Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
i find it extremely distasteful for you to suggest i am getting satisfaction of putting others down. frankly sir YOU ARE the only one who is putting people down. i referenced an article with facts. you are throwing labels on people out there.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
i find it extremely distasteful for you to suggest i am getting satisfaction of putting others down. frankly sir YOU ARE the only one who is putting people down. i referenced an article with facts. you are throwing labels on people out there.
Your facts and article don't counter my argument. And believe as you will.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
Your stat and link do nothing to counter my argument and your not understanding or not wanting to.
So you don't care to answer the question I posed to you? Did you even bother to look at the data (you sometimes don't)?
I, and everyone else, fully understand what you are saying. The problem is... you have oversimplified the situation and consistently fail to acknowledge other variables that may or may not contribute to the epidemic.
It's just not as simple as you would like to suggest it is.
Think it's a cop out to say "hey if they just tried harder", Then feel free to bash the folks that have shit environment. Realize it makes one feel all warm and fuzzy but it's shit. The whole black on black crime rant is racism. We're all humans. We are all products of our environment.
you really don't have to work very hard NOT to murder someone or commit a violent crime. not everyone in 'shit environments' as you label them does those things. We are all humans...some of us just treat other humans better than others.
The haves have not a fkn clue.
You aren't special. If you were born in that environment you would react the same.
they how do you explain those born in that environment that don't act the same? please enlighten us.
and I am special.
You are focusing on the wrong thing. Of course not every person who grows up in that environment is that kind of criminal. The majority of them aren't. But pretty much every single person who is that kind of criminal did grow up in that kind of environment, and that is the stat that matters. For your point to make any sense, some of them would have to be the products of a more privileged environment, and that is obviously not the case.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So please explain how and why we have so much crime and death in our poor inner cities?
Ah we're getting somewhere now.
I will take that one...lack of personal responsibility and impulse control is a start.
It goes deeper than that -- for instance, why are these impulses that cannot be controlled often violent ones and why is personal responsibility shrugged off?
Keep asking why, and we might find an answer -- or at least some semblance of understanding and compassion.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
this is precisely it.
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
this is precisely it.
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
I agree with much of what you say here, but I do think that cultural aspects are talking points in a discussion such as this.
Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
this is precisely it.
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
I agree with much of what you say here, but I do think that cultural aspects are talking points in a discussion such as this.
can you clarify what you mean by "cultural aspects"?
Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
this is precisely it.
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
I agree with much of what you say here, but I do think that cultural aspects are talking points in a discussion such as this.
can you clarify what you mean by "cultural aspects"?
Sure.
You used the First Nations people in your example. Their culture differs in that they don't engage in the rat race as much as the European Canadian (I wasn't sure how to express a Canadian citizen not of First Nation descent). From what I have come to know of First Nation people... many seek harmony with the earth. As much as I can appreciate that and be envious of it to some degree... it places some First Nation people in a precarious position relevant to economical prosperity.
Further... their culture is one that carries- for good reason- a high level of distrust for white people. This distrust manifests itself in many ways that limit engagement with mainstream society.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
I see you're asking questions of people. Did you care to take a stab at this question I've posed to you for the third time?
I've addressed this from my first post over and over again.
Yes violence is byproduct of our society.
Income distribution Corporate profit. Education Racism On and on and on.
And dont put words in my mouth. If you do crime you do time, has to be that way but how do we make things better?
Thirty you are the product of your environment and Birth. You are not special or smart or enlightened. Just lucky mofo as am I. For you to say "hey you guys Do good" is being simplistic. I know it feels good to point fingers and comforting but your no better than any other human.
The whole mentality of Blacks need to stop killing blacks is moronic and racist. It's humans killing humans.
Will say that cops do get short end if the stick in dealing with crime as we rely on them to manage our social failures
Remember folks we are debating, don't get your panties in a wad. I know my posts are provocative
Cal,all based on the numbers in the Philly paper story.
To be honest didn't even read it. The whole black on black crime and they need to take care if their own before talking of others just reeks to me.
Peace.
wait so you are ripping on me for posting the article with stats and you didn't even read it? come on man. that's weak
So what message did you receive from article?
that black on black crime is a huge problem that is not being adequately addressed. it's not about talking points and slogans but about facts
Again it's not black on black crime it's poor uneducated humans born into a shit life crime against poor uneducated humans born into a shit life.
The term "black on black crime" is used by humans that have need to feel superior. But they aren't, just lucky mofo's.
And why don't we discuss solutions? How do make this situation better?
Education, jobs, hope. None of this exists for many.
Things are tough so I'm going to kill someone?
Is this ultimately what you are saying?
Not saying that at all.
We are all products of our environment. It's not a race thing. Affluent blacks living in nice areas if the country don't have kids that do crime as thise in poor projects. So I'm dying blaming it on race is wrong and incorrect. Hence my strong opposition of comments made after story was presented and those got in the black on black crime chant.
i don't think anyone is disagreeing on the cause...but when you put down on a file the race of the victim and the race of the perpratraitor the numbers ultimately fall at much greater proportions to both being black. those are facts that are indisputable.
But the race isn't the contributing factor so why bring it up?
this is precisely it.
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
I agree with much of what you say here, but I do think that cultural aspects are talking points in a discussion such as this.
can you clarify what you mean by "cultural aspects"?
Sure.
You used the First Nations people in your example. Their culture differs in that they don't engage in the rat race as much as the European Canadian (I wasn't sure how to express a Canadian citizen not of First Nation descent). From what I have come to know of First Nation people... many seek harmony with the earth. As much as I can appreciate that and be envious of it to some degree... it places some First Nation people in a precarious position relevant to economical prosperity.
Further... their culture is one that carries- for good reason- a high level of distrust for white people. This distrust manifests itself in many ways that limit engagement with mainstream society.
it is an incredibly difficult situation, as you said. on one hand, we FORCED them into our way of life, and now we sit back and wonder why they can't succeed, for the most part, at something that goes against their very nature.
obviously, they can't go back to the way things were for their culturally. so how do we handle it? well, throwing money at it hasn't worked. Duh. I can't for the life of me understand why anyone thought that would work in the first place.
anyway, I think I may have contributed slightly to this thread being a little derailed, so maybe a new/separate thread on cultural economic disparity should be created.
Find it distasteful for humans born and raised in decent neighborhoods with decent family support systems to look down at another subgroup and say...."just do better, be responsible".
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is mainstream society completely responsible for the 'black on black' crime that's being dissected at the moment?
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
I see you're asking questions of people. Did you care to take a stab at this question I've posed to you for the third time?
I've addressed this from my first post over and over again.
Yes violence is byproduct of our society.
Income distribution Corporate profit. Education Racism On and on and on.
And dont put words in my mouth. If you do crime you do time, has to be that way but how do we make things better?
Thirty you are the product of your environment and Birth. You are not special or smart or enlightened. Just lucky mofo as am I. For you to say "hey you guys Do good" is being simplistic. I know it feels good to point fingers and comforting but your no better than any other human.
The whole mentality of Blacks need to stop killing blacks is moronic and racist. It's humans killing humans.
Will say that cops do get short end if the stick in dealing with crime as we rely on them to manage our social failures
Remember folks we are debating, don't get your panties in a wad. I know my posts are provocative
. Thirty I know you know...
This question, Callen: Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
So your answer is 'yes'. You are saying society is to blame for two thirds of black children being raised by a single parent. It's interesting that you say this.
I would disagree. I agree that it is a contributing factor, but its not the deciding factor. I would suggest that the cycle of children being raised by single parents is in full gear and perpetuating itself. There are reasons- such as the one you keep insisting- for this epidemic, but let's not deny it.
* I'm not saying anything at all about genetics that distinguish one race from another. But I could though. I do believe there are inherent differences amongst the races that cannot be disputed very easily. For example... how many Chinese people do you see in the NBA compared to black people? It should be equal if people are all the same... but we are not. I'm not saying one race is better than the next race: we are different... and I have no problem with that at all.
As for your silly question... no... no one race isn't hornier than another.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
but how can we expect parents in these situations to "step up" when they had no model to follow? they were part of the cycle as well. society needs to step up for them and help.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
but how can we expect parents in these situations to "step up" when they had no model to follow? they were part of the cycle as well. society needs to step up for them and help.
This is the million dollar question.
There are conditions which are not favourable to making the correction, but some of the variables that perpetuate the situation are internal. It's not completely 'society's fault'.
Listen... I don't know how I'm coming across, but know this: I have an extreme amount of respect and admiration for a people that were released from bondage with nothing but the clothes on their back and in relatively little time... ascended to the presidency of the country that once held them in chains. A freaking unbelievable accomplishment and unparalleled progress when you think of it.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
but how can we expect parents in these situations to "step up" when they had no model to follow? they were part of the cycle as well. society needs to step up for them and help.
do you suggest we personally put condoms on them? how does society fix the problem of unwanted children and absentee fathers? sorry parenthood is a PERSONAL responsibility, not societies.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
but how can we expect parents in these situations to "step up" when they had no model to follow? they were part of the cycle as well. society needs to step up for them and help.
do you suggest we personally put condoms on them? how does society fix the problem of unwanted children and absentee fathers? sorry parenthood is a PERSONAL responsibility, not societies.
society is responsible for the current situation. society put them in that position through oppression/cultural genocide/slavery/etc.
they need to be willing partners, but yes, it is a societal issue. that's what a civilized society IS.
if you grew up being neglected and beaten, chances are you would do the same, especially if it was the social norm. and that happened in the first place because of what the Europeans did to them.
I've answered this repeatedly. You are the product of your environment. Call the environment what you like. (Society).
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
how do you know how Thirty or anyone else on here was brought up or in what environment they were brought up in? I am sure there are some people on here who weren't brought up with a golden spoon in their mouth. stop it already.
if you grow up around gang bangers, hookers, drugs, and crime, chances are that cycle will repeat. just as my dad was a white collar office worker, so are his kids. are there anomalies? of course there are. but it's not the norm. you are born into a herd, you adopt their behaviours and tendencies. saying "I have a (insert downtrodden minority here) friend who got out of the ghetto and is leading a productive life, so I know it can be done" isn't a plausible argument. those are the exceptions to the rule.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
Agreed.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
but how can we expect parents in these situations to "step up" when they had no model to follow? they were part of the cycle as well. society needs to step up for them and help.
This is the million dollar question.
There are conditions which are not favourable to making the correction, but some of the variables that perpetuate the situation are internal. It's not completely 'society's fault'.
Listen... I don't know how I'm coming across, but know this: I have an extreme amount of respect and admiration for a people that were released from bondage with nothing but the clothes on their back and in relatively little time... ascended to the presidency of the country that once held them in chains. A freaking unbelievable accomplishment and unparalleled progress when you think of it.
to me, you are coming across as a person with intellgent thoughts and respectful discussion points.
it started as society's fault. and it went from there. these things don't happen naturally. and the government thought throwing money at them and giving them land would help. well come on, you give the leader of any community all the cash, and say "disperse equally as you see fit, good luck", and then act surprised when the chief has a giant house and everyone else's is dilapidated. that type of corruption and greed happens in all walks of life. it's just so much more obvious on small reserves.
Comments
Demonstrates ignorance and insecurities. Everyone is the product of their environment. No one is special or more virtuous. Just more fortunate not have been born in a really bad situation.
So you can either point and shout and snicker and profess your self perceived superiority or you can look at the reasons things are the way they are and address how we as a society can do better.
Unfortunately the satisfaction of putting others down is to strong.
Is society responsible for the fact that two thirds of young black children are raised by single parents?
http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data/tables/107-children-in-single-parent-families-by#detailed/1/any/false/36,868,867,133,38/10,168,9,12,1,13,185/432,431
I, and everyone else, fully understand what you are saying. The problem is... you have oversimplified the situation and consistently fail to acknowledge other variables that may or may not contribute to the epidemic.
It's just not as simple as you would like to suggest it is.
So please explain how and why we have so much crime and death in our poor inner cities?
Ah we're getting somewhere now.
Keep asking why, and we might find an answer -- or at least some semblance of understanding and compassion.
I see you're asking questions of people. Did you care to take a stab at this question I've posed to you for the third time?
it's not black on black crime. it's poor person on poor person crime. race is irrelevant, and it is part of the roadblock to solving the issue. there are poor neighbourhoods in every big city. some are predominantly black, some are predominantly white, some are aboriginal (as is the case in my city).
I find that racism is the biggest roadblock to getting the issue solved. "if those lazy fucking indians would just get off their asses and get a job" is the usual one I hear, even from friends, co workers, and family. it's disgusting. that's why it doesn't get the support from the public that it should in addressing it. they don't get it that being oppressed for generations is not something you can just "get over". all of society needs to contribute to the solution, otherwise, politicians won't get behind it to affect actual positive change.
we need to stop talking about race and solve the actual issue.
www.headstonesband.com
www.headstonesband.com
You used the First Nations people in your example. Their culture differs in that they don't engage in the rat race as much as the European Canadian (I wasn't sure how to express a Canadian citizen not of First Nation descent). From what I have come to know of First Nation people... many seek harmony with the earth. As much as I can appreciate that and be envious of it to some degree... it places some First Nation people in a precarious position relevant to economical prosperity.
Further... their culture is one that carries- for good reason- a high level of distrust for white people. This distrust manifests itself in many ways that limit engagement with mainstream society.
Yes violence is byproduct of our society.
Income distribution
Corporate profit.
Education
Racism
On and on and on.
And dont put words in my mouth. If you do crime you do time, has to be that way but how do we make things better?
Thirty you are the product of your environment and Birth. You are not special or smart or enlightened. Just lucky mofo as am I. For you to say "hey you guys Do good" is being simplistic. I know it feels good to point fingers and comforting but your no better than any other human.
The whole mentality of Blacks need to stop killing blacks is moronic and racist. It's humans killing humans.
Will say that cops do get short end if the stick in dealing with crime as we rely on them to manage our social failures
Remember folks we are debating, don't get your panties in a wad. I know my posts are provocative
. Thirty I know you know...
obviously, they can't go back to the way things were for their culturally. so how do we handle it? well, throwing money at it hasn't worked. Duh. I can't for the life of me understand why anyone thought that would work in the first place.
anyway, I think I may have contributed slightly to this thread being a little derailed, so maybe a new/separate thread on cultural economic disparity should be created.
www.headstonesband.com
(source is in my original post)
You aren't special Thirty. Your views action opportunities are programmed by your environment.
What are you trying to say thirty? Please explain your question. Are you relating race with promiscuity? Is it a gene? If you feel so just say it.
most people don't move up or down an ecomomic or social class. they generally stay in the one they were born into and grew up in. that's the whole point. it's not a racial thing. it's a human nature thing.
www.headstonesband.com
I would disagree. I agree that it is a contributing factor, but its not the deciding factor. I would suggest that the cycle of children being raised by single parents is in full gear and perpetuating itself. There are reasons- such as the one you keep insisting- for this epidemic, but let's not deny it.
* I'm not saying anything at all about genetics that distinguish one race from another. But I could though. I do believe there are inherent differences amongst the races that cannot be disputed very easily. For example... how many Chinese people do you see in the NBA compared to black people? It should be equal if people are all the same... but we are not. I'm not saying one race is better than the next race: we are different... and I have no problem with that at all.
As for your silly question... no... no one race isn't hornier than another.
There are other human instincts too, Hugh: paternal and maternal instincts.
My point, if it is not obvious, is that if you leave children to raise themselves... they are doomed to failure. When two thirds of your population is raised by a single parent and such a practice entrenches itself as the norm... that's not going to play out well for future generations.
People keep asking for solutions to the problem. I'm trying to illustrate one: eventually, people need to fulfill their responsibility as parents in some of these communities. How is that going to happen? I don't know. Conditions aren't favourable for that reversing itself anytime soon, but its fair to say that kids need a semblance of normalcy before they grow into hardened adults (or adolescents for that matter) destined for anything but success.
www.headstonesband.com
There are conditions which are not favourable to making the correction, but some of the variables that perpetuate the situation are internal. It's not completely 'society's fault'.
Listen... I don't know how I'm coming across, but know this: I have an extreme amount of respect and admiration for a people that were released from bondage with nothing but the clothes on their back and in relatively little time... ascended to the presidency of the country that once held them in chains. A freaking unbelievable accomplishment and unparalleled progress when you think of it.
they need to be willing partners, but yes, it is a societal issue. that's what a civilized society IS.
if you grew up being neglected and beaten, chances are you would do the same, especially if it was the social norm. and that happened in the first place because of what the Europeans did to them.
www.headstonesband.com
it started as society's fault. and it went from there. these things don't happen naturally. and the government thought throwing money at them and giving them land would help. well come on, you give the leader of any community all the cash, and say "disperse equally as you see fit, good luck", and then act surprised when the chief has a giant house and everyone else's is dilapidated. that type of corruption and greed happens in all walks of life. it's just so much more obvious on small reserves.
www.headstonesband.com