America's Gun Violence

Gern Blansten

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Does anyone have the right to control how hard you beat your wife or child? The point is that when gun laws begin to hurt society as a whole then society has to stand up and find a solution.

You want to ignore it....we don't.

CM189191

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

Godfather.

Gern Blansten said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Does anyone have the right to control how hard you beat your wife or child? The point is that when gun laws begin to hurt society as a whole then society has to stand up and find a solution.

You want to ignore it....we don't.

did you know that if you beat a man to death with a baseball bat you'd most likely get more time in prison than if you had used a gun and if you buy that bat spicificly to use as a weapon and the fed's can prove it ...somehow then you'd get even more time, yada yada yada I know but seriously I don't think gun laws hurt society as a whole I think bad people and politions do that.

Godfather.

Godfather.

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society ? sorry but I see it differently, the more(too much) control that is forced on any society is what always begens it's break down.


Godfather.

CM189191

Godfather. said:

did you know that if you beat a man to death with a baseball bat you'd most likely get more time in prison than if you had used a gun and if you buy that bat spicificly to use as a weapon and the fed's can prove it ...somehow then you'd get even more time, yada yada yada I know but seriously I don't think gun laws hurt society as a whole I think bad people and politions do that.

Godfather. said:

This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society ? sorry but I see it differently, the more(too much) control that is forced on any society is what always begens it's break down.

It sound like you're agreeable to the concept of gun control, it's just a matter finding a balance. No?

I'd say on a scale of 1-100, we're somewhere between 5 & 10. I'd like to see us closer to the 50-75 range. Maybe see how that works for a while?

CM189191

Refresh my memory, which one is the good guy with a gun again?

Godfather.

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

did you know that if you beat a man to death with a baseball bat you'd most likely get more time in prison than if you had used a gun and if you buy that bat spicificly to use as a weapon and the fed's can prove it ...somehow then you'd get even more time, yada yada yada I know but seriously I don't think gun laws hurt society as a whole I think bad people and politions do that.

Godfather. said:

This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society ? sorry but I see it differently, the more(too much) control that is forced on any society is what always begens it's break down.

It sound like you're agreeable to the concept of gun control, it's just a matter finding a balance. No?

I'd say on a scale of 1-100, we're somewhere between 5 & 10. I'd like to see us closer to the 50-75 range. Maybe see how that works for a while?

I agree:
that any person convicted of a vicous violent crime should not have a gun.
any person who is mentally disabled/challenged should not own a gun (unless acompanyed by an adult instructor at a shooting range or leagle hunting area)
use a gun for a crime and receieve 5 years automatically on top of the courts judgment for crimes committed.


disagree:
gun control forced any law abiding citizen.


Godfather

Godfather.

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

fife

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

can you tell me what restriction you have an issue with.

no one believes that only bad guys have guns. we are talking about making restriction on gun ownership.

Jason P

fife said:

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

can you tell me what restriction you have an issue with.

no one believes that only bad guys have guns. we are talking about making restriction on gun ownership.

The Man won't let me buy a bazooka. Yet they let Hulk Hogan roam Miami. How can I defend myself against the Red Coats without a bazooka or Ol' Painless?

Godfather.

fife said:

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

can you tell me what restriction you have an issue with.

no one believes that only bad guys have guns. we are talking about making restriction on gun ownership.

when you say gun ownership what exactly do you mean ? resctrict the owners from what ? there are many restrictions already in place and so many people want more...what else is there to take away with out outlawing guns ? I live in california and there are pleanty of restrictions as far as what is legal to own, look out Arizona here I come.

Godfather.

fife

Godfather. said:

fife said:

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

can you tell me what restriction you have an issue with.

no one believes that only bad guys have guns. we are talking about making restriction on gun ownership.

when you say gun ownership what exactly do you mean ? resctrict the owners from what ? there are many restrictions already in place and so many people want more...what else is there to take away with out outlawing guns ? I live in california and there are pleanty of restrictions as far as what is legal to own, look out Arizona here I come.

Godfather.

hey Godfather, first off i asked if you can give me an example of a restriction that you have a problem with. can you please answer that question?

as to answer your questions, what i mean my gun ownership is this. I believe that there should be a restriction on the who can gets guns. i believe that if you want to buy a gun not only should there be a background check on you but anyone else in the household. I believe that all guns should be registered even if it is passed along to family members. I believe that if you were convicted of any violent crime you should not be able to able to get a gun. i believe that anyone who has/had a restraining order placed on them should not be able to purchase a gun.

I believe that you should have to renew gun licenses every year and do a back ground check every year again along with anyone else in the household.

i believe that if it is found that you didn't store your gun properly and that gun is used in a crime that you should be changed and your license revoke.

unsung

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

CM189191

unsung said:

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

I remember when I read Atlas Shrugged & The Fountainhead in high school, too. What year will you graduate? (assuming you don't get shot in the cafeteria)

After a few years of college, perhaps you will learn the difference between reality and philosophy. Objectivism is a perfectly fine philosophy if everyone subscribes to it to the nth degree. The reality is, we live somewhere in the middle. But anytime someone talks about regulating guns, your knee jerk reaction is "Liberal Commie Overlord".

Japan, Canada, Sweden, England, Australia and pretty much the rest of the industrialized modern world has more liberal gun laws than the US, and they're working. I don't think any of these countries would describe themselves as Totalitarian States.

callen

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

What restrictions?

Anyone in the US can go to a gun show and buy a gun. No restrictions.

Gern Blansten

unsung said:

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

So you prefer a society like Somalia over the USA, Great Britain, any country in Europe, etc.

Jason P

Due to an accident while cleaning his gun, Jose Conseco will never be able to do this again unless he has a real good surgeon ...

chadwick

i've read it on here several times already... it goes like this

if a responsible gun owner has a gun stolen from his home & the thief uses that firearm in a crime some of you good folks believe that the gun owner should be punished... i can not wrap my head around this logic for all of the tea in china. unfuckingreal

tonight as you are sleeping nicely in your warm beds, a drunk man will steel your car & smash into a mini van fulla soccer kids traveling from a game. you're in a fucking jam! congratulations

or

while robbing you of your cool nice stuff some guy in his black face mask also says to himself, "wow this fucker has a nice knife set here in his kitchen" he snags it too & later slices a cop with it & the cop bleeds everywhere & almost dies. this means you housed a deadly weapon that almost took a cop's life. you're in a jam! congratulations

a friend of your son's steels your nun chucks, takes them to school & beats a kid nearly to death w/ them cracking the kid's skull wide open. you're jammed up! congratulations

unsung

callen said:

Godfather. said:

America has put so many restrictions on guns and brain washed so many people into beleiving only bad guys have guns that the rest of the public has become paranoied at even the mention of a gun.

Godfather.

What restrictions?

Anyone in the US can go to a gun show and buy a gun. No restrictions.

That's the beauty with arguing against you guys, it's easy because people actually believe that statement. We just sit back and laugh while Mitt Romney eats babies.

unsung

CM189191 said:

unsung said:

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

I remember when I read Atlas Shrugged & The Fountainhead in high school, too. What year will you graduate? (assuming you don't get shot in the cafeteria)

After a few years of college, perhaps you will learn the difference between reality and philosophy. Objectivism is a perfectly fine philosophy if everyone subscribes to it to the nth degree. The reality is, we live somewhere in the middle. But anytime someone talks about regulating guns, your knee jerk reaction is "Liberal Commie Overlord".

Japan, Canada, Sweden, England, Australia and pretty much the rest of the industrialized modern world has more liberal gun laws than the US, and they're working. I don't think any of these countries would describe themselves as Totalitarian States.

Just keep bowing to your masters.

unsung

chadwick said:

i've read it on here several times already... it goes like this

if a responsible gun owner has a gun stolen from his home & the thief uses that firearm in a crime some of you good folks believe that the gun owner should be punished... i can not wrap my head around this logic for all of the tea in china. unfuckingreal

tonight as you are sleeping nicely in your warm beds, a drunk man will steel your car & smash into a mini van fulla soccer kids traveling from a game. you're in a fucking jam! congratulations

or

while robbing you of your cool nice stuff some guy in his black face mask also says to himself, "wow this fucker has a nice knife set here in his kitchen" he snags it too & later slices a cop with it & the cop bleeds everywhere & almost dies. this means you housed a deadly weapon that almost took a cop's life. you're in a jam! congratulations

a friend of your son's steels your nun chucks, takes them to school & beats a kid nearly to death w/ them cracking the kid's skull wide open. you're jammed up! congratulations

It's because they like to argue using emotions instead of logic.

unsung

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

So you prefer a society like Somalia over the USA, Great Britain, any country in Europe, etc.

Pretty dumb retort.

Nope, I just prefer it that you mind your fucking business and stay the fuck out of mine. In return I'll mind my business and stay out of yours. I understand that is a difficult process for some of you to grasp, however you should try it.

hedonist

unsung said:

chadwick said:

i've read it on here several times already... it goes like this

if a responsible gun owner has a gun stolen from his home & the thief uses that firearm in a crime some of you good folks believe that the gun owner should be punished... i can not wrap my head around this logic for all of the tea in china. unfuckingreal

tonight as you are sleeping nicely in your warm beds, a drunk man will steel your car & smash into a mini van fulla soccer kids traveling from a game. you're in a fucking jam! congratulations

or

while robbing you of your cool nice stuff some guy in his black face mask also says to himself, "wow this fucker has a nice knife set here in his kitchen" he snags it too & later slices a cop with it & the cop bleeds everywhere & almost dies. this means you housed a deadly weapon that almost took a cop's life. you're in a jam! congratulations

a friend of your son's steels your nun chucks, takes them to school & beats a kid nearly to death w/ them cracking the kid's skull wide open. you're jammed up! congratulations

It's because they like to argue using emotions instead of logic.

I've been scolded for using logic.

Honestly, I think both that and emotions have their proper place.

What chadwick said:
if a responsible gun owner has a gun stolen from his home & the thief uses that firearm in a crime some of you good folks believe that the gun owner should be punished... i can not wrap my head around this logic for all of the tea in china. unfuckingreal

My head too is unwrapped with that. This said with a huge nod to "responsible".

unsung

So if I'm on vacation and two hoods break in and crack my safe and steal my guns then go out on a killing spree and maim hundreds I should be on trial?

And you guys wonder why your side isn't taken with any real amount of seriousness?

unsung

CM189191 said:

unsung said:

CM189191 said:

Godfather. said:

Thirty I see what the point is Bro I just don't understand why anybody believes they have the right to control my firearm, if someone uses a gun in a crime in most states it's 5 years minimum right off the top but if I don't use a gun in any crime why would I let anybody have control over my firearm ?

Because no man is an island. You're part of a larger society, and that society is ruled by laws, social norms & mores. Right now those are all failing us miserably just so you can hang on to your precious firearm without regard to the rest of society. This mentality directly contributes to our failure as a civilized society.

In your society it is ruled by people who think that they know what is best for everyone else. Your society tells the individual that they need government to protect them from themselves. Your society prefers overlords.

My society defends the smallest minority group to the end; the individual.

I remember when I read Atlas Shrugged & The Fountainhead in high school, too. What year will you graduate? (assuming you don't get shot in the cafeteria)

After a few years of college, perhaps you will learn the difference between reality and philosophy. Objectivism is a perfectly fine philosophy if everyone subscribes to it to the nth degree. The reality is, we live somewhere in the middle. But anytime someone talks about regulating guns, your knee jerk reaction is "Liberal Commie Overlord".

Japan, Canada, Sweden, England, Australia and pretty much the rest of the industrialized modern world has more liberal gun laws than the US, and they're working. I don't think any of these countries would describe themselves as Totalitarian States.

I can't wait until Rand Paul is your President. Two more years.

gimmesometruth27

sorry man, rand paul will never be president of the united states.

rgambs

Yes exactly, it's the folks on vacation who keep their guns locked in safes that we are after in particular. You take everything to the extreme always, it's like listening to talk radio or cable news.
And who are you to say we aren't taken seriously, most of the freaking planet is in agreement with us.

unsung

gimmesometruth27 said:

sorry man, rand paul will never be president of the united states.

You're smarter than that.

unsung

rgambs said:

Yes exactly, it's the folks on vacation who keep their guns locked in safes that we are after in particular. You take everything to the extreme always, it's like listening to talk radio or cable news.
And who are you to say we aren't taken seriously, most of the freaking planet is in agreement with us.

Excuse me for being obvious but that was what was said. If my guns were stolen then I should be charged as an accessory to the crime. No?

CM189191

unsung said:

So if I'm on vacation and two hoods break in and crack my safe and steal my guns then go out on a killing spree and maim hundreds I should be on trial?

And you guys wonder why your side isn't taken with any real amount of seriousness?

With power comes responsibility. You want the responsibility of owning a powerful instrument of death; then you should pay the consequences for the damage and harm it causes.

Perhaps a mandatory gun-owners insurance policy would cover it?