Minimum wage hike voted down...

Jeanwah

...by Republicans. And we wonder why the poor can barely get by making minimum wage...

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/e ... -wage-hike

House Republicans unanimously voted down a measure Friday that would have raised the federal minimum wage, from its current $7.25 per hour to $10.10 by 2015.

Six Democrats joined 227 Republicans in voting it down; 184 Democrats voted yes.

The legislation was proposed as a last-minute amendment upon passage of the SKILLS Act, which reauthorizes a jobs training program. The procedural move, known as the motion to recommit, was invoked by Democrats with the instruction that the minimum wage amendment be tacked on to the SKILLS Act, an aide said.

An increase in the minimum wage to $9 was backed by President Obama during this year's State of the Union, and immediately shot down by House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH), who argued that it would drive up unemployment by making it harder for small businesses to hire.

Democrats believe it's a winning issue for them, and Rep. George Miller (D-CA), the author of the amendment, offered a glimpse into how they intend to talk about it.

"Even while corporate profits soar and the stock market reaches new highs, the working poor continue to fall further and further behind," Miller said in a prepared statement. "If the Republicans want to take away a priority of service for low income Americans who want to learn new skills for a better job and a better life, the least we can do is make sure these workers get a decent wage."

Last-12-Exit

This is a good thing. This being voted down does help large corporations like Walmart and McDonald's, but it SAVES small businesses from laying people off or providing medical insurance. We don't need minimum wage to be $20/hour to save this economy or to allow the poor to climb out of poverty.

gimmesometruth27

Last-12-Exit wrote:

This is a good thing. This being voted down does help large corporations like Walmart and McDonald's, but it SAVES small businesses from laying people off or providing medical insurance. We don't need minimum wage to be $20/hour to save this economy or to allow the poor to climb out of poverty.

how so? people can not work 80 hour weeks at the current minimum wage to keep their heads above water.

gimmesometruth27

leave it to the gop to favor business over the people. how the fuck can they expect people to stimulate the economy when they do not have the income to do so?

pandora

This would not effect our business but it would have many other small businesses.
We are all struggling. If passed this would have cost jobs or at the least less hours worked.
Somethings in business are fixed... rent, lights, consumables, etc ... wages are not.
Something has to give when you think you are going to have to close the doors.

I'm glad the Republicans got the employer's asses covered.

Newch91

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/1 ... de=2125742

Elizabeth Warren: Minimum Wage Would Be $22 An Hour If It Had Kept Up With Productivity

Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) made a case for increasing the minimum wage last week during a Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor and Pensions hearing, in which she cited a study that suggested the federal minimum wage would have stood at nearly $22 an hour today if it had kept up with increased rates in worker productivity.

"If we started in 1960 and we said that as productivity goes up, that is as workers are producing more, then the minimum wage is going to go up the same. And if that were the case then the minimum wage today would be about $22 an hour," she said, speaking to Dr. Arindrajit Dube, a University of Massachusetts Amherst professor who has studied the economic impacts of minimum wage. "So my question is Mr. Dube, with a minimum wage of $7.25 an hour, what happened to the other $14.75? It sure didn't go to the worker."

Dube went on to note that if minimum wage incomes had grown over that period at the same pace as it had for the top 1 percent of income earners, the minimum wage would actually be closer to $33 an hour than the current $7.25.

It didn't appear that Warren was actually trying to make the case for a $22 an hour minimum wage, but rather highlighting the results of a recent study that showed flat minimum wage growth over the past 40-plus years coinciding with surging inequality across a number of economic indicators.

Warren went on to argue that raising the federal minimum wage to over $10 an hour in incremental steps over the next two years -- a cause championed by President Barack Obama in his State of the Union address and since taken up in the Senate -- would not be as damaging for businesses as some critics have argued.

Last-12-Exit

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Last-12-Exit wrote:

This is a good thing. This being voted down does help large corporations like Walmart and McDonald's, but it SAVES small businesses from laying people off or providing medical insurance. We don't need minimum wage to be $20/hour to save this economy or to allow the poor to climb out of poverty.

how so? people can not work 80 hour weeks at the current minimum wage to keep their heads above water.

How will they keep their heads above water when the landscaping company has to lay him/her off when they were forced to give them a $3/hour raise that they couldn't afford.


Edit: I forgot that Obama allows one to be on unemployment for 2 yrs or so now.

even flow - question mark

Obviously for governments it is easier to hand out welfare then to make minimum wage worth while.

As said above: don't want the poor to climb out of poverty. Whatever!

Jeanwah

pandora wrote:

This would not effect our business but it would have many other small businesses.
We are all struggling. If passed this would have cost jobs or at the least less hours worked.
Somethings in business are fixed... rent, lights, consumables, etc ... wages are not.
Something has to give when you think you are going to have to close the doors.

I'm glad the Republicans got the employer's asses covered.

Oh yeah, because businesses are SO much more important than the struggling poor... But you don't worry about them, you just care about your business, is that right?

Jeanwah

Newch91 wrote:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/18/elizabeth-warren-minimum-wage_n_2900984.html?utm_hp_ref=tw#slide=2125742

Elizabeth Warren: Minimum Wage Would Be $22 An Hour If It Had Kept Up With Productivity

Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) made a case for increasing the minimum wage last week during a Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor and Pensions hearing, in which she cited a study that suggested the federal minimum wage would have stood at nearly $22 an hour today if it had kept up with increased rates in worker productivity.

"If we started in 1960 and we said that as productivity goes up, that is as workers are producing more, then the minimum wage is going to go up the same. And if that were the case then the minimum wage today would be about $22 an hour," she said, speaking to Dr. Arindrajit Dube, a University of Massachusetts Amherst professor who has studied the economic impacts of minimum wage. "So my question is Mr. Dube, with a minimum wage of $7.25 an hour, what happened to the other $14.75? It sure didn't go to the worker."

Dube went on to note that if minimum wage incomes had grown over that period at the same pace as it had for the top 1 percent of income earners, the minimum wage would actually be closer to $33 an hour than the current $7.25.

It didn't appear that Warren was actually trying to make the case for a $22 an hour minimum wage, but rather highlighting the results of a recent study that showed flat minimum wage growth over the past 40-plus years coinciding with surging inequality across a number of economic indicators.

Warren went on to argue that raising the federal minimum wage to over $10 an hour in incremental steps over the next two years -- a cause championed by President Barack Obama in his State of the Union address and since taken up in the Senate -- would not be as damaging for businesses as some critics have argued.

Jason P

I don't think $7.25/hr is enough to support yourself. But I also think a 38% increase to small business payroll will result in layoffs and business closures.

pandora

Sen Elizabeth Warren was a Professor specializing in Bankruptcy law..
that struck my funny bone.

Those lawyers have been doing well for themselves in recent years
at business owners expense.

Last-12-Exit

A friend of my wife works as a manger at a pizza hut. Now pizza hut won't be hurt by a minimum wage increase. They are going to make their money regardless. In preparation for the possible minimum wage increase, they reduced the hours for all employees from 40 down to 32. The same thing would have happened at the Wal-Mart's and McDonald's across the country. So how exactly would an increase help pull people out of poverty?

Newch91

Sure, you have corporations who have all the money in the world when it comes to political donations, but when it comes to workers' pay raise and benefits, all of a sudden they don't have the money and may have to lay people off.

You've got Wal Mart - one of the most profitable companies in the world - paying their workers shit (for a company like Wal Mart) and not having great benefits.

Then you have Costco, who's average starting pay for a new employee is $11+ and that number keeps increasing as you stay. You get great health benefits, paid holidays and paid vacation. They care about their workers. And they are making record profits.

http://www.politicususa.com/costco-prov ... -soar.html

Costco Proves Republicans Wrong By Paying a Living Wage and Watching Profits Soar

Costco is proving Republicans and the Wal-Mart wrong by paying workers a living wage while also earning record profits.

While Wal-Mart experienced February sales that were considered, “total disaster,” Costco’s earnings for the second quarter of the year climbed 39%. The New York Times reported, “Costco Wholesale’s net income for its second quarter climbed 39 percent as it pulled in more money from membership fees, sales improved and it recorded a large tax benefit.”

Costco CEO Craig Jelinek openly supports raising the minimum wage to $11.50 an hour, “At Costco, we know that paying employees good wages makes good sense for business. We pay a starting hourly wage of $11.50 in all states where we do business, and we are still able to keep our overhead costs low. An important reason for the success of Costco’s business model is the attraction and retention of great employees. Instead of minimizing wages, we know it’s a lot more profitable in the long term to minimize employee turnover and maximize employee productivity, commitment and loyalty. We support efforts to increase the federal minimum wage.”

Costco is proof that the Republican idea that labor must be stomped on in order for our economy to prosper is wrong. It is possible for companies to earn record profits while respecting their workers and paying them a living wage. Wal-Mart embodies the conservative ideology that the country functions best when wealth is concentrated at the top. To match the Walton family’s fortune, an average Wal-Mart employee would have to work for the company for 7 million years. This model is what Republicans are advocating for the entire country, and it is failing to lead to prosperity.

Given Costco’s record profits, Wal-Mart’s blaming of the payroll tax and gas prices for their decline in sales doesn’t wash. Costco’s customers also faced higher gas prices and payroll taxes, but their sales were up six percent during the first quarter of the year.

Despite what both Wal-Mart and Republicans have been saying, companies can prosper and still have a conscience. When companies pay a living wage, workers benefit. When workers make more money, they spend more money. When people spend more money, the economy is stronger. When the economy is stronger, the nation as a whole benefits.

The economic virtuous circle that Republicans and their corporate benefactors thought they killed is alive, well, and living at Costco.

Last-12-Exit

Newch91 wrote:

Sure, you have corporations who have all the money in the world when it comes to political donations, but when it comes to workers' pay raise and benefits, all of a sudden they don't have the money and may have to lay people off.

You've got Wal Mart - one of the most profitable companies in the world - paying their workers shit (for a company like Wal Mart) and not having great benefits.

Then you have Costco, who's average starting pay for a new employee is $11+ and that number keeps increasing as you stay. You get great health benefits, paid holidays and paid vacation. They care about their workers. And they are making record profits.

http://www.politicususa.com/costco-prov ... -soar.html

Costco Proves Republicans Wrong By Paying a Living Wage and Watching Profits Soar

Costco is proving Republicans and the Wal-Mart wrong by paying workers a living wage while also earning record profits.

While Wal-Mart experienced February sales that were considered, “total disaster,” Costco’s earnings for the second quarter of the year climbed 39%. The New York Times reported, “Costco Wholesale’s net income for its second quarter climbed 39 percent as it pulled in more money from membership fees, sales improved and it recorded a large tax benefit.”

Costco CEO Craig Jelinek openly supports raising the minimum wage to $11.50 an hour, “At Costco, we know that paying employees good wages makes good sense for business. We pay a starting hourly wage of $11.50 in all states where we do business, and we are still able to keep our overhead costs low. An important reason for the success of Costco’s business model is the attraction and retention of great employees. Instead of minimizing wages, we know it’s a lot more profitable in the long term to minimize employee turnover and maximize employee productivity, commitment and loyalty. We support efforts to increase the federal minimum wage.”

Costco is proof that the Republican idea that labor must be stomped on in order for our economy to prosper is wrong. It is possible for companies to earn record profits while respecting their workers and paying them a living wage. Wal-Mart embodies the conservative ideology that the country functions best when wealth is concentrated at the top. To match the Walton family’s fortune, an average Wal-Mart employee would have to work for the company for 7 million years. This model is what Republicans are advocating for the entire country, and it is failing to lead to prosperity.

Given Costco’s record profits, Wal-Mart’s blaming of the payroll tax and gas prices for their decline in sales doesn’t wash. Costco’s customers also faced higher gas prices and payroll taxes, but their sales were up six percent during the first quarter of the year.

Despite what both Wal-Mart and Republicans have been saying, companies can prosper and still have a conscience. When companies pay a living wage, workers benefit. When workers make more money, they spend more money. When people spend more money, the economy is stronger. When the economy is stronger, the nation as a whole benefits.

The economic virtuous circle that Republicans and their corporate benefactors thought they killed is alive, well, and living at Costco.

I agree with u 100%. The companies are ultimately responsible for paying good workers well. But it doesnt happen. Walmart will not pay people. They are greedy and could care less about their employees. Driving up minimum wage is NOT going to change that.

pandora

Jeanwah wrote:

pandora wrote:

This would not effect our business but it would have many other small businesses.
We are all struggling. If passed this would have cost jobs or at the least less hours worked.
Somethings in business are fixed... rent, lights, consumables, etc ... wages are not.
Something has to give when you think you are going to have to close the doors.

I'm glad the Republicans got the employer's asses covered.

Oh yeah, because businesses are SO much more important than the struggling poor... But you don't worry about them, you just care about your business, is that right?

is that a personal question? :? oh boy :fp: a good expample of assuming and the ultimate judgement.

even flow - question mark

Last-12-Exit wrote:

I agree with u 100%. The companies are ultimately responsible for paying good workers well. But it doesnt happen. Walmart will not pay people. They are greedy and could care less about their employees. Driving up minimum wage is NOT going to change that.

And the funny thing is the poor people go to this shithole to do their shopping. What a circle.... :roll:

Last-12-Exit

even flow - question mark wrote:

Last-12-Exit wrote:

I agree with u 100%. The companies are ultimately responsible for paying good workers well. But it doesnt happen. Walmart will not pay people. They are greedy and could care less about their employees. Driving up minimum wage is NOT going to change that.

And the funny thing is the poor people go to this shithole to do their shopping. What a circle.... :roll:

Well, they do get a 4% employee discount.

gimmesometruth27

Last-12-Exit wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Last-12-Exit wrote:

This is a good thing. This being voted down does help large corporations like Walmart and McDonald's, but it SAVES small businesses from laying people off or providing medical insurance. We don't need minimum wage to be $20/hour to save this economy or to allow the poor to climb out of poverty.

how so? people can not work 80 hour weeks at the current minimum wage to keep their heads above water.

How will they keep their heads above water when the landscaping company has to lay him/her off when they were forced to give them a $3/hour raise that they couldn't afford.


Edit: I forgot that Obama allows one to be on unemployment for 2 yrs or so now.

no it is not 2 years. remember the debt ceiling fight from last year? obama wanted to keep unemployment benefits as they were and the gop held those hostage and would not raise the debt ceiling unless obama cut the time you can be on unemployment.

gimmesometruth27

anyone arguing that raising the minimum wage would destroy business need look no further than costco.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

$3 an hour raise?
Based on a 40 hour work week, that person is getting over a $6000 a year raise.
The guy cooking french fries at McDonalds deserves a $6000 raise?

I want a $6000 raise this year.
Maybe I will go to work today, and DEMAND it from my boss.

mikepegg44

Hypothetical stituation:

I have $40,000 budgeted for employee wages. I have 120 hours to give to employees in a given week spread out of multiple hours of service, should I hire 3 people and give them 40 hours a week? Should I hire 20 people and give them 6 hours a week? What situation would benefit my customers the most? I have an idea, why doesn't the gov't just tell me how many I should hire and how much of my profit from my risk I should be entitled to...

People do realize that not all companies are fortune 500 hundreds making obscene profits right?

There are consequences with the most well-intentioned of legislation. Small business would be affected by this, there is no doubt about. Some folks may even see their benefits received by the state reduced or eliminated because of the amount of money they now take in but still be struggling, possibly worse than they were making a little less. Some folks would benefit greatly from the added income...damned if you do, hate the poor if you don't.


Gimmie,

CosCo experiencing profits does nothing in terms of Proving republicans wrong. they are a massive discount retailer. The kind that people fight all the time because they destroy small business. Paying their employees 11.50 an hour might offer them the service they need to compete, but that doesn't mean all businesses are in a position to make that jump.

Last-12-Exit

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

anyone arguing that raising the minimum wage would destroy business need look no further than costco.

Costco is a huge corporation that can (and does) pay their employees well. Johnson's landscaping, on the other hand, is not a huge corporation. So 1 of 2 things would happen, they lay off employees or shut down.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

So if I own a business making widgets and employ 10 people making minimum wage, the government wants me to now pay out an additional $60k a year in payroll? But my business only profited $80K last year. Am I better off laying off 5 people and cutting my business? Or am I better off laying all 10 of them off, and getting myself a job at McDonalds cooking french fries and working 80 hours a week?

Last-12-Exit

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

So if I own a business making widgets and employ 10 people making minimum wage, the government wants me to now pay out an additional $60k a year in payroll? But my business only profited $80K last year. Am I better off laying off 5 people and cutting my business? Or am I better off laying all 10 of them off, and getting myself a job at McDonalds cooking french fries and working 80 hours a week?

You'll lay off 6, cut the hours of the remaining 4 and give those 4 the responsibilities of the laid off 6 and tell those 4 they will do it and if they don't like it, you know 6 people that would take their job in a heart beat.

gimmesometruth27

Last-12-Exit wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

anyone arguing that raising the minimum wage would destroy business need look no further than costco.

Costco is a huge corporation that can (and does) pay their employees well. Johnson's landscaping, on the other hand, is not a huge corporation. So 1 of 2 things would happen, they lay off employees or shut down.

if you can't afford to pay your employees a living wage with benefits it can be argued that you have no business being in business.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

Last-12-Exit wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

So if I own a business making widgets and employ 10 people making minimum wage, the government wants me to now pay out an additional $60k a year in payroll? But my business only profited $80K last year. Am I better off laying off 5 people and cutting my business? Or am I better off laying all 10 of them off, and getting myself a job at McDonalds cooking french fries and working 80 hours a week?

You'll lay off 6, cut the hours of the remaining 4 and give those 4 the responsibilities of the laid off 6 and tell those 4 they will do it and if they don't like it, you know 6 people that would take their job in a heart beat.

And those remaining 4, better NOT EVEN THINK of ever getting any over-time.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Last-12-Exit wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

anyone arguing that raising the minimum wage would destroy business need look no further than costco.

Costco is a huge corporation that can (and does) pay their employees well. Johnson's landscaping, on the other hand, is not a huge corporation. So 1 of 2 things would happen, they lay off employees or shut down.

if you can't afford to pay your employees a living wage with benefits it can be argued that you have no business being in business.

I remember a time when the minimum wage jobs were saved for the high school kids. Not for people trying to raise a family, own a car, and dream of buying a house.

81

minimum wage goes up......prices go up....that's all that will happen...but people will feel warm and fuzzy.

if you want to make more than minimum wage, go get yourself some training and a skill set that is worth something.

Last-12-Exit

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Last-12-Exit wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

anyone arguing that raising the minimum wage would destroy business need look no further than costco.

Costco is a huge corporation that can (and does) pay their employees well. Johnson's landscaping, on the other hand, is not a huge corporation. So 1 of 2 things would happen, they lay off employees or shut down.

if you can't afford to pay your employees a living wage with benefits it can be argued that you have no business being in business.

Yes, it could be argued, but not well.

81

Last-12-Exit wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if you can't afford to pay your employees a living wage with benefits it can be argued that you have no business being in business.

Yes, it could be argued, but not well.