Yes, we can, what we can't is agree on the point who does it... and why it has been done, and who's to blame for it, etc, etc...
I see what you're saying. We can only go by the evidence we have. So far I think the evidence is pretty conclusive where the blame lies. I won't post any of that info here since it would be pretty redundant given the amount of evidence posted on this thread and others these last few weeks.
'Conflicting' reports suggest there have been documented cases of Hamas hiding behind their people in this fight- in other words, trying to take advantage of international laws to keep their munitions free from attack. This wouldn't be the first time such a tactic was employed and if true... I don't think anyone should be surprised. So, I would say if boot is offering this for perspective- he's in bounds for doing so. I don't think he offered the post to... as some others have consistently done... defend an indefensible Israel.
But ultimately, it doesn't matter. Israel's actions have far exceeded any decent person's tolerance level. Badbrains' white phosphorous link makes my blood boil. It is quite evident they care very little for the Palestinians or give a shit what the rest of the world thinks: this event, as bad as it was two weeks ago, is escalating in intensity.
At this point in time, it must be evidently clear that Israel is hell bent on an agenda, ruthlessly following through on that agenda, willing to suffer the short term consequences relevant to international perceptions and relations, and hoping for short term memories in the aftermath.
Israel has their Final Solution
anybody else see the irony in that???
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
i just kidnapped and abducted a Canadian soldier that crossed the border to shoot at my neighbor's house?? i love the use of certain terminology in the MM, my all time favorite during hurricane katrina...evacuees instead of refugees. evacuees? when and what we they going back to?
"I think Israel needs to stop shelling Palestine. It is totally one-sided at this point in civilians being killed. But don't act like Hamas is totally innocent in all of this. In a conflict lasting 50 years there has to be at least one bad thing both sides have done and it is tough to agree with some of you when you act like Hamas walks on water and has done no wrong ever"
I think a lot of us Bootlegger hold this opinion.We don't agree with the horror that is befalling the Palestinians right now and with good conscience can't help but feel for the innocent lives lost.And hope they soon feel real freedom.But the above also has to be factored in.Hamas is weighing down their cause like an anchor.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
to be honest I had been surprised it was as quiet as it appeared to be before this all started. What with all the strife ongoing in the region and elsewhere. I might have thought soemthing would have popped off befroe this. I guess the reconciliation of PA/Hamas governance to create a unity government was unacceptable to the occupiers.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
lets be like most of americans and ignore or disbelieve that israel is bombing innocent civilians and think about the list of reasons why a nation/state would bomb: mosques/churches and places of worship hospitals and ambulances shelters schools/universities water and power plants roadways bridges ...a real short list of reason
there also is a real short list of those who need to dig tunnels...1. prisoners 2.? 3?
Twice now you've admitted that Hamas stored weapons in schools, and yet you can't even remotely admit that they shouldn't be doing that.
This is beside the point. The claim made was that Hamas has used human shields. It hasn't.
Carry on...
Do you think the the UN cares about schools and hospitals because of the bricks and mortar of the buildings? No, it is because there are innocent people that are in those buildings. So using a school to store weapons is in fact using people as a shield and is putting innocent people at risk who may go to that school after it has been turned into a target by Hamas.
Anyway, after 5 posts of deflecting, I can only conclude you are okay with Hamas storing weapons in schools. No one is going to think you support Israel if you are critical of Hamas. They might actually respect you for being thoughtful instead of close-minded to anything that doesn't support your view.
For example: It is not okay for Hamas to kidnap a soldier during an agreed upon ceasefire, but that doesn't make it right for Israel to retaliate and kill 50+ civilians in Palestine. If you can't admit that it makes you sound like you just don't like Israel instead of supporting Palestinians.
Well yeah, this human shield thing is a moot issue to me. So what if Hamas were using children as human shields? Is that Israel's idea of a reason the go ahead and kill the human shields, aka children? Wtf kind of explanation or justification is that, be it propaganda or otherwise? Does Israel think the world is okay with deliberately bombing children just because their enemy put them there on purpose? Ummm, seems to me like the Israeli government has lost touch with reality as far as PR goes. The deliberate bombing of innocent civilians can't be justified this day and age. Even the US government can't figure out a way to keep support this... very interested to see Wtf the US is going to do now with the way things are going.
As for the disgusting, mealy-mouthed motherfucker Stephen Harper, he has reiterated his support of the Israeli government (aka reiterated his burning desire to let Obama fuck him up the ass), and is incapable of understanding that supporting Israel is not the only option if you don't support Hamas (which I don't think anyone should do either). He has encouraged other governments to continue supporting Israel, clinging to the idea that all of this is 100% Hamas's fault. It's fucking ludicrous..... well, perhaps if nothing else happen, his stubborn and embarrassing g position on this will be what causes him to lose the next election. [-O<
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
surprised they haven't said "kidnapped", just to skew it further.
They have used that word.
Captured, abducted, kidnapped... that really all means the same thing to me. That a soldier was taken. I don't give a shit which word is used. It changes nothing. Are people really gullible enough to allow those different words to influence their impression of what happened? That's pathetic.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Twice now you've admitted that Hamas stored weapons in schools, and yet you can't even remotely admit that they shouldn't be doing that.
This is beside the point. The claim made was that Hamas has used human shields. It hasn't.
Carry on...
Do you think the the UN cares about schools and hospitals because of the bricks and mortar of the buildings? No, it is because there are innocent people that are in those buildings. So using a school to store weapons is in fact using people as a shield and is putting innocent people at risk who may go to that school after it has been turned into a target by Hamas.
Anyway, after 5 posts of deflecting, I can only conclude you are okay with Hamas storing weapons in schools. No one is going to think you support Israel if you are critical of Hamas. They might actually respect you for being thoughtful instead of close-minded to anything that doesn't support your view.
For example: It is not okay for Hamas to kidnap a soldier during an agreed upon ceasefire, but that doesn't make it right for Israel to retaliate and kill 50+ civilians in Palestine. If you can't admit that it makes you sound like you just don't like Israel instead of supporting Palestinians.
If I'm correct, those schools were abandoned, they were not schools anymore. The UN abandoned them some time ago.
so based on that, its (2 my mind) incorrect to say that Hamas stores weapons in schools.
surprised they haven't said "kidnapped", just to skew it further.
They have used that word.
Captured, an ducted, kidnapped... that really all means the same thing to me. That a soldier was taken. I don't give a shit which word is used. It changes nothing. Are people really gullible enough to allow those different words to influence their impression of what happened? That's pathetic.
Are you not aware of how media works? Different words elicit different emotions from readers/viewers...
Are we really expecting Obama to speak out against Israel?
Have we all not seen his Aipac speeches? Do we not remember when he went to South Africa and defended Israel?
(then got blasted in South Africa for his stance) -
Or maybe Obama is waiting for his last term as president to start, you know, before he takes a 'just' stand on this current massacre.
I don't know... i don't really think that the US government can keep this up much longer.
Well, no doubt that it will eventually end, when? I'm not sure, but I reckon that things will get even worse before it ends.
Of course how much more worse can it get? Israel has already dropped bombs ripping the limbs off of children as they sleep, burning the skin off of babies, destroying shelters, that's all already checked off the list of horrors.
Can things get any worse?
We need to be holding our leaders feet to the fire, and burning them.
yes, they apparently fired A rocket from the parking lot at the rear of the hospital. Not sure in what way this means "human shields" were used. Would be and am interested to hear more about that aspect.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Oh I get it, these few apparent examples are what Israel uses to defend its destruction of Palestine.
Some guy with a gun grabs a kid, drags him, and that's the human shield, a vid of a group of kids Standing behind a rocket, k, weird shit, but in Israel and the US we see kids around jets, and firing rockets, you know in demonstrations,air shows. I'm just saying, things are relative, we dont even know where that rocket was going, for all we know it was just a show, I mean, I dont know, I need more Evidence.
Hammad is a nut, this is known. What government, group does not have nutters?
What do you think Netanyahu is? A nut, a coconut, he's wiping out an entire people, then starts talking about human shields.
Does it make sense? I mean really, at the end it will always come down to 'root cause', the 'root', stop taking more land, return to agreed borders (internationally agreed borders).
That's it, enough with all this propaganda, just focus on the actual issue. 'Stop taking more land and building settlements', then return to '67 borders.
If Hamas continues to fire rockets after Israel does those things, that's another story.
The 'power' is with Israel and the US. No more excuses.
Comments
Netnyahoo wont use lube the next time Obomba visits tel aviv...promised to go A to M on Obomba also
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
i love the use of certain terminology in the MM, my all time favorite during hurricane katrina...evacuees instead of refugees. evacuees? when and what we they going back to?
I think a lot of us Bootlegger hold this opinion.We don't agree with the horror that is befalling the Palestinians right now and with good conscience can't help but feel for the innocent lives lost.And hope they soon feel real freedom.But the above also has to be factored in.Hamas is weighing down their cause like an anchor.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
and think about the list of reasons why a nation/state would bomb:
mosques/churches and places of worship
hospitals and ambulances
shelters
schools/universities
water and power plants
roadways bridges
...a real short list of reason
there also is a real short list of those who need to dig tunnels...1. prisoners 2.? 3?
Anyway, after 5 posts of deflecting, I can only conclude you are okay with Hamas storing weapons in schools. No one is going to think you support Israel if you are critical of Hamas. They might actually respect you for being thoughtful instead of close-minded to anything that doesn't support your view.
For example: It is not okay for Hamas to kidnap a soldier during an agreed upon ceasefire, but that doesn't make it right for Israel to retaliate and kill 50+ civilians in Palestine. If you can't admit that it makes you sound like you just don't like Israel instead of supporting Palestinians.
source
http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/02/world/meast/mideast-crisis/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
As for the disgusting, mealy-mouthed motherfucker Stephen Harper, he has reiterated his support of the Israeli government (aka reiterated his burning desire to let Obama fuck him up the ass), and is incapable of understanding that supporting Israel is not the only option if you don't support Hamas (which I don't think anyone should do either). He has encouraged other governments to continue supporting Israel, clinging to the idea that all of this is 100% Hamas's fault. It's fucking ludicrous..... well, perhaps if nothing else happen, his stubborn and embarrassing g position on this will be what causes him to lose the next election. [-O<
Captured, abducted, kidnapped... that really all means the same thing to me. That a soldier was taken. I don't give a shit which word is used. It changes nothing. Are people really gullible enough to allow those different words to influence their impression of what happened? That's pathetic.
so based on that, its (2 my mind) incorrect to say that Hamas stores weapons in schools.
Of course how much more worse can it get? Israel has already dropped bombs ripping the limbs off of children as they sleep, burning the skin off of babies, destroying shelters, that's all already checked off the list of horrors.
Can things get any worse?
We need to be holding our leaders feet to the fire, and burning them.
2010: 9/7/10 - Bilbao
2012: 26-27/6/12 - Amsterdam ~~ 29/6/12 - Werchter ~~ 4-5/7/12 - Berlin
2014: 25/6/14 - Vienna ~~ 26/6/14 - Berlin
2010: 9/7/10 - Bilbao
2012: 26-27/6/12 - Amsterdam ~~ 29/6/12 - Werchter ~~ 4-5/7/12 - Berlin
2014: 25/6/14 - Vienna ~~ 26/6/14 - Berlin
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
2010: 9/7/10 - Bilbao
2012: 26-27/6/12 - Amsterdam ~~ 29/6/12 - Werchter ~~ 4-5/7/12 - Berlin
2014: 25/6/14 - Vienna ~~ 26/6/14 - Berlin
2010: 9/7/10 - Bilbao
2012: 26-27/6/12 - Amsterdam ~~ 29/6/12 - Werchter ~~ 4-5/7/12 - Berlin
2014: 25/6/14 - Vienna ~~ 26/6/14 - Berlin
2010: 9/7/10 - Bilbao
2012: 26-27/6/12 - Amsterdam ~~ 29/6/12 - Werchter ~~ 4-5/7/12 - Berlin
2014: 25/6/14 - Vienna ~~ 26/6/14 - Berlin
Is this the proof you speak of?
Some guy with a gun grabs a kid, drags him, and that's the human shield, a vid of a group of kids Standing behind a rocket, k, weird shit, but in Israel and the US we see kids around jets, and firing rockets, you know in demonstrations,air shows. I'm just saying, things are relative, we dont even know where that rocket was going, for all we know it was just a show, I mean, I dont know, I need more Evidence.
Hammad is a nut, this is known. What government, group does not have nutters?
What do you think Netanyahu is? A nut, a coconut, he's wiping out an entire people, then starts talking about human shields.
Does it make sense? I mean really, at the end it will always come down to 'root cause', the 'root', stop taking more land, return to agreed borders (internationally agreed borders).
That's it, enough with all this propaganda, just focus on the actual issue. 'Stop taking more land and building settlements', then return to '67 borders.
If Hamas continues to fire rockets after Israel does those things, that's another story.
The 'power' is with Israel and the US. No more excuses.