this guy is holy crap crazy only thing crazier is thinking he belongs anywhere near innocent people
I'll take America any day if this is how they handle bat shit crazy in other countries too lenient
and no can't rehabilitate this crazy not this is crazy
I don't mean to be condescending here, but it would greatly benefit you to read up on mental illness, it's causes, and therapies.
a malfunctioning brain is no different than any other sick organ. it needs medical attention, and yes, it can be repaired.
and please, folks, stop turning this into one nation vs the next. this has nothing to do with america being better than canada or the reverse. arguments such as this in any context don't make any sense to me.
if you don't mean it man don't do it :roll:
how do you know what I know and crap shouldn't you think about the victims family at all
what if he ate your brother num num
if it were my bro he wouldn't see the light of day probably not another day but I can figure
you'd be all ok with it still
that is as bat shit crazy as the cannibal but figures
this guy is holy crap crazy only thing crazier is thinking he belongs anywhere near innocent people
I'll take America any day if this is how they handle bat shit crazy in other countries too lenient
and no can't rehabilitate this crazy not this is crazy
You'd take a country that executes innocent and mentally incapable people over countries that try and rehabilitate...
this guy is holy crap crazy only thing crazier is thinking he belongs anywhere near innocent people
I'll take America any day if this is how they handle bat shit crazy in other countries too lenient
and no can't rehabilitate this crazy not this is crazy
You'd take a country that executes innocent and mentally incapable people over countries that try and rehabilitate...
Well, to each is own.
did I say I was for capital punishment ever wtf
you stated you'd take the US over Canada any day. US executes innocent people and Canada tries to rehabilitate them, to put it in extremely simplistic terms.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
this guy is holy crap crazy only thing crazier is thinking he belongs anywhere near innocent people
I'll take America any day if this is how they handle bat shit crazy in other countries too lenient
and no can't rehabilitate this crazy not this is crazy
I don't mean to be condescending here, but it would greatly benefit you to read up on mental illness, it's causes, and therapies.
a malfunctioning brain is no different than any other sick organ. it needs medical attention, and yes, it can be repaired.
and please, folks, stop turning this into one nation vs the next. this has nothing to do with america being better than canada or the reverse. arguments such as this in any context don't make any sense to me.
if you don't mean it man don't do it :roll:
how do you know what I know and crap shouldn't you think about the victims family at all
what if he ate your brother num num
if it were my bro he wouldn't see the light of day probably not another day but I can figure
you'd be all ok with it still
that is as bat shit crazy as the cannibal but figures
I can see that this is going anywhere but meaningful and respectful discussion with you, so I'll say good day to you sir.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
You'd take a country that executes innocent and mentally incapable people over countries that try and rehabilitate...
Well, to each is own.
did I say I was for capital punishment ever wtf
you stated you'd take the US over Canada any day. US executes innocent people and Canada tries to rehabilitate them, to put it in extremely simplistic terms.
you got that right for many reasons I would take the US over Canada the least cause of the death penalty
this a good example of canadians in action know nothing about me and got me all figured out ha
I wouldn't panic yet anyways...so far its just very short supervised leaves eventually leading up to little longer leaves. I would guess he still has a long ways to go before he permanently leaves...and who says he will ever be allowed permanent leave...I imagine that decision is years away from happening.
Post edited by lukin2006 on
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
you got that right for many reasons I would take the US over Canada the least cause of the death penalty
this a good example of canadians in action know nothing about me and got me all figured out ha
You said you'd take USA over Canada based on this case, I just responded to that...
Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
WINNIPEG, Manitoba - A Chinese immigrant who beheaded and cannibalized a fellow passenger on a Greyhound bus in western Canada four years ago thought he was attacking an alien, according to a mental health advocate who interviewed him.
In 2009, Vince Li was found not criminally responsible due to mental illness for the death of Tim McLean, a 22-year-old carnival worker who was sitting next to him on a bus traveling near Portage la Prairie, Manitoba. McLean had his eyes closed and was listening to music on his headphones when Li suddenly stood up and started stabbing him. As the bus stopped and horrified passengers fled, Li carved up McLean's body, ate portions of it, and displayed the victim's head to some passengers outside the bus.
After the judge's ruling, Li was placed in a locked wing of the Selkirk Mental Health Centre. Initially, he was not allowed outside, but over the years he has gained more freedom. Last week, a Criminal Code review board decided that Li can start having escorted trips off the hospital grounds and into the nearby city of Selkirk.
The ruling sparked renewed outrage from some members of the public, prompting Chris Summerville, head of the Manitoba Schizophrenia Society, to conduct a 45-minute interview with Li last weekend with the hope of shedding light on his progress.
Summerville has met with Li roughly every two months over the last four years.
"(Li feels) remorse, a degree of humility - I know a lot of people won't believe that - regret and a sense of torment," Summerville said Tuesday. "He understands now that schizophrenia is a mental illness which plays tricks on the brain. He knows that the medication works to keep the voices away."
Summerville released an edited transcript of the interview to the media Tuesday, in which he and Li discuss the night of July 30, 2008, when Li sat on a bus next to McLean that was traveling on a desolate stretch of the TransCanada Highway bound for Winnipeg. Thirty-seven passengers were aboard the bus.
"He was on the lookout for aliens as such, and the voice of God told him that Tim McLean was an alien and he needed to destroy him lest Tim destroy other people," Summerville said.
According to Summerville's transcript, Li recognizes that people fear him.
"I understand people are scared because of my behavior on the Greyhound bus. I am not at risk for anybody. I don't believe in aliens. I don't hear voices," Summerville quoted Li as saying. "I take my medication ... everyday. I am glad to take it. I don't have any weird voices any more."
Li also told Summerville he would like to be forgiven.
"I would do anything for (McLean's) family. I would ask forgiveness, but I know it would be hard to accept," Summerville quoted Li as saying.
That forgiveness may be a tall order.
"I think for the advancement of my own being ... my own soul, I will have to come to a place of accepting," Carol DeDelley, McLean's mother, said Tuesday.
"But what would be unforgivable for me would be ... to not do anything to try to prevent this from happening again by the same perpetrator. I don't think Vince Li can be trusted to take his medication."
DeDelley wants Li kept in a mental hospital permanently, but expects that he will gain more freedom every year until he is eventually released.
"If he's not responsible for his own behavior, then the state, the government, must step in and be responsible for him for the rest of (his) natural life."
Li emigrated to Canada from China in 2001 and became a Canadian citizen four years later.
this guy is holy crap crazy only thing crazier is thinking he belongs anywhere near innocent people
I'll take America any day if this is how they handle bat shit crazy in other countries too lenient
and no can't rehabilitate this crazy not this is crazy
Becuase I am sure the mental health system in the US is great at handling mentally ill people and there are no schizophrenic people living on the streets or being released from mental hospitals because there isn't enough room for them.
I was thinking the same I know it's not the case outside of our little bubble here, but it's still nice to see some unity.
Re: the country vs country angle to this thread – it was started in the thread title. This could have been titled ‘does this man deserve freedom’, or ‘Decapitation - Rehabilitation?’ or something along those lines.
An American stating that ‘the Canadian justice system is a joke’ is bound to get peoples’ backs up….esp when our justice system is currently being co-opted by a government intent on an unpopular, (and more Americanized) system.
Maybe some of our friends to the south are tired of being criticized, and are looking for reasons to point the finger back at others…
I think another important thing to remember is there is a huge difference between afternoon supervised outings with probably a guard and a doctor with a bag full of drugs (and hopefully no access to knives) compared to the hospital just saying "you're cured" and handing the guy a bottle full of pills and sending him on his way. And I would imagine that even if these supervised outings go perfect there is still a long way to go before the guy is living anywhere other than the mental hospital he lives in now. And even if he ever does get to live anwhere else other than the hospital at he might only ever get to live in some kind of group home type of facility.
I was thinking the same I know it's not the case outside of our little bubble here, but it's still nice to see some unity.
Re: the country vs country angle to this thread – it was started in the thread title. This could have been titled ‘does this man deserve freedom’, or ‘Decapitation - Rehabilitation?’ or something along those lines.
An American stating that ‘the Canadian justice system is a joke’ is bound to get peoples’ backs up….esp when our justice system is currently being co-opted by a government intent on an unpopular, (and more Americanized) system.
Maybe some of our friends to the south are tired of being criticized, and are looking for reasons to point the finger back at others…
I think another important thing to remember is there is a huge difference between afternoon supervised outings with probably a guard and a doctor with a bag full of drugs (and hopefully no access to knives) compared to the hospital just saying "you're cured" and handing the guy a bottle full of pills and sending him on his way. And I would imagine that even if these supervised outings go perfect there is still a long way to go before the guy is living anywhere other than the mental hospital he lives in now. And even if he ever does get to live anwhere else other than the hospital at he might only ever get to live in some kind of group home type of facility.
I agree....he could be years away from release...or never get released...no matter what happens I'm sure he going to be heavily supervised the rest of his life.
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
I was thinking the same I know it's not the case outside of our little bubble here, but it's still nice to see some unity.
Re: the country vs country angle to this thread – it was started in the thread title. This could have been titled ‘does this man deserve freedom’, or ‘Decapitation - Rehabilitation?’ or something along those lines.
An American stating that ‘the Canadian justice system is a joke’ is bound to get peoples’ backs up….esp when our justice system is currently being co-opted by a government intent on an unpopular, (and more Americanized) system.
Maybe some of our friends to the south are tired of being criticized, and are looking for reasons to point the finger back at others…
actually ... i think most of us took the title with a grain of salt ... it didn't bother me at all and i can appreciate other people's sentiment ... my sole goal was just to provide some context to the discussion and try and show why it was the way it was ...
i think OJ being free is a joke but this story is more complicated and i am content with the judicial system in this particular case ... we are by no means perfect and there is plenty of things to criticize canada for ... ahem ... tar sands ... but this isn't one of them i think ...
Thread title fixed, didn't mean to insult anyone, I just think its ridiculous that they would let this looney out after just 4 years.
it's cool ... but just to reiterate ... they didn't let him out ... he has supervised leave once a week or something with a medical staff and a security guard ...
also ... this story hits a bit harder because about a week before this happened ... i was traveling across the country on a greyhound bus ... and on this exact same route ... :(
Thread title fixed, didn't mean to insult anyone, I just think its ridiculous that they would let this looney out after just 4 years.
Cool man :thumbup:
No offense taken at all…. there were a few comments pointing fingers back and forth about the nationalist angle to the thread, so I chimed in. And as far as feeling tired of being picked on…I didn’t mean to insinuate YOU in particular, just a general comment…even when criticism isn’t directed at you personally, it’s frustrating to feel stereotyped or viewed as part of the problem because of where you live...I can empathize with this, being from Alberta (tar sands). I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to be a liberal minded person in, say, Alabama....
(not directed at you, polaris ….I hear a lot of negative comments about Albertans, as people, because of the tar sands – mostly from BC people).
I think of the victims in all crime and their loved ones....
the suffering in this case immense I am sure.
It seems others here disregard them and that.
I know about mental illness first hand ...
it's not nor ever was curable only controllable.
It would be very dangerous to think anything otherwise especially in this case
and controllable just isn't good enough.
Lock and key!
you seem to believe that no one is thinking of the victims which is not the case. the issue boils down to the fact that this person is also a victim. he is a mental health victim. Yes mental health is not curable but it is treatable. I don't doubt for a second that these doctors have supervised him for a very long time and I will also not doubt that they feel that he is safe to be outside with supervision.
just curious and thinkin i'd do a what if scenario
what if this gentleman (the word gentleman being used lightly) has friends on the outside whom he communicates with, what if those pals stash alcohol, drugs, guns & bullets, and other weaponry around downtown whatever, canada for this gentleman to locate and use. just sayin.
this is how shit happens. it happens inside the walls of penitentiaries constantly; someone brings in weaponry and or drugs pretty much everyday of the week across the board in this coutry and other countries such as Canada, if it isn't happening then please explain all the drugs that are in the penal system today. yes even guards can be suckered into smuggling dope and other bullshit into a penitentiary
what if this dude has people wanting to help break him out of the mental institution? jump the guard and the hospital worker... easy as pie.
now i sit and wait for someone to say, chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film; please go take a nap, you gotta be tired
just curious and thinkin i'd do a what if scenario
what if this gentleman (the word gentleman being used lightly) has friends on the outside whom he communicates with, what if those pals stash alcohol, drugs, guns & bullets, and other weaponry around downtown whatever, canada for this gentleman to locate and use. just sayin.
this is how shit happens. it happens inside the walls of penitentiaries constantly; someone brings in weaponry and or drugs pretty much everyday of the week across the board in this coutry and other countries such as Canada, if it isn't happening then please explain all the drugs that are in the penal system today. yes even guards can be suckered into smuggling dope and other bullshit into a penitentiary
what if this dude has people wanting to help break him out of the mental institution? jump the guard and the hospital worker... easy as pie.
now i sit and wait for someone to say, chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film; please go take a nap, you gotta be tired
come on chad.. were not dealing with a criminal mastermind here.. were dealing with a mentally ill person. any ill person needs medical help. this man is getting it. and he needs to be supported.
oh and go take a nap.. yo be trippin'!
Post edited by catefrances on
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
just curious and thinkin i'd do a what if scenario
what if this gentleman (the word gentleman being used lightly) has friends on the outside whom he communicates with, what if those pals stash alcohol, drugs, guns & bullets, and other weaponry around downtown whatever, canada for this gentleman to locate and use. just sayin.
this is how shit happens. it happens inside the walls of penitentiaries constantly; someone brings in weaponry and or drugs pretty much everyday of the week across the board in this coutry and other countries such as Canada, if it isn't happening then please explain all the drugs that are in the penal system today. yes even guards can be suckered into smuggling dope and other bullshit into a penitentiary
what if this dude has people wanting to help break him out of the mental institution? jump the guard and the hospital worker... easy as pie.
now i sit and wait for someone to say, chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film; please go take a nap, you gotta be tired
Chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film now take a nap.
but to be honest, that can happen with anyone. what if I guy was in jail for assault and got out of jail and committed a murder. we can't prevent crime from happening but we can't live in fear and keep people in hospitals or jails forever too.
just curious and thinkin i'd do a what if scenario
what if this gentleman (the word gentleman being used lightly) has friends on the outside whom he communicates with, what if those pals stash alcohol, drugs, guns & bullets, and other weaponry around downtown whatever, canada for this gentleman to locate and use. just sayin.
this is how shit happens. it happens inside the walls of penitentiaries constantly; someone brings in weaponry and or drugs pretty much everyday of the week across the board in this coutry and other countries such as Canada, if it isn't happening then please explain all the drugs that are in the penal system today. yes even guards can be suckered into smuggling dope and other bullshit into a penitentiary
what if this dude has people wanting to help break him out of the mental institution? jump the guard and the hospital worker... easy as pie.
now i sit and wait for someone to say, chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film; please go take a nap, you gotta be tired
What if this guy actually was talking to god on the bus that night and the guy he killed actually was a dangerous alien? Since that seems about as likely as your scenario.
Comments
themselves
how do you know what I know and crap shouldn't you think about the victims family at all
what if he ate your brother num num
if it were my bro he wouldn't see the light of day probably not another day but I can figure
you'd be all ok with it still
that is as bat shit crazy as the cannibal but figures
I think of the victims in all crime and their loved ones....
the suffering in this case immense I am sure.
It seems others here disregard them and that.
I know about mental illness first hand ...
it's not nor ever was curable only controllable.
It would be very dangerous to think anything otherwise especially in this case
and controllable just isn't good enough.
Lock and key!
you stated you'd take the US over Canada any day. US executes innocent people and Canada tries to rehabilitate them, to put it in extremely simplistic terms.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I can see that this is going anywhere but meaningful and respectful discussion with you, so I'll say good day to you sir.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
this a good example of canadians in action know nothing about me and got me all figured out ha
of this lunatic either
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
In 2009, Vince Li was found not criminally responsible due to mental illness for the death of Tim McLean, a 22-year-old carnival worker who was sitting next to him on a bus traveling near Portage la Prairie, Manitoba. McLean had his eyes closed and was listening to music on his headphones when Li suddenly stood up and started stabbing him. As the bus stopped and horrified passengers fled, Li carved up McLean's body, ate portions of it, and displayed the victim's head to some passengers outside the bus.
After the judge's ruling, Li was placed in a locked wing of the Selkirk Mental Health Centre. Initially, he was not allowed outside, but over the years he has gained more freedom. Last week, a Criminal Code review board decided that Li can start having escorted trips off the hospital grounds and into the nearby city of Selkirk.
The ruling sparked renewed outrage from some members of the public, prompting Chris Summerville, head of the Manitoba Schizophrenia Society, to conduct a 45-minute interview with Li last weekend with the hope of shedding light on his progress.
Summerville has met with Li roughly every two months over the last four years.
"(Li feels) remorse, a degree of humility - I know a lot of people won't believe that - regret and a sense of torment," Summerville said Tuesday. "He understands now that schizophrenia is a mental illness which plays tricks on the brain. He knows that the medication works to keep the voices away."
Summerville released an edited transcript of the interview to the media Tuesday, in which he and Li discuss the night of July 30, 2008, when Li sat on a bus next to McLean that was traveling on a desolate stretch of the TransCanada Highway bound for Winnipeg. Thirty-seven passengers were aboard the bus.
"He was on the lookout for aliens as such, and the voice of God told him that Tim McLean was an alien and he needed to destroy him lest Tim destroy other people," Summerville said.
According to Summerville's transcript, Li recognizes that people fear him.
"I understand people are scared because of my behavior on the Greyhound bus. I am not at risk for anybody. I don't believe in aliens. I don't hear voices," Summerville quoted Li as saying. "I take my medication ... everyday. I am glad to take it. I don't have any weird voices any more."
Li also told Summerville he would like to be forgiven.
"I would do anything for (McLean's) family. I would ask forgiveness, but I know it would be hard to accept," Summerville quoted Li as saying.
That forgiveness may be a tall order.
"I think for the advancement of my own being ... my own soul, I will have to come to a place of accepting," Carol DeDelley, McLean's mother, said Tuesday.
"But what would be unforgivable for me would be ... to not do anything to try to prevent this from happening again by the same perpetrator. I don't think Vince Li can be trusted to take his medication."
DeDelley wants Li kept in a mental hospital permanently, but expects that he will gain more freedom every year until he is eventually released.
"If he's not responsible for his own behavior, then the state, the government, must step in and be responsible for him for the rest of (his) natural life."
Li emigrated to Canada from China in 2001 and became a Canadian citizen four years later.
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/m ... z1vhSgSqph
Aliens huh well that explains everything, good luck Canada when this nutjob is eventually released.
Becuase I am sure the mental health system in the US is great at handling mentally ill people and there are no schizophrenic people living on the streets or being released from mental hospitals because there isn't enough room for them.
Re: the country vs country angle to this thread – it was started in the thread title. This could have been titled ‘does this man deserve freedom’, or ‘Decapitation - Rehabilitation?’ or something along those lines.
An American stating that ‘the Canadian justice system is a joke’ is bound to get peoples’ backs up….esp when our justice system is currently being co-opted by a government intent on an unpopular, (and more Americanized) system.
Maybe some of our friends to the south are tired of being criticized, and are looking for reasons to point the finger back at others…
I agree....he could be years away from release...or never get released...no matter what happens I'm sure he going to be heavily supervised the rest of his life.
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
actually ... i think most of us took the title with a grain of salt ... it didn't bother me at all and i can appreciate other people's sentiment ... my sole goal was just to provide some context to the discussion and try and show why it was the way it was ...
i think OJ being free is a joke but this story is more complicated and i am content with the judicial system in this particular case ... we are by no means perfect and there is plenty of things to criticize canada for ... ahem ... tar sands ... but this isn't one of them i think ...
it's cool ... but just to reiterate ... they didn't let him out ... he has supervised leave once a week or something with a medical staff and a security guard ...
No offense taken at all…. there were a few comments pointing fingers back and forth about the nationalist angle to the thread, so I chimed in. And as far as feeling tired of being picked on…I didn’t mean to insinuate YOU in particular, just a general comment…even when criticism isn’t directed at you personally, it’s frustrating to feel stereotyped or viewed as part of the problem because of where you live...I can empathize with this, being from Alberta (tar sands). I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to be a liberal minded person in, say, Alabama....
(not directed at you, polaris
you seem to believe that no one is thinking of the victims which is not the case. the issue boils down to the fact that this person is also a victim. he is a mental health victim. Yes mental health is not curable but it is treatable. I don't doubt for a second that these doctors have supervised him for a very long time and I will also not doubt that they feel that he is safe to be outside with supervision.
I agree that supervised 'releases' with a guard is a long way from being released into population.
what if this gentleman (the word gentleman being used lightly) has friends on the outside whom he communicates with, what if those pals stash alcohol, drugs, guns & bullets, and other weaponry around downtown whatever, canada for this gentleman to locate and use. just sayin.
this is how shit happens. it happens inside the walls of penitentiaries constantly; someone brings in weaponry and or drugs pretty much everyday of the week across the board in this coutry and other countries such as Canada, if it isn't happening then please explain all the drugs that are in the penal system today. yes even guards can be suckered into smuggling dope and other bullshit into a penitentiary
what if this dude has people wanting to help break him out of the mental institution? jump the guard and the hospital worker... easy as pie.
now i sit and wait for someone to say, chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film; please go take a nap, you gotta be tired
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
come on chad.. were not dealing with a criminal mastermind here.. were dealing with a mentally ill person. any ill person needs medical help. this man is getting it. and he needs to be supported.
oh and go take a nap.. yo be trippin'!
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Chadwick, you are daydreaming in a bullshit hollywood film now take a nap.
but to be honest, that can happen with anyone. what if I guy was in jail for assault and got out of jail and committed a murder. we can't prevent crime from happening but we can't live in fear and keep people in hospitals or jails forever too.
What if this guy actually was talking to god on the bus that night and the guy he killed actually was a dangerous alien? Since that seems about as likely as your scenario.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
and then jumped back in with both feet, guns blazing and your hair on fire.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say