to every other album?
no more shows
No, I would agree with you on the studio end. It's hard to say though. I mean, could Jack do justice to a song like Grievance, or Cropduster? I don't know.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
I like this analogy a lot. Thumbs up man!
PBM
Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
Great songs to mention. Every rocker on Binaurul was off, everyone blamed production, personally I thought Grievance, Breakerfall, and Gods Dice were lacking the punch of songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, Faithfull, now obviously they are not the same songs, but the flow and raw emotion was on the generic side for Eds screaming. I thought the drums were good enough but the fills were a lil to quick and had more of a basic 4/4 50s kind of beat, where Jack had these drum rolls on YIELD and No Code that seemd to have a lil more substance. Now live the Binaurul songs were much better. Now this is from the perspective of a fan, I am not a drummer, I am just giving pure opinion.
As far as Cropduster well that is a purely differant direction, so I doubt the band woukld have done that with Jack, I like Matts Harmonizing at the end of that one, but in Jacks defense I love his singing on The Whale song.
So the easy answer comes down to this the band respects Matt enough to write his songs, but when it really comes down to it they probably dont bow down to him when they write theirs.
They should bring back Jack to a certain degree, it would not hurt things at all. Matt is proved he is no headcase, and wouldnt mind.
no more shows
Thank you, I always enjoy reading your posts so Im glad to add some thought.
no more shows
I don't know if that's so much Matt as it is Tchad Blake's producing. Live, Matt really nails those songs. The drums on Binaural had a funky sound to em, but live those songs are much better. Plus, I would say on songs like Hail Hail, Brain of J, and Faithfull, Matt doesn't really miss a step.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
Matt never misses a step, live he is great, Im talking feeling, as far as studio production, but on those songs matt opts for an almost 4/4 early rock kind of simplistic drum beat, where I feel jack adds a lil off beat fill in.
no more shows
Yeah, I'd agree with you on that, a very good point. How do you feel about what Matt did with In My Tree in 2000? I think he did alright with it. Personally, I prefer the newer In My Tree, I'm one of the few.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.
Matts is fine with everything, I have no problem with his drunning, I liked in my tree, I think the point here is how the band responded to jack.
I thoguth this while Im here listening to my shuffle.
1 Its safe to say Matts drums in SG are better than his PJ drums. I vote yes.
2 Jacks drums on these 2 albums are on the level of Matts drums in SG.
Matt was an integral part of SG his drums were almost the bands signature behind Chris with his rolls and time signatures, and off beats. I feel the same way when I listen to Jack on YIELD and No Code, they are a very serious part of the vibe, more so on YIELD becasue Im guessing the band felt more cohesive after a tour and album.
I just dont think the drums are as involved in the overall sound, its like they write their songs and he puts the drums in. Now of course severed hand and other stuff they rock out in but its differant, its almost more technical rather than grooveing
A good part to feel the differance is in Present Tense, right before they rock out the band kinda slows down and speeds up with the bass and drums kind of holding eachother together. Now Matt misses that but speeds the song up at the end.
no more shows
I will say the band as a whole plays songs, like Severed Hand, much faster than they should. You are right though, Matt's drums in SG aren't the same as they are now in PJ. Not better or worse in my opinion, just different.
I think a good song to hear where Matt is better is listening to a live boot of Animal or Corduroy, where Jack's little fills would get him in trouble live, and could throw things off a bit. Plus on Animal, Jack would try to do too much with the song. It isn't about the drums on Animal, but at times he'd try and make it about the drums.
Edit: Just listened to Glorified G from 95 at soldier field, and I think the reason I don't like what Jack does is because he uses the bass drum alot more than Matt does and it feels like the song plods along.
Mansfield II '08
EV Solo Shows:
NYC I
NJPAC
I. LOVE. YIELD.