2. All those guns at the Navy Yard did a hell of a job stopping this guy.
Kind of kills the idea that arming the teachers will prevent something like this happening considering two of the most recent mass shootings have taken place at US military institutions.
I think the only place with better training and equipment to stop something like this would be a ninja colony.
2. All those guns at the Navy Yard did a hell of a job stopping this guy.
Kind of kills the idea that arming the teachers will prevent something like this happening considering two of the most recent mass shootings have taken place at US military institutions.
I think the only place with better training and equipment to stop something like this would be a ninja colony.
Back up a second...wasn't the guy at fort hood stopped by an armed guard? They are saying that this situation also ended when confronted by armed guards. Who is to say the casualty count would not have been a lot higher if not for the heroic actions of armed individuals willing to stand up to them? I don't know about preventing crazy people from doing crazy things, but it at least gives the people in these situations a fighting chance if they cannot get out of the building.
2. All those guns at the Navy Yard did a hell of a job stopping this guy.
Kind of kills the idea that arming the teachers will prevent something like this happening considering two of the most recent mass shootings have taken place at US military institutions.
I think the only place with better training and equipment to stop something like this would be a ninja colony.
Accoding to a few articles I have read, then Presidnet Clinton ordered only Military Police or Special Police in the Air Force are authorized to carry weapons on a military installation.
So there might be weapons on post, but they are locked in an armory.
96 Randall's Island II
98 CAA
00 Virginia Beach;Camden I; Jones Beach III
05 Borgata Night I; Wachovia Center
06 Letterman Show; Webcast (guy in blue shirt), Camden I; DC
08 Camden I; Camden II; DC
09 Phillie III
10 MSG II
13 Wrigley Field
16 Phillie II
if newtown didn't change anything, nothing ever will.
our society of violence is just fucked.
over 90% of americans want tougher gun legislation, but congress won't move on it.
the only thing that would ever change anything is if someone shot up congress and the people elected to replace those killed voted for background checks.
DISCLAIMER
i am in no way advocating that, by the way....
Your post just got spit up onto some government guy's screen in DC.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
2. All those guns at the Navy Yard did a hell of a job stopping this guy.
Kind of kills the idea that arming the teachers will prevent something like this happening considering two of the most recent mass shootings have taken place at US military institutions.
I think the only place with better training and equipment to stop something like this would be a ninja colony.
Back up a second...wasn't the guy at fort hood stopped by an armed guard? They are saying that this situation also ended when confronted by armed guards. Who is to say the casualty count would not have been a lot higher if not for the heroic actions of armed individuals willing to stand up to them? I don't know about preventing crazy people from doing crazy things, but it at least gives the people in these situations a fighting chance if they cannot get out of the building.
You're using Fort Hood of all places to make your argument? Of course there was an armed guard. It was an Army base. :fp: And same goes for the Navy yard. Of course there were armed guards. But the fact that this guy managed to use the guards' guns (supposedly) is meaningful against the argument for arming security guards in public places and schools. If military security at the Naval yard can be disarmed by a shooter and their weapons used against victims, I think that is a strong argument against arming some civilian guard at an elementary school who earns $11 an hour.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
You're using Fort Hood of all places to make your argument? Of course there was an armed guard. It was an Army base. :fp: And same goes for the Navy yard. Of course there were armed guards. But the fact that this guy managed to use the guards' guns (supposedly) is meaningful against the argument for arming security guards in public places and schools. If military security at the Naval yard can be disarmed by a shooter and their weapons used against victims, I think that is a strong argument against arming some civilian guard at an elementary school who earns $11 an hour.
Love the cute face slap, but save it for yourself! You would think "of course there are armed guards", but that's not the truth. It took 5 minutes for armed guards to reach the murderer at Fort Hood, 7 min at the navy yard...why? The answer was in an above post about Billy Blowjob Clinton making based gun free zones. Most if not all of the murders happened before the guards got to him. It is irrelevant where he got his guns as he could have gotten just as easily somewhere else... My point was that these assholes are effectively stopped once there is an armed RESPONSE!
You're using Fort Hood of all places to make your argument? Of course there was an armed guard. It was an Army base. :fp: And same goes for the Navy yard. Of course there were armed guards. But the fact that this guy managed to use the guards' guns (supposedly) is meaningful against the argument for arming security guards in public places and schools. If military security at the Naval yard can be disarmed by a shooter and their weapons used against victims, I think that is a strong argument against arming some civilian guard at an elementary school who earns $11 an hour.
Love the cute face slap, but save it for yourself! You would think "of course there are armed guards", but that's not the truth. It took 5 minutes for armed guards to reach the murderer at Fort Hood, 7 min at the navy yard...why? The answer was in an above post about Billy Blowjob Clinton making based gun free zones. Most if not all of the murders happened before the guards got to him. It is irrelevant where he got his guns as he could have gotten just as easily somewhere else... My point was that these assholes are effectively stopped once there is an armed RESPONSE!
Then info has been updated since I last checked. The last I knew was that he disarmed the armed guards (when and where they came from is irrelevant to what I'm saying) ... that isn't the case??
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
From what I've read there was probably an armed guard at a checkpoint somewhere on the perimeter. This guy had worked there and knew exactly where to go. On the inside, people effectively had their ability to protect themselves removed. I fully agree though, we should not rely on armed guards to protect us. And if there is an armed guard, they should probably be somewhere with a barrier or better vantage point than anyone else. I'm one of those nuts that believe people should be able to protect themselves instead of having to wait for law enforcement to arrive. That's a whole new argument though...
From what I've read there was probably an armed guard at a checkpoint somewhere on the perimeter. This guy had worked there and knew exactly where to go. On the inside, people effectively had their ability to protect themselves removed. I fully agree though, we should not rely on armed guards to protect us. And if there is an armed guard, they should probably be somewhere with a barrier or better vantage point than anyone else. I'm one of those nuts that believe people should be able to protect themselves instead of having to wait for law enforcement to arrive. That's a whole new argument though...
Aren't armed guards usually at the outside doors monitoring who comes in? And the guy disarmed said guards when they did show up.... I guess your argument is that staff there should be able to carry concealed weapons at work on a military base? I personally do not know enough about the reasoning behind wanting military bases to be largely gun free, but I have to assume those in military weighed the options and were consulted when the rules were made, with all things considered... It's not like the military is anti-gun.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
From what I've read there was probably an armed guard at a checkpoint somewhere on the perimeter. This guy had worked there and knew exactly where to go. On the inside, people effectively had their ability to protect themselves removed. I fully agree though, we should not rely on armed guards to protect us. And if there is an armed guard, they should probably be somewhere with a barrier or better vantage point than anyone else. I'm one of those nuts that believe people should be able to protect themselves instead of having to wait for law enforcement to arrive. That's a whole new argument though...
Aren't armed guards usually at the outside doors monitoring who comes in? And the guy disarmed said guards when they did show up.... I guess your argument is that staff there should be able to carry concealed weapons at work on a military base? I personally do not know enough about the reasoning behind wanting military bases to be largely gun free, but I have to assume those in military weighed the options and were consulted when the rules were made, with all things considered... It's not like the military is anti-gun.
We don't know the specifics, but I'm guessing there was an element of surprise and I have not heard that he disarmed multiple guards as you are suggesting. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I also doubt Bill Clinton did much collaborating with the wants and needs of the military as he was just another pololitician with an anti-gun agenda. All that asside, I still do not see how this effectively kills the notion of armed individuals at schools or elsewhere, but it does put pressure on the need for those individuals to be properly equipped and trained and I'm sure this incident will change the way future armed guards are trained at the navy yard.
I don't get how they can go from 3 guns including that rifle to just a shotgun. :fp: The media has to get a grip and stop just blurting out shit as they hear it from whothefuckever. I don't care if people want info fast. They have no integrity anymore just to spew out info the fastest. Pathetic.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So I'm sure that we can ALL agree that the facts coming out about this guy's documented past with guns combined with the fact that he was not only sold guns, but also given clearance by the US military, is extremely disturbing? I will be interested to see what the gun freaks who don't believe in regulation have to say about that...
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
If people heard gun shots where I live, there would be 1000 calls to 911 all at one time.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
If people heard gun shots where I live, there would be 1000 calls to 911 all at one time.
I wish I could say the same was true here. A neighbor here recently shot herself in the carotid artery (she was a nurse and made sure she bled out) and the chances that anyone around here called 911 or even the sheriffs department is almost nil because too many [deleted run-on expletives] people around here shoot their guns. (Yes, I'm looking for a new home. ANyone in need of a good little bookstore in their town? )
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Those that feel less guns mean less crime, would you put a sign in front of your home stating.... this is a
"Gun Free Home"?
this is easily one of the dumbest things I've read on here in quite some time.
Why is it no one can answer it?
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
If people heard gun shots where I live, there would be 1000 calls to 911 all at one time.
I wish I could say the same was true here. A neighbor here recently shot herself in the carotid artery (she was a nurse and made sure she bled out) and the chances that anyone around here called 911 or even the sheriffs department is almost nil because too many [deleted run-on expletives] people around here shoot their guns. (Yes, I'm looking for a new home. ANyone in need of a good little bookstore in their town? )
You could go to the south side of Chicago. Gun control laws are the strictest in that city.
If people heard gun shots where I live, there would be 1000 calls to 911 all at one time.
I wish I could say the same was true here. A neighbor here recently shot herself in the carotid artery (she was a nurse and made sure she bled out) and the chances that anyone around here called 911 or even the sheriffs department is almost nil because too many [deleted run-on expletives] people around here shoot their guns. (Yes, I'm looking for a new home. ANyone in need of a good little bookstore in their town? )
You could go to the south side of Chicago. Gun control laws are the strictest in that city.
Yeah Brian. Move to a gangland war zone.
Helpful and enlightening as always Unsung! :wave:
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
If people heard gun shots where I live, there would be 1000 calls to 911 all at one time.
I wish I could say the same was true here. A neighbor here recently shot herself in the carotid artery (she was a nurse and made sure she bled out) and the chances that anyone around here called 911 or even the sheriffs department is almost nil because too many [deleted run-on expletives] people around here shoot their guns. (Yes, I'm looking for a new home. ANyone in need of a good little bookstore in their town? )
One another note this guy had already passed a very strict government background check, would a different have prevented his crime? Maybe we should make a law against murder instead.
You could go to the south side of Chicago. Gun control laws are the strictest in that city.
Without an effective perimeter for containment, gun laws specific to a region won't work unless said region encloses itself.
Take Windsor Canada for example. The crime rate in Windsor is one of the lowest in Canada and they went 27 months without a homicide a few years back. Detroit, a mere river away ... well I don't think I need to pull up any stats on that city.
One another note this guy had already passed a very strict government background check, would a different have prevented his crime? Maybe we should make a law against murder instead.
I am disturbed that a "very strict" government background check didn't seem to uncover the past gun crimes that the news networks discovered within 5 minutes of checking the internet. Either that, or they uncovered them, and the people making the decisions on who can buy a gun just didn't give a shit that the guy has used his gun emotionally, aggressively, and very dangerously in the past (i.e. shooting out people's tires and shooting at neighbor's houses).
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
I don't know...I think people in general have the propensity to be incredibly aggressive and physical.
Again, I don't know. If Americans are a melange of a continuing influx of cultures, aren't those cultures themselves also violent? Not necessarily in the same way, but there are many means to carry out those urges.
My stepfather used to have a client from Denmark. Sweet man, gentle, spent many long stays at our home. Without fail, he'd make it to some gun or knife event, and then show us what he bought. Shit was scary but beautiful in its craftsmanship and artistry; we're talking samurai-type swords, gutting knives and the like. I think his family did some hunting near home though not sure how the sword would fit in there.
Anyway, the more I learn about this shooter, the more I believe there's some true fuckedupness and oversights that happened prior.
A friend of mine and his nephew- both native Germans- recently visited us at our home here in the Sierra foothills. We were outside talking and heard gunfire not far away. I told them that because we lived outside city limits people were allowed to shoot on their property (which is fucking stupid and I hate it.) They couldn't believe it. They said that in Germany, very few people have guns. The sort of thing they experienced here would never happen in their country, not even in their forests- except for a few places where hunting is allowed.
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
I don't know...I think people in general have the propensity to be incredibly aggressive and physical.
Again, I don't know. If Americans are a melange of a continuing influx of cultures, aren't those cultures themselves also violent? Not necessarily in the same way, but there are many means to carry out those urges.
My stepfather used to have a client from Denmark. Sweet man, gentle, spent many long stays at our home. Without fail, he'd make it to some gun or knife event, and then show us what he bought. Shit was scary but beautiful in its craftsmanship and artistry; we're talking samurai-type swords, gutting knives and the like. I think his family did some hunting near home though not sure how the sword would fit in there.
Anyway, the more I learn about this shooter, the more I believe there's some true fuckedupness and oversights that happened prior.
Yeah, I think people are violent everywhere.... I just think that the US is also gun happy. Bad combo. The gun culture has to be dealt with or else this shit will keep happening this frequently.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
I think the only place with better training and equipment to stop something like this would be a ninja colony.
http://www.ehow.com/list_6770093_milita ... -laws.html
So there might be weapons on post, but they are locked in an armory.
98 CAA
00 Virginia Beach;Camden I; Jones Beach III
05 Borgata Night I; Wachovia Center
06 Letterman Show; Webcast (guy in blue shirt), Camden I; DC
08 Camden I; Camden II; DC
09 Phillie III
10 MSG II
13 Wrigley Field
16 Phillie II
:roll:
Classic Biden ...
Who?
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
The horrible truth is that America is a violent people, a violent nation.
I wish I could say the same was true here. A neighbor here recently shot herself in the carotid artery (she was a nurse and made sure she bled out) and the chances that anyone around here called 911 or even the sheriffs department is almost nil because too many [deleted run-on expletives] people around here shoot their guns. (Yes, I'm looking for a new home. ANyone in need of a good little bookstore in their town?
Why is it no one can answer it?
You could go to the south side of Chicago. Gun control laws are the strictest in that city.
Helpful and enlightening as always Unsung! :wave:
Ahh yeah, thanks anyway. My blues guitar licks are just not that good.
Take Windsor Canada for example. The crime rate in Windsor is one of the lowest in Canada and they went 27 months without a homicide a few years back. Detroit, a mere river away ... well I don't think I need to pull up any stats on that city.
Again, I don't know. If Americans are a melange of a continuing influx of cultures, aren't those cultures themselves also violent? Not necessarily in the same way, but there are many means to carry out those urges.
My stepfather used to have a client from Denmark. Sweet man, gentle, spent many long stays at our home. Without fail, he'd make it to some gun or knife event, and then show us what he bought. Shit was scary but beautiful in its craftsmanship and artistry; we're talking samurai-type swords, gutting knives and the like. I think his family did some hunting near home though not sure how the sword would fit in there.
Anyway, the more I learn about this shooter, the more I believe there's some true fuckedupness and oversights that happened prior.